If Christianity is true

[JustMe]

"Just me" quote from another thread:
""Now for someone to suggest from verse 24, and/or verse 28, to conclude that Yeshua was divine or the same as his Father, YHWH, they need to really hide their heads in shame. They dishonor both the Son and the Father, who is YHWH""

Exactly what watchtower does to the testimony of Jesus.

The bible says Jesus created all things.
The cults say Jesus was created.

The bible says only God receives worship.
"I the Lord am a Jelous God, thou shalt have no other God's before me"
Jesus received worship.
The cults have a created being receiving worship.

Jesus said, " Destroy this temple and then three days i've raised it up"
The cults can not do anything with that, but actually smear it into some reframing, so Jesus in their workbook, did not raise himself from the dead.

Jesus said " I am the Same yesterday today and forever."
You align yourself with the cults and say, "no, he is not, he was created".

Again the bible says Jesus is creator.
EVERY CULT WITHOUT EXCEPTION, stumbles all over that.

The FATHER SAYS concerning Jesus in Hebrews, " Thy throne o God is forever and ever"
You and the cults say that is false.

So I now see who you are, playing the role of a roving troll attempting to guard the bridge of Orthodoxy; and unsuccessfully I might add. By one definition, you are this vey troll by deliberately posting inflammatory, irrelevant, or offensive comments or other disruptive content.

That's you isn't it with your bow and arrow readied to fire at anything that strikes you, and racks your brain. Childish to say the least.

Well why don't you quote the entire post of that particular thread to get the context. You might want to read it all for a change and learn something.

----------------

John 8:24 and 28 – Epistrophe I am - you that you would die in your sins​

(Joh 8:24) I told you that you would die in your sins. Yes, if you don't believe that I AM, you will die in your sins."
(Joh 8:25) They asked, "Then who are you?" Jesus answered, "I am what I have told you from the beginning.
(Joh 8:26) I have much more I could say to judge you. But I tell people only what I have heard from the one who sent me, and he speaks the truth."
(Joh 8:27) They did not understand who he was talking about. He was telling them about the Father.
(Joh 8:28) So he said to them, "You will lift up the Son of Man. Then you will know that I AM. You will know that whatever I do is not by my own authority. You will know that I say only what the Father has taught me.
(Joh 8:29) The one who sent me is with me. I always do what pleases him. So he has not left me alone."
(Joh 8:30) While he was saying these things, many people believed in him. (ERV)

In verse 24 Jesus insists the people know who Yeshua is, else without this knowledge, they will not have the opportunity to believe in him, and consequently their sins will not be forgiven upon their death.

So they ask him who are you, in verse 25. And Yeshua replies, I already told you from/at the beginning, of our discussions or when he first met them.

Then Yeshua, in verses 26 - 29, speaks about his God, his Father. Yeshua is again hinting about who he is, as his position with and the work of his Father, who is God.

In verse 28 Yeshua broadcasts to the people he is the Son of Man, a human being, a human person.

In verses 28 and 29, by strong inference, Yeshua is also saying he is the anointed one, the Messiah of God. Yeshua, the man had to be anointed or become the Messiah of God, filled with the power of his Father in order to succeed to the Cross. Yeshua had no power or authority in himself or independently, he depended solely on his Father, who is the one God. Yeshua performed his work as the special human being separated by God for this special mission. He was born to become the agent of God, to speak the word of God to execute the human sacrifice portion of God's plan for salvific restoration.

And then in verse 30, many knew Yeshua was a man, a human person born of God and also the Messiah of God. And many consequently then believed on him and did not die in their sins, as his Father God told his Son.

Now for someone to suggest from verse 24, and/or verse 28,, to conclude that Yeshua was divine or the same as his Father, YHWH, they need to really hide their heads in shame. They dishonor both the Son and the Father, who is YHWH.

The term "I am" that should not be capitalized, is an emphatic metaphoric expression for the self-identification of Yeshua, and it’s not YHWH or the divine one either. It is the Son of Man, the Messiah of God as his Son.

__________________________

You have a lot to learn in scripture..

So you think that Christ raised himself to new life from his grave when he was dead, dead as any man would be? Find the scripture that says his Father raised him. It is there I assure you. If you even have a Bible at your disposal to search for it.

And the rest of scripture you raise, its truth also eludes you. I do have studies on all subjects you list. I can blast them into several posts if you wish. Then again maybe not. You do not care to know the truth in scripture.

Try putting down your bow and arrow for a change and get to class and learn something useful, about the difference between God, the Father, and his Son and Messiah.

And for your home work, write up a commentary about Jesus being 'the creator.' Convince me, surely you can do that, as your fellow brethren with religious orthodox Christian eyes are watching you. Don't let them down.

 

[rebuilder 454]

So I now see who you are, playing the role of a roving troll attempting to guard the bridge of Orthodoxy; and unsuccessfully I might add. By one definition, you are this vey troll by deliberately posting inflammatory, irrelevant, or offensive comments or other disruptive content.

That's you isn't it with your bow and arrow readied to fire at anything that strikes you, and racks your brain. Childish to say the least.

Well why don't you quote the entire post of that particular thread to get the context. You might want to read it all for a change and learn something.

----------------

John 8:24 and 28 – Epistrophe I am - you that you would die in your sins​

(Joh 8:24) I told you that you would die in your sins. Yes, if you don't believe that I AM, you will die in your sins."
(Joh 8:25) They asked, "Then who are you?" Jesus answered, "I am what I have told you from the beginning.
(Joh 8:26) I have much more I could say to judge you. But I tell people only what I have heard from the one who sent me, and he speaks the truth."
(Joh 8:27) They did not understand who he was talking about. He was telling them about the Father.
(Joh 8:28) So he said to them, "You will lift up the Son of Man. Then you will know that I AM. You will know that whatever I do is not by my own authority. You will know that I say only what the Father has taught me.
(Joh 8:29) The one who sent me is with me. I always do what pleases him. So he has not left me alone."
(Joh 8:30) While he was saying these things, many people believed in him. (ERV)

In verse 24 Jesus insists the people know who Yeshua is, else without this knowledge, they will not have the opportunity to believe in him, and consequently their sins will not be forgiven upon their death.

So they ask him who are you, in verse 25. And Yeshua replies, I already told you from/at the beginning, of our discussions or when he first met them.

Then Yeshua, in verses 26 - 29, speaks about his God, his Father. Yeshua is again hinting about who he is, as his position with and the work of his Father, who is God.

In verse 28 Yeshua broadcasts to the people he is the Son of Man, a human being, a human person.

In verses 28 and 29, by strong inference, Yeshua is also saying he is the anointed one, the Messiah of God. Yeshua, the man had to be anointed or become the Messiah of God, filled with the power of his Father in order to succeed to the Cross. Yeshua had no power or authority in himself or independently, he depended solely on his Father, who is the one God. Yeshua performed his work as the special human being separated by God for this special mission. He was born to become the agent of God, to speak the word of God to execute the human sacrifice portion of God's plan for salvific restoration.

And then in verse 30, many knew Yeshua was a man, a human person born of God and also the Messiah of God. And many consequently then believed on him and did not die in their sins, as his Father God told his Son.

Now for someone to suggest from verse 24, and/or verse 28,, to conclude that Yeshua was divine or the same as his Father, YHWH, they need to really hide their heads in shame. They dishonor both the Son and the Father, who is YHWH.

The term "I am" that should not be capitalized, is an emphatic metaphoric expression for the self-identification of Yeshua, and it’s not YHWH or the divine one either. It is the Son of Man, the Messiah of God as his Son.

__________________________

You have a lot to learn in scripture..

So you think that Christ raised himself to new life from his grave when he was dead, dead as any man would be? Find the scripture that says his Father raised him. It is there I assure you. If you even have a Bible at your disposal to search for it.

And the rest of scripture you raise, its truth also eludes you. I do have studies on all subjects you list. I can blast them into several posts if you wish. Then again maybe not. You do not care to know the truth in scripture.

Try putting down your bow and arrow for a change and get to class and learn something useful, about the difference between God, the Father, and his Son and Messiah.

And for your home work, write up a commentary about Jesus being 'the creator.' Convince me, surely you can do that, as your fellow brethren with religious orthodox Christian eyes are watching you. Don't let them down.

QUOTE
""You have a lot to learn in scripture..
So you think that Christ raised himself to new life from his grave when he was dead, dead as any man would be? Find the scripture that says his Father raised him. It is there I assure you. If you even have a Bible at your disposal to search for it.""

As if you know something?

Jesus said, " Destroy this temple and in three days I will raise it up again"
What can you do to upset that?
I know for a fact you have a real problem with the testimony of Yeshua.



...meanwhile you have God approving of the worship of Jesus ( who you claim is created, and not a deity)....complete with watchtower applauds and exortation).
Psssst...... "auntie," (who keeps liking your posts and same doctrine) is WATCHTOWER CULTIST.

The more you talk the more your words condemn the testimony of Jesus.

That deity of Jesus dynamic ain't going away.
This is a Christian site.

 

[David in NJ]

Wow.
We ALL BELIEVE he comes after the trib.

That is not even part of the debate.

You remind me of those trump haters.
When asked "why", they just look at you.
All they "know" is they hate him...they have no idea why.
All you "know" is you hate pretrib rapture.
Then when you are SHOWN a SEPARATE COMING BEFORE THE WHITE HORSES COMING OF REV 19........YOU STARE OFF INTO SPACE.

Pssssst......beyond any DOUBT....ANY DOUBT...NO MATTER HOW HARD YOU TRY....THAT PROVED MORE THAT ONE COMING.
Rev 14: 14 beyond any doubt....destroyed the "one coming", made up mess, that you guys invented.

I can pm you the info on where to send the truck and title.

Well, i voted for Trump - so there goes another 'oops' on you brother.

beyond any doubt....destroyed the "one coming", made up mess, that you guys invented.

Yep, we invented:
a.) His "one" Coming in His 1st Advent
b.) His "one" Coming in His 2nd Advent

i will post a picture of my 2022 RAM 1500 HEMI - FREE = IF, you can find more then "one" 2nd Coming from the Mouth of GOD in JESUS words in Revelation chapter 1:5-8

To Him who loves us and has released us from our sins by His blood, who has made us to be a kingdom, priests to His God and Father—to Him be the glory and power forever and ever! Amen.

Behold, He is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see Him—even those who pierced Him. And all the tribes of the earth will mourn because of Him. So shall it be! Amen.

“I am the Alpha and the Omega,” says the Lord God, Who Is and Was and Is to Come—the Almighty.

Allow the HOLY SPIRIT to set you FREE from the lie of pre-trib rapture.

Resist, and you remain stuck where you are = and that will leave you in great disappointment when you find out you were lied to!

 

[JustMe]

QUOTE
""You have a lot to learn in scripture..
So you think that Christ raised himself to new life from his grave when he was dead, dead as any man would be? Find the scripture that says his Father raised him. It is there I assure you. If you even have a Bible at your disposal to search for it.""

As if you know something?

Jesus said, " Destroy this temple and in three days I will raise it up again"
What can you do to upset that?
I know for a fact you have a real problem with the testimony of Yeshua.



...meanwhile you have God approving of the worship of Jesus ( who you claim is created, and not a deity)....complete with watchtower applauds and exortation).
Psssst...... "auntie," (who keeps liking your posts and same doctrine) is WATCHTOWER CULTIST.

The more you talk the more your words condemn the testimony of Jesus.

That deity of Jesus dynamic ain't going away.
This is a Christian site.

Having fun I again I see, while you mope around in circles on the floor. You have given me another opportunity and opening to preach the word of God to you and anyone interested in reading about it.

This is yet another subject you have shown not have a clue about....I posted this on another thread recently.

The worship of Yeshua by the angels​

The tune is called or about ' Jesus is worshipped by angels.' So now the sky must fall and everything changes. Not at all. It's just a case of ignorance and laziness of those not wanting to really understand the subject, especially if their core belief system depends upon it.

The amazing and yet self-inflicted difficultly in understanding the word ‘worship’ as used in the Bible.

Many have found scripture that says we worship God and even Yeshua, his Son, and therefore the son is at least divine if not God aswell. They hang their hats on the English translated word from Hebrew and Greek words for ‘worship’ considered exclusive acts only for God and Yeshua.

The association with the word worship for both God and his Son creates unnecessary faulty logic, that this word worship is the link to Yeshua’s divinity and being God.

The Hebrew word shachah and the Greek word proskuneo account for more than 80% of the appearances of the word “worship” in most English versions of the Bible, so these two words are at the center of attention.

Both of these words mean ‘to bow down” and similar meaning words, of a few.

For the Hebrew word shachah, it means ‘bowing down’ or’ prostrating oneself’ usually before a human of superior rank or recognition or God.

For the Greek word proskuneo, ‘pros’ means towards and ‘kuneo’ means to kiss. It means to literally kiss the hand towards someone as a token of reverence.

Examples: Lot worshipped the strangers who came to Sodom. He spread out to the ground to show his respect for them.(Gen 19:1). Moses worshipped his father-in-law whom he respected and honored (Ex 18:7). There are many more examples where all mean to honor another person, he would bow down or fall down (worship) before them. That was the custom, that was the culture. And this custom of common worship of this visible outward act between other people revealed the inner heart of respect and honor.

So why do we use the English word ‘worship’ at all in the Bible? The English origin of the word means worthiness for the word ‘weorthscipe.’ They are worthy to be worshipped.

As the background has now been set, now here’s why there’s poison in this soup. There are many variations of these Hebrew and Geek words when translated in English text of the bible. Translators have created their own logic. Many translators in many versions of the Bible, when associated between one person to another, translate the words consistently as “bow down” or of similar language. And when these two words of the Hebrew and Greek are used before God or his Son, they, nearly all prefer using these words as ‘worship.’ So then many misunderstand the word ‘worship’ today. They then say that Yeshua must be God because he is worshipped as God. And yet when God alone is the subject of worship, and his Son truly worships his Father, the translators were careful not to use the word ‘worship.’ They uses a phrase of ‘bowing down’ or similar language as if the Son was the same God as his Father (Matt 26:39). There is definitely a real bias afoot here.

Now it is obvious that not only God or Jesus are worshipped, but many men are also worshipped as well. People worshipping Jesus does not make him God any more than Abraham bowing down before the Hittites makes them God.

The translators need to be consistent within all scripture and where the Greek and Hebrew is used: either all translated as 'worship' or all translated into English as 'bowing down' or something of the same effect.

Anyone worthy or deserving honor and respect and also obedience, given by a sincere heart should be worshipped.

And then it is appropriate for Yeshua to also be worshipped, as God provided and commanded it to all his creation for his Son, for he is worthy. and ultimately for his Father's own glory.

And this study shows again that Yeshua, being worshipped (and many today do not even bow down or collapse to the ground either), really means showing honor and respect and obedience as to a King, or Son of God, or a man worthy of such an act.

And it still does not make Yeshua divine or God either, as it would be an appropriate chorus line for this tune.
----------------------------------------------------

And so what does it mean in the verse, when Jesus said, " Destroy this temple and in three days I will raise it up again". It means more that the eye can see, more than what a simpleton can understand, as yourself..

 

[David in NJ]

The association with the word worship for both God and his Son creates unnecessary faulty logic, that this word worship is the link to Yeshua’s divinity and being God.

You just FAILED the Truth Test

Therefore your statement applies to your own misunderstanding of the WAY the TRUTH and the LIFE

Ditto = This is yet another subject you have shown not have a clue about....

 

[JustMe]

You just FAILED the Truth Test

Therefore your statement applies to your own misunderstanding of the WAY the TRUTH and the LIFE

Ditto = This is yet another subject you have shown not have a clue about....

I've stirred up the peanut gallery mob now...I must be doing something right.

I failed the test you say. Well that is a great outcome, coming from you. It really means that your did not like the answer I gave. Well at least we both are consistent.

I was wondering when might you chime in and given you typical expert opinion on these matters, as you have not moved the needle for me in the past, and still haven't done so today.

So, why don't you expound on your posted comments and set me straight and correct my errors? As always you will not, as you cannot, because you do not have the proper spirit of understanding to speak these subjects with confidence that only comes from God.

I would suggest you obtain it and rely on it in the future. I do..it is a 'life saver.'

 

[David in NJ]

I've stirred up the peanut gallery mob now...I must be doing something right.

lol - Another misunderstanding from you

As always you will not, as you cannot

lolx100 - even more misunderstanding from you

because you do not have the proper spirit of understanding to speak these subjects with confidence

LOL x1000000000000 = you hit the JACKPOT of pride = which is a LOSING payout

that only comes from God.

Well, now = there is still hope for you afterall = but ONLY as you submit to GOD and His WORD

Are you a jehova witness?

 

[Angelina]

For this site and in obedience and compliance of its rules that I've read and understood, I'm not a loyalist to creeds of faith for starters.

Me neither, @JustMe. I am not a creed loyalist but I am a believer and follower of Jesus anyway and that makes me a Christian.

 

[Angelina]

Just let me know @JustMe and I will change your status...

 

[David in NJ]

I would suggest you obtain it and rely on it in the future. I do..it is a 'life saver.'

God has placed me Way ahead of you on that one as well

For someone who seems to be smart = you sure are making a bunch of mistakes!!!

 

[David in NJ]

I've stirred up the peanut gallery mob now...I must be doing something right.

I failed the test you say. Well that is a great outcome, coming from you. It really means that your did not like the answer I gave. Well at least we both are consistent.

I was wondering when might you chime in and given you typical expert opinion on these matters, as you have not moved the needle for me in the past, and still haven't done so today.

So, why don't you expound on your posted comments and set me straight and correct my errors? As always you will not, as you cannot, because you do not have the proper spirit of understanding to speak these subjects with confidence that only comes from God.

I would suggest you obtain it and rely on it in the future. I do..it is a 'life saver.'

Question: Do you see in the scriptures JESUS being worshipped anywhere = the same way God is worshipped?

 

[David in NJ]

I've stirred up the peanut gallery mob now...I must be doing something right.

I failed the test you say. Well that is a great outcome, coming from you. It really means that your did not like the answer I gave. Well at least we both are consistent.

I was wondering when might you chime in and given you typical expert opinion on these matters, as you have not moved the needle for me in the past, and still haven't done so today.

So, why don't you expound on your posted comments and set me straight and correct my errors? As always you will not, as you cannot, because you do not have the proper spirit of understanding to speak these subjects with confidence that only comes from God.

I would suggest you obtain it and rely on it in the future. I do..it is a 'life saver.'

Do you see in the scriptures JESUS being worshipped anywhere = the same way God is worshipped?

 

[Matthias]

If Christianity is true, would you become a Christian?

As can be seen in this thread, Christianity is ugly.

Would you become a Christian if Christianity wasn’t ugly?

 

[JustMe]

Just let me know @JustMe and I will change your status...

Well thank you Angelina I would like that very much. However, and it should not affect my altered status, I still owe it to myself and others to keep maintaining good order and discipline with my comments on these forums. Some can be raw and not for the thin-skinned; even if I believe my intentions are genuine and written with patience and not in haste.

And that may be a challenge for me as it has been in the past.

Well I do consider myself a genuine believer as one with zeal and eagerness for my lord and my God, in Christ, every single day Amen

Thank you again Angelina.

 

[David in NJ]

As can be seen in this thread, Christianity is ugly.

Would you become a Christian if Christianity wasn’t ugly?

OT Judaism is far more UGLY = even to the point of the Second Death

 

[JustMe]

Do you see in the scriptures JESUS being worshipped anywhere = the same way God is worshipped?

David, if I can call you that name, and I excuse you for being from New Jersey. Off hand I do not see any explicit ones. Can you provide such a scripture so I then cab study it...

 

[Matthias]

OT Judaism is far more UGLY = even to the point of the Second Death

I’m not interested in your ugliness comparison. I’ve stated the purpose for this thread in an earlier post. (See post #7)

 

[David in NJ]

David, if I can call you that name, and I excuse you for being from New Jersey. Off hand I do not see any explicit ones. Can you provide such a scripture so I then cab study it...

Thank you for your reply.

I excuse you for being from New Jersey.

i like this "as laughter is medicine to the bones"

Let us continue being respectful to each other for it is His Way - Amen

Off hand I do not see any explicit ones. Can you provide such a scripture so I then cab study it...

Yes, in Scripture and you will SEE that it is Found in the Center of God's Throne.


Then I saw a scroll in the right hand of the One seated on the throne. It had writing on both sides and was sealed with seven seals.
And I saw a mighty angel proclaiming in a loud voice, “Who is worthy to break the seals and open the scroll?”

But no one in heaven or on earth or under the earth was able to open the scroll or look inside it.
And I began to weep bitterly, because no one was found worthy to open the scroll or look inside it.

Then one of the elders said to me, “Do not weep! Behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, has triumphed to open the scroll and its seven seals.”

Then I saw a Lamb who appeared to have been slain, standing in the center of the throne, encircled by the four living creatures and the elders. The Lamb had seven horns and seven eyes, which represent the seven spirits of God sent out into all the earth.
And He came and took the scroll from the right hand of the One seated on the throne.

When He had taken the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb. Each one had a harp, and they were holding golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints. And they sang a new song:

“Worthy are You to take the scroll and open its seals,
because You were slain,
and by Your blood You purchased for God
those from every tribe and tongue and people and nation.
You have made them to be a kingdom
and priests to serve our God,
and they will reign upon the earth.”

 

[David in NJ]

I’m not interested in your ugliness comparison. I’ve stated the purpose for this thread in an earlier post. (See post #7)

The Purpose of this Post was so that the MESSIAH would be nailed to it and remove the "ugliness" of SIN that is upon the whole world.

Jew to Jew = "Behold the Lamb that takes away the Sins of the World"

 

[Matthias]

The Purpose of this Post was so that the MESSIAH would be nailed it and remove the "ugliness" of SIN that is upon the whole world.

Jew to Jew = "Behold the Lamb that takes away the Sins of the World"

That’s not the purpose of my thread. A new thread in one of the “Christians Only” forums would be better suited for your purpose.

Since you muddied the water I need to point out that this thread isn’t connected with drawing people to OT Judaism.