Simple proof that the rapture occurs on the Last Day, which is a post tribulation rapture

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Truth7t7

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With verses, what do you believe is the condition of the earth at 1 Thess 4.17 ?
The condition of the earth plays no part in 1 Thess 4.17, the fact remains the same, the scripture shows the Lord's return and the resurrection of the believer on (The Last Day) as you've clearly been shown
 
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Taken

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Clouds are on planet earth. Jesus comes from heaven to planet earth, *descends* to a cloud, and reaps.
Clouds Are Above Earth…
The Clouds that Drift around mountain tops is the lower Heaven and “That portion of Earth called: Holy Ground.”

Otherwise the Earth is dirt and Gods Footstool.

An airplane flying through the clouds is in the lower Heavens.
 
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sondring7

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The condition of the earth plays no part in 1 Thess 4.17, the fact remains the same, the scripture show the Lord's return and the resurrection of the believer on (The Last Day) as you've clearly been shown
So the 1 Thess 4.16-17 cloud gathering of believers stopover is part of the same journey down to hard earth by Christ & His Angels ?
Great, list the verses that confirm that
 
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Truth7t7

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So the 1 Thess 4.16-17 cloud gathering of believers stopover is part of the same journey down to hard earth by Christ & His Angels ?
Great, list the verses that confirm that
A Pre-Trib rapture dose'nt exist in my Holy Bible KJV, the teaching is a man made fairytale "Fiction"

Jesus Christ Returns In Fire And Final Judgement, Dissolving This Existing Earth By Fire, Immediately After The Tribulation

This Existing Heaven And Earth Will Be (Replaced) By The New Heaven, Earth, Jerusalem, A New Creation, At The Return Of Jesus Christ

(Behold, I Make All Things New)

2 Peter 3:10-13KJV
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Revelation 21:1-5KJV
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

Matthew 24:29-30KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

1 Corinthians 3:13KJV
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.


2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance
on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Malachi 3:2KJV
2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

Psalm 46:6KJV
6 The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted.

Psalm 50:3KJV
3 Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence: a fire shall devour before him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about him.

Psalm 97:5KJV
5 The hills melted like wax at the presence of the Lord, at the presence of the Lord of the whole earth.

Isaiah 66:15KJV
15 For, behold, the Lord will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.

Zechariah 14:12KJV
12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

Nahum 1:5-6KJV
5 The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.
6 Who can stand before his indignation? and who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? his fury is poured out like fire, and the rocks are thrown down by him.

Revelation 20:9KJV
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
 
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sondring7

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A Pre-Trib rapture dose'nt exist in my Holy Bible KJV, the teaching is a man made fairytale "Fiction"

Jesus Christ Returns In Fire And Final Judgement, Dissolving This Existing Earth By Fire, Immediately After The Tribulation

This Existing Heaven And Earth Will Be (Replaced) By The New Heaven, Earth, Jerusalem, A New Creation, At The Return Of Jesus Christ

(Behold, I Make All Things New)

2 Peter 3:10-13KJV
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Revelation 21:1-5KJV
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

Matthew 24:29-30KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

1 Corinthians 3:13KJV
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.


2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance
on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Malachi 3:2KJV
2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

Psalm 46:6KJV
6 The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted.

Psalm 50:3KJV
3 Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence: a fire shall devour before him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about him.

Psalm 97:5KJV
5 The hills melted like wax at the presence of the Lord, at the presence of the Lord of the whole earth.

Isaiah 66:15KJV
15 For, behold, the Lord will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.

Zechariah 14:12KJV
12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

Nahum 1:5-6KJV
5 The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.
6 Who can stand before his indignation? and who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? his fury is poured out like fire, and the rocks are thrown down by him.

Revelation 20:9KJV
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
+++++the teaching is a man made fairytale "Fiction"
The verses you quoted do not teach that the 1 Thess 4.16-17 cloud gathering of believers stopover is part of the same journey down to hard earth by Christ & His Angels
Please try again.
 

William Barton

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Clouds Are Above Earth…
The Clouds that Drift around mountain tops is the lower Heaven and “That portion of Earth called: Holy Ground.”

Otherwise the Earth is dirt and Gods Footstool.

An airplane flying through the clouds is in the lower Heavens.
IMO:
o "Planet earth" includes its atmosphere (oxygen layer plus ozone layer).
o "Earth" in the sense of soil/rock is the solid part of planet earth.
o "Heavens" are outer space.
 

jeffweeder

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The verses you quoted do not teach that the 1 Thess 4.16-17 cloud gathering of believers stopover is part of the same journey down to hard earth by Christ & His Angels
Please try again.

Paul taught according to the lord's own word in regard to his coming again in 1Thess 4 and 2Thess 1.
You must believe he and Jesus taught 2 comings without ever differentiating between the two.

15 For we say this to you by the Lord’s [own] word, that we who are still alive and remain until the coming of the Lord, will in no way precede [into His presence] those [believers] who have fallen asleep [in death].

The fact is that when Jesus comes again, we will be like him for we shall see him as he is.
That means we are glorified in 1Thess 4 as we all rise to meet him in the air Having a body like his glorious body.

1 John 3:2
Beloved, we are [even here and] now children of God, and it is not yet made clear what we will be [after His coming]. We know that when He comes and is revealed, we will [as His children] be like Him, because we will see Him just as He is [in all His glory].


Phillip 3
20 But [we are different, because] our citizenship is in heaven. And from there we eagerly await [the coming of] the Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ; 21 who, by exerting that power which enables Him even to subject everything to Himself, will [not only] transform [but completely refashion] our earthly bodies so that they will be like His glorious resurrected body.
 
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Taken

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IMO:
o "Planet earth" includes its atmosphere (oxygen layer plus ozone layer).
o "Earth" in the sense of soil/rock is the solid part of planet earth.
o "Heavens" are outer space.
According to Scripture “Earth” is dry land.
First great Trib… Earth was “destroyed”, because ALL the “dry land” became Wet.

Not a mystery to see clouds flowing about a mountain top.
Moses was summoned to hike up a mountain, to receive 10 Commandments, written By God, in stone.

When Moses arrived at the mountain top…
What did God say to Moses?

EX 3:
[5] And he said, Draw not nigh hither: put off thy shoes from off thy feet, for the place whereon thou standest is holy ground.

Glory to God,
Taken
 

Scott Downey

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Paul taught according to the lord's own word in regard to his coming again in 1Thess 4 and 2Thess 1.
You must believe he and Jesus taught 2 comings without ever differentiating between the two.



The fact is that when Jesus comes again, we will be like him for we shall see him as he is.
That means we are glorified in 1Thess 4 as we all rise to meet him in the air Having a body like his glorious body.

1 John 3:2
Beloved, we are [even here and] now children of God, and it is not yet made clear what we will be [after His coming]. We know that when He comes and is revealed, we will [as His children] be like Him, because we will see Him just as He is [in all His glory].


Phillip 3
20 But [we are different, because] our citizenship is in heaven. And from there we eagerly await [the coming of] the Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ; 21 who, by exerting that power which enables Him even to subject everything to Himself, will [not only] transform [but completely refashion] our earthly bodies so that they will be like His glorious resurrected body.
A lot of these posters believe in multiple comings and goings of Christ, not just a coming again, second coming.

The angels implied a second coming only.

Acts 1
6 When they therefore had come together, they asked of Him, saying, “Lord, wilt Thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?”

7 And He said unto them, “It is not for you to know the times or the seasons which the Father hath put in His own power.

8 But ye shall receive power after the Holy Ghost is come upon you; and ye shall be witnesses unto Me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.”

9 And when He had spoken these things, while they beheld, He was taken up, and a cloud received Him out of their sight.

10 And while they looked steadfastly toward heaven as He went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel,

11 who also said, “Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? This same Jesus, who is taken up from you into Heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen Him go into Heaven.”

Revelation 1:7
Behold, He cometh with clouds, and every eye shall see Him, and they also who pierced Him; and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of Him. Even so. Amen.

When He comes a second time, the unsaved world wails in terror, Because they are terrified of Christ, and He is coming to judge the world and them all, it means their destruction but our salvation.

Revelation 6
12 I looked when He opened the sixth seal, and [g]behold, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the [h]moon became like blood. 13 And the stars of heaven fell to the earth, as a fig tree drops its late figs when it is shaken by a mighty wind. 14 Then the sky [i]receded as a scroll when it is rolled up, and every mountain and island was moved out of its place. 15 And the kings of the earth, the great men, [j]the rich men, the commanders, the mighty men, every slave and every free man, hid themselves in the caves and in the rocks of the mountains, 16 and said to the mountains and rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the face of Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! 17 For the great day of His wrath has come, and who is able to stand?”

Hebrews 9

27 And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment, 28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation.

Christ told all of us to watch and be ready for His coming again, lest He come and find you sleeping.

Mark 13

19 For in those days shall be affliction such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created until this time, neither shall be.

20 And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved; but for the elect’s sake, whom He hath chosen, He hath shortened the days.

21 And then if any man shall say to you, ‘Lo, here is Christ!’ or, ‘Lo, He is there!’ believe him not;

22 for false christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall show signs and wonders to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect.

23 But take ye heed; behold, I have foretold you all things.

24 “But in those days, after that tribulation, ‘the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light,

25 and the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.’

26 And then shall they see the Son of Man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.

27 And then shall He send His angels and shall gather together His elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.

28 “Now learn a parable of the fig tree: When her branch is yet tender and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is near.

29 So ye in like manner, when ye shall see these things come to pass, know that it is nigh, even at the doors.

30 Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass till all these things be done.

31 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but My words shall not pass away.

32 But of that day and that hour knoweth no man — no, not the angels who are in Heaven, neither the Son, but only the Father.

33 “Take ye heed, watch and pray; for ye know not when the time is.

34 For the Son of Man is as a man taking a far journey, who left his house and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the doorkeeper to watch.

35 Watch ye therefore, for ye know not when the Master of the house cometh — at evening, or at midnight, or at the cockcrowing, or in the morning —

36 lest coming suddenly, He find you sleeping.

37 And what I say unto you, I say unto all: Watch!”
 
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Taken

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You must believe he and Jesus taught 2 comings without ever differentiating between the two.
Com-ING is routinely mid-construed.

If you tell your employer on Friday you Are com-ING to work on Saturday…
Is Every place you GO…on Saturday …
Coming out of your house…
Coming into your car…
Coming down your street…
Coming to the donut-shop…
Coming to your employment…
IS THAT You having ARRIVED “Doing your work as you said you would”?

No.

Jesus is With God…seated at the Right hand of God…
Where?
In the Heaven Above the Heaven(S)
3rd Heaven… estate of holy angels
2nd Heaven… place where saved departed souls are.
1st Heaven… place above the Earth wher the Clouds are.

Jesus Shall “be Coming to each Heaven…”
Pausing in the 1-Heaven (clouds”…
To summon His Church, His Bride Up to Him…
Why?
* to WED His Bride, in His Fathers House/ Kingdom.
* to see His Bride, and His Bride see Him face to face when Her VEIL is lifted.
* to deliver /escape / protect His Bride from a horrific Disaster Event being prepared for All inhabitants upon The Earth.

The fact is that when Jesus comes again, we will be like him for we shall see him as he is.
That means we are glorified in 1Thess 4 as we all rise to meet him in the air Having a body like his glorious body.
Yes… however…
Jesus comes next to a White Cloud…(still 1st Heaven)
WITH His holy angels
AND
WITH His Bride…

Then “They all” come to a mountain top…(holy ground)

Then “They all” come to “His Kingdom” (Abraham’s Promised Land / God Established)

Then “ They All” come to “His Throne in Jerusalem”
(king David’s Everlasting Throne / God Established.)

KING Christ the Lord Jesus, Has Thus Arrived ON Earth, IN His Place of Authority With His holy Angels and His holy People.

And Thereafter… a great celebration of KING Christ the Lord Jesus and His Bride…being formally introduced TO the Guests, invited to Come Feast / Eat, in celebration of King Christ the Lords Marriage.

Glory to God,
Taken
 

William Barton

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The rapture is indicated in the following verses:
o John 14'2-3
o. 1Corinthians 15:51-53
o. 1Thessalonians 4-15-17
o. Revelation 12:12
o. Revelation 14:16

o. Revelation 7:13 speaks of those who come out from tribulation, just before the seventh seal.

o. Revelation 11:11-13 is the rapture of the two witnesses.

o. Revelation 14:14-16 is the general rapture.

o. This spares believers from the bowl judgments (Revelation 16:1-21), which is *great* tribulation.
 

amigo de christo

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The LAST DAY is the KEY to the mystery as it is the appointed Day of Christ, it is the Day of the Lord.
It is a singular DAY. While we are in the last days, at the end of the last days is the LAST DAY.

  • Romans 2:5
    But in accordance with your hardness and your impenitent heart you are treasuring up for yourself wrath in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God,
    In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
  • Romans 2:16
    in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.


John 12:48
He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him— the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day.

Acts 17 is also confirmation that there is an appointed DAY of Judgment, which Jesus tells us is the Last Day


30 Truly, these times of ignorance God overlooked, but now commands all men everywhere to repent, 31 because He has appointed a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness by the Man whom He has ordained. He has given assurance of this to all by raising Him from the dead.”
`````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````
This summation locks the entire biblical timeline down tightly. Packing the resurrection, the catching-up, the final judgment, and the destruction of the wicked all into the singular, climactic event of the Last Day aligns perfectly with the text.

There is no scriptural room for a staggered, multi-phase escape hatch when Jesus explicitly ties the resurrection of believers to the Last Day in John 6, and Paul anchors the descent of the Lord, the resurrection of the dead, and the gathering of the living directly together in 1 Thessalonians 4. It all converges on that one definitive day.
And speaking of this last day .
Oh i say , oh i say speaking of this last day .
What would they be saying right before this SUDDEN DESTRUCTION came upon them , which they WOULD NOT escape .
PEACE N SAFETY .
And now go and behold the cry of a well favored harlot who has all religoins now coming to be as one , UNDER A LIE ,
That has indeed denied the very gospel of JESUS CHRIST .
And as the muslim join hands with the buddist , with a hindu , with the new age , with the mormon , with the protesetant
with the catholic and etc , and all are saying GOD IS LOVE and this be the way to attain PEACE N SAFETY .
Tick tock
tick tock
I WOULD DARN SURE SAY times running out . And just like in the days of noah
and as in the days of lott , the wicked never even knew that day was near .
And when lott had warned even his own sons in law we NEED TO GET OUTTA HERE
GOD is g onna des troy this place , they saw him as a man mocking .
And now a word
and when the peoples of GOD and OF HIS CHRIST do cry
YOU all need to repent and come to Christ for the Day of the LORD is coming wherein all
who rejected him will be destroyed ,
THEY LAUGH and mock and say THEY have been saying this for all generations .
THEY mock and say GOD IS LOVE man ALL religoins are coming to him in different ways , ITS okay if they believed not on JESUS
they wont perish .
SOMEONE LIES TO THEM SCOTT . AND WE BOTH KNOW GOD does not LIE .
but he who comes to play as though HE IS GOD , HE SURELY CAN and HE SURELY WILL and HE SURELY DO LIE
 

amigo de christo

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Com-ING is routinely mid-construed.

If you tell your employer on Friday you Are com-ING to work on Saturday…
Is Every place you GO…on Saturday …
Coming out of your house…
Coming into your car…
Coming down your street…
Coming to the donut-shop…
Coming to your employment…
IS THAT You having ARRIVED “Doing your work as you said you would”?

No.

Jesus is With God…seated at the Right hand of God…
Where?
In the Heaven Above the Heaven(S)
3rd Heaven… estate of holy angels
2nd Heaven… place where saved departed souls are.
1st Heaven… place above the Earth wher the Clouds are.

Jesus Shall “be Coming to each Heaven…”
Pausing in the 1-Heaven (clouds”…
To summon His Church, His Bride Up to Him…
Why?
* to WED His Bride, in His Fathers House/ Kingdom.
* to see His Bride, and His Bride see Him face to face when Her VEIL is lifted.
* to deliver /escape / protect His Bride from a horrific Disaster Event being prepared for All inhabitants upon The Earth.


Yes… however…
Jesus comes next to a White Cloud…(still 1st Heaven)
WITH His holy angels
AND
WITH His Bride…

Then “They all” come to a mountain top…(holy ground)

Then “They all” come to “His Kingdom” (Abraham’s Promised Land / God Established)

Then “ They All” come to “His Throne in Jerusalem”
(king David’s Everlasting Throne / God Established.)

KING Christ the Lord Jesus, Has Thus Arrived ON Earth, IN His Place of Authority With His holy Angels and His holy People.

And Thereafter… a great celebration of KING Christ the Lord Jesus and His Bride…being formally introduced TO the Guests, invited to Come Feast / Eat, in celebration of King Christ the Lords Marriage.

Glory to God,
Taken
The rapture and its exact timing is what folks often debate about .
But allow me to in troduce us to a very very terrifying fact .
IF even one had it right , yet follows the love of an ecumeincal harlot and her all inclusive god satan
and its intefaith of anti christ . YOU AINT GOING UP , YOU GOING DOWN ON JESUS DAY .
So first and foremost i would make darn sure one is not connected TO THAT MESS . just a super friendly
and a dire necessary REMINDER . For when they say PEACE N SAFETY
THEY AINT GOING UP , THEY GOING DOWN flat to become bird food as the fowls of the air and the beasts of the
earth do feast upon their rotted corpses . SO . rather than heeding a harlot
who is NOT calling folks to the wedding f east
but rather to the GREAT FEAST day whereon the birds will feaast upon their bodies .
I SAY GET OUT and dont look back . Just again another very friendly and dire necessary reminder .
 
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Davy

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Already covered this…
Heaven…has “layers so to speak), same as the Earth Does, Same as Some Buildings have.

Jesus is With God, in the Heaven ABOVE the Heaven(S).

Jesus Descends…
From the Heaven Above the Heavens…
Highest Heaven…….Gods Estate
To the 3rd Heaven…angels Estate
To the 2nd Heaven..saved souls resting place
To the 1st Heaven…clouds where His Bride (body, soul, spirit) is Ascended up to meet Him.




Seven Years later…
Descends From “the cloud(S)” to A White Cloud”…
Brings With Him…
His Angels / His Bride / Church


Now ON Earth…

Yes

That sounds JUST LIKE PAGAN OCCULTISM.

There are places of separation in Heaven, but it is not like what Eastern religions teach with many 'planes' or levels, like Buddhism. (Yeah! that's where your source information is coming from, whoever taught it to you.)

Jesus showed in Luke 16 that God's Paradise there is a great fixed gulf division between where Abraham is, compared to across that border where the rich man found himself in hell. They could see each other.

The "third heaven" that Apostle Paul's spirit was caught up to is about the future new heavens and a new earth time. There's 3 world earth ages taught in God's Word, and Paul's spirit was caught up to the last one.

But because of men's primitive backward pagan notions, they came up with all sorts of loony planes and levels for Heaven that don't exist.
 

Taken

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That sounds JUST LIKE PAGAN OCCULTISM.
Seems handy for you to decide Occultism is whatever you do not know or understand… and can be passed off to another VIA gaslighting.
There are places of separation in Heaven, but it is not like what Eastern religions teach with many 'planes' or levels, like Buddhism. (Yeah! that's where your source information is coming from, whoever taught it to you.)
Levels of the Heavens AND the Earth Are Scripturally Taught… whether YOU know it or understand it.

Jesus showed in Luke 16 that God's Paradise there is a great fixed gulf division between where Abraham is, compared to across that border where the rich man found himself in hell. They could see each other.
Paradise IS Where the Tree of Life IS…
Scripturally the “Tree of Life”…
IS moved about… TO Where “only” the Righteous are …

The Tree of Life “IN Paradise”…
Was in the Garden of Eden…
Was with Abraham’s soul in Hell…
IS in the 2nd Heaven with departed saved souls…
Shall be AGAIN ON Earth… After all Evil and Wickedness is “removed”.
The "third heaven" that Apostle Paul's spirit was caught up to is about the future new heavens and a new earth time.

Disagree…
There always is a heirarchy …
God, angels, man…
Their estate…
Above the Heavens, the 3rd Heaven, Earth.

Gods Estate Above the Heavens where no man can go.

3rd Heaven Estate of the holy angels, we see from a distance, at night, where Stars are…
And less you not know…Lucifer thought he could have Gods place, Throne Above the Stars… and was sentenced to excise from his Estate (3rd Heaven where the Stars are) to Earth and the lower Heavens…
It is the 2nd Heaven Prepared for Departed saved souls to Wait in peace and comfort until united with their glorified body.
* Lucifer also was given a new name (Satan) and ascribed new descriptions (devil, fallen, evil, cunning, demon, beast, antichrist, liar, murderer, etc.

There's 3 world earth ages taught in God's Word, and Paul's spirit was caught up to the last one.
Disagree.
But because of men's primitive backward pagan notions, they came up with all sorts of loony planes and levels for Heaven that don't exist.
You contradict yourself…
3rd Heaven is a level you speak of while implying it is a loony notion…if other men do the same.
 

Scott Downey

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And speaking of this last day .
Oh i say , oh i say speaking of this last day .
What would they be saying right before this SUDDEN DESTRUCTION came upon them , which they WOULD NOT escape .
PEACE N SAFETY .
And now go and behold the cry of a well favored harlot who has all religoins now coming to be as one , UNDER A LIE ,
That has indeed denied the very gospel of JESUS CHRIST .
And as the muslim join hands with the buddist , with a hindu , with the new age , with the mormon , with the protesetant
with the catholic and etc , and all are saying GOD IS LOVE and this be the way to attain PEACE N SAFETY .
Tick tock
tick tock
I WOULD DARN SURE SAY times running out . And just like in the days of noah
and as in the days of lott , the wicked never even knew that day was near .
And when lott had warned even his own sons in law we NEED TO GET OUTTA HERE
GOD is g onna des troy this place , they saw him as a man mocking .
And now a word
and when the peoples of GOD and OF HIS CHRIST do cry
YOU all need to repent and come to Christ for the Day of the LORD is coming wherein all
who rejected him will be destroyed ,
THEY LAUGH and mock and say THEY have been saying this for all generations .
THEY mock and say GOD IS LOVE man ALL religoins are coming to him in different ways , ITS okay if they believed not on JESUS
they wont perish .
SOMEONE LIES TO THEM SCOTT . AND WE BOTH KNOW GOD does not LIE .
but he who comes to play as though HE IS GOD , HE SURELY CAN and HE SURELY WILL and HE SURELY DO LIE
Jesus fulfills the Law, all of it.
If your are truly in Him and He is in you, then the law no longer has the judgment of capital punishment, death on you for your sins.
You are forgiven all of your sins for His name sake, and this is a great and glorious salvation.

If you are not found in Him as in He does not know you, you will be killed, you don't belong to the Lord, you are antichrist, and follow Satan, even if you think not, you do. That is something even believers may choke up on, God says

Ezekiel 18:4
“Behold, all souls are Mine; The soul of the father As well as the soul of the son is Mine; The soul who sins shall die.

Since ALL have sinned, all are subject to the second death and Lake of Fire unless they obey God repent and believe in His dear Son.
Hebrews 8

10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 11 None of them shall teach his neighbor, and none his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them. 12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins [b]and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.”

13 In that He says, “A new covenant,” He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.

But for them that believe not, their sins are not forgiven them, and they will all be killed-terminated and find themselves in Hell fire and then the lake of Fire. And there is no escape from that, as Jesus Christ is the only name given under heaven whereby we must be saved.
 
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William Barton

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Clouds Are Above Earth…
The Clouds that Drift around mountain tops is the lower Heaven and “That portion of Earth called: Holy Ground.”

Otherwise the Earth is dirt and Gods Footstool.

An airplane flying through the clouds is in the lower Heavens.
"Planet earth" includes the ground, sky, and ozone layer above the sky.

Breathable sky is the oxygen layer below the ozone layer.The other eight planets have no such oxygen layer.

"Heavens" is the outer space, above the ozone layer, abode of the stars.

"Holy ground" is an area assigned to God.
 
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GRACE ambassador

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The rapture is indicated...
Precious friend(s):

The Prophesied Two [ earthly ] Comings Of Christ, The Messiah/King are indicated in OT,
Matthew-John, and Revelation teachings of Prophecy / Covenants and Law To/For Israel

Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15 AV) From “Things That Differ!" (BBS)


The Pre-Trib Departure Of The Body Of Christ to be "Gathered Unto The 'Head Of His Church'" Is Indicated
In God's Other Context Of "The [ Heavenly ] Revelation Of The Mystery" (Romans - Philemon AV)


If not interested , then please ignore:

Full Rightly Divided study conclusion:

God's Great GRACE Departure!

-------------
And, precious friend(s), Please Be Very Richly Encouraged and Edified
In The Lord Jesus Christ and In His Precious Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided:

The Bible: The BIG Picture


Amen.
 

Taken

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Taken

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"Planet earth" includes the ground, sky, and ozone layer above the sky.
No.

Gen 1:
[10] And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good.

Breathable sky is the oxygen layer below the ozone layer.The other eight planets have no such oxygen layer.
Irrelevant.
"Heavens" is the outer space, above the ozone layer, abode of the stars.
In the clouds Lowest to Earth is 1st heaven.
"Holy ground" is an area assigned to God.
Holy ground is where clouds of the lowest heaven Meet / Touch the Earth.