(The Beast) & (The Two Witnesses) Will Be On This Earth Together For 3.5 Years (Then Cometh The End)

[Truth7t7]

I have bypassed this, but there comes a time for spirit and truth.

The above is not spirit a truth, it is man's understanding according to the times and terms of this [fallen] world. So, yes, whoever wants to believe it as such certainly can, that has been the way it has been now for a long time. But again, it is written, "the hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth" (John 4:23". Those are the two choices.

When He, the Spirit of truth, has come, how will you be lead--by the understanding of men, or the Spirit of God?

The difference in those two opposing ways, is a matter of translating and understanding the terms according to God's terms or man's worldly terms. From God's perspective and according to His terms, He has established in the scriptures, "precept upon precept, line upon line, here a little there a little" a conclusion far different that the one stated above in the original post. Which began with 7 times given in the days of creation as God making good His promise, saying, "new things I declare; Before they spring forth I tell you of them.” Then in Daniel, by an angel of the Lord, elaborates the 7 times, saying the whole matter comes during, "a time times and half a time" further elaborated by breaking it all down to 70 weeks. Ten times, meaning: all (according to the count of men, made in the image of God), and yet it all refers to the same "time times and half a time", which is to say 7 times, made up of two half times of 3 1/2.

That, very simply from scripture, is God's explanation of the times.

Man, on the other hand, is prone to thinking in literal or worldly terms and times, rather than the looking at the bigger picture...and then of course, pushing whatever they don't clearly understand off to support a false future fulfillment doctrine. And we need to remember John said above in John 4:23--not future, but "now is."

In that very simple frame given by God, the two witnesses are "the Jew first and also for the Greek (gentile)" and or "the spiritual is not first, but the natural, and afterward the spiritual" each as one man "one new man from the two" in Christ (Ephesians 2:15).

But like I said, if you don't want to follow along "precept upon precept" etc...that's your choice.

Scott do you believe you're a Prophet of God?

 

[Truth7t7]

IMO:

o "Earth dissolved" (2Peter 3:10) occurs after the millennium.

o See Revelation chapters 21, 22 for details.

There Will Be No 1,000 Year Millennial Kingdom Upon This Earth, Jesus Christ Returns In Fire And Final Judgement, Dissolving This Existing Earth By Fire, Immediately After The Tribulation

This Existing Heaven And Earth Will Be (Replaced) By The New Heaven, Earth, Jerusalem, A New Creation, At The Return Of Jesus Christ

(Behold, I Make All Things New)

2 Peter 3:10-13KJV
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Revelation 21:1-5KJV
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

Matthew 24:29-30KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

1 Corinthians 3:13KJV
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Malachi 3:2KJV
2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

Psalm 46:6KJV
6 The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted.

Psalm 50:3KJV
3 Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence: a fire shall devour before him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about him.

Psalm 97:5KJV
5 The hills melted like wax at the presence of the Lord, at the presence of the Lord of the whole earth.

Isaiah 66:15KJV
15 For, behold, the Lord will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.

Zechariah 14:12KJV
12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

Nahum 1:5-6KJV
5 The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.
6 Who can stand before his indignation? and who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? his fury is poured out like fire, and the rocks are thrown down by him.

Revelation 20:9KJV
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

 

[ScottA]

Scott do you believe you're a Prophet of God?

I do not call myself a prophet. I am however one sent by God.

Why do you ask?

 

[William Barton]

o. Mille= Latin "1000"
o. Annus = Latin "year"
o. This carries over into English "millennium" = "1000 years"
o. Revelation 20:6 says: "...they will rule with him (Jesus) one thousand years."

 

[Truth7t7]

Revelation 20:6 says: "...they will rule with him (Jesus) a thousand years."

Revelation 20:1-6 Isnt A Millennial Kingdom On This Earth, Dont Be Deceived​

Can you find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) Physical Earthly Kingdom?
2.) Physical Earthly Throne?
3.) Physical Mortal Humans?

The Above Claims (Don't Exist)

Revelation 20:1-6 Is 100% In The Lords (Spiritual) Angel, Heaven, Devil, Satan, The Souls, The Dead, God, Christ

100% Spiritual Realm, No "Literal" Time

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Revelation 20:1-6KJV
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

 

[Truth7t7]

There is very little description of heaven in the Bible. But if we are to go there then I presume there would be oxygen, warmth, water, foliage, etc. And there are lots of people there now.

Believers have physically died, their bodies are dead in the grave, and you suggest the souls in heaven are in need of oxygen living, surrounded by plant life?

It's my opinion that when scripture is silent on the description leave it at that "A Mystery"

 

[ewq1938]

When Satan is cast down to earth, he will be the star that John saw falling to earth, who will open the bottomless pit and release the locust creatures.

I don't believe satan would be given a key like that, to a place he will be imprisoned in. An angel has the key in Rev 20, so that would be the "star" that had the key not long before that.

 

[David Lamb]

IMO:
Hot-oil torture is not used during the tribulation, rather "bowl of hot oil" is symbolic of the intensity of the tribulation "bowl" judgments.

Otherwise I do not see why a simple "bowl" would represent severe suffering.

I would say that is supposition. Revelation is mostly an account of the vision(s) given to John, and many things in visions in the Bible are symbolic. We are not told, even symbolically, what the bowls contained, just their effects.

 

[David Lamb]

"Wrath poured out" is a metaphor, indicating "severe wrath."
In Revelation chapter 16:
o. Foul and evil sores (v. 2)
o. Sea like blood (v. 3)
o. Rivers like blood (v. 4)
o. Scorching sun (v. 8)
o. Darkness (v. 10)
o. Euphrates dried up (v. 12)
o. Babylon split, cities fell (v. 13)

Yes it is symbolic. Most of Revelation is an account of John's God-given vision(s). Such visions mostly involve symbolism, as when Nebuchadnezzar dreamt of that huge statue, recorded in Daniel 2.

 

[Davy]

You are right. I did not consider the untimely figs because of the logic problem I pointed out about the timing of the sun, moon, star event. This event can happen after the period of great tribulation or it can happen during the period of great tribulation, not both. To me, this needs to be resolved before any other considerations of the matter.

It won't be resolved for you then, not until you listen to The Holy Spirit about the "untimely figs," and many other Bible Scriptures associated with it. There is a false-Messiah coming to play Jesus first, and it will be Satan himself, with his angels, cast out of heaven down to this earth at the end, in plain sight. Already that point is no doubt a big enough problem for you to handle where your understanding is at right now. But that is exactly what that "untimely figs" part of the 6th Seal is pointing to, the stars that fall to the earth as "untimely figs" on that 6th Seal.

So then, try this, even though you may not yet understand or believe it. Let's say Satan is coming first as a false-Messiah at the end to play Lord Jesus Christ. What events would Satan as that false-Messiah try to mimic that is to happen when Lord Jesus Christ comes later, in order to deceive even Christ's elect? Would there be a FAKE earthquake, in the sense of not as big as the "great earthquake" that is written to happen with Jesus' later coming?

 

[Davy]

Rev 6:12-14 "12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; 13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. 14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together;

Matt 24:29 "Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:"

I thought you agreed that the signs in bold above were the same signs. Do you?

No. Because the Matthew 24:29-31 Scripture is about the day of Christ's coming to gather His Church, and parallels 1 Thessalonians 4:13-16.

But the Revelation 6:12-13 Scripture is about "And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs...", which is about the casting out of heaven of Satan and his angels by the future war of Revelation 12:7 forward. And NOTICE I did NOT include the 14th verse which goes with the time of Jesus' later coming as the 2nd part of the 6th Seal.

By that you should have noted that you are not going to get around why that earthquake and sun darkened and moon became as blood signs are given with that "untimely figs" event. Further, there is a difference with that moon sign. When Jesus comes it says the moon won't give her light. But with the "untimely figs" it say the moon became as blood.

Isaiah 13:9-10 reveals when the moon does not give her light, it is "day of the Lord" timing, which is the "last day" of this world when Lord Jesus comes. Isaiah 24:23 also points to this.

Joel 2:31
31 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come.
KJV

But that Joel 2:31 Scripture with the moon became as blood is pointing to the time BEFORE the "day of the Lord", which is PRIOR to Matthew 24:29.

 

[WitnessX]

We have a record of I AM coming to Moses on Sinai, take a look:

Exodus 19:9 (KJV) And the LORD said unto Moses, Lo, I come unto thee in a thick cloud, that the people may hear when I speak with thee, and believe thee for ever. And Moses told the words of the people unto the LORD.

Exodus 19:11 (KJV) And be ready against the third day: for the third day the LORD will come down in the sight of all the people upon mount Sinai.

Exodus 19:16 (KJV) And it came to pass on the third day in the morning, that there were thunders and lightnings, and a thick cloud upon the mount, and the voice of the trumpet exceeding loud; so that all the people that [was] in the camp trembled.

Exodus 19:18 (KJV) And mount Sinai was altogether on a smoke, because the LORD descended upon it in fire: and the smoke thereof ascended as the smoke of a furnace, and the whole mount quaked greatly.

DOTL:

Joel 2:30-31 (KJV) 30 And I will shew wonders in the heavens and in the earth, blood, and fire, and pillars of smoke. 31 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come.

Joel 3:14-15 (KJV) 14 Multitudes, multitudes in the valley of decision: for the day of the LORD [is] near in the valley of decision. 15 The sun and the moon shall be darkened, and the stars shall withdraw their shining.

Isaiah 13:9-10 (KJV) 9 Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it. 10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

Zephaniah 1:14-15 (KJV) 14 The great day of the LORD [is] near, [it is] near, and hasteth greatly, [even] the voice of the day of the LORD: the mighty man shall cry there bitterly. 15 That day [is] a day of wrath, a day of trouble and distress, a day of wasteness and desolation, a day of darkness and gloominess, a day of clouds and thick darkness,

 

[WitnessX]

No. Because the Matthew 24:29-31 Scripture is about the day of Christ's coming to gather His Church, and parallels 1 Thessalonians 4:13-16.

But the Revelation 6:12-13 Scripture is about "And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs...", which is about the casting out of heaven of Satan and his angels by the future war of Revelation 12:7 forward. And NOTICE I did NOT include the 14th verse which goes with the time of Jesus' later coming as the 2nd part of the 6th Seal.

By that you should have noted that you are not going to get around why that earthquake and sun darkened and moon became as blood signs are given with that "untimely figs" event. Further, there is a difference with that moon sign. When Jesus comes it says the moon won't give her light. But with the "untimely figs" it say the moon became as blood.

Isaiah 13:9-10 reveals when the moon does not give her light, it is "day of the Lord" timing, which is the "last day" of this world when Lord Jesus comes. Isaiah 24:23 also points to this.

Joel 2:31
31 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come.
KJV

But that Joel 2:31 Scripture with the moon became as blood is pointing to the time BEFORE the "day of the Lord", which is PRIOR to Matthew 24:29.

I don’t believe there is a distinction; I see not giving off her light as the regular light, so a blood moon, darkness all points the same timing which would support Matt 24, Luke 21, and Mark 13 at the cosmic signs directly preceding the Lords coming.

The difference is in it’s a day of darkness for those who are not in Christ Jesus. I say this based of 1 Thess 5 mainly and that believers are not appointed to wrath.

1 Thessalonians 5:2 (KJV) For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.

1 Thessalonians 5:4 (KJV) But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.

1 Thessalonians 5:5-6 (KJV) 5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. 6 Therefore let us not sleep, as [do] others; but let us watch and be sober.

Believers who see these cosmic signs know what’s about to happen provided…they have trimmed their wicks and had extra oil on hand. They are ready. Their redemption draw nigh.

Luke 21:28 (KJV) And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.

Matthew 24:31 (KJV) And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Mark 13:27 (KJV) And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.

Then Paul gives an example of conduct that gives us a good report before the Lord and what believers should be doing in the rest of 1 Thess 5.

 

[Douggg]

I don't believe satan would be given a key like that, to a place he will be imprisoned in. An angel has the key in Rev 20, so that would be the "star" that had the key not long before that.

The key will be taken away from Satan, so that he won't be able to escape from the bottomless pit prison.

How many keys do you have for your car ? Just one, or a couple ?

 

[Truth7t7]

The key will be taken away from Satan, so that he won't be able to escape from the bottomless pit prison.

How many keys do you have for your car ? Just one, or a couple ?

Are they making these keys at home depot or ace hardware?

Lol!

 

[William Barton]

Truth 7t7 noted:
"no millennium"

Bible noted:
"reigned with Christ for a thousand years" (Revelation 20:4)

 

[6 Stories]

"Be sober, be watchful, your adversary the devil prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour." (1Peter 5:8). This roaring (not reigning) will continue until the return if Jesus (see Revelation 19:11-20:3).

That is my opinion as well. I believe when the 2nd woe ends the period of great tribulation ends as well, but Satan will not yet have been bound. Rev 11:18 "...and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth." The destruction of the destroyers will occur after the great tribulation has ended. This will be the time that God's wrath will be poured out.

Rev 11:19 "And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail." I also believe Rev 11:19 will happen at the same time as Rev 19:11-21.

 

[William Barton]

Are they making these keys at home depot or ace hardware?

Lol!

Revelation 20:1 says "holding in his hand the key to the bottomless pit." "Key" is reminiscent of jail-cell keys. The details of the "pit" are not given, perhaps a deep rock cavern, who knows.

 

[6 Stories]

I strongly disagree, this present earth will be dissolved by the Lord's fire at his return in final judgement 2 Peter 3:10, Luke 17:29-30

I strongly disagree, there is one future day of the Lord and it takes place at the Lord's future second coming

How is Jesus going to reign on earth if earth is destroyed? When would Rev 20:7-9 occur if earth is destroyed?

Luke 17:29-30 pictures the hail of Rev 16:21 "And there fell upon men a great hail out of heaven, every stone about the weight of a talent: and men blasphemed God because of the plague of the hail; for the plague thereof was exceeding great."

2 Peter 3:10 pictures Rev 20:11. "And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them." This will be a future "Day of the Lord" at least 1,000 years after Jesus returns. This will be the last trump of 1 Cor 15:52. " In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed." The last trump is the last voice of God the Father in this present creation. After this trump, there will be a new creation, a new heaven and earth.

There were several past "Days of the Lord" which leaves the door open to more than 1 future "Day of the Lord." Past - Jer 46:10, Ez 13:5, Amos 5. Future - When Jesus returns and when this creation ends.

No millennial kingdom for you?

 

[Truth7t7]

Truth 7t7 noted:
"no millennium"

Bible noted:
"reigned with Christ for a thousand years" (Revelation 20:4)

Thats 100% Correct, There Won't Be A Future Millennial Kingdom On This Earth, It's A Fabricated Fairy Tale Of Man

(Fact) Jesus Returns In Fire And Final Judgement Dissolving This Earth By Fire, Just As Post #262 Above Clearly Shows That Was Presented To You And Before The Forum