Reason for The Crusades explained

[Wrangler]

Of course. The point is that the disciples of the Messiah - who himself didn’t resist his enemies and was slain - must be prepared to follow his example.

His example upon his return is to conquer, yes?

 

[Matthias]

His example upon his return is to conquer, yes?

Yes. Wait for him.

 

[Matthias]

If you want to be a martyr, go for it. Go into Somali and stop hiding behind mommy's skirt.

I’ve been thinking off and on this morning about my evangelism trips to Africa.

I was robbed at gunpoint of a small amount of money by an armed Christian militia in Malawi. Yet at the same time, I stayed in a run down hotel in Blantyre that housed two UN soldiers, and a Malawi army unit sat directly outside the window of my ground floor room every night. I didn’t ask for them to be there. A small band of armed rebels in a jeep were raiding an isolated mountainous area where I was evangelizing. I don’t know how close they came to me, I never saw them, but the locals feared for their lives and mine.

In Mozambique I was robbed of a more substantial amount of money by a corrupt border guard. When I objected and asked to speak with the person in charge of the post, my interpreter quickly stepped in, apologized to the guard, and told me to be quiet and leave immediately. She later told me that my life was more important than the money. An hour later we were unknowingly walking beside a mine field that hadn’t been cleared. Locals were terrified when they saw it and rushed to warn us, showing us where it was safe to walk around bombed out villages.

In Kenya I was stalked by a man in Kisumu who intended to rob me as I walked around Lake Victoria. I was warned of the danger and shown a way to elude the bandit, who was waiting down the road to ambush me.

In Zimbabwe I was confronted at the airport in Harare by a soldier pointing a machine gun at my belly. Through no fault of mine, my paperwork wasn’t in order. There was a line on the floor that I was told not to step over. I was assured by an airline representative (who worked diligently in the middle of the night to get me a new visa) that if stepped across the line I would be shot. I was warned by hotel staff never to venture out of the hotel alone. It wasn’t safe there.

If you had any conviction in your nonsense, you'd put yourself in danger for the Lord.

You sound like the devil. I was in a bit of danger at times, but wisely avoided it when possible.

But, you feel good condemning others, hiding.

I haven’t condemned anyone and I haven’t hidden, not that there is anything wrong with hiding when confronted with danger.

 

[Matthias]

Well, take the martyr train down to martyr town

* The devil whispers in my ear. *

John 13:35 completes the Messiah’s thought.

 

[Wrangler]

Yes. Wait for him.

Agh, no. He does his part. We do our part:

1. Ask,
2. seek,
3. knock,
4. work to eat
5. buy swords,
6. train hands for war
7. baptize nations,
8. show faith by your works,
9. rebuke those in error
10. Prepare (not wait) for his return. Matthew 24:44

Christianity is a religion of action, not a philosophy to rationalize inaction and pacifism.


Always be ready! You don't know when the Son of Man will come.
Matthew 24:44 (CEV)

 

[Matthias]

Agh, no. He does his part. We do our part:

1. Ask,
2. seek,
3. knock,
4. work to eat
5. buy swords,
6. train hands for war
7. baptize nations,
8. show faith by your works,
9. rebuke those in error
10. Prepare (not wait) for his return. Matthew 24:44

Christianity is a religion of action, not a philosophy to rationalize inaction and pacifism.


Always be ready! You don't know when the Son of Man will come.
Matthew 24:44 (CEV)

Go ahead and try to conquer the nations with your weapons of the world then. You won’t get far.

”Those who use the sword perish by the sword.”

***

“Don’t wait for Jesus” is bad advice, readers.

The disciple’s job until the Messiah returns is to evangelize the world, not conquer the world.

 

[Wrangler]

I’ve witnessed in all of them, and did so without being armed

When I play with my grandchildren in their homes, I'm not armed either. What does that prove? The Crusades were not an act of witnessing.

The Crusades were a reaction to centuries of slaughter, enslavement, rape, pillage, plunder, forced conversion and conquest by Islamic Jihadi's against Christiandom. Finally, Christian soldiers from Christian nations took it to the enemy in their strongholds.

 

[Matthias]

When I play with my grandchildren in their homes, I'm not armed either. What does that prove?

Playing with your grandchildren in their homes doesn’t prove anything.

The Crusades were not an act of witnessing.

That’s right.

The Crusades were a reaction to centuries of slaughter, enslavement, rape, pillage, plunder, forced conversion and conquest by Islamic Jihadi's against Christiandom. Finally, Christian soldiers from Christian nations took it to the enemy in their strongholds.

The Crusaders treated their enemies the way their enemies treated them. They lived by the sword and perished by the sword. Even the pope apologized for the fourth Crusade.

The Crusaders killed men, women and children - Muslims, Jews, and Christians. They raped. They tortured. They plundered. Go and do likewise if you think they did well.

As you do, remember these words of Paul: “We do not use the weapons of the world”.

 

[Matthias]

For the second time today, AI offered me an overview; this time when I used a search engine for “The atrocities of the Crusaders” -

“The Crusades were marked by numerous atrocities, involving massacres, pillaging, and other brutal acts committed against Muslims, Jews, and even fellow Christians. These acts were widespread and occurred throughout the different crusading expeditions, often driven by religious zeal, a desire for plunder, and supply shortages.

Key atrocities include:

Massacres of Jewish communities: During the First Crusade, Crusader mobs massacred entire Jewish communities in the Rhineland cities of Speyer, Worms, and Mainz in 1096. Historians estimate as many as 10,000 Jews in Europe died during this wave of violence.

The Siege and Sack of Jerusalem (1099): After capturing Jerusalem, the Crusaders engaged in brutal massacre of its Muslim and Jewish inhabitants, with chroniclers describing piles of heads, hands, and feet in the streets. Estimates of the combined dead range in the thousands.

Cannibalism: Following the siege of Ma’arra in 1098, some starving Crusaders resorted to cannibalizing the bodies of dead Muslims. Reports of this barbarity were used as a weapon of psychological warfare to terrify other Muslim garrisons into surrender.

Massacres of fellow Christians: The Fourth Crusade (1202-1204) notoriously diverted its path to attack and sack the Orthodox Christian city of Constantinople. The Crusaders looted churches, destroyed holy relics, raped women, and killed thousands of Christians, actions that appalled even the Pope and permanently damaged relations between the Eastern and Western Churches.

The Albigensian Crusade (1209): Pipe Innocent III launched a crusade against the Cathar heretics in Southern France, which resulted in the massacre of thousands of men, women, and children with little regard for whether they were actual heretics or loyal Catholics. A papal legate at the siege of Beziers allegedly ordered, ‘Kill them all, God knows his own’.

Massacre of Prisoners of War: During the Third Crusade, after taking the city of Acre in 1191, King Richard I ordered the execution of approximately 2,700 Muslim prisoners, including women and children, after a ransom deal fell through.

General Brutality: Beyond large-scale massacres, the Crusades were characterized by constant, widespread violence, including torture, mutilation of captives, and indiscriminate pillaging of civilian populations for supplies.

These atrocities contributed to a legacy of distrust and hostility between the Christian, Muslim, and Jewish worlds that persists to some extent today.”

I don’t trust AI but what I was offered is consistent with what I’ve read about the Crusades.

You are there in spirit @Wrangler. This is what you are championing. This is what you are defending.

 

[JesusFan]

I had always heard about The Crusades in a negative way. But in this video, Bob from Speaker's Corner in London, explains why The Crusades started. They were in response to centuries of Islamic invasion of many Christian countries.

They were done to get back the holy city of jerusalem and to try to stop islam from taking over known world with their false religion

 

[Matthias]

The AI overview of the Crusades is reasonable but invest the time to read and study the history of the Crusades for yourself. It is Catholic history.

It isn’t a history to be proud of. It isn’t a history to be repeated. It isn’t a history that is compatible with the Messiah’s teaching. It isn’t a history to be celebrated. It isn’t a history to be defended.

This is not the behavior that the Messiah and the apostles instructed the disciples to engage in.

 

[Matthias]

They were done to get back the holy city of jerusalem and to try to stop islam from taking over known world with their false religion

In your opinion, is Catholic religion the true religion?

Is it the Messiah’s religion?

Could you be persuaded to do what the Crusaders did?

 

[Matthias]

As @Wrangler rightly said, the Crusaders weren’t witnessing. They were returning evil for evil and, in some cases, evil for good -> the exact opposite of what the Messiah’s disciples are instructed to do.

 

[Wrangler]

The Crusaders treated their enemies the way their enemies treated them. They lived by the sword and perished by the sword.

That’s where you are totally wrong! They lived by the sword, which is why Jesus commanded them to get one.

Christiandom was not over-run by the sword because brave men with arms stood up physically and violently to evil men with arms initiating violence against peaceful Christians.

I’m proud as can be of my Crusading ancestors. This generation of overly-spiritualized pacifists, not so much.

 

[Wrangler]

For the second time today, AI offered me an overview; this time when I used a search engine for “The atrocities of the Crusaders” -

Why not ask AI for the atrocities the Crusaders were reacting to? Arming yourself or educating yourself?

 

[Wrangler]

They were returning evil for evil

Jesus did not command us to get a sword to do evil. Civilization depends on righteous armed men to stand against evil armed men with manly resolve in preserving what matters more than life itself.

 

[Matthias]

That’s where you are totally wrong! They lived by the sword, which is why Jesus commanded them to get one.

The Crusaders lived by the sword and died by the sword. Jesus didn’t command them to do it.

Christiandom was not over-run by the sword because brave men with arms stood up physically and violently to evil men with arms initiating violence against peaceful Christians.

Brave Catholics defended the Western Empire and killed the brave Byzantines of the Eastern Empire, as well as Jews - who did what to them exactly? - and Muslims.

I’m proud as can be of my Crusading ancestors.

You are like them. AI provided a decent summary of their atrocities.

This generation of overly-spiritualized pacifists, not so much.

 

[Matthias]

Why not ask AI for the atrocities the Crusaders were reacting to?

We can do that. I’m sure AI would give us a decent summary of them.

Arming yourself or educating yourself?

Educating others.

 

[Matthias]

Jesus did not command us to get a sword to do evil.

Review again the atrocities which you are defending as good.

Civilization depends on righteous armed men to stand against evil armed men with manly resolve in preserving what matters more than life itself.

Civilization is doomed. Why? Because it depends on man, not on God and Messiah.

 

[Matthias]

“We do not use the weapons of the world.” - Paul

The Muslims did. The Crusaders did. The Byzantine Christians did.

What Paul taught on the matter made no difference to them. It makes no difference to those who urge us to emulate their action.

While others say in effect, “Boo that man; it’s impractical“- I say, ”Listen to Paul; follow his instruction.”