No one has seen God at any time, John?

[dak]

I could have said Christendom, but the point is most Christian denominations, their leaders, and statements of faith prescribe to and even insist that Jesus returning "soon" and "all these things" that He said "must shortly come to pass" was not the truth.

Thanks, now I understand this portion, and I agree that it is indeed what has happened, (at least in the west), but I do not agree with consigning people to outer darkness just because of a dispensationalist+futurist perspective.

 

[Matthias]

Be honest @ScottA. You were when you said you go beyond what is written in scripture. Tell at @marks: Are you a trinitarian or are you a non-trinitarian? (You both know that I’m not a trinitarian.)

No reply.

You aren’t aligned with me. Are you aligned with one another?

Trinitarian and non-trinitarian mystic, they are not aligned but rather allied with one another.

Their theologies don’t match. Their theologies don’t matter. There is no division between them.

 

[Riven]

Eating peanut butter straight out of the jar is underrated.

Moses technically saw God. Shouldn't that be case closed?

 

[Matthias]

Eating peanut butter straight out of the jar is underrated.

Don’t buy your peanut butter from snakes.

 

[Riven]

Don’t buy your peanut butter from snakes.

I didn't even know I was allowed to post in this part of the forum.

 

[Matthias]

I didn't even know I was allowed to post in this part of the forum.

Play your cards right and you will soon be allowed to post in every part of the forum, if that’s what you want to do.

You’ve been lied to in this thread.

 

[ScottA]

Thanks, now I understand this portion, and I agree that it is indeed what has happened, (at least in the west), but I do not agree with consigning people to outer darkness just because of a dispensationalist+futurist perspective.

Nor do I, and nor does God. God has set before all a choice between life and death, blessing and cursing. Those who are cast into outer darkness choose it...some of whom have entered into the church teachings false doctrines bringing destruction "on themselves." By whom are many victims: those who come to weep having suffered not of there own doings, and others who come to gnash their teeth for fear of their own fate for knowingly or unknowingly aiding the enemy.

 

[ScottA]

Eating peanut butter straight out of the jar is underrated.

Moses technically saw God. Shouldn't that be case closed?

The thing is, it's not a technical matter. Not even a physical matter, but spiritual. Moses seeing with eyes of flesh, did not see God, for got is spirit.

What did Moses see then that qualified to be called God's behind? Notice I said "behind"--which spiritually does not refer to His bum. It means "afterward"--that afterward Moses would see God. As will we all.

 

[Riven]

The thing is, it's not a technical matter. Not even a physical matter, but spiritual. Moses seeing with eyes of flesh, did not see God, for got is spirit.

What did Moses see then that qualified to be called God's behind? Notice I said "behind"--which spiritually does not refer to His bum. It means "afterward"--that afterward Moses would see God. As will we all.

How does that make sense when God is speaking directly to Moses?

 

[Matthias]

“1. The one God. (a) theos is the most frequent designation of God in the NT. Belief in the one, only, and unique God (Matt. 23:9; Rom. 3:30; 1 Cor. 8:4-6; Gal. 3:20; 1 Tim. 2:5; Jas. 2:19) is an established part of Christian tradition. Jesus himself made the fundamental confession of Jud. his own and expressly quoted the Shema (Deut. 6:4-5; see Mk. 12:29-30; cf. Matt. 22:37; Lk. 10:27). This guaranteed continuity between the old and the new covenants. The God whom Christians worship is the God of the fathers (Acts 3:13; 5:30; 22:14), the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob (Acts 3:13; 7:32; cf. Matt. 22:32; Mk. 12:26; Lk. 20:37), the God of Israel (Matt. 15:31; Lk. 1:68; Acts 13:17), and the God of Jesus Christ (2 Cor. 1:3; Eph. 1:3; 1 Pet. 1:3).”

(New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology, Abridged Edition, p. 244)

That’s the God of Jewish monotheism. That’s the God of primitive Christianity. That’s my God.

@Riven this is what you need to know about who the one God is. If you’ll remember it you won’t be lead astray by anyone.

 

[amigo de christo]

Don’t buy your peanut butter from snakes.

Buy not the peanut butter of the well favored ecumenical WHORELOT
for those peanuts have been digested already and cometh of the butt doctrines of men gone wrong .
Just a friendly reminder to us all that the very golden waters she has given in her ecumincal cup
and her loafs of chocolate manna
are yellow for a reason and brown for a reason . It cometh of the cisterns of men and the wee and dung polluted waters .
Okay everyone feel free to return to the original post now . This was but a temporary , but DIRE needful , reminder .

 

[JustMe]

Yes, Jesus is God. Scripture says this and even Jesus said, "Before Abraham was, I am." He is the Alpha and Omega, the Beginning and the End. He is called, "the Everlasting Father" ...and Thomas called Him, "my Savior and my God" and Jesus did not rebuke him. So take ALL SCRIPTURE as whole. Don't toss out all the scriptures that say clearly who Jesus is.... the Word that was made flesh and walked among men.

So then, God in His spirit form, on His throne ...no one can stand in His presence and live. You need your new glorified body for that.

Who precisely is this person who wished the Pharisees to possess such deep faith in him that they would live accordingly, without sin on this earth, and depart in that same sinless condition? Thanks for your attention, in advance.

 

[Matthias]

“This idea of ‘going beyond’ the Bible is intrinsic to much mystic thought. However, it potentially violates both the doctrine of ‘Scripture alone’ and ‘faith alone,’ opting instead for an experience of God that transcends the typical restraints of Scripture. In such a scenario, the mystic concludes there are no boundaries (or very few) to one’s experience of God. The experience alone is its justification and authority. Thus you must know the God of the bible … then go beyond.”

(Mike Duran, “The Dangers of Christian Mysticism”)

https://www.mikeduran.com/2017/11/27/the-dangers-of-christian-mysticism/

You’ve seen that happen in this thread @Riven. The trinitarian lacked discernment and was mesmerized by the non-trinitarian mystic.

The Messiah’s God - the one God - has been blasphemed by the non-trinitarian mystic.

 

[Matthias]

We’ve heard a Christian mystic speak in this thread about weeping and gnashing of teeth. It is the Christian mystic himself who is on the path that leads to weeping and gnashing of teeth. It is the Christian mystic himself who, if he doesn’t repent, will find himself weeping and gnashing his teeth.

 

[ScottA]

How does that make sense when God is speaking directly to Moses?

God elsewhere speaks out of a cloud, or just in a voice that was heard, through angels, and sometimes with special effects. He's God.

 

[Matthias]

I do--I admit that I have been beyond the cannon of what is written on parchment, caught up to the third heaven, and now speak what is not mine but His who sent me to reveal and finish the mystery of God as he declared to his servants the prophets.

Thanks again. This was your second best comment in the thread.

***

@Riven do you believe ScottA was sent by Jesus to “reveal and finish the mystery of God”?

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

“No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him.”

(John 1:18, NKJV)

@RLT63 you asked me a question this evening (thank you) about this passage in a thread and forum where I don’t have posting privileges. Your question:

”Was John wrong?”

My answer: No. John was not wrong.

NO, John was correct!. In His spiritual form, no human has seen God, accept Jesus, tue God/Man. We see in our physical dimension. Unless angels manifest themselves physically, we can't see them either. Jesus is God in the flesh ( the WORD BECAME FLESH AND DWELT AMONG US). WAS JOHN WRONG? NO.
The disciple asked Jesus, "Show us the Father". What did He say .
Matthias?

• John 14:9: Jesus tells Philip, "Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father," indicating a perfect revelation of the Father's nature through Him.
• John 10:30: Jesus says, "I and the Father are one," suggesting unity and shared essence with the Father.
• Colossians 1:15: The Son is described as "the image of the invisible God," highlighting that Jesus perfectly reveals the divine nature that is otherwise unseen.
• Hebrews 1:3: Jesus is the exact "radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being".
• Colossians 1:16-17 describes Jesus as the CREATOR of everything, visible and invisible on earth and in heaven. So he did not create Himself.
• And btw, Do of you believe that God dwells in us, look in the mirror ... can you see Him? The Holy Spirit is also invisible.

 

[Matthias]

NO, John was correct!. In His spiritual form, no human has seen God, accept Jesus, tue God/Man. We see in our physical dimension. Unless angels manifest themselves physically, we can't see them either. Jesus is God in the flesh ( the WORD BECAME FLESH AND DWELT AMONG US). WAS JOHN WRONG? NO.
The disciple asked Jesus, "Show us the Father". What did He say .
Matthias?

• John 14:9: Jesus tells Philip, "Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father," indicating a perfect revelation of the Father's nature through Him.
• John 10:30: Jesus says, "I and the Father are one," suggesting unity and shared essence with the Father.
• Colossians 1:15: The Son is described as "the image of the invisible God," highlighting that Jesus perfectly reveals the divine nature that is otherwise unseen.
• Hebrews 1:3: Jesus is the exact "radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being".
• Colossians 1:16-17 describes Jesus as the CREATOR of everything, visible and invisible on earth and in heaven. So he did not create Himself.
• And btw, Do of you believe that God dwells in us, look in the mirror ... can you see Him? The Holy Spirit is also invisible.

I was asked by a trinitarian member if I thought John was wrong. I replied that John was not wrong.

While you’re here, do you believe that @ScottA - a non-trinitarian Christian mystic who publicly admitted that he has gone beyond what is written in scripture - has been sent by Jesus to “reveal and finish the mystery of God”? (See post #165)

 

[Matthias]

I know where this is going

Did you have “Believing Jewish monotheist vs. Non-trinitarian Christian mystic” on your BINGO card?

 

[marks]

Lol, so you explain to marks that he is a victim and kindly send him on his way to your tripartite version of outer darkness, and he in turn supports you in your reinterpretation of what you said to Matthias. Why am I not surprised?

Don't misunderstand . . .

I responded to Matthias claiming Jesus for his group of "Jewish Monotheists", by challenging that this was so. Matthias claims Jesus' theology is the same as his own, and I challenged that. Matthias has no right to put words into Jesus' mouth as though the Lord were denying the very truth about Himself.

And then Matthias began to push me towards Scott, attempting to get me into a triangle with Scott, I would guess to take attention off the post I made.

I'm not in this discussion to speak with Scott, he's fine, I like him and all. I truly appreciate his good manners, and that he doesn't play these kinds of games. I don't agree with everything he says, and he doesn't agree with everything I say. I know this. There is no surprise.

But that's all this is.

I called out Matthias on what I believe to be false assertions, and challenged his foundation for making such claims. He's attempted triangulation the rest of the way through. And effectively, it seems. But it's just being manipulative.



"Jesus himself says He's not God"

"You don't have the basis by which to make such a claim"

"Look at what Scott said!!"

"I'm discussing with you"

"Oh but look at what Scott said".

And on it went.

Much love!