When Jesus "took away" your sin, did He leave behind the source, the sin nature?

[quietthinker]

When Jesus "took away" your sin, did He leave behind the source, the sin nature?​

Yes Ma'am, my sin nature seems to grow and grow. For sure, things I used to engage I don't these days BUT those things (sin) of which I was unconscious then, now come into my consciousness. The closer I get to Jesus the more I see a prodigal who finds the pig pen unattractive.

 

[Anchorite]

I see a few who do not believe Jesus destroyed the works of Satan. Not all.

Don't you know that this body is like a floppy puppet? It is NOT sinning on its own. That is why it doesn't have to be born again now, but can wait until our resurrection from the dead. What is born again NOW is our nature, the puppet masters! The "old man."

I'll include everyone to not shine a light on those who slap Jesus in the face.

cc: @RedLetterJoe @marks @Episkopos @PS95 @Gray_Joy

I praise Jesus for His supernatural life working within me. I could do nothing on my own. He did it all. And only He will know when He has completed the good work He started.

This post of yours is sinful, for you publicly judge individuals by name who you claim “slap Jesus in the face.”

This prideful, holier than thou attitude comes from the old sin nature inherited from Adam.

1 Corinthians 4

3 But with me it is a very small thing that I should be judged of you, or of man's judgment: yea, I judge not mine own self.

4 For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified: but he that judgeth me is the Lord.

5 Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God.




We all must keep crucifying our flesh, because Jesus does not do that for us. He forgave and forgives us our sins, but He did not remove our sin nature.


Romans 8:13

For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

I used the wrong word. Thank you.
I was trying to communicate that I think the sin nature becomes vaguely discernable in the born again holy spirit filled believer.

Thanks again.

I believe clean is clean. That is why there is no "practice" in 1 John 3:9 as modern Bibles add.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

This post of yours is sinful, for you publicly judge individuals by name who you claim “slap Jesus in the face.”

This prideful, holier than thou attitude comes from the old sin nature inherited from Adam.

1 Corinthians 4

3 But with me it is a very small thing that I should be judged of you, or of man's judgment: yea, I judge not mine own self.

4 For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified: but he that judgeth me is the Lord.

5 Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God.




We all must keep crucifying our flesh, because Jesus does not do that for us. He forgave and forgives us our sins, but He did not remove our sin nature.


Romans 8:13

For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

If you read it again, I did not name anyone, but included everyone as to NOT do what you accuse me of. Again, you read what you want and believe what you want, whether it is true or false.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

When Jesus "took away" your sin, did He leave behind the source, the sin nature?​

Yes Ma'am, my sin nature seems to grow and grow. For sure, things I used to engage I don't these days BUT those things (sin) of which I was unconscious then, now come into my consciousness. The closer I get to Jesus the more I see a prodigal who finds the pig pen unattractive.

Read this.

For the worshipers, once purified, would have had no more consciousness of sins.

 

[quietthinker]

Read this.

For the worshipers, once purified, would have had no more consciousness of sins.

The only people I know who have little or no consciousness of sins are criminals. On the other hand, I, yes me have no sense of condemnation because I believe and know in my experience my sins are forgiven, even all of them from birth to death.
I have every reason to whistle and sing his praises which in fact I do as I go about any given day.

 

[Lambano]

The only people I know who have little or no consciousness of sins are criminals.

Or psychopaths.

They don't become criminals until they get some convictions, of the legal variety.

 

[quietthinker]

Or psychopaths.

They don't become criminals until they get some convictions, of the legal variety.

Lack of assurance is in my view one of the biggies within Christendom. It is manifest in the talk of Christians, their prayers and their behaviour. It is lacking because their understanding of why Jesus visited this planet is muddled in many ways. It dissipates their energy and focus. It confuses mountains with molehills and visa versa. It is the saddest thing ever when God's overflowing generosity is misunderstood.

 

[Lizbeth]

Read this.

For the worshipers, once purified, would have had no more consciousness of sins.

I don't see why the Lord could not cast Satan entirely out of these earthen vessels of ours and take full possession of us....prepared as a bride. Jesus has all power and authority to do so. But I think we need to come to the place where we realize we need that and are willing for Him to do it.

Jesus saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven......he was cast out of heaven down to the earth. Heaven in scripture is sometimes an allegory for our spirit and earth/land refers to our body (earthen vessel). When He was about to be crucified Jesus said "NOW is the judgment of this world: NOW shall the prince of this world be cast out". (John 12).

Looking at Revelation 12 we see that there was war in heaven....Michael and his angels fought the dragon and his angels and cast them out of heaven and down to earth. That is the victory Jesus won on the cross and this is what happens when a soul comes to faith in Christ. Because that same scripture goes on to say, (agreeing with John 12), "NOW is come salvation and the kingdom of our God....the accuser of the brethren is cast down." Remembering that Jesus had said the kingdom is within us......Christ's rule and reign is within us, in our spirit, no longer Satan..... Satan has been cast out of our spirit and down to our flesh so to speak...so now I believe we need to have him cast out of our flesh, and have our temple fully cleansed/sanctified...spirit, soul and body....and consecrated/set apart for God, so that He, His Spirit might fill it entirely and take full possession of it. That is what seems to have happened with you sister, I believe. The more I look, the more witnesses to this that I find (and scriptures agreeing), though every one understands and describes it in their own way.

 

[Gray_Joy]

I believe clean is clean. That is why there is no "practice" in 1 John 3:9 as modern Bibles add.

I think you have spoken in contradiction numerous times here.

Your ego is veiling God's truth.

 

[marks]

I didn't know you believe we are still under the Old Covenant and therefore are UNDER the Law?

What a crock!

You must know better than this, and are just taking a potshot.

What a sad moment!

 

[ScottA]

Adam and Even did not know they were naked when Eve first ate of the forbidden tree, but their eyes were opened only after Adam committed a willful sin against the commandment of God and knowingly and willfully sinned against God, Himself. There is a difference in sin in the eyes of God. From that one willful sin man' clean human nature mutated and acquired Satan's sin nature, a "work" of Satan. Unintentional Sin vs. Willful Sin. In the Old Testament Numbers 15:22-36 shows that there WAS a sacrifice for unintentional sin, but NO sacrifice for a willful sin against a law of God. They were stoned, or at the least sent out of the camp to die alone in the blistering hot wilderness with no Cloud to cover them, and no pillar of Fire to warm them at night.

1 John 3:4-9 addresses first the category of sin Jesus takes away. Lawlessness. Lawlessness is willfully breaking a commandment of God. And ends with the works of Satan are destroyed and the born again of the Spirit no longer has any desire to commit willful lawlessness. The sin nature of Satan was taken away including the desire to sin against God, Himself.

For those who already have the knowledge that the Law brought to the children of Israel by Moses a consciousness of sin as play acted by Paul in Romans 7:9 and 14-25, now read Hebrews 10:2 of those same people AFTER being cleansed, sanctified and justified by the Spirit of Christ.

"2 For the worshipers, once purified, would have had no more consciousness of sins."

This is because the sin nature of Satan has been destroyed. 1 John 3:8-9 "8 He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has sinned from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil. 9 Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God."

A true born again of the Spirit of Christ does not have two natures.
A true born again of the Spirit of Christ does not any longer have a sin nature.
A true born again of the Spirit of Christ with a clean nature may now partake of the divine nature of God.

Do not believe the false teaching that any of the above is false. Demons that work for Satan want you to go against your own conscience where God has written his laws on your new nature so that you love what God loves, but HATES what God hates and cannot do them.

Immature fruit which a new born again of the Spirit believer may do even while walking in the Spirit, commit infractions due to them UNINTENTIONALLY, and the blood of Jesus cleanses them, keeping us in fellowship with God. 1 John 1:7 These are the lesser type of sin (against fruit, not against God's Laws written on your own heart.) Mind you, not everyone going to church has been actually born again of the Spirit. You know what the laws of God are, thus, committed willfully and KNOWingly. Test yourself to see if you are born again, Galatians 5:19-21, for Jesus said, "you MUST be born again of the Spirit." Don't let Jesus have to say to you, "I never knew you."

1 John 3:9 does not include the word, "PRACTICE" that was added because they didn't recognize the SUBJECT/CONTEXT in verse 4, "lawlessness." A born again of the Spirit Christian CANNOT COMMIT murder even ONCE, let alone practice murder. See how stupid some old church fathers were without the Spirit guiding them into all truth?

You have made a good presentation, but what is missing is that those born again of the spirit of God do not have a sin nature, but they do still have a body of sin--two different bodies.

It is true that the newborn spiritual body does not have a sin nature, but the old natural body still does until it dies. Which Paul wrote of referring to a law of sin still in his members with which he struggled.

 

[marks]

I see a few who do not believe Jesus destroyed the works of Satan. Not all.

Don't you know that this body is like a floppy puppet? It is NOT sinning on its own. That is why it doesn't have to be born again now, but can wait until our resurrection from the dead. What is born again NOW is our nature, the puppet masters! The "old man."

I'll include everyone to not shine a light on those who slap Jesus in the face.

cc: @RedLetterJoe @marks @Episkopos @PS95 @Gray_Joy

I praise Jesus for His supernatural life working within me. I could do nothing on my own. He did it all. And only He will know when He has completed the good work He started.

Are you thinking you can hide behind word games? This is a very sad thread! Is this what "the good work" produces in you? Veiled insults? False witness against others?

Telling me I don't believe things I believe? Telling me I'm slapping Jesus in the face?

I pray the Holy Spirit opens your eyes!

Much love!

 

[1stCenturyLady]

The only people I know who have little or no consciousness of sins are criminals. On the other hand, I, yes me have no sense of condemnation because I believe and know in my experience my sins are forgiven, even all of them from birth to death.
I have every reason to whistle and sing his praises which in fact I do as I go about any given day.

So, tell me.

Which of the two types of sins do you commit? Willful lawless sins unto death against the Ten Commandments that no born again of the Spirit Christian can even commit according to 1 John 3:9, or just immature fruit of the Spirit you commit unintentionally until the Spirit checks your spirit that Jesus cleanses as we commit them according to 1 John 1:7 and He is still conforming us to be like Him?


Do you see the difference? Do you lie to get someone else in trouble or commit fornication? Those are the two most common sins unto death that a born again Christian who does not keep himself pure can commit when done intentionally. But Jesus will say to them, "I never knew you."


Righteousness is sinlessness (of sins unto death). Holiness is more than righteousness; it is perfection of BOTH types of sin when Jesus has completed maturing you of all the fruit of the Spirit.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

You have made a good presentation, but what is missing is that those born again of the spirit of God do not have a sin nature, but they do still have a body of sin--two different bodies.

It is true that the newborn spiritual body does not have a sin nature, but the old natural body still does until it dies. Which Paul wrote of referring to a law of sin still in his members with which he struggled.

Paul made it clear in Romans 8:9-10 that in Romans 6, 5-7, the "old man"/sin nature that was crucified and resurrected NOW is not our body of flesh and bone that we see dying before our very eyes, but dwells within. "But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you.

How does Jesus completely take away our lawless sin if our body commits sins by itself? The answer is it doesn't. It is just a robot that moves based on what is inside. Jesus replaces the inside spirit and soul known as our mind and heart/conscience. That is why when born again we act differently than the day before. If we don't, then, of course, we have not been born again of the powerful Spirit of Christ and Jesus will say to that church goer, "I never knew you."

 

[Anchorite]

So, tell me.

Which of the two types of sins do you commit? Willful lawless sins unto death against the Ten Commandments that no born again of the Spirit Christian can even commit according to 1 John 3:9, or just immature fruit of the Spirit you commit unintentionally until the Spirit checks your spirit that Jesus cleanses as we commit them according to 1 John 1:7 and He is still conforming us to be like Him?

Do you see the difference? Do you lie to get someone else in trouble or commit fornication? Those are the two most common sins unto death that a born again Christian who does not keep himself pure can commit when done intentionally. But Jesus will say to them, "I never knew you."

Righteousness is sinlessness (of sins unto death). Holiness is more than righteousness; it is perfection of BOTH types of sin when Jesus has completed maturing you of all the fruit of the Spirit.

Your doctrine of Sinless Perfectionism from a second work of grace is an old Pentecostal heresy.

You make up phrases and definitions that are unbiblical: “willful lawless sins unto death against the Ten Commandments”, “immature fruit of the Spirit you commit unintentionally”, “righteousness is sinlessness of sins unto death”.

Your definition of holiness is absurd: “Holiness is more than righteousness; it is perfection of BOTH types of sin“.

You incoherently scramble unintentional sins with immature fruit of the Spirit.

Nobody understands your muddled statements that indicate a confused mind and a holier than thou arrogance.

 

[ScottA]

Paul made it clear in Romans 8:9-10 that in Romans 6, 5-7, the "old man"/sin nature that was crucified and resurrected NOW is not our body of flesh and bone that we see dying before our very eyes, but dwells within. "But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you.

How does Jesus completely take away our lawless sin if our body commits sins by itself? The answer is it doesn't. It is just a robot that moves based on what is inside. Jesus replaces the inside spirit and soul known as our mind and heart/conscience. That is why when born again we act differently than the day before. If we don't, then, of course, we have not been born again of the powerful Spirit of Christ and Jesus will say to that church goer, "I never knew you."

Tit for tatting scripture quotes will get you nowhere good. Paul did not contradict himself, you did.

Paul rightly divided, you have not. He spoke of two different bodies, you have not.

Meanwhile, "we who are alive and remain" a spiritual body within a flesh body, struggle as he also struggled.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

Tit for tatting scripture quotes will get you nowhere good. Paul did not contradict himself, you did.

Paul rightly divided, you have not. He spoke of two different bodies, you have not.

Meanwhile, "we who are alive and remain" a spiritual body within a flesh body, struggle as he also struggled.

Glad I have a thick skin, plus mature fruit. So, do you believe Jesus took away our inner sin nature or not? Answer, "yes" or "not."

Our body is dying because of ADAM'S SIN not OUR still sinning.

 

[Gray_Joy]

Our body is dying because of ADAM'S SIN not OUR still sinning.

Where did Jesus teach us that?

 

[PS95]

I'll include everyone to not shine a light on those who slap Jesus in the face.

cc: @RedLetterJoe @marks @Episkopos @PS95 @Gray_Joy

I would never slap my Lord in the face. If I misunderstand something then please explain yourself better rather than throw a terrible accusation at me. That was uncalled for. All I did was offer you verses to consider. I read your reply, but it falls very short of all of the verses I gave you.
Even If, I agreed with you that Paul was play acting- you ignored many other verses which are quite clear where Paul is teaching "believers" how to live a godly life in Christ, so as not to sin.
So, if I was slapping my Lord, then you would also have to accuse Paul of the same. Read the context-. Please don't twist this. It's not right to do that.
Colossians 3:1-17
1If then you were raised with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ is, sitting at the right hand of God. 2Set your mind on things above, not on things on the earth. 3For you died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God. 4When Christ who is our life appears, then you also will appear with Him in glory.
5Therefore put to death your members which are on the earth: fornication, uncleanness, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry. 6Because of these things the wrath of God is coming upon the sons of disobedience, 7in which you yourselves once walked when you lived in them.
8But now you yourselves are to put off all these: anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy language out of your mouth. 9Do not lie to one another, since you have put off the old man with his deeds, 10and have put on the new man who is renewed in knowledge according to the image of Him who created him, 11where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcised nor uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave nor free, but Christ is all and in all.
12Therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, put on tender mercies, kindness, humility, meekness, longsuffering; 13bearing with one another, and forgiving one another, if anyone has a complaint against another; even as Christ forgave you, so you also must do. 14But above all these things put on love, which is the bond of perfection. 15And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to which also you were called in one body; and be thankful. 16Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom, teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord. 17And whatever you do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through Him.
---------------------------

The same is true of John- Yes, John said we don't sin- you make him contradict himself by ignoring the meaning by disregarding "practicing" or walking in- living a life of sin? If by doing so scripture harmonizes and doesn't cause the apostle to contradict himself or the other apostles, then it should be accepted. Sometimes words must be added to reflect true meaning. Translations can be difficult! do you know Greek? Look at 1 John 2- John is speaking to young Jewish believers-
I John 2:1-11
1My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. 2And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world.
3Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God [a]is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. 6He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.
7Brethren, I write no new commandment to you, but an old commandment which you have had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which you heard [c]from the beginning. 8Again, a new commandment I write to you, which thing is true in Him and in you, because the darkness is passing away, and the true light is already shining.
9He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now. 10He who loves his brother abides in the light, and there is no cause for stumbling in him. 11But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes.
-----------------------

As to your verse in Hebrews 10:2- You are reading something into that which is not there. I offer you 3 old commentaries in my next post that explain better than I do.
"For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins."