Time to move on

[GodsGrace]

I hope so! God gave us magnificient brains, made for thinking. He also allows us the freedom to think.

Now, if you were asking if Christians can love in any distorted way they want and still follow Jesus, i would have to say absolutely not.

A Christian CANNOT believe whatever he wants.
There are set rules and beliefs which must be accepted if you want to be called a Christian.
A buddhist's beliefs, for instance, are not Christian.

It doesn't seem to me that this is something that even needs to be said.

 

[aspen]

A Christian CANNOT believe whatever he wants.
There are set rules and beliefs which must be accepted if you want to be called a Christian.
A buddhist's beliefs, for instance, are not Christian.

It doesn't seem to me that this is something that even needs to be said.

Thinking and believing are different.

Thinking involves thoughts and ideas

Believing involves thinking, which engages action.

Christians have all sorts of crazy ideas involved in their spirituality; some orthodox, some heretical and others, undetermined. Jesus calls us to love. If we get too caught up in perfecting our thoughts on doctrine, morality and spirituality we become prideful. Best to focus on working with God to perfect our love.

Indeed, our sanctification happens when our thoughts, emotions, and will are on in agreement and compel us to love and receive love perfectly. But, there is no order in which this happens - sometimes unorthodox thoughts or emotions (intentions, motivations) lag behind our ability to love; sometimes our love remains self centered even when thoughts are orthodox.

We are perfected on the narrow path even when we run askew.

 

[pia]

There are set rules and beliefs which must be accepted

From what I have gathered, the 'rules and beliefs' are :' You must believe with all of your heart that Jesus is the Son of the living God....That He died for your (and everyone's) sins, but that He did not stay in death, He rose again into new Life and if we put our faith and trust in Him, we shall join Him in everlasting Life."
And :" Love the Lord your God with all of your heart, with all of your soul, with all of your mind and with all of your strength.......and love others as Jesus has loved / loves us "...
If any person can do just these two things, they are well ahead of the curve.....

 

[GodsGrace]

Thinking and believing are different.

Thinking involves thoughts and ideas

Believing involves thinking, which engages action.

Christians have all sorts of crazy ideas involved in their spirituality; some orthodox, some heretical and others, undetermined. Jesus calls us to love. If we get too caught up in perfecting our thoughts on doctrine, morality and spirituality we become prideful. Best to focus on working with God to perfect our love.

Indeed, our sanctification happens when our thoughts, emotions, and will are on in agreement and compel us to love and receive love perfectly. But, there is no order in which this happens - sometimes unorthodox thoughts or emotions (intentions, motivations) lag behind our ability to love; sometimes our love remains self centered even when thoughts are orthodox.

We are perfected on the narrow path even when we run askew.

If love is all you need, then one would be able to believe whatever he wanted to, whether it be Christian beliefs or not.

Krishna teaches love much more than Christianity does. The whole point is love, whereas Jesus taught us how to behave, how to create a kingdom of God here on earth right now, and how to be saved to go to be with Him at death.

So, are you saying I could believe in reincarnation and still call myself a Christian?
I could not believe in the Trinity and still call myself a Christian?
I could believe Jesus died only spiritually and still call myself a Christian?

So all these "crazy ideas" you speak of which "Christians" have are perfectly acceptable to you?

 

[GodsGrace]

From what I have gathered, the 'rules and beliefs' are :' You must believe with all of your heart that Jesus is the Son of the living God....That He died for your (and everyone's) sins, but that He did not stay in death, He rose again into new Life and if we put our faith and trust in Him, we shall join Him in everlasting Life."
And :" Love the Lord your God with all of your heart, with all of your soul, with all of your mind and with all of your strength.......and love others as Jesus has loved / loves us "...
If any person can do just these two things, they are well ahead of the curve.....

I agree.
What about the Trinity?
If Jesus is not God, then we're just worshipping a man.
Even the JW are now saying that Jesus is the son of God, but not the way we mean it.
They mean that we're all sons, but Jesus is a SPECIAL son of God.
What about believing in the Holy Spirit?
How about belief in the proper nature of God?
Would you say we could add a few more beliefs?

 

[Willie T]

Good point.
No matter what I say and do, you should always be able to tell I love Jesus more than anything.
Someone who questions Jesus questions Christianity
Unless he takes a stand that he wants to learn the truth, he really is not serving a positive purpose here.
He is an agent of the devil trying to bring us down.

But someone who questions "Christianity" isn't necessarily questioning Jesus.

 

[GodsGrace]

But someone who questions "Christianity" isn't necessarily questioning Jesus.

???
Jesus IS Christianity.
If you question Christianity, you're questioning Jesus!

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

But someone who questions "Christianity" isn't necessarily questioning Jesus.

Very good point.
Christianity means so many different things to different people.
That's why I say focus on Jesus.

 

[GodsGrace]

Very good point.
Christianity means so many different things to different people.
That's why I say focus on Jesus.

Here we go again...
Christianity cannot mean different things to different people.
There's set beliefs that make one a christian...if they don't have these beliefs they are not christian.

 

[Nomad]

Here we go again...
Christianity cannot mean different things to different people.
There's set beliefs that make one a christian...if they don't have these beliefs they are not christian.

Amen to that. If Christianity can mean different things to different people, Jude was wrong.

Jud 1:3 Beloved, although I was very eager to write to you about our common salvation, I found it necessary to write appealing to you to contend for the faith that was once for all delivered to the saints.

 

[aspen]

If love is all you need, then one would be able to believe whatever he wanted to, whether it be Christian beliefs or not.

Krishna teaches love much more than Christianity does. The whole point is love, whereas Jesus taught us how to behave, how to create a kingdom of God here on earth right now, and how to be saved to go to be with Him at death.

So, are you saying I could believe in reincarnation and still call myself a Christian?
I could not believe in the Trinity and still call myself a Christian?
I could believe Jesus died only spiritually and still call myself a Christian?

So all these "crazy ideas" you speak of which "Christians" have are perfectly acceptable to you?

So you listed 3 ‘crazy’ ideas and then accussed me of teaching them? LOL

If you think Krishna is capable of justifying and sanctifying you so that you will become perfected in love, then you need to get back on the narrow path!

 

[aspen]

What is diversity in thought??
You mean a Christian could believe whatever he wants to?

No.....your comment is called a ‘slippery slope’, not diversity in thought

 

[Willie T]

Here we go again...
Christianity cannot mean different things to different people.
There's set beliefs that make one a christian...if they don't have these beliefs they are not christian.

Sadly, this is far from accurate.

 

[APAK]

Here we go again...
Christianity cannot mean different things to different people.
There's set beliefs that make one a christian...if they don't have these beliefs they are not christian.

GodsGrace: Is this new news?...waking up are we...?.
The 1st step in facing a problem is knowing it exists....now is it your problem or someone else's? And then why is this so?
The referee for me is the new spirit within me. And then there lies the rub, someone else says well my spirit says this and that....
There is a piece of scripture that point to truth in a person, it is called the fruit(s) of the spirit. Look for this in people. I do anyway. You can still get deceived though if you are not experienced...it takes time...

Bless you,

APAK

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

Here we go again...
Christianity cannot mean different things to different people.
There's set beliefs that make one a christian...if they don't have these beliefs they are not christian.

No, I disagree with that.
I believe there are roman catholics that saved even though they still worship Mary

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

Amen to that. If Christianity can mean different things to different people, Jude was wrong.

Jud 1:3 Beloved, although I was very eager to write to you about our common salvation, I found it necessary to write appealing to you to contend for the faith that was once for all delivered to the saints.

That verse is subject to interpretation.
Do you want to take it further?

 

[GodsGrace]

Amen to that. If Christianity can mean different things to different people, Jude was wrong.

Jud 1:3 Beloved, although I was very eager to write to you about our common salvation, I found it necessary to write appealing to you to contend for the faith that was once for all delivered to the saints.

I like the Nicene Creed for the beliefs Christians should have. (325 AD)
There were too many heresies making the rounds, much as today, so it had to be established exactly what the Christian faith was to consist of. The Nicene Creed was the result.

 

[GodsGrace]

So you listed 3 ‘crazy’ ideas and then accussed me of teaching them? LOL

If you think Krishna is capable of justifying and sanctifying you so that you will become perfected in love, then you need to get back on the narrow path!

I didn't accuse you of anything.
I listed 3 things a Christian CANNOT believe and still be called a Christian.

As to your second paragraph, I didn't say that either.
You've misunderstood everything I wrote.

 

[GodsGrace]

No.....your comment is called a ‘slippery slope’, not diversity in thought

No slippery slopes for me Aspen.
You're misunderstanding me...it might be me...

 

[GodsGrace]

GodsGrace: Is this new news?...waking up are we...?.
The 1st step in facing a problem is knowing it exists....now is it your problem or someone else's? And then why is this so?
The referee for me is the new spirit within me. And then there lies the rub, someone else says well my spirit says this and that....
There is a piece of scripture that point to truth in a person, it is called the fruit(s) of the spirit. Look for this in people. I do anyway. You can still get deceived though if you are not experienced...it takes time...

Bless you,

APAK

It's the problem of all of us if a person says he is a Christian and then believes doctrine that is not Christian.

I don't believe we can call ourselves Christian unless we believe in Christian doctrine. I don't mean that we're going to agree on every topic, but we have to have the basics down, as Jesus, Paul and the other writers meant us to have.

If this is not the case, then Christianity is lost. If we can believe what we want to and still be called Christian, then Christianity has lost all identity and it has been washed away and no longer exists.