I THINK I agree.
I always thought the New Jerusalem is the New Earth AFTER the end of times.
But, as I said, I don't really know.
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I always thought the New Jerusalem is the New Earth AFTER the end of times.
But, as I said, I don't really know.
Triumph1300
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Not a single one of us really "knows." We just have to depend that we are believing what God wants us to believe.
Helen
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We know there are no comma's or anything else..just run-on sentences..
And I do believe in Paradise ...a Beautiful Place that we will instantly be in. :)
Paradise is Abraham's Bossom.
So you believe we're all going to Abraham's Bossom, as in Luke 16, to await the end of the world?
Since God wants every person who is saved to come unto the knowledge of the truth, you can certainly know after you have studied the Bible for yourself.
Yes, after the end times, there will be (1) new heavens (applicable to the first and second heaven, since the third heaven -- God's Heaven -- needs no cleansing), (2) a new earth, which has been thoroughly purified by supernatural fire, in order to be totally cleansed from everything which defiles, and (3) the New Jerusalem (which was already in existence at the time of Abraham), and which will be the eternal home of God and Christ, as well as all the saints of God.
However, contrary to what many think, the New Jerusalem will descend, but will NOT come down to earth. It is a gigantic supernatural city with the dimensions of a continent (1500 miles x 1500 miles x 1500 miles), and since the sun will not exist any longer, it will become a heavenly body above the earth so that it gives light to the earth.
And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it. And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof. And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it. (Rev 21:22-24).
I don't think John meant everything literally.
For instance, John says the city had NO NEED of the sun...it doesn't say the sun didn't exist anymore. GOD gave light to the city. Because evil was gone and only God's light existed.
It's what I think...I've never studied this and won't insist.
I do thank you for the information.
While that passage does not say this, there are other Scriptures which do. Here's one for example: And there shall be no night there; and they need no candle, neither light of the sun; for the Lord God giveth them light: and they shall reign for ever and ever. (Rev 22:5)
So if there is no need for the light of the sun, and *the heaven has departed as a scroll*, while all the stars have fallen from heaven, it is clear that the sun has ceased to exist.
Maybe not true.
The description of the New Jerusalem indicates that we will be living inside it, like a house with no windows.
Triumph1300
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Ok.....what did he mean literally.....and what did he not mean literally.....that's the question.
This is going to give a whole different twist to Bible study.
Do you believe everything in Revelation is literal?
It can't be...
A dragon with many heads ,,, or is it horns?
Envelopes being opened.
Jesus knocking on a door...
This is all symbolism.
Helen
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NO!! I do not. That parable doesn't sound very inviting on either side of the "gulf fixed"... :)
Helen
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Totally agree, .....but there are so many literalist on this Site...it does really amaze me.
Hi ByGrace,
I used to think the very same way about Abrahams Bosom...and VERY recently I have learned something about that that has totally switched my thinking. I learned that A.B. was for the OT saints waiting for Jesus to die and resurrect, and after that He descended to the "Lower Parts" to set them free and then brought Abraham and all the OT Saints to Heaven with Him!
I have no scriptures at this time but, everything I read online about it pretty much verifies/solidifies my new understanding. Abraham and all the O.T. Saints are all in Heaven now!
Helen
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And I Totally agree...but GodsGrace was telling me that Paradise is Abrahams
Bosom...which I do not believe.
I agree that AB was pre-cross and resurrection.
Here is an interesting article (IMHO) it is from:Where did Old Testaments saints go at death? Abraham's Bosom?
The full question we received was, “Before Jesus died on the cross and opened the gates of Heaven, where did people go when they died? What’s Abraham’s Bosom?”
I love the way the person asked this question because it indicates an understanding that it is only by Jesus’ finished work on the cross that anyone, in any time period, goes to Heaven. That includes Old Testament saints. They did not go to Heaven when they died, because Jesus had not come to earth and lived the life we could not live and died the death we should have died. His work, alone, opened the way to the Father in Heaven.
While people in the Old Testament were saved by the grace of God when they trusted in Him (saving faith), their sins were not yet washed away (atoned for) by the blood of Jesus. After God delivered His people from Egypt, and when He first set them on a journey to their inheritance in the Promised Land, He gave them a system of animal sacrifice to be a blood offering to cover their sins. However, the blood of an animal could never fully atone for the sins of man, and the works of man (including sacrificial works) could never fully satisfy God. Therefore, it was necessary that a day would come when God would send His Son, to be incarnated as a man, to live a pure and sinless life and to die as the perfect Lamb of God who would take away the sins of the world (John 1:29).
In the wilderness God had told His people that the life of man is in the blood (Leviticus 17:11) and therefore only by the blood of a man could the wrath of God’s judgment of sin be satisfied and the penalty for sin be paid. And, it had to be pure, sinless blood. Only Jesus could be that sacrifice and so He laid down His life in submission to His Father’s will and His blood was acceptable in God’s sight.
So where did Old Testament saints go before Jesus’ finished work?
We know that only Jesus is the way, truth and life (John 14:6) and the Old Testament saints did not know the Way. Prior to Jesus’ atonement, the Old Testament saints went to a place called Abraham’s Bosom. In Luke 16, Jesus describes two distinctly different places, where man’s soul went at death:
1. the place of comfort called Abraham’s Bosom and
2. the place of torment that we refer to as Hell.
1) Abraham’s Bosom Was Not Heaven.
Heaven is defined as the place where God dwells. Geographically we think of it as being “up above,” beyond the heaven that we see, the one in which birds and airplanes fly. The place where God dwells is even beyond the heavens in which the sun, moon, and stars exist. God’s dwelling place is considered to be the highest of heavens (Luke 19:38), the “Heaven of heavens” (Deuteronomy 10:14, 1 Kings 8:27) and is referred to in the Bible as the third heaven (2 Corinthians 12:2).
Where was Abraham’s Bosom?
Abraham’s Bosom was located “down below” the heavens in the depths of the earth. Jesus referred to it as the “heart of the earth” (Matthew 12:40) and it was the abode of the righteous dead prior to Jesus’ resurrection. Jesus also referred to this place as “paradise,” when He promised the thief on the cross next to Him that he would be with Him that same day, in paradise. (Luke 23:43)
What was Abraham’s Bosom?
Abraham’s Bosom was a place of comfort and it was a place of waiting. The sins of Old Testament saints were remitted by the Levitical system of atonement using the blood of animals. Since this was not sufficient to completely atone for sins, those who died in faith went to Abraham’s Bosom and waited until the time their sins would be paid for completely. They waited for the promised Seed, the Rescuer, the One who was promised in the Garden (Genesis 3:15, Galatians 4:4) to their father Abraham (Genesis 22:17-18, Galatians 3:16) and promised again to their most exalted earthly King, King David (2 Samuel 7:12-16, Acts 13:21-23).
When Jesus offered Himself in payment for the penalty of man’s sins, His shed blood made the complete and final atonement for sins. And, when Jesus ascended into Heaven, He led the Old Testament saints from Abraham’s Bosom to their new dwelling place with Him (Ephesians 4:8) in the Heaven of heavens.
2) The Other Place
Since the time of Jesus’ ascension, there now only remains the place of torment within the earth. We call this place “hell,” which is a translation of the Hebrew word “sheol” (meaning the world of the dead, the grave or the pit) and the Greek word “Hades” (meaning the place of departed souls, the grave). Remember, prior to Jesus’ ascension into Heaven both Abraham’s Bosom and the place of torment existed in the earth as the place of the dead. Since Jesus’ ascension, only one place remains Hell. That is why, when we refer to Hell now, we are referring to the place of torment only.
The place of torment is similar to Abraham’s Bosom in that it is a temporary abode for the unrighteous dead (Abraham’s Bosom was the temporary abode for the righteous dead until the saints were fully redeemed). In the place of torment, the unrighteous await a final judgment that is yet to come, which is referred to as the Great White Throne Judgment in Revelation 20:11-15. At that time, all the souls in the place of torment will be bodily raised and judged. They will go to their eternal destination, which the Bible calls the Lake of Fire (Revelations 20:15). The Lake of Fire is certainly not a place of comfort and rest.
Fatherly Comfort
In Abraham’s Bosom the Old Testament saints were comforted by Father Abraham, but now they are in the comfort and rest of God the Father—the God whom the Old Testament saints knew as the God of their forefathers. Heaven is the eternal resting place of all who die in faith, having had their sins forgiven and washed away by the blood of Jesus. The Old Testament saints awaited Jesus’ atonement and then were taken there. New Testament saints, those who live in the age of the Christian Church (also known as the age of the indwelling Holy Spirit), go immediately to be with Jesus in Heaven. (2 Corinthians 5:8) at the time of death.
It’s amazing to think that our souls will be transported up above the heavens of our atmosphere and outer space, and beyond that to the Heaven of heavens in which God the Father and Jesus the Son dwell. We will join the multitude of saints who have gone before us. A bit lengthy but, worth the read.
Not sure what you mean by "maybe not true". Let's keep in mind that we are discussing a city that is actually beyond the grasp of mere mortals. But whatever needed to be revealed has been revealed.
I agree that we will be living in the New Jerusalem, but since the light radiating from this city will light the earth, "no windows" would be incorrect. While windows are not mentioned in Revelation, the fact that all the saints presently in the New Jerusalem are witnesses of the saints on earth (Heb 12:1) could mean that perhaps it is totally transparent, therefore no need for windows.
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