IOW you can't refute anything I said. Let me take a wild guess, you're one of the JEALOUS Israel wannabees?
"True" Israel?
- Thread starter Randy Kluth
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All you prove is you're a wannabee tooting your horn, LOOK AT ME! Otherwise NOBODY notices the Israel wannabees. They're too busy watching Israel in the Land of the Bible in International news nearly every day.
Why aren't you in Israel? Too scary?
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God bless Israel in the Land of the Bible! That ain't you, wannabee. And He will continue to BLESS Israel in the Land of the Bible no matter how many of you wannabees die trying to stop Him! Israel wannabees are CURSED. Too bad the wannabees even bring the curse on their own families!
Just one example of the future of Israel wannabees:
Zechariah 14:12
12 And this shall be the plague with which the LORD will strike all the people who fought against Jerusalem: Their flesh shall dissolve while they stand on their feet, Their eyes shall dissolve in their sockets, And their tongues shall dissolve in their mouths.
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This is the Hope of Israel Paul was in chains for Acts 28:20
For this reason therefore I have called for you, to see you and speak with you, because for the hope of Israel I am bound with this chain.”
Now this Hope of Israel of which Paul was in chain, the jews for the most part rejected it, for it wasn't what they thought, and it concerned the Lord Jesus Christ and the Kingdom of God Acts 20:23
23 And when they had appointed him a day, there came many to him into his lodging; to whom he expounded and testified the kingdom of God, persuading them concerning Jesus, both out of the law of Moses, and out of the prophets, from morning till evening.
Some jews believed Paul Vs 24,25-27
24 And some believed the things which were spoken, and some believed not.
Then Paul reminded them that God through Isaiah and the Holy Ghost had foretold this judgment upon the jews in their rejection of the the Messiah and His Kingdom and Salvation:
25 And when they agreed not among themselves, they departed, after that Paul had spoken one word, Well spake the Holy Ghost by Esaias the prophet unto our fathers,
26 Saying, Go unto this people, and say, Hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and not perceive:
27 For the heart of this people is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes have they closed; lest they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.
Mind you Paul is talking about " The Hope of Israel" Acts 28:20,
Then he says, that God was now sending this same message that the majority of the jews rejected regarding the Hope of Israel, and that they will hear it Vs 28-31
28 Be it known therefore unto you, that the salvation of God is sent unto the Gentiles, and that they will hear it.
29 And when he had said these words, the Jews departed, and had great reasoning among themselves.
30 And Paul dwelt two whole years in his own hired house, and received all that came in unto him,
31 Preaching the kingdom of God, and teaching those things which concern the Lord Jesus Christ, with all confidence, no man forbidding him.
This proves that the Gentiles had part in the Hope of Israel, the Church ! 18
For this reason therefore I have called for you, to see you and speak with you, because for the hope of Israel I am bound with this chain.”
Now this Hope of Israel of which Paul was in chain, the jews for the most part rejected it, for it wasn't what they thought, and it concerned the Lord Jesus Christ and the Kingdom of God Acts 20:23
23 And when they had appointed him a day, there came many to him into his lodging; to whom he expounded and testified the kingdom of God, persuading them concerning Jesus, both out of the law of Moses, and out of the prophets, from morning till evening.
Some jews believed Paul Vs 24,25-27
24 And some believed the things which were spoken, and some believed not.
Then Paul reminded them that God through Isaiah and the Holy Ghost had foretold this judgment upon the jews in their rejection of the the Messiah and His Kingdom and Salvation:
25 And when they agreed not among themselves, they departed, after that Paul had spoken one word, Well spake the Holy Ghost by Esaias the prophet unto our fathers,
26 Saying, Go unto this people, and say, Hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and not perceive:
27 For the heart of this people is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes have they closed; lest they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.
Mind you Paul is talking about " The Hope of Israel" Acts 28:20,
Then he says, that God was now sending this same message that the majority of the jews rejected regarding the Hope of Israel, and that they will hear it Vs 28-31
28 Be it known therefore unto you, that the salvation of God is sent unto the Gentiles, and that they will hear it.
29 And when he had said these words, the Jews departed, and had great reasoning among themselves.
30 And Paul dwelt two whole years in his own hired house, and received all that came in unto him,
31 Preaching the kingdom of God, and teaching those things which concern the Lord Jesus Christ, with all confidence, no man forbidding him.
This proves that the Gentiles had part in the Hope of Israel, the Church ! 18
The Inheritance to the Saints
The same Inheritance proves that the Church the Body of Christ is also Israel Spiritual from the OT, Paul writes Col 1:12-13
12 Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:
13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
This is not a physical inheritance but Spiritual and Heavenly, its the Inheritance promised the Saints of Old and which they looked for and desired, admitting they were pilgrims and strangers to this physical world Heb 11:8-16
8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.
9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:
10 For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.
11 Through faith also Sara herself received strength to conceive seed, and was delivered of a child when she was past age, because she judged him faithful who had promised.
12 Therefore sprang there even of one, and him as good as dead, so many as the stars of the sky in multitude, and as the sand which is by the sea shore innumerable.
13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.
14 For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country.
15 And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned.
16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.
Its the Inheritance Paul refers to in Gal 3:16-18
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
And its the inheritance Peter writes of here 1 Pet 1:3-5
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
Gentiles are included in this Inheritance as the seed of Abraham as we see in Col 1:12 and also Acts 26:17-18
17 Delivering thee from the people, and from the Gentiles, unto whom now I send thee,
18 To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.
Gentiles are called to this Eternal Inheritance Heb 9:15
And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
The same Inheritance proves that the Church the Body of Christ is also Israel Spiritual from the OT, Paul writes Col 1:12-13
12 Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:
13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
This is not a physical inheritance but Spiritual and Heavenly, its the Inheritance promised the Saints of Old and which they looked for and desired, admitting they were pilgrims and strangers to this physical world Heb 11:8-16
8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.
9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:
10 For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.
11 Through faith also Sara herself received strength to conceive seed, and was delivered of a child when she was past age, because she judged him faithful who had promised.
12 Therefore sprang there even of one, and him as good as dead, so many as the stars of the sky in multitude, and as the sand which is by the sea shore innumerable.
13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.
14 For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country.
15 And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned.
16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.
Its the Inheritance Paul refers to in Gal 3:16-18
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
And its the inheritance Peter writes of here 1 Pet 1:3-5
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
Gentiles are included in this Inheritance as the seed of Abraham as we see in Col 1:12 and also Acts 26:17-18
17 Delivering thee from the people, and from the Gentiles, unto whom now I send thee,
18 To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.
Gentiles are called to this Eternal Inheritance Heb 9:15
And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
Israel and the Church are One because, not national israel, but Spiritual Israel of God, the elect remnant, because Israel /Jacob are the Lords Portion and His Inheritance Deut 32:9
For the Lord's portion is his people; Jacob is the lot of his inheritance.
The NT counterpart the Church now emerges as the same Eph 1:17-18
17 That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:
18 The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints
The Church is in view here Ps 33:12
12 Blessed is the nation whose God is the Lord; and the people whom he hath chosen for his own inheritance
Remember Paul speaking of the Church said they were the Lords Chosen Eph 1:4,18
4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
God doesnt have Two sets of chosen Inheritances, no they are One and the same people Chosen in Christ ! 18
For the Lord's portion is his people; Jacob is the lot of his inheritance.
The NT counterpart the Church now emerges as the same Eph 1:17-18
17 That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:
18 The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints
The Church is in view here Ps 33:12
12 Blessed is the nation whose God is the Lord; and the people whom he hath chosen for his own inheritance
Remember Paul speaking of the Church said they were the Lords Chosen Eph 1:4,18
4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
God doesnt have Two sets of chosen Inheritances, no they are One and the same people Chosen in Christ ! 18
Dan Clarkston
Well-Known Member
And yet the Lord is still protecting "National Israel" not allowing anybody to defeat her. Weird.
Rockerduck
Well-Known Member
Right now Jesus is protecting all the elect only. 2 Timothy 2:19, John 10:28-29, Matthew 24:22.
Dan Clarkston
Well-Known Member
If that were true, then in some nations He's doing a very poor job.
Dan Clarkston
Well-Known Member
And He elected ALL to be saved... but only those that walk with Him to the end of their lives will be saved.
God predestined ALL to be saved, and then many allowed satan to blind their eyes to prevent them from seeing the Gospel
See - Romans 8:29-30, Romans 1:19-21, Titus 2:11-12, 1 John 2:2, 2 Peter 3:9, 1 Timothy 2:1-4, Acts 17:30, John 12:32, Hebrews 2:9, John 3:16, Matthew 5:6
Romans 5:17,18
For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.
Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
NOTE - Romans 5:17,18 is clearly telling us that the free gift came upon all men agreeing with Titus 2:11,12
Titus 2:11,12
For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to ALL men,
Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
1 John 2:2
Jesus is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
2 Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that ALL should come to repentance.
Rockerduck
Well-Known Member
Oh its true, but you also have a time to die, for instance Martyrs for the faith. Look how the Lord used the stoning of Stephen.
Dan Clarkston
Well-Known Member
The Book of Hebrews speaks of some of the old time saints refusing deliverance so they could be with the Lord.
Stephen could have been protected / delivered by the Lord had he believed for it.
We know this is true since God is way more powerful than demon possessed religious nuts serving satan.
Well yeah, the Land of the Bible, Israel, where Jesus will return and FIGHT for Israel.
Nobody would even hear about the Israel wannabees if they didn't TOOT their own horn so often. 'Look at me'!!!
Look at israel , why dont you pack up and go live over there, see if you survive a week
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