Do you admit that the gospel cannot change the world?

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lforrest

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The gospel should change us, but we cannot change the world. Therefore, the gospel cannot change the world. Even those who have heard the gospel might be changed by the world, and then they might go on to change the true meaning of the gospel.
I'm not sure how you were expecting the world to be changed. It wasn't going to turn into a utopia. Man isn't even going to build a Holy nation. All prior attempts have failed.

The world tries to shape people with violence into conforming them to fit into certain roles. But God uses fallible people that he has been in the process of shaping for their entire lives. With these people he is building a kingdom by his own hands.

This world is like a ruin from which God is taking building material. But we see the love of Christians influencing the world around us still, while we remain here. The only lasting result of that is in the kingdom though. As this world is temporary.
 

Rotsen777

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Hasn't it already done just that, and for the better? Contrast the world before and after Christianity. It was a much more violent world prior to Christianity, with little room for compassion. Compare and contrast Christian nations (at least culturally) to non-Christian nations. They have fewer freedoms, less prosperity, more chaos, etc. The world is still in a fallen state, granted, but Christianity has been a light to the world.
What Christianity are you referring to, the denominations?
 

soberxp

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Hasn't it already done just that, and for the better? Contrast the world before and after Christianity. It was a much more violent world prior to Christianity, with little room for compassion. Compare and contrast Christian nations (at least culturally) to non-Christian nations. They have fewer freedoms, less prosperity, more chaos, etc. The world is still in a fallen state, granted, but Christianity has been a light to the world.
70% of the people on this forum are in favor of the war.
You think this is better than what you described.
 

soberxp

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Rotsen777

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Are we in the NT period?
 

soberxp

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Is the end time the same as the last day, which is in the NT where we are in right now?
We are near the Revelation 9:15,
And the four angels were loosed, which were prepared for an hour, and a day, and a month, and a year, for to slay the third part of men.
 

Rotsen777

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We are near the Revelation 9:15,
And the four angels were loosed, which were prepared for an hour, and a day, and a month, and a year, for to slay the third part of men.
How did you know that? Are you a messenger of God?
 

soberxp

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How did you know that?
By reading Revelation Chapter 8 and combining some knowledge, as well as having an overall understanding of the Bible.

Genesis 1:28
And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

"and subdue it": should translated into "govern this earth". Or understand the meaning for "life system".

Revelation 8:9
And the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed.


Marine life is generally divided into three broad categories based on their ecological habits and distribution in the ocean:

1. **Plankton**
These organisms are usually tiny and invisible to the naked eye (though some, like jellyfish, can be large). They have little or no ability to swim and simply drift with the currents. Examples include phytoplankton (diatoms, dinoflagellates) and zooplankton (copepods, krill, jellyfish).

2. **Nekton**
These organisms possess well-developed swimming organs and can actively and swiftly move through the water column, overcoming currents. This group contains the most familiar marine animals. Examples include fish (tuna, cod), marine mammals (whales, dolphins), reptiles (sea turtles), and cephalopods (squid, octopus).

3. **Benthos**
These organisms live on, in, or near the seabed (including the ocean floor and within bottom sediments). They may be attached to the bottom, crawl slowly, or burrow into the sand or mud. Examples include starfish, sea cucumbers, shellfish (clams, oysters), crabs, seaweed (like kelp), and corals.


Ships at sea can be broadly divided into the following three categories based on their usage:

1. Civilian Transport Vessels (Merchant Ships)
2. **Military Vessels (Warships)**
3. **Working Ships (Special

The harm caused by human domestic waste to marine life is comprehensive and long-lasting, far beyond the shocking images and news we commonly see. It brings not only physical fatal injuries but also profoundly disrupts the balance of the entire marine ecosystem.

Based on current scientific research, these harms can be summarized in the following aspects:

### Physical Harm: Entanglement, Ingestion, and Suffocation

This is the most direct and tragic form of harm.

- **Lethal Entanglement**: Abandoned fishing gear (known as "ghost fishing nets"), plastic packaging straps, etc., act like traps, ensnaring marine mammals, sea turtles, and fish. Unable to break free, they suffer injuries, drown, cannot hunt, and ultimately die. It is estimated that this leads to death in sea turtles with a probability as high as **91%**.

- **Ingestion and Blockage**: Many marine animals mistake plastic for food. For example, sea turtles cannot distinguish between jellyfish and plastic bags, and whales, seabirds also ingest large quantities of plastic fragments. This debris blocks their digestive tracts, creates a false sense of fullness, prevents them from eating, and eventually leads to death from **starvation and malnutrition**. The stomach of a stranded whale was once found to contain a giant帆布袋 measuring **88 cm × 52 cm**, and over **nearly 6 jin (approx. 3 kg)** of marine debris was removed from another sea turtle. Research shows that ingesting just one piece of plastic increases a sea turtle's risk of death by **22%**.

- **Smothering and Suffocation**: Heavy plastic debris or fishing nets sinking to the seabed can blanket coral reefs like a carpet, blocking sunlight, hindering water flow and oxygen exchange, leading to coral bleaching and even large-scale death. Coral reefs are the "rainforests of the sea," and their decline signifies the loss of habitat for countless marine species.

- **Impeding Escape**: A recent study found that debris settled on the seafloor, such as **just 5 plastic bags**, can clog the mesh of trawl nets once caught, preventing small fish and shrimp that would otherwise escape from fleeing, thereby delivering a double blow to fishery resources and the ecosystem.

### Disruption of the Deeper Ecosystem

Plastic pollution is fundamentally altering the survival rules for marine life, introducing deeper ecological problems.

- **Creating an "Invasion Express"**: Marine debris provides a "ride" and new habitats for coastal organisms (like certain sea anemones) that couldn't previously cross vast oceans. They can attach to plastic, drift across the sea, and "settle" in new waters, becoming **invasive alien species** and threatening local ecological balance.

- **Falling into an "Evolutionary Trap"**: After soaking in seawater, plastic becomes coated with algae and microorganisms, emitting smells that mimic food, tricking animals like sea turtles into ingesting it. This is a prime example of how rapid environmental change can disrupt biological behavior.

### Chemical Contamination: The Insidious Spread of Microplastics and Toxins

Invisible tiny particles are quietly infiltrating up the food chain.

- **Microplastics are Everywhere**: Larger plastic items break down over time due to sun and waves into pieces smaller than 5 mm called "microplastics," and even smaller "nanoplastics." They are found everywhere, from the sea surface and seabed to ice cores in the Arctic and Antarctic.

- **Bioaccumulation and Toxicity**:
- **Direct Harm**: When ingested by organisms from plankton to fish, microplastics can cause **physiological damage at the cellular level, potentially affecting reproductive capacity**.
- **"Toxin Taxis"**: The additives within plastics themselves, along with heavy metals and organic pollutants absorbed from seawater, can be carried by microplastics into organisms. These toxins are then **transferred and concentrated as they move up the food chain**. The highest concentrations of toxic substances are often found in top predators (including humans).


Reports on the discharge of nuclear-contaminated water from the Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Power Station into the sea leading to the deaths of a large number of marine life

| Date | Location | Species and Scale | Official or Expert Explanation for Possible Cause |
| :--- | :--- | :--- | :--- |
| **December 2023** | Coast of **Hakodate, Hokkaido**, Japan | A large number of **sardine** carcasses washed ashore, stretching for about 1 kilometer. | Oxygen deficiency, a sharp drop in seawater temperature, or being chased by predators into shallow waters leading to suffocation. |
| **December 2023** | **Wagu Fishing Port, Shima City, Mie Prefecture**, Japan | A massive die-off of fish, mainly **sardines**, with over **85 tons** recovered, so many that fishing boats couldn't go out. | The local government did not clarify the cause; some analyses pointed to environmental factors similar to those in Hokkaido. |
| **March 2023** | Coast of **Sado City, Niigata Prefecture**, Japan | A large number of **firefly squid** stranded and died, with carcasses stretching over 200 meters. | Possibly due to disorientation caused by changes in water temperature or ocean currents during spawning season, eventually being washed ashore by waves. |
| **August 2023** | Southern sea areas like **Yeosu City, South Korea** | Over **1 million** farmed **rockfish** died. | Mainly attributed to **abnormally high seawater temperatures** (heat stress). The news of the Fukushima water discharge also led to their **stagnant sales**, forcing fish to be overcrowded in net cages, exacerbating the die-off. |

### How to Rationally View These Phenomena?

Faced with these shocking scenes, it's only human to connect them to the "nuclear-contaminated water." However, scientifically, we need to distinguish between "correlation" and "causation":

1. **Direct link between events and the water discharge cannot be confirmed**: Although the long-term hazards of nuclear-contaminated water cannot be ignored, the large-scale die-offs mentioned above all have more direct scientific explanations that fit the local environment at the time, such as **drastic changes in seawater temperature, oxygen deficiency, biological habits**, etc. Currently, **no peer-reviewed scientific report attributes these specific events to the Fukushima water discharge**. The Japanese government also strongly denies this connection.

2. **"Indirect impacts" are already evident**: While it cannot be proven that the water discharge directly "poisoned" the fish, its "indirect impacts" are real. As seen in the case of the South Korean rockfish, the **consumer panic and market stagnation** triggered by the news of the discharge led to a backlog of live fish, which ultimately died due to high temperatures. This economic "butterfly effect" is also a tangible consequence of the water discharge.

3. **Science requires time and continuous monitoring**: The discharge of nuclear-contaminated water is a process that will last for 30 years. The true impact on the marine ecosystem may not manifest in the dramatic form of "short-term mass deaths," but more as **long-term, low-dose cumulative effects**. For example, this could include bioaccumulation through the food chain, effects on the reproductive capacity of organisms, or chronic processes leading to genetic damage.



Are you a messenger of God?
Perhaps.
 

Rotsen777

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By reading Revelation Chapter 8 and combining some knowledge, as well as having an overall understanding of the Bible.

Genesis 1:28
And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

"and subdue it": should translated into "govern this earth". Or understand the meaning for "life system".

Revelation 8:9
And the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed.


Marine life is generally divided into three broad categories based on their ecological habits and distribution in the ocean:

1. **Plankton**
These organisms are usually tiny and invisible to the naked eye (though some, like jellyfish, can be large). They have little or no ability to swim and simply drift with the currents. Examples include phytoplankton (diatoms, dinoflagellates) and zooplankton (copepods, krill, jellyfish).

2. **Nekton**
These organisms possess well-developed swimming organs and can actively and swiftly move through the water column, overcoming currents. This group contains the most familiar marine animals. Examples include fish (tuna, cod), marine mammals (whales, dolphins), reptiles (sea turtles), and cephalopods (squid, octopus).

3. **Benthos**
These organisms live on, in, or near the seabed (including the ocean floor and within bottom sediments). They may be attached to the bottom, crawl slowly, or burrow into the sand or mud. Examples include starfish, sea cucumbers, shellfish (clams, oysters), crabs, seaweed (like kelp), and corals.


Ships at sea can be broadly divided into the following three categories based on their usage:

1. Civilian Transport Vessels (Merchant Ships)
2. **Military Vessels (Warships)**
3. **Working Ships (Special

The harm caused by human domestic waste to marine life is comprehensive and long-lasting, far beyond the shocking images and news we commonly see. It brings not only physical fatal injuries but also profoundly disrupts the balance of the entire marine ecosystem.

Based on current scientific research, these harms can be summarized in the following aspects:

### Physical Harm: Entanglement, Ingestion, and Suffocation

This is the most direct and tragic form of harm.

- **Lethal Entanglement**: Abandoned fishing gear (known as "ghost fishing nets"), plastic packaging straps, etc., act like traps, ensnaring marine mammals, sea turtles, and fish. Unable to break free, they suffer injuries, drown, cannot hunt, and ultimately die. It is estimated that this leads to death in sea turtles with a probability as high as **91%**.

- **Ingestion and Blockage**: Many marine animals mistake plastic for food. For example, sea turtles cannot distinguish between jellyfish and plastic bags, and whales, seabirds also ingest large quantities of plastic fragments. This debris blocks their digestive tracts, creates a false sense of fullness, prevents them from eating, and eventually leads to death from **starvation and malnutrition**. The stomach of a stranded whale was once found to contain a giant帆布袋 measuring **88 cm × 52 cm**, and over **nearly 6 jin (approx. 3 kg)** of marine debris was removed from another sea turtle. Research shows that ingesting just one piece of plastic increases a sea turtle's risk of death by **22%**.

- **Smothering and Suffocation**: Heavy plastic debris or fishing nets sinking to the seabed can blanket coral reefs like a carpet, blocking sunlight, hindering water flow and oxygen exchange, leading to coral bleaching and even large-scale death. Coral reefs are the "rainforests of the sea," and their decline signifies the loss of habitat for countless marine species.

- **Impeding Escape**: A recent study found that debris settled on the seafloor, such as **just 5 plastic bags**, can clog the mesh of trawl nets once caught, preventing small fish and shrimp that would otherwise escape from fleeing, thereby delivering a double blow to fishery resources and the ecosystem.

### Disruption of the Deeper Ecosystem

Plastic pollution is fundamentally altering the survival rules for marine life, introducing deeper ecological problems.

- **Creating an "Invasion Express"**: Marine debris provides a "ride" and new habitats for coastal organisms (like certain sea anemones) that couldn't previously cross vast oceans. They can attach to plastic, drift across the sea, and "settle" in new waters, becoming **invasive alien species** and threatening local ecological balance.

- **Falling into an "Evolutionary Trap"**: After soaking in seawater, plastic becomes coated with algae and microorganisms, emitting smells that mimic food, tricking animals like sea turtles into ingesting it. This is a prime example of how rapid environmental change can disrupt biological behavior.

### Chemical Contamination: The Insidious Spread of Microplastics and Toxins

Invisible tiny particles are quietly infiltrating up the food chain.

- **Microplastics are Everywhere**: Larger plastic items break down over time due to sun and waves into pieces smaller than 5 mm called "microplastics," and even smaller "nanoplastics." They are found everywhere, from the sea surface and seabed to ice cores in the Arctic and Antarctic.

- **Bioaccumulation and Toxicity**:
- **Direct Harm**: When ingested by organisms from plankton to fish, microplastics can cause **physiological damage at the cellular level, potentially affecting reproductive capacity**.
- **"Toxin Taxis"**: The additives within plastics themselves, along with heavy metals and organic pollutants absorbed from seawater, can be carried by microplastics into organisms. These toxins are then **transferred and concentrated as they move up the food chain**. The highest concentrations of toxic substances are often found in top predators (including humans).


Reports on the discharge of nuclear-contaminated water from the Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Power Station into the sea leading to the deaths of a large number of marine life

| Date | Location | Species and Scale | Official or Expert Explanation for Possible Cause |
| :--- | :--- | :--- | :--- |
| **December 2023** | Coast of **Hakodate, Hokkaido**, Japan | A large number of **sardine** carcasses washed ashore, stretching for about 1 kilometer. | Oxygen deficiency, a sharp drop in seawater temperature, or being chased by predators into shallow waters leading to suffocation. |
| **December 2023** | **Wagu Fishing Port, Shima City, Mie Prefecture**, Japan | A massive die-off of fish, mainly **sardines**, with over **85 tons** recovered, so many that fishing boats couldn't go out. | The local government did not clarify the cause; some analyses pointed to environmental factors similar to those in Hokkaido. |
| **March 2023** | Coast of **Sado City, Niigata Prefecture**, Japan | A large number of **firefly squid** stranded and died, with carcasses stretching over 200 meters. | Possibly due to disorientation caused by changes in water temperature or ocean currents during spawning season, eventually being washed ashore by waves. |
| **August 2023** | Southern sea areas like **Yeosu City, South Korea** | Over **1 million** farmed **rockfish** died. | Mainly attributed to **abnormally high seawater temperatures** (heat stress). The news of the Fukushima water discharge also led to their **stagnant sales**, forcing fish to be overcrowded in net cages, exacerbating the die-off. |

### How to Rationally View These Phenomena?

Faced with these shocking scenes, it's only human to connect them to the "nuclear-contaminated water." However, scientifically, we need to distinguish between "correlation" and "causation":

1. **Direct link between events and the water discharge cannot be confirmed**: Although the long-term hazards of nuclear-contaminated water cannot be ignored, the large-scale die-offs mentioned above all have more direct scientific explanations that fit the local environment at the time, such as **drastic changes in seawater temperature, oxygen deficiency, biological habits**, etc. Currently, **no peer-reviewed scientific report attributes these specific events to the Fukushima water discharge**. The Japanese government also strongly denies this connection.

2. **"Indirect impacts" are already evident**: While it cannot be proven that the water discharge directly "poisoned" the fish, its "indirect impacts" are real. As seen in the case of the South Korean rockfish, the **consumer panic and market stagnation** triggered by the news of the discharge led to a backlog of live fish, which ultimately died due to high temperatures. This economic "butterfly effect" is also a tangible consequence of the water discharge.

3. **Science requires time and continuous monitoring**: The discharge of nuclear-contaminated water is a process that will last for 30 years. The true impact on the marine ecosystem may not manifest in the dramatic form of "short-term mass deaths," but more as **long-term, low-dose cumulative effects**. For example, this could include bioaccumulation through the food chain, effects on the reproductive capacity of organisms, or chronic processes leading to genetic damage.
How would you equate these things to the end time events? Where will these things fit in the chronology of events mentioned by Jesus in Matthew Chapter 24?
Why perhaps? Are you a modern Moses in our time today?
 

soberxp

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How would you equate these things to the end time events?

Why called Biosphere 2?
Cuz the earth is Biosphere 1.
Where will these things fit in the chronology of events mentioned by Jesus in Matthew Chapter 24?

Why perhaps? Are you a modern Moses in our time today?
All about the second coming of Jesus.
Do your Google "the second coming of Jesus" and "soberxp".

I'm already tired of expressing it.
 
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Jericho

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What Christianity are you referring to, the denominations?

Speaking of Christianity in general. Specifically, it's influence on the culture.

70% of the people on this forum are in favor of the war.

We don't live in a perfect world. Sometimes war is necessary to stop evil (i.e., World War 2). Someday we will beat our swords into ploughshares (when Christ returns), but that day is not today.

You think this is better than what you described.

Freeing a nation from a regime that kills it's own citizens for protesting? Yes.
 
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shepherdsword

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"Do you admit that the gospel cannot change the world?"
No...because the gospel WILL change the world drastically when Jesus returns.
 

Rotsen777

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Speaking of Christianity in general. Specifically, it's influence on the culture.
Christianity is all about the shepherding and guidance of Jesus [to His sheep] across all generations. However, what you have said is pure religion based on culture, which is not Christianity since its doctrines are only emanating from the fabricated narrative of men/women pastors leading local churches, instead of the Lord Jesus Christ Himself.
We don't live in a perfect world. Sometimes war is necessary to stop evil (i.e., World War 2). Someday we will beat our swords into ploughshares (when Christ returns), but that day is not today.
The dwelling place of the followers of Christ is Paradise, which will soon come down from heaven.
Freeing a nation from a regime that kills it's own citizens for protesting? Yes.
He who lives by the sword shall die by it, in due time.
 

Rotsen777

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"Do you admit that the gospel cannot change the world?"
No...because the gospel WILL change the world drastically when Jesus returns.
What???? What will be there to change after all when everything will be consumed by fire and fervent heat when Jesus returns?
 

Rotsen777

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Why called Biosphere 2?
Cuz the earth is Biosphere 1.

All about the second coming of Jesus.
Do your Google "the second coming of Jesus" and "soberxp".

I'm already tired of expressing it.
Thanks! None of them can save us but Jesus alone.
 

Reggie Belafonte

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Because the issue of faith is simply believing.
If those who claim to believe do something contrary to what they claim to believe,
For example, Israel, in the past, at present, and in the future.
The Gosple can change anyone in fact !

True Faith, is not blind faith !

Israel is the Servants of the Servant ! = born again Christians !

OT was under the schoolmaster !
 

Rotsen777

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The Gosple can change anyone in fact!
Is the change beneficial to the destiny of the soul? If yes, in what sense do you say it is beneficial?
True Faith, is not blind faith!
What then is true faith, and how it is being practiced?
Israel is the Servants of the Servant ! = born again Christians!
Isn’t what you said here an opinion of yours????
OT was under the schoolmaster !
OT is done with, what’s the fuss about it today???
 

shepherdsword

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What???? What will be there to change after all when everything will be consumed by fire and fervent heat when Jesus returns?
That doesn't happen at the second coming. BUT..even if it did it would be followed by the new heaven and new earth. That's a big change,