What Is Episkopos Really Teaching? Read His Own Words

[Lizbeth]

No, you have to reconcile it.

Remember it's in a great house.
Matt. 25:46 says
"And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal."
Where does it say the goats are bundled and burned? This sounds like outer darkness, because Acts 2:21 says, "whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved." Saved to what....??? God decides.

Those are all terms for the same thing........God's wrath.

And I have reconciled those scrips.

Of course I believe there will be different rewards for each person depending on God's judgment of all the factors of their lives/hearts.......but sister, outer darkness is punishment, not salvation or reward on any level. Those who inherit eternal life will not be weeping and gnashing teeth, on the contrary, God will be wiping away tears.

 

[David in NJ]

There is very rarely anything taught about the spiritual walk without sin. Most by far believe that Jesus forgives ongoing sin. They believe the cross is about forgiveness...as if God is unable to be merciful otherwise.

In Him is no sin. If we abide in Christ we don't sin. You can't live in the Spirit and sin. Sin takes you OUT of the Spirit, to walk again as any man in his own strength. Grace is the power over sin. even the smallest amount of grace conquers sin.

So then the New Covenant is not about forgiving carnal sinners. No, it is empowering a part of us (the inner man) to walk in the resurrection life of Christ. The other sinful art is meant o be crucified and taken out of the way.

Thanks again for the reply - you have stirred my interest but you still have not clarified your statement.

what is already achievable without God in any way shape or form.

Please define/clarify that which is "already achievable without God in any way shape or form."

Thank You

 

[bdavidc]

1 Corinthians 2:14
But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

1 Corinthians 2:14 does not answer the question I asked.

Paul is contrasting the natural man, who does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, with those who have received the Spirit. He is not teaching that anyone who disagrees with your interpretation may simply be labeled spiritually blind.

If you believe I am misunderstanding Scripture, then show me from Scripture where I am wrong. That is exactly what I am asking you to do.

Quoting “spiritually discerned” is not a substitute for proving the doctrine being questioned.

 

[bdavidc]

We ALL will.

I know I will answer to God for what I do and teach as well. I am not personally worried about that in this discussion because I am not trying to invent a doctrine or build a teaching around my own ideas. I am trying to stay with what Scripture actually says.

What should concern every one of us is false teaching, because Scripture gives some of its strongest warnings there. Peter said there would be “false teachers among you” who would bring in “damnable heresies,” and that “their damnation slumbereth not” (2 Peter 2:1, 3). Paul said that if anyone preaches another gospel, “let him be accursed” (Galatians 1:8–9). James warns that teachers “shall receive the greater condemnation” (James 3:1).

Those are not mild warnings. God takes it seriously when someone speaks in His name and teaches what He has not said. A false teacher is not merely making an innocent mistake if he persists in twisting Scripture, adding to the gospel, or leading people away from the truth. He will answer to God for every soul he misleads.

We will all give account. That is exactly why I am not interested in protecting a teacher, a doctrine, or even my own opinion. If it cannot stand under the clear teaching of Scripture, it needs to be rejected.

 

[bdavidc]

he has been doing that since I first met him. he never takes accountability. and always trys to blame shift.

That kind of pattern should concern us, because it sounds very much like the way Satan operates. Scripture calls Satan “the accuser of our brethren” (Revelation 12:10), and Jesus said he is “a liar, and the father of it” (John 8:44). Satan accuses, deceives, shifts attention away from truth, and tries to put the focus somewhere else.

So when a discussion keeps getting turned away from the actual teaching and onto the person, actual pointing to what the Scripture actually says, that should raise a red flag. Truth does not need blame-shifting to defend it. If the teaching is biblical, then it should be able to stand in the light of Scripture.

 

[David in NJ]

I can tell you this David in NJ?
That there ARE some things that should ought NOT be "witnessed about, NOR testified TO", as it may cause a "block of stumbling" to some which would make for a losing of what little faith one may have already!

AGREE
Now please give an example of such.

Also = i Love His Name El Shaddai

 

[GodsGrace]

For you personally, it is that simple. That is your experience. But you better not become a teacher. Since a teacher is held to a much stricter judgment because he NEEDS a better judgment.

What do you say to those who already are obedient to God but know nothing of Him? Repent from your obedience?

What do you say to those who say they believe but teach lies?

What do you say to those who have "accepted" Jesus and see everything through that lens...the lens of themselves being the foundation?

LOL
I HAVE taught our faith.
I know James 3:1 very well.

Nothing is personal for me.
I state that we go by what the NT teaches,,,NOT by our emotional feelings.

Those who know God and are obedient are as saved as they ever will be.
Whether or not they understand theology is irrelevant.
And if you think it is...
you better make sure you have your doctrine correct or you will be judged by it.
Just as you've stated above....

But I maintain that we are NOT saved by our theology.
Are all calvinists doomed?
Are all JWs doomed?
Are all Catholics doomed?
No sir.
God will judge as the NT states....
by their oebedience...
by their deeds...whether good or bad.

Those who believe and teach lies are not teaching lies.
They are teaching what they believe to be correct.
If you want one uniform teaching,,,I suggest you join the CC.
They all share on belief system and they stick to it.
That might be more your speed.

If you want to be Protestant...
you're going to have to allow that some read their bibles at home
and come up with their own theological system.
It's known as solo scriptura...much worse than sola scriptura - which is bad enough.

I don't know what you mean by THEMSELVES BEING THE FOUNDATION.
There is no other foundation with which we are to build except Jesus.
1 Corinthians 3:15....

 

[GodsGrace]

1 Corinthians 2:14 does not answer the question I asked.

Paul is contrasting the natural man, who does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, with those who have received the Spirit. He is not teaching that anyone who disagrees with your interpretation may simply be labeled spiritually blind.

If you believe I am misunderstanding Scripture, then show me from Scripture where I am wrong. That is exactly what I am asking you to do.

Quoting “spiritually discerned” is not a substitute for proving the doctrine being questioned.

No one on these boards accepts correction.
It is a practice in futility.
But I like post anyway,,,for those reading along.

Have I changed YOUR mind about ANYTHING?
Have you changed MINE?


Actually, mine was changed many years ago,
but no need to go there.

 

[bdavidc]

Let us know after you read it - thank you

I actually have a copy of J.F. Morin's book, The Sum of All Possibilities in Christ. I am not judging his teaching from rumors or from what somebody else claims he believes. I have read his own words.

And what I have read is deeply concerning. He teaches “two steps, or salvations,” with a person being born again first and entering Christ later. He says, “God imputes righteousness by works AND by faith.” He says Christ's death “cannot justify a person.” He says the crucifixion was “not orchestrated by God.” He denies the personal distinction of the Holy Spirit, and in his section called “The Gospel” he speaks of a gospel “exclusive to few” and a “second step towards God.”

Those are not little disagreements over secondary issues. Those statements touch salvation, justification, the cross, the Holy Spirit, and the gospel itself.

I have not even finished the entire book. Those teachings appear within the portion I have already examined. Anyone who reads and studies the real actual Bible will know he is promoting a false gospel.

And yes, this is a book being promoted and sold to Christians. The printed book is listed for $44.95.

That is why I believe this needs to be exposed with his own words beside the Word of God. People should be able to read exactly what he teaches and then do what Scripture commands: “Prove all things; hold fast that which is good” (1 Thessalonians 5:21).

 

[David in NJ]

LOL
I HAVE taught our faith.
I know James 3:1 very well.

Nothing is personal for me.
I state that we go by what the NT teaches,,,NOT by our emotional feelings.

Those who know God and are obedient are as saved as they ever will be.
Whether or not they understand theology is irrelevant.
And if you think it is...
you better make sure you have your doctrine correct or you will be judged by it.
Just as you've stated above....


No sir.
God will judge as the NT states....
by their oebedience...
by their deeds...whether good or bad.

Those who believe and teach lies are not teaching lies.
They are teaching what they believe to be correct.
If you want one uniform teaching,,,I suggest you join the CC.
They all share on belief system and they stick to it.
That might be more your speed.


It's known as solo scriptura...much worse than sola scriptura - which is bad enough.

But I maintain that we are NOT saved by our theology.

Correct

Who's theology are we saved by?

Are all calvinists doomed?
Are all JWs doomed?
Are all Catholics doomed?

"No sir!" = AGREE

God will judge as the NT states....
by their oebedience...
by their deeds...whether good or bad.

Well this is true but FIRST their faith must be in the LORD Jesus Christ = John chapter 3
Works will not save any of us = Ephesians 2:1-10

sola scriptura is "bad enough" ???

WOW
That would be your "solo scriptura" = correct!!!

 

[Episkopos]

Thanks again for the reply - you have stirred my interest but you still have not clarified your statement.


Please define/clarify that which is "already achievable without God in any way shape or form."

Thank You

Humanly achievable. People will claim to be divinely helped based on their beliefs when people who have no religion can do better.

Actually human righteousness is humanly achievable...but no one can claim to be such before God. Many will claim to have the righteousness of God based on an ideology,...but they are doing worse than others who are not claiming such.

 

[bdavidc]

I will always defend righteousness in any form....as I learned from God. God is more merciful than men on the one hand...and much harder than men on the other. The fear of the Lord makes sure we don't get that mixed up.

I preach the fear of the Lord and righteousness. People who are opposed to God and His ways preach BELIEFS and call that faith.

But we show our faith by obedience. It takes faith to fear the Lord. The reason why modern believers don't fear the Lord is because they have no faith. No, they have beliefs ABOUT Jesus and what they think He can do for them. Lip service.

How can I even speak of the New Covenant among such lawless people? There is no point in trying to enter a kingdom that a person is not qualified for. How can we speak of the kind of surrender it takes to be noticed by God? How can I speak of the faith that is required to be translated into God's presence to walk in the Spirit WHERE Jesus is?

But these things are either beneath the modern religionists or else so far above him that no attention is made. Instead these follow a religion that is tailor made just for them...because it was made for them as they are, carnal to the extreme. Did God make it? Yes, but not for the purpose that people think. God has chosen the delusion that will snare those who hate the truth...who hate His ways.

Let the hostility of the unbelievers be on me. It's all benefit to me.

You keep wrapping your doctrine in words like righteousness, surrender, obedience, and the fear of God, but none of that excuses teaching what God has not said. A lie does not become truth because it is spoken with religious confidence.

Paul did not tolerate men like you who corrupted the gospel. He said, “If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed” (Galatians 1:9). That is not gentle language, because false teaching about salvation is not a small matter.

You speak of people needing to be “qualified” for the kingdom, of surrender that causes a person to be “noticed by God,” and of being “translated into God’s presence” to walk where Jesus is. Show it from Scripture. Not your system. Not your spiritual language. Not your private framework. Show the text.

Scripture says believers are “made meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light” by the Father (Colossians 1:12). Scripture says, “being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ” (Romans 5:1). Scripture says, “There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus” (Romans 8:1). You do not get to add another spiritual qualification to what God has already declared.

And stop hiding behind accusations against the people challenging you. Calling people lawless, unbelieving, blind, carnal, or religious does not prove one word of your doctrine. False teachers have always done this. So what you're doing is not anything new. When they cannot establish their teaching from the Word, they attack the people exposing it.

Look at the warning Scripture gives. Peter said false teachers would bring in “damnable heresies” and that “their damnation slumbereth not” (2 Peter 2:1, 3). Jude says certain men were “before of old ordained to this condemnation” and describes them as “wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever” (Jude 4, 13).

That is where this road leads when a man persists in teaching what God has not said and refuses correction from the Word.

False teachers have come and gone for centuries. Their names, movements, secret revelations, higher teachings, and spiritual systems all eventually disappear. God’s Word remains. Those who corrupted His truth did not win by sounding spiritual. They only stored up judgment for themselves.

So enough with the fog. Put your doctrine under the light of Scripture. If God taught it, prove it. If you cannot prove it, stop teaching it and repent.

 

[GodsGrace]

Correct

Who's theology are we saved by?


"No sir!" = AGREE


Well this is true but FIRST their faith must be in the LORD Jesus Christ = John chapter 3
Works will not save any of us = Ephesians 2:1-10



WOW
That would be your "solo scriptura" = correct!!!

We agree on all.
And yes, deeds will be judged....but, of course, we must believe first.
Without faith,,,good works are dead works.
Only faith saves.
THEN good works are needed as Jesus taught.

 

[NayborBear]

AGREE
Now please give an example of such.

Also = i Love His Name El Shaddai

Ok?......Ok.
There IS a HUGE difference in these 2 verses.
John 14:9

Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath SEEN the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?
Compared with?
John 14:6

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: NO MAN COMETH UNTO the Father, but by me.

This 2nd verse means: NOT "IN" Christ! Not WITH Christ!
Unto the Father BY Christ's "RECOMMENDATION!"
AND? GOD'S ACCEPTANCE!
YOU yourself WITH the Father!
Which is done in THIS way.:
1 Peter 2:5
5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to OFFER UP SPIRITUAL SACRIFICES, ACCEPTABLE TO GOD by Jesus Christ.
As to WHAT or HOW MANY of these Spiritual sacrifices are needed? Is different for everyone!
And THEN?: Be patient. And DON'T become arrogant like some are want to do and be like the end of this tune:

 

[bdavidc]

Jesus said not to cast what is holy to either the swine or the dogs. If this was a place where spiritually aware seekers congregated...or even just honest seekers frequented...well maybe I could go deeper into the manifold experiences that inform me of where I stand today.

Jesus said My sheep hear My voice.

This is on 2 levels.

1. We can recognize the truth in what Jesus is saying in order to put our lives on track with the commands of Christ.

2. We can be guided by the inner voice of the Spirit....in an audible voice...either from within...or from outside, from above.

Some Christians are indeed influenced by the first. The second is far more rare.

I only teach deeper things among disciples. Paul is an example of this. And it works. Our CLOSE fellowship is ONLY among disciples even as we all interact with others who are just believers but have no spiritual understanding. We always help those to their advantage not our own. All are our brethren whether spiritual or not. But a carnal believer can't hear anything deeper. A filthy believer will attack and accuse, because they are animated by a spirit of carnality. They have been promised life IN their wickedness. Where? Those who set up pews and fleece money from people.

This is remarkable. You were simply asked how you were taught “directly” by the Holy Spirit, and instead of answering plainly, you immediately reached for “dogs” and “swine” and explained that your deeper experiences are only for the spiritually qualified.

Then you created two levels again. One group merely recognizes Christ’s truth, while a much rarer group supposedly hears an audible inner or external voice of the Spirit.

But “My sheep hear my voice” does not say that. Jesus said, “My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me” (John 10:27). He did not divide His sheep into ordinary believers and an elite class who receive a second, audible level of revelation.

And notice what happens whenever someone asks you to establish these deeper claims from Scripture. Instead of giving the text, the questioner becomes carnal, filthy, spiritually unaware, a mere believer without understanding, or apparently someone to whom holy things should not even be given.

That is becoming a pattern. If God really taught you these things directly, then His written Word should confirm what you are teaching. “To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them” (Isaiah 8:20).

So the question still stands. Where does Scripture teach these two levels of Christians and this rare second level of hearing an audible voice of the Spirit?

Calling the people asking the question “dogs,” “swine,” carnal, or spiritually ignorant does not answer it.

 

[GodsGrace]

Not everybody is on fire so that they need a firehose to save them. Those who don't know God scream the loudest about peope going to hell. It turns off more than it helps. It depends on the application. To a hammer everybody looks like a nail.

But I thought you said that we had to tell the truth??
I've always had a difficult time undersanding what you believe.
Not that it's necessary for me to understand.

You can't get a like until you realize that darkness has many depths. And so many will be rejected into outer darkness because they are happy without the light.

You should leave judging to God and just concentrate on repeating what the NT teaches.
It sounds like maybe YOU are on fire.

No...regeneration is a SAMPLE of the light. To move INTO the light you need to sell all you have and buy the field that contains it. Few if any will ever do that.

Yes. Well I won't be selling my house any time soon.
And if you mean give all my soul things away...
that's not going to happen either.
Buddha tried that.
He got depressed.

God gave us things so we could bear life.
He gave us mountains so we could go hiking.
Water so we could swim and enjoy the feel of it.
He gave us hobbies so we wouldn't die working like the Israeli's.

I saw a canary yellow 4 carat diamond today.
I stared at it for a good minute or two.
Is that a sin?
Maybe.
But the beauty of it shined though, both literaly and figuratively, because God put the things in the earth
that created this thing of beauty.
My brother rode 200 km through the south of Tuscany last year.
He's been a born again Christian as long as I have.
Was THAT a sin?
Maybe.
But God made a beautiful world for us to enjoy.

Yes sir.
Not selling everything until God tells me it's time and I have to stop.

 

[GodsGrace]

This is remarkable. You were simply asked how you were taught “directly” by the Holy Spirit, and instead of answering plainly, you immediately reached for “dogs” and “swine” and explained that your deeper experiences are only for the spiritually qualified.

Then you created two levels again. One group merely recognizes Christ’s truth, while a much rarer group supposedly hears an audible inner or external voice of the Spirit.

But “My sheep hear my voice” does not say that. Jesus said, “My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me” (John 10:27). He did not divide His sheep into ordinary believers and an elite class who receive a second, audible level of revelation.

And notice what happens whenever someone asks you to establish these deeper claims from Scripture. Instead of giving the text, the questioner becomes carnal, filthy, spiritually unaware, a mere believer without understanding, or apparently someone to whom holy things should not even be given.

That is becoming a pattern. If God really taught you these things directly, then His written Word should confirm what you are teaching. “To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them” (Isaiah 8:20).

So the question still stands. Where does Scripture teach these two levels of Christians and this rare second level of hearing an audible voice of the Spirit?

Calling the people asking the question “dogs,” “swine,” carnal, or spiritually ignorant does not answer it.

Maybe Episkopos is a gnostic believer?
Maybe he really does know more than any one of us?
Blessed are the humble.
Yeah.

 

[David in NJ]

There IS a HUGE difference in these 2 verses.
John 14:9

Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath SEEN the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?
Compared with?
John 14:6

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: NO MAN COMETH UNTO the Father, but by me.

This 2nd verse means: NOT "IN" Christ! Not WITH Christ!

Question
Do you believe we can come to the FATHER "NOT "IN" Christ! Not WITH Christ!"

 

[David in NJ]

Humanly achievable. People will claim to be divinely helped based on their beliefs when people who have no religion can do better.

If you mean acts of kindness and generosity = Yes, i have seen such

Actually human righteousness is humanly achievable...but no one can claim to be such before God.

AGREE

Many will claim to have the righteousness of God based on an ideology,...but they are doing worse than others who are not claiming such.

AGREE

So then, how are we Saved?
a.) By righteousness that exceeds the pharisees
b.) By righteousness that exceeds our religious neighbors
c.) By righteousness that is from a pure heart
d.) other righteousness

 

[NayborBear]

Question
Do you believe we can come to the FATHER "NOT "IN" Christ! Not WITH Christ!"

Is that what I stated? I didn't did I?
See? I TOLD you this COULD happen! Didn't I? DIDN'T I?
You saw what you WANTED to see, and disregarded the rest. Didn't you?

John 14:6
Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh UNTO the Father, BUT BY ME.
This is why is so HARD to teach!
I CAN tell you!
I CAN'T NOR WILL I FORCE YOU!
For that is a "minefield" you have to traverse through and not get snagged nor ensnared FOR YOURSELF!
I can only bare witness TO a somewhat successful trekking OF!

Hebrews 6:1
Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,