"Before Abraham Was, I AM"

[amigo de christo]

Now note which comes first in the covenant:
I will write my laws in their minds
And place them on their hearts
THEN HE ADDS
Their sins and lawless deeds I will remember no more/Jesus died for your sin s

You only get the second part because the first part has taken place, for Jesus will be no ones saviour from sin unless they in their heart desire to live as His father wants them to live

and no man can attain either the law upon the heart or forgivenss of sins
IF said one BELIEVES NOT ON JESUS the CHRIST . always remember that and keep
all hope IN Him .
THE SPIRIT would never call JESUS accursed . THE SPIRIT would , as you mentioned , NEVER
have allowed sin upon us , calling evil good and good evil . j ustifying sins and ev en unbeleif , COMETH NOT OF THE SPIRIT
THUS not of G OD . it cometh of the FLESH . As i am sure you already know that .

 

[amigo de christo]

We are to have the mind of Christ.....our minds need to be fed and illuminated by His Spirit (Tree of Life) to become the mind of Christ could we say?....not the Tree of dead carnal Knowledge. "Let this mind be in you, which also was in Christ Jesus....."

Oh yes indeed dear sister .
And THE MIND of CHRIST does not honor any sin , no lie , not unbelief .
Many follow another spirit all together . That while it has come under the guise it be of GOD , of CHRIST
MAN it sure dont behave as DID JESUS .
It will honor lies , it will contradict His words , His gospel .
He who sinned not . And yet their spirit has led them into acceptance OF certain sins and even unbeleief .
JESUS was to BE and should have been OUR EXAMPLE
Seeing no man has seen HIM
We have to ask ourselves , HOW do they know if they truly l ove HE who they cannot see
A hint . IF A MAN LOVES NOT TRUTH , HE LOVES NOT HE WHO IS TRUTH and WHO INSPIRED TRUTH .
HIS WORDS ARE TRUTH

 

[amigo de christo]

What are we His workmanship for?



I never feared God.
I always tried to live for Him.
I don't care for analogies - God is not human.
What you're doing is comparing the law to grace...
then just do that.


Paul said we are not to walk in the flesh but in the spirit.
He said this to Christians.

I've had this convo many times before and I don't understand where the nuance is....
it's a tiny nuance but it seems to make a difference.
(because we basically agree).

I agree.
Some change overnight....
and others take time.

I agree that IF YOU WOULD BE PERFECT implies willingness.
It would have been up to the Rich Man to go and sell everything...

But the Rich Young Man went away sad.


Lizabeth...I know you've been on these Forums a long time.
It's hard to believe you've just stated that.

Here's what I've heard/read:
1. So called believers stating that once they're saved they can never lose their salvation..
2. They could blasphem God and still be saved (those very words).
3. They don't need to do anything because God has done it all.
4. It's A SIN to try to help God with our good deeds - they are as filthy rags.




Are we going to get into HOW MANY SINS MUST I COMMIT BEFORE I'M CUT OFF...
??

These conversations could go on forever.
John said we will sin.
He said we have an advocate.
He said our sins will be forgiven.

Right.
God will not be mocked.
Let's make that clear in these threads?


Does my stating that we must obey God sound like it's a relationship of tryranny?
Or does it sound like it's GOD we're having this relationship with?

Please answer my simple question:

AFTER salvation,,,are we required to obey God.

I say Yes.

Jesus expects from us.


Matthew 25:14-30
14 "For it is just like a man about to go on a journey, who called his own slaves and entrusted his possessions to them.

15 "To one he gave five talents, to another *, two, and to another *, one, each according to his own ability; and he went on his journey.

16 "Immediately the one who had received the five talents went and traded with them, and gained five more talents.

17 "In the same manner the one who had received the two talents gained two more.

18 "But he who received the one talent went away, and dug a hole in the ground and hid his master's money.

19 "Now after a long time the master of those slaves came and settled accounts with them.

20 "The one who had received the five talents came up and brought five more talents, saying, 'Master, you entrusted five talents to me. See, I have gained five more talents.'

21 "His master said to him, 'Well done, good and faithful slave. You were faithful with a few things, I will put you in charge of many things; enter into the joy of your master.'

22 "Also the one who had received the two talents came up and said, 'Master, you entrusted two talents to me. See, I have gained two more talents.'

23 "His master said to him, 'Well done, good and faithful slave. You were faithful with a few things, I will put you in charge of many things; enter into the joy of your master.'

24 "And the one also who had received the one talent came up and said, 'Master, I knew you to be a hard man, reaping where you did not sow and gathering where you scattered no seed.

25 'And I was afraid, and went away and hid your talent in the ground. See, you have what is yours.'

26 "But his master answered and said to him, 'You wicked, lazy slave, you knew that I reap where I did not sow and gather where I scattered no seed.

27 'Then you ought to have put my money in the bank, and on my arrival I would have received my money back with interest.

28 'Therefore take away the talent from him, and give it to the one who has the ten talents.'

29 "For to everyone who has, more shall be given, and he will have an abundance; but from the one who does not have, even what he does have shall be taken away.

30 "Throw out the worthless slave into the outer darkness; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

his workman created unto GOOD and not evil works . And sin is evil , to preach unbeleif is dire wicked .

 

[saved by grace 101]

The carnal mind is ENMITY with God, and can't perceive the things of God. I wonder then why many rely on it so much. They do so to their peril. The deity of Christ is revealed through many scriptures by the Holy Spirit.....even the old testament testifies as to Who Christ is. Our brains of flesh are "weak" as is all of our flesh...too weak to grasp things of the Spirit. We always need ears to hear and eyes to see, which comes only from the Spirit of God/Christ. "Blessed are you Simon Bar Jonah for man did not REVEAL this to you, but my Father in heaven." We sure do need to be careful of the teachings of man.

You write many good posts, most better than me, so I will ask you something. I believe the Holy Spirit fully resides in Christ. I would say just about every christian I know would either term it the Holy Spirit fully resides in Christ or the father fully resides in Christ. I'm sure that is what you believe, and every other equal trinitarian believes on this website.
Therefore, the difference in opinion does not concern the essence of Christ but his title. Now Im a simple person, but in the circumstances, to say it is not enough to title Christ the son of God is mind boggling to me. This is the title laid down by Christ himself and the Apostles that must be given to Christ to be saved.
And no one is going to be condemned for believing the title Christ himself laid down as who he must be believed to be to inherit eternal life. I hope you would agree with that
This subject may be envigorating to many on the internet, but in over forty years of going to various trinitarian denominational churches I have only ever come across one minister who actually stated from the pulpit Christ is God Himself and everyone should believe it. He was an assistant pastor fresh out of bible college. I rang a friend who had also been to trinitarian churches for over forty years. He hadn't heard it stated either from the pulpit Christ is God Himself

 

[keithr]

Is God not able to do what He wishes to do?
Why do you limit the powers of God?

God is immortal, which means that it is impossible for him to die or be killed. That means that He can't change His own nature to become a mortal human. He could, like the angels, appear to humans by creating and animating a human body, and then dissolving it away, but that would not be a suitable sacrifice for God to justify restoring Adam to life. God states that perfect justice is an equal life for a life. God wished to save Adam, and all mankind, so He devised a way to do that - John 3:16 WEB

(16) For God so loved the world, that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have eternal life.​

Let's see what Jesus says about His immortality:

John 2:18-22
18 The Jews then said to Him, "What sign do You show us as your authority for doing these things?"
19 Jesus answered them, "Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up."
20 The Jews then said, "It took forty-six * * years to build this temple, and will You raise it up in three days?"
21 But He was speaking of the temple of His body.
22 So when He was raised from the dead,

Do you believe Jesus?

Of course I believe Jesus.

Jesus stated that 3 days after His destruction, He would raise Himself up.

HOW does a dead person raise themselves from the dead?

Jesus spoke the words that God told him to speak (John 14:10, John 12:50). I therefore believe that as a prophet he was speaking God 's word to them, i.e. that it was God declaring through Jesus that if they killed Jesus, who was a temple for God's Holy Spirit, then God would raise him up after three days. That is consistent with later verses. Jesus did not raise himself from death, it was God, His Father, that resurrected Jesus:

Acts 2:24 WEB

(24) whom God raised up, having freed him from the agony of death, because it was not possible that he should be held by it.​

Acts 3:14-15 WEB

(14) But you denied the Holy and Righteous One, and asked for a murderer to be granted to you,​

(15) and killed the Prince of life, whom God raised from the dead, to which we are witnesses.​

Acts 4:10 WEB

(10) be it known to you all, and to all the people of Israel, that in the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified, whom God raised from the dead, in him does this man stand here before you whole.​

Acts 13:30 WEB

(30) But God raised him from the dead,​

Romans 4:24 WEB

(24) but for our sake also, to whom it will be accounted, who believe in him who raised Jesus, our Lord, from the dead,​

Romans 6:4 WEB

(4) We were buried therefore with him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, so we also might walk in newness of life.​

Romans 8:11 WEB

(11) But if the Spirit of him who raised up Jesus from the dead dwells in you, he who raised up Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit who dwells in you.​

Romans 10:9 WEB

(9) that if you will confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.​

Galatians 1:1 WEB

(1) Paul, an apostle (not from men, nor through man, but through Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised him from the dead),​

Ephesians 1:20 WEB

(20) which he worked in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and made him to sit at his right hand in the heavenly places,​

1 Thessalonians 1:10 WEB

(10) and to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead—Jesus, who delivers us from the wrath to come.​

1 Peter 1:21 WEB

(21) who through him are believers in God, who raised him from the dead, and gave him glory; so that your faith and hope might be in God.​

Not once does it say in the Scriptures that Jesus raised himself from death (which is impossible - Ecclesiastes 9:10 WEB "there is no work, nor plan, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in Sheol, where you are going", Psalms 146:4 WEB "His spirit departs, and he returns to the earth. In that very day, his thoughts perish").

So you're a believer in the Old Testament and believe in its Laws,
so why do you call yourself a Christian??

Of course I believe the Old Testament - the larger part of God's word to us. You can't be a Christian if you don't believe the Old Testament. Jesus believed the Old Testament and frequently quoted from it. As Jesus said, Matthew 5:17 WEB

(17) “Don’t think that I came to destroy the law or the prophets. I didn’t come to destroy, but to fulfill.​

Here is what Jesus taught:

Matthew 5:
38 "You have heard that it was said, 'AN EYE FOR AN EYE, AND A TOOTH FOR A TOOTH.'
39 "But I say to you, do not resist an evil person; but whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also.
40 "If anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, let him have your coat also.
41 "Whoever forces you to go one mile, go with him two.

Jesus teaching that we should forgive people doesn't mean that God should go against His stated perfect justice. If the penalty for sin is death, then the just price ro redeem that person from death is the death of an equal person (not a sinful person for a sinless person, but a sinless person for a sinless person - Adam was sinless until he sinned).

The Old Testament teaches that GOD HIMSELF will save His people and will change thier heart from stone to flesh.

It also says "to us a child is born. To us a son is given" (Isaiah 9:6) and Luke 2:11 WEB

(11) For there is born to you today, in David’s city, a Savior, who is Christ the Lord.​

1 John 4:14 WEB

(14) We have seen and testify that the Father has sent the Son as the Savior of the world.​

Acts 5:30-31 MKJV

(30) The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom you killed and hanged on a tree.​

(31) This One God has exalted to be a Ruler and Savior to His right hand in order to give repentance and remission of sins to Israel.​

God Himself sent His Son as a man, raised him to life again after he was killed, and exalted him to be king of His Kingdom.

You say God cannot become a man....
You limit the powers of God.

No I don't limit God's powers, I just acknowledge what God says about his nature, that He is immortal. God cannot change Himself to be mortal because by definition that would mean that He is not immortal!

God can do whatever He wishes to do.

Within reason. God also can't lie - Titus 1:2 WEB

(2) in hope of eternal life, which God, who can’t lie, promised before time began;​

Oh ....you have a problem with Philippians?

No.

Paul believed Jesus to be God incarnate.

Where does he state that?

Why would he then In Philippians 2 make any statement that was contrary? Did Paul want to contradict himself?

No Paul does not contradict himself.

Ephesians 1:1-3 WEB

(1) Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus through the will of God, to the saints who are at Ephesus, and the faithful in Christ Jesus:​

(2) Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.​

(3) Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ;​

1 Corinthians 8:6 WEB

(6) yet to us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we for him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and we live through him.​

Paul believed Jesus was God by referring to Him in that way.

Romans 10:13
13 for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

You're probably confused by the translation, with the translators wrongly replacing God's name with LORD which leads many people to think that calling Jesus a lord means that he was God, which is incorrect. In this case, Paul was quoting Joel 2:32 WEB

(32) It will happen that whoever will call on Yahweh’s name shall be saved; for in Mount Zion and in Jerusalem there will be those who escape, as Yahweh has said, and among the remnant, those whom Yahweh calls.​

So Paul is referring to God, not Jesus, in this verse.

Joel 2:31-32
31 The sun will be turned to darkness and the moon to blood before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD.
32 And everyone who calls on the name of the LORD will be saved;

There you go! You quoted it yourself. It says LORD in the translation you copied, which indicates that is should be "who calls on the name of YHVH".

 

[BreadOfLife]

Then you start a thread. You want to explain catholic doctrine, you are the expert, not me. Just tell me where the thread is and I will join you

Ummm, YOU'RE the one who challenged me and my Catholic beliefs if you want answers - then YOU need to start a new thread . . .

 

[saved by grace 101]

Ummm, YOU'RE the one who challenged me and my Catholic beliefs if you want answers - then YOU need to start a new thread . . .

Im not surprised you are reticent to start a thread. In many years on these kinds of websites Ive never come across any catholic who started a thread on justification. We can only discuss the subject if you put your beliefs up concerning it. BTW, hope you see now 2Cor3:6-9 does NOT refer to to the mosaic law of rite, ritual and ceremony. So some good may have come out of our brief discussion.

 

[Justified]

I believe the Holy Spirit fully resides in Christ. I would say just about every christian I know would either term it the Holy Spirit fully resides in Christ or the father fully resides in Christ. I'm sure that is what you believe, and every other equal trinitarian believes on this website.

Do you believe the Holy Spirit is the Father? The Bible teaches that both the Father and the Holy Spirit are in Christ, although it was the Son who was incarnate:

Luk 3:21 Now when all the people were baptized, and when Jesus also had been baptized and was praying, the heavens were opened,
Luk 3:22 and the Holy Spirit descended on him in bodily form, like a dove; and a voice came from heaven, “You are my beloved Son; with you I am well pleased.”

Luk 4:1 And Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, returned from the Jordan and was led by the Spirit in the wilderness

Joh 14:10 Do you not believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on my own authority, but the Father who dwells in me does his works.
Joh 14:11 Believe me that I am in the Father and the Father is in me, or else believe on account of the works themselves.

Gal 4:4 But when the fullness of time had come, God sent forth his Son, born of woman, born under the law,

 

[Justified]

1 Corinthians 8:6 WEB

(6) yet to us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we for him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and we live through him.​

Do you not believe that the Son has always existed, that he is also God in nature? If not, I would suggest looking closer at what this verse is saying:

1Co 8:6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist.

You're probably confused by the translation, with the translators wrongly replacing God's name with LORD which leads many people to think that calling Jesus a lord means that he was God, which is incorrect. In this case, Paul was quoting Joel 2:32 WEB

(32) It will happen that whoever will call on Yahweh’s name shall be saved; for in Mount Zion and in Jerusalem there will be those who escape, as Yahweh has said, and among the remnant, those whom Yahweh calls.​

So Paul is referring to God, not Jesus, in this verse.


There you go! You quoted it yourself. It says LORD in the translation you copied, which indicates that is should be "who calls on the name of YHVH".

The line of argument from Paul is pretty straightforward:

Rom 10:9 because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
Rom 10:10 For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved.
Rom 10:11 For the Scripture says, “Everyone who believes in him will not be put to shame.”
Rom 10:12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, bestowing his riches on all who call on him.
Rom 10:13 For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

Each "for" links to the previous statement, creating a chain of thought for his argument, from verse 9 to verse 13. Paul is therefore applying Joel 2:32 to Jesus, that calling on his name is the same as calling on the name of Yahweh. It is the Septuagint that uses "Lord," kyrios, in the OT in the place of YHWH, over 6,000 times. But you probably knew that. While it does have other meanings that are used of Christ, there are instances where the meaning of LORD (YHWH), is applied directly to him.

Here, Paul's application of Joel 2:32, as it would read in the LXX, is to ascribe deity to Jesus, by the line of thought he develops from verse 9 to verse 13--confessing Jesus is Lord is to call on the name of the Lord and be saved.

 

[amigo de christo]

You write many good posts, most better than me, so I will ask you something. I believe the Holy Spirit fully resides in Christ. I would say just about every christian I know would either term it the Holy Spirit fully resides in Christ or the father fully resides in Christ. I'm sure that is what you believe, and every other equal trinitarian believes on this website.
Therefore, the difference in opinion does not concern the essence of Christ but his title. Now Im a simple person, but in the circumstances, to say it is not enough to title Christ the son of God is mind boggling to me. This is the title laid down by Christ himself and the Apostles that must be given to Christ to be saved.
And no one is going to be condemned for believing the title Christ himself laid down as who he must be believed to be to inherit eternal life. I hope you would agree with that
This subject may be envigorating to many on the internet, but in over forty years of going to various trinitarian denominational churches I have only ever come across one minister who actually stated from the pulpit Christ is God Himself and everyone should believe it. He was an assistant pastor fresh out of bible college. I rang a friend who had also been to trinitarian churches for over forty years. He hadn't heard it stated either from the pulpit Christ is God Himself

It is enough to TITLE HIM the SON OF GOD. however never deny the d iety of CHRIST .
John wrote and said BELEIVE HE IS the CHRIST the SON OF GOD .
SO to call HIM SON OF GOD is a right and true statment indeed .
But if one then turns around and tries to DENY the WORD was GOD , well then i would shudder for such a man .
BUT YES . HIS TITLES are SON OF GOD , CHRIST , WORD OF GOD and others too .

 

[saved by grace 101]

Do you believe the Holy Spirit is the Father? The Bible teaches that both the Father and the Holy Spirit are in Christ, although it was the Son who was incarnate:

Luk 3:21 Now when all the people were baptized, and when Jesus also had been baptized and was praying, the heavens were opened,
Luk 3:22 and the Holy Spirit descended on him in bodily form, like a dove; and a voice came from heaven, “You are my beloved Son; with you I am well pleased.”

Luk 4:1 And Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, returned from the Jordan and was led by the Spirit in the wilderness

Joh 14:10 Do you not believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on my own authority, but the Father who dwells in me does his works.
Joh 14:11 Believe me that I am in the Father and the Father is in me, or else believe on account of the works themselves.

Gal 4:4 But when the fullness of time had come, God sent forth his Son, born of woman, born under the law,

I believe some people have heads so crammed full of theology there is no room left for discernment

 

[amigo de christo]

John17:21

notice he said so that THE WORLD may BELEIVE that you have sent ME .
not so that they can all find common ground and that all religions serve the same GOD differently .
Verily verily i say unto thee , GET THEM OUT of anything tied into ecumenicalism and do not wait
for the morrow either . GET them out . That is a harlots love meant only to gather ALL of the decieved to be as one .
GET THEM OUT and allow not the ecumenical intefaith lie of anti christ upon them .

 

[saved by grace 101]

notice he said so that THE WORLD may BELEIVE that you have sent ME .
not so that they can all find common ground and that all religions serve the same GOD differently .
Verily verily i say unto thee , GET THEM OUT of anything tied into ecumenicalism and do not wait
for the morrow either . GET them out . That is a harlots love meant only to gather ALL of the decieved to be as one .
GET THEM OUT and allow not the ecumenical intefaith lie of anti christ upon them .

He said: JUST AS you are in me and I am in you may they(believers) also be in us
How can believers be in Father and Son?

 

[Justified]

John17:21

Okay. What do you mean by posting that?

I believe some people have heads so crammed full of theology there is no room left for discernment

Okay. I'm not sure what that has to do with my post. Are you saying that theology is not important for discernment? What is your definition of discernment?

 

[saved by grace 101]

Okay. What do you mean by posting that?


Okay. I'm not sure what that has to do with my post. Are you saying that theology is not important for discernment? What is your definition of discernment?

Theology where man studies endlessly relying on his academic mind to learn is a waste of time. The person who humbly relies on the Holy Spirit to lead them into truth, not themselves will not waste their time

 

[Justified]

Theology where man studies endlessly relying on his academic mind to learn is a waste of time. The person who humbly relies on the Holy Spirit to lead them into truth, not themselves will not waste their time

Where does the Bible teach both of those things?

 

[saved by grace 101]

Where does the Bible teach both of those things?

But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all the truth. John16:13
I will destroy the wisdom of the wise;
the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate.”[c]
20 Where is the wise person? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? 1Cor1:19-21
My message and my preaching were not with wise and persuasive words, but with a demonstration of the Spirit’s power, 5 so that your faith might not rest on human wisdom, but on God’s power. 1Cor2:4&5
and again, “The Lord knows that the thoughts of the wise are futile 1Cor3:20

 

[BreadOfLife]

Im not surprised you are reticent to start a thread. In many years on these kinds of websites Ive never come across any catholic who started a thread on justification. We can only discuss the subject if you put your beliefs up concerning it. BTW, hope you see now 2Cor3:6-9 does NOT refer to to the mosaic law of rite, ritual and ceremony. So some good may have come out of our brief discussion.

Nice try – but I’m not susceptible to reverse psychological tricks. You won’t start a thread because you don’t have the ammunition.

Like I said – you’re new here, so you don’t understand why I’m here - NOT to pick fights or starts threads.
I’ve explained on many occasions that I am here SOLELY to dispel myths and blatant lies about the Catholic Church vomited out by hateful or otherwise ignorant anti-Catholics.
You’re like cowardly dive bombers who shoot and fly away . . .

 

[Justified]

But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all the truth. John16:13

Which he spoke to the disciples, the outcome of which is the Bible. So that is rather a circular argument.

I will destroy the wisdom of the wise;
the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate.”[c]
20 Where is the wise person? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? 1Cor1:19-21
My message and my preaching were not with wise and persuasive words, but with a demonstration of the Spirit’s power, 5 so that your faith might not rest on human wisdom, but on God’s power. 1Cor2:4&5
and again, “The Lord knows that the thoughts of the wise are futile 1Cor3:20

Yes, this is speaking of worldly wisdom, which leads to foolishness (Rom. 1:22). The Bible says much about godly wisdom. Why does Paul tell us to use wisdom and to walk in wisdom?

Col 3:16 Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God.

Col 4:5 Walk in wisdom toward outsiders, making the best use of the time.


Why do you think that James tells us to pray for wisdom from God and to be wise?

Jas 1:5 If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask God, who gives generously to all without reproach, and it will be given him.

Jas 3:13 Who is wise and understanding among you? By his good conduct let him show his works in the meekness of wisdom.

Jas 3:17 But the wisdom from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, open to reason, full of mercy and good fruits, impartial and sincere.


Could Paul and James say those things because of what Jesus said?

Mat 22:37 And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.


Christians are supposed to fully engage their minds in the reading and understanding of Scripture, with the help of the Holy Spirit. We are never to simply "rely on the Holy Spirit." God gave us minds for a reason, being created in his image--he will never bypass our minds, as he fully expects us to use them.

That is also why Paul made it his custom to reason with the Jews on the Sabbath (Acts 17:2, 17; 18:4, 19; 19:8-9; 24:25). Reasoning is to use logic and argument to try and persuade. It is what all believers are to do:

1Pe 3:15 but in your hearts honor Christ the Lord as holy, always being prepared to make a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you; yet do it with gentleness and respect,


So, where does the Bible teach that studying and "relying on his academic mind to learn is a waste of time," and that all we need to do is "humbly [rely] on the Holy Spirit" to be led into truth? Where are those made mutually exclusive?

Of course, this is all off-topic from what you said and I responded with: "Before Abraham Was, I AM"

 

[XtraPercept]

We are to have the mind of Christ.....our minds need to be fed and illuminated by His Spirit (Tree of Life) to become the mind of Christ could we say?....not the Tree of dead carnal Knowledge. "Let this mind be in you, which also was in Christ Jesus....."

How are you going to express the right words but from the wrong idea in disagreement with me?

How is it carnal to make sense of what a "spirit" is?

You really want to believe in ghosts and goblins and call yourself pious for it?

God makes so much more sense when you stop pursuing such irrational thinking.