Eternal Security

[gadar perets]

However, we know that we have the Spirit of the Lord...and you don't.

You sound like a little immature brat. "We have the Spirit of the Lord and you don't, na na nanana."

No one can say that Jesus is the Lord (see Matthew 11:25, Luke 10:21, Ephesians 4:5) except by the Holy Ghost (1 Corinthians 12:3 (kjv)). Therefore if you don't confess that Jesus is the Lord (God), you don't have the Holy Ghost. Simple as that.

Actually, "Jesus" is another of the KJV's errors since the letter "J" does not exist in Hebrew or Aramaic. It is a recent invention of man after printers invented the letter "J" in English. Prior to that, the Son's name was spelled "Iesus" in the 1611 KJV. The Son's name is "Yeshua" meaning "he will save". It does NOT mean "YHWH is salvation". So I can say, "Yeshua is Lord". I can even say, "Yeshua is my Lord". Therefore, I have the Holy Spirit. Can you say, "Yeshua is Lord" or do you insist on using an erroneous name?

 

[justbyfaith]

I can say that "Yeshua is the Lord", if you can say that "Jesus is the Lord" or even that "Yeshua is the Lord" in light of what it says in Matthew 11:25, Luke 10:21, and Ephesians 4:5.

But if I say "Yeshua is Lord" before you do that, I think I would be calling Lord a different Jesus than is the Jesus of the Bible, who is not truly the Son of God in light of Isaiah 9:6.

I would be calling the Jesus that you preach ("Yeshua") who is not the Jesus of the Bible, Lord.

I will not call any false Jesus Lord (see 2 Corinthians 11:3-4).

Can you say that 'Yeshua is the Lord" in light of Matthew 11:25, Luke 10:21, and Ephesians 4:5? If you can, then I will know that the Person you refer to as Yeshua is the true Jesus; and I will have no problem calling Jesus by the Hebrew pronunciation of His name, as being the Lord of my life. Because the real, true, and living Yeshua is indeed the Lord of my life and the Lord of all. But by Yeshua I do not mean the Yeshua that you are preaching (again, see 2 Corinthians 11:3-4).

 

[justbyfaith]

Yes. However, it is not a matter of "IF YHWH refers to the Father". That is an undeniable Scriptural fact (Psalm 2:7).

No kidding.

I have already dealt with it in past replies.

Not adequately enough to convince anyone (who is truly saved) of your point of view.

 

[APAK]

@GodsGrace ..I rushed this commentary...it still says what I wanted it to say. I estimate 8 posts for this commentary I wanted you to have and meditate on...comes purely out of scripture.

This is 1 of say 8 posts at this point....

Eternal Security and Assurance of Salvation – you are ‘saved’ and you must know it

These are the words of God that clearly show that if one is truly saved and converted their salvation and future is secure. You are truly held in God’s hands or power.

The most critical thing we first must know with 100 percent certainty is that we are saved. It is the prerequisite for any further discussion here.

Look at 1 John 5:10-13

(1Jn 5:10) He that believes in the Son of God has the witness in himself. He that does not believe God has made Him a liar; because he has not believed in the witness that God has given concerning His Son.
(1Jn 5:11) And the witness is this: that God gave to us eternal life, and this life is in His Son.
(1Jn 5:12) He that has the Son has life. He that does not have the Son of God does not have life.
(1Jn 5:13) I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life. (NEV)

In verse 10, John says that if we truly believe in the son of God then we have this substantiated inside of us already. We are our own witness. God said this, not Calvin or myself.

God says that our heart knows we believe in verse 11, that we know we have eternal life and we are in Christ that gives us this eternal life. Someone that denies that they know they have eternal life from their heart is a liar and is not saved, because they are then calling God a liar. God is not a liar. These people that are liars are professing believers as tares in the field with the corn that shall be dealt with at the harvest and the Day of judgment.

Verse 13 again foot stomps the fact that a believer knows they have eternal life. It is proof that is beyond the carnal mind and the flesh of sin to comprehend.

God places in our hearts the knowledge that we have eternal life in Christ, as proof we are truly saved.

Look at 2 Tim 1:12 and 14

(2Ti 1:12) For which cause I suffer also these things. Yet I am not ashamed. For I know him whom I have believed, and I am persuaded that he is able to guard what I have committed to him against that day.
(2Ti 1:14) That good thing which was committed to you guard through the Holy Spirit which dwells in us. (NEV)

Once we are saved and we know it, we are guarded and protected through the spirit of God that gave us the spirit of Christ.

Timothy say he does suffer by preaching the gospel is not ashamed of it and is persuaded that because he is saved (committed) and believes in Christ he is guarded until Jesus returns (against that Day). Timothy believed it, not just Calvin and not just me. Scripture says it. The ‘good thing committed’ in verse 14 to those that are saved, is eternal life.

to the 2nd post of the commentary....APAK

 

[APAK]

@GodsGrace ..2nd post of the commentary follows...

The spirit of God, that part of it for us, the spirit of Christ that lives in a believer, guards and guarantees this assurance of eternal life when Jesus returns.

Look at 2 Cor 5:1-5

Now Paul is confident in his eternal life as well.

(2Co 5:1) For we know that if the tent that is our earthly home is dissolved, we have a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal, in the heavens.
(2Co 5:2) For indeed in this tent we groan, longing to be clothed with our dwelling from heaven
(2Co 5:3) inasmuch as we, having put it on, will not be found naked.
(2Co 5:4) For indeed we that are in this tent do groan, being burdened. Not that we would be unclothed, but that we would be further clothed, that what is mortal may be swallowed up by life.
(2Co 5:5) Now He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who also has given us the Spirit as a guarantee. (NEV)

Paul is saying what Timothy said.

The spirit of Christ placed within us by God, guarantees that those saved shall be transformed from mortal to immortality – eternal life.

So now John, Timothy, Paul, Calvin, Rollo and I at least, we believe we have assurance of eternal life.

Look at John 10:27-29

(Joh 10:27) My sheep hear my voice, and I know them and they follow me.
(Joh 10:28) And I give to them eternal life; and they shall never perish, and no one shall snatch them out of my hand.
(Joh 10:29) My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. (NEV)

Now Jesus is saying not only shall he give believers eternal life, his Father shall also ensure this shall happen. What other assurance do we need?

Jesus gives us, the converted, eternal life and we shall NEVER perish because he and his Father shall guarantee it.

So now Jesus as the means of eternal life tells John, Timothy, Paul, Calvin, Rollo and I at least, we have assurance of eternal life from him and his Father.

Look at Eph 1:13-14

More guarantee of secured salvation.

(Eph 1:13) In whom you also believed, having heard the word of the truth, the gospel of your salvation, and were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,
(Eph 1:14) which is a guarantee of our inheritance, of the final redemption of God's own possession, for the praise of His glory. (NEV)

to the 3rd post of the commentary.....APAK

 

[APAK]

the 3rd post of the commentary follows....

God sealed us and guaranteed our inheritance to be redeemed as his promise, of our eternal life.

We are sealed in Christ and thus sealed in God Almighty because he crated Christ (his spirit that dwells within us.

Look at Romans 8:329-0, 33-34

(Rom 8:29) " For whom He foreknew, He also foreordained to be conformed to the image of His Son, that he might be the firstborn among many other children. "
(Rom 8:30) " And whom He foreordained, those He also called, and whom He called, these He also justified, and who He justified, these He also glorified. " (NEV)

God foreknew those he would save. He foreordained them to salvation by conforming or bonding them to the spirit or image of his son. He called the saved out to believe and be justified. And these he justified he glorified.

God foreknew, foreordained, justified and then glorified (gave immortality to) those he saved.

Look at Romans 4: 4-5 and 11:6

(Rom 4:4) " Now to him that works, the reward is not reckoned as of grace, but as of debt. "
(Rom 4:5) " But to him that works not, but believes in Him that justifies the ungodly, his faith is reckoned for righteousness. " (NEV)

We must recognize that to God, works are not grace it is to pay a debt. Grace is that we are allowed to believe in Christ that justifies anyone, his faith in Christ is sufficient for being right with God. We are thus saved through grace and not works as under the Law.

We are saved by grace and not works as to pay off a debt.

(Rom 11:6) " But if it is by grace, it is no more of works. Otherwise grace is no more grace. "

Look at Heb 6:4-8

If we do works for salvation, we are not under grace anymore. We can never be saved under works as if under the Law, no matter how hard we repent and confess ours sins to God while grace is in effect. Even if we have tasted or experienced the spirit of God as others did under the OT-OC. It makes no difference.

How can we bring someone back to true repentance under grace even if they experienced or tasted the spirit of God for salvation for them to return back to works and the Law to pay off their sins? Their new repentance under grace would require Christ to re-sacrifice himself again for them, which is impossible. They can return if they stop their works for salvation and genuinely repent under grace.

(Heb 6:4) For as touching those who were once enlightened and tasted the heavenly gift and were made partakers of the Holy Spirit,
(Heb 6:5) who tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come,

to the 4th post of the commentary......

 

[APAK]

@GodsGrace .. the 4th commentary post follows...

(Heb 6:6) but then fell away- it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
(Heb 6:7) For the earth which drinks in the rain that often comes upon it, and bears herbs useful for those by whom it is cultivated, receives blessing from God.
(Heb 6:8) But if it bears thorns and thistles, it is rejected and in danger of being cursed, whose end is to be burned. (NEV)

Those that want to be saved do it under grace in faith of Jesus’ work not our work to repay our sins off. If we have tasted the spirit, the word of God and salvation that touches our heart we need to continue under grace and accept the gift of salvation and repent under these terms to justification. Even if we keep tasting the heavenly things of God for salvation and continue in works we will never be saved. We cannot commit to God and accept his gift of salvation if we want to do it our own way, under our own power and will. We are considered crucifiers of Christ once again if we reject God gift of salvation under grace. How can one change this rejecting mind back to Christ again? We cannot, they rejected the truth and never became believers in Christ.

We repent, become justified and are saved by God under his grace and not under our own will, efforts or power or by our works.

Look at Ecc 12:14, 1 Cor 3:1, 13-15

(Ecc 12:14) For God will bring every work into judgment, with every hidden thing, whether it is good, or whether it is evil.

(1Co 3:1) And I, brothers, can not speak to you as spiritual people, but as carnal people, as infants in Christ.
(1Co 3:13) each man's work shall be revealed. For the day of judgment shall declare it, because it will be revealed by fire; and the fire itself shall test each man's work of what sort it is.
(1Co 3:14) If anyone's work shall endure which he built thereon, he shall receive a reward.
(1Co 3:15) If anyone's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss; but he himself shall be saved, yet as having passed through fire. (NEV)

Even a saved person can commit the gravest of sin, as a sinner or unbeliever. The saved though will not get any reward for them. The sinner will not have salvation at all. The saved are never affected or in jeopardy of losing their salvation because of sin as God never ‘sees’ them in sin, as they are in Christ. Some believers have eternal life under grace as if they were saved from a fire that threatened or seemed likely to engulf and destroy them.

Look at Romans 8: 38-39

(Rom 8:38)" For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, "
(Rom 8:39) " nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord." (NEV)

to the 5th post of the commentary...APAK

 

[APAK]

@GodsGrace .. the 5th post of the commentary follows....

Paul is again persuaded that the love of God cannot be separated from him and those saved because of Jesus’ spirit dwelling within him and us. And as I began we know we have this love because we know we have the assurance of salvation from God.

Look at 1 Cor 12:15-25

(1Co 12:15) If the foot shall say: Because I am not the hand, I am not of the body- that would not make it not a part of the body.
(1Co 12:16) And if the ear shall say: Because I am not the eye, I am not of the body- that would not make it not a part of the body.
(1Co 12:17) If the whole body were an eye, where is the hearing? If the whole were hearing, where is the smelling?
(1Co 12:18) But now has God set the members each one of them in the body, even as it pleased Him.
(1Co 12:19) And if they were all one member, where is the body?
(1Co 12:20) But now they are many members, but one body.
(1Co 12:21) Therefore the eye cannot say to the hand: I have no need of you; nor the head to the feet: I have no need of you.
(1Co 12:22) No, on the contrary, those members of the body which seem to be more feeble are necessary.
(1Co 12:23) And those parts of the body, which we think to be less honourable, upon these we bestow more abundant honour; and our unattractive parts have more abundant covering;

(1Co 12:24) whereas our more attractive parts have no need of this. But God tempered the body together, giving more abundant honour to that part which lacked it,
(1Co 12:25) so that there should be no schism in the body, but that the members should have the same care one for another.
(1Co 12:26) And whether one member suffers, all the members suffer with it; or one member is honoured, all the members rejoice with it. (NEV)

Those saved in the body of God through Christ as its head, are all of equal importance. If a member sins more than another, God will make up for this member’s failures through Christ. God wants his people to be as one body as of equal importance and significance. There is no work we can do under our own will to shine above another member. God is in control and not us. All members share in each other’s failures or rewards.

Look at 1 John 3:9, 5:18

(1Jn 3:9) Whoever is begotten of God does not keep on in sin, because his seed abides in him, and he cannot keep on in sin, because he is begotten of God.

(1Jn 5:13) I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life. (NEV)

Again, John is saying he knows that the seed, Christ’s spirit is bonded within us and therefore we cannot sin. We are now born of God because he gave us Christ’s spirit (Image); as Jesus was born of God in his spirit. This forms the basis of knowing and guaranteeing our eternal life.

Look at Col 2:11

the 6th commentary post follows....APAK

 

[APAK]

@GodsGrace ..this is the 6th post of the commentary...

(Col 2:11) In him you were also circumcised with a circumcision not made with hands, in the putting off of the body of the flesh, in the circumcision of Christ.

We saved are spiritually cut off from our sinful body of flesh. We are circumcised and separated into Christ. This is another reason we have eternal security.

Look at Eph 4:30

(Eph 4:30) And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by which you were sealed until the day of redemption. (NEV)

Even though we as believers sometimes grieve the spirit that is bonded (sealed) to us, we still have the assurance of salvation and eternal security.

Look at Romans 8: 19-23

(Rom 8:19) For the earnest expectation of the creation awaits the revealing of God’s children.
(Rom 8:20)" For the creation was subjected to vanity, not of its own will, but by reason of Him who subjected it in hope; "
(Rom 8:21) that the creation itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the liberty of the glory of the children of God.
(Rom 8:22) For we know that the whole creation has been groaning together in the pains of childbirth until now.
(Rom 8:23)" And not only the creation, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for adoption as children and the redemption of our bodies. " (NEV)

We as believers cannot wait to be delivered (raptured into Jesus’ realm) from bondage into freedom, transformed to eternal life as the immortals and children of God and his glory.

Look at 1 Cor 5: 1, 5

(1Co 5:1) It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and such immorality as is not even among the Gentiles, that one of you has taken to himself his father's wife.
(1Co 5:5) deliver such a person to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus. (NEV)

If a believer continues to commit grave sins they it is better for them to physically die through their continued acts of evil and natural desires of their body so that his spirit can be free to salvation sooner. This is another example that sin has NO bearing on our salvation and its assurance. Again, we just do not sin in God’s eyes.

Look at 2 Cor 12: 19-21

(2Co 12:19) You think all this time that we are excusing ourselves to you. But in the sight of God we speak in Christ. All things, beloved, are for your upbuilding.

 

[APAK]

@GodsGrace … this is the 7th posting of the commentary...

(2Co 12:20) For I fear, lest by any means, when I come, I should find you not as I would wish, and should myself be found by you such as you would not wish. Lest by any means there should be quarrelling, jealousy, anger, hostility, slander, gossip, conceit, and disorder.
(2Co 12:21) I fear that when I come again my God may humble me before you, and I may have to mourn over many of those who sinned earlier and have not repented of the impurity, sexual immorality and sensuality that they have practiced.

Again, the gravest of sins committed do not jeopardize our salvation. Although a believer still needs to repent as Christs’ spirit would desire it of us.

Look at Eph 1:5-6

(Eph 1:5) Having foreordained us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will,
(Eph 1:6) to the praise of the glory of His grace, which He freely bestowed on us in the beloved. (NEV)

God’s will and purpose, and not of our own will, brings us to him for salvation. God gave us grace to salvation as adopted sons of God through the seed of Jesus’ spirit.

So, in summary:

1. God places in our hearts the knowledge that we have eternal life in Christ, as proof we are truly saved.

2. The spirit of God, that part of it for us, the spirit of Christ that lives in a believer, guards and guarantees this assurance of eternal life until/when Jesus returns.

3. The spirit of Christ placed within us by God, guarantees that those saved shall be transformed from mortality to immortality – eternal life.

4. Jesus gives us, the converted, eternal life and we shall NEVER perish because he and his Father shall guarantee it.

5. God sealed us and guaranteed our inheritance to be redeemed as his promise, of our eternal life.

6. God foreknew, foreordained, justified and then glorified (gave immortality to) those he saved.

7. We are saved by grace and not works as to pay off a debt.

8. We repent, become justified and are saved by God under his grace and not under our own will, efforts or power or by our works -even if we have experienced the heavenly powers and the spirit of God. It is impossible for Christ to re-sacrifice for our sins again and have us come to genuine repentance under grace if we only believe the terms of Law or under works of debt or compensation or penance. We then act as enemies of God and only desire to crucify Jesus again for public display and shame.

9. The love of God cannot be separated from those saved because of Jesus’ spirit dwelling within us. And as I began we know we have this love because we know we have the assurance of salvation from God.

10. The seed, Christ’s spirit is bonded within us and therefore we cannot sin. We are now born of God because he gave us Christ’s spirit (Image); as Jesus was born of God in his spirit. This forms the basis of knowing and guaranteeing our eternal life.

11. We saved are spiritually cut off from our sinful body of flesh. We are circumcised and separated into Christ. This is another reason we have eternal security.

12. Even though we as believers sometimes grieve the spirit that is bonded (sealed) to us, we still have the assurance of salvation and eternal security.

 

[APAK]

@GodsGrace ..the last and 8th posting of the commentary follows...

1. We as believers cannot wait to be delivered (raptured into Jesus’ realm) from bondage into freedom, transformed to eternal life as the immortals and children of God and his glory.

13. Sin has NO bearing on our salvation and its assurance. We just do not sin in God’s eyes.

14. The gravest of sins committed do not jeopardize our salvation. Although a believer still needs to repent as Christs’ spirit would desire it of him.

15. God’s will and purpose, and not of our own will, brings us to him for salvation. God gave us grace to salvation as adopted sons of God through the seed of Jesus’ spirit.

8th posting of commentary completed.

The End..

Bless you,

APAK

 

[GodsGrace]

No,no,no...the Prodigal son never was lost to his Father, he never lost his salvation from his Father....he just was not glorifying his Father in his life....his salvation was never in jeopardy.....read the scripture again. He never 'fell away' meaning that he never lost his salvation!!!!

Yes, these folks were mostly wanting to go back to the Law and thus never really repented to our Lord Jesus and would never be saved through the Law. They were actually mocking him

I'm afraid you're going to have to take it up with Jesus since HE told the parable to teach us many things....It's my favorite in the entire N.T.

Luke 15:24 Jesus said:
24for this son of mine was dead and has come to life again; he was lost and has been found.’ And they began to celebrate.

Dead...not alive, not living, not physically dead because the son was alive,,,but spiritually dead.

Lost...As lost as anyone is when they don't have belief in God and the dwelling of the Holy Spirit.

 

[GodsGrace]

If you are referring to Hebrews 6:4-8, that passage has nothing to do with the Law. You are reading that into the text.

Hebrews 6:1-6
1Therefore leaving the elementary teaching about the Christ, let us press on to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God,
2of instruction about washings and laying on of hands, and the resurrection of the dead and eternal judgment.
3And this we will do, if God permits.
4For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit,
5and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come,
6and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame.

In Hebrews chapter 5 Paul is explaining how Jesus is the perfect High Priest.
He explains to the Jews how Jesus became the source for eternal salvation...5:9

He tells the Jews they have BECOME dull of hearing...5:11

The Jews should be more mature by now, but they need milk again...5:12

In chapter 6:1 Paul tells the Jewish converts to Christianity that they are not AGAIN to lay a foundation of DEAD WORKS. Dead works....trying to become saved by WORKING for it and not by trusting in Jesus which is the new way.

Verses 4-6 are referring to those Jews who had heard about Jesus and believed in Him, but they became frightened that they might be making a mistake and were considering going back to the LAW,,,washings, laying on of hands (levitical law), the resurrection of the dead as in the O.T. which was not believed by some (the sadducees).

It would be impossible to renew these persons again to repentence since they would be insulting the cross of Christ and that is blasphemy.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

I am not a JW and never have been. They are lawless as well.

As for John 1:1, I choose to not read the Son into the text as trinitarian translators do. The "logos" is a thing, not a person. The key to understanding John 1:1 lies in the word order of John 1:1c. Here is an excerpt from one of the most, if not the most widely used Biblical Greek Grammars (Mounce, William D. Basics of Biblical Greek Grammar. Grand Rapids, MI: Zondervan, 2003.)

"As we have said, word order is employed especially for the sake of emphasis. Generally speaking, when a word is thrown to the front of the clause it is done so for emphasis. When a predicate nominative is thrown in front of the verb, by virtue of word order it takes on emphasis. A good illustration of this is John 1:1c. The English versions typically have, 'and the Word was God.' But in Greek, the word order has been reversed. It reads,

καὶ θεὸς ἦν ὁ λόγος

and God was the Word.​

We know that "the Word" is the subject because it has the definite article, and we translate it accordingly: 'and the Word was God.' Two questions, both of theological import, should come to mind: (1) why was θεὸς thrown forward? and (2) why does it lack the article? In brief, its emphatic position stresses its essence or quality: 'What God was, the Word was' is how one translation (Revised English Bible) brings out this force." (bold, gadar perets).
​

In other words, If YHWH our Elohim is holy, so is His word. If YHWH is powerful, so is His word. If YHWH is creative, so is His word. The attributes of the word of YHWH are the same as the attributes of YHWH Himself.

By reversing the word order and making the logos "God" and reading that "God" as the Son has caused great confusion and led to the use of pronoun "him" in verses 3-4. Versions prior to the KJV were not confused. They did not read the Son into the text and used "it" instead of "him".

John 1:3 All thinges were made by it and with out it was made nothinge that was made.
John 1:4 In it was lyfe and the lyfe was ye lyght of men
John 1:5 and the lyght shyneth in the darcknes but the darcknes comprehended it not. Tyndale's Bible
​

Other versions such as The Geneva Bible, The Bishop's Bible, Matthews Bible, and The Great Bible all made similar translations. Today, all versions follow the KJV error of changing "it" to "him" to help support the trinity doctrine which needs all the help it can get.

Worldly knowledge gets you no where.
There are enough scholars throughout the centuries to prove you wrong.
You have itchy ears.
You found someone who said what you wanted to hear.
So you are a Mohammedan afterall.

 

[gadar perets]

I can say that "Yeshua is the Lord", if you can say that "Jesus is the Lord" or even that "Yeshua is the Lord" in light of what it says in Matthew 11:25, Luke 10:21, and Ephesians 4:5.

I can definitely say, "Yeshua is the Lord". I can NEVER say, "Yeshua is the LORD (meaning YHWH). Yeshua is not the "Lord" mentioned in Matthew 11:25 and Luke 10:21. Both of those verses make it perfectly clear that Yeshua is talking a different "Lord", to his FATHER who is YHWH (Psalm 2:7). Or do you prefer to believe that Yeshua was talking to himself???????????

As for Ephesians 4:5 where Paul says there is "one Lord", it cannot mean there is only one Lord in this world and no other. Paul himself said there were many lords in 1 Corinthians 8:5. Even Matthew 11:25 and Luke 10:21 show there is another "Lord" besides Yeshua (his Father).
When Paul said, "one Lord", it is to be understood that the "one God" he mentioned in verse 6 was excluded in verse 5 because he intended to mention Him in verse 6.

What do you do with Luke 2:22? "And when the days of her purification according to the law of Moses were accomplished, they brought him to Jerusalem, to present him to the Lord;" Yeshua is being presented to "the Lord" to fulfill Exodus 13:2. Was Yeshua being presented to himself or to a different "Lord"?

But if I say "Yeshua is Lord" before you do that, I think I would be calling Lord a different Jesus than is the Jesus of the Bible, who is not truly the Son of God in light of Isaiah 9:6.

I would be calling the Jesus that you preach ("Yeshua") who is not the Jesus of the Bible, Lord.

I will not call any false Jesus Lord (see 2 Corinthians 11:3-4).

Can you say that 'Yeshua is the Lord" in light of Matthew 11:25, Luke 10:21, and Ephesians 4:5? If you can, then I will know that the Person you refer to as Yeshua is the true Jesus; and I will have no problem calling Jesus by the Hebrew pronunciation of His name, as being the Lord of my life. Because the real, true, and living Yeshua is indeed the Lord of my life and the Lord of all. But by Yeshua I do not mean the Yeshua that you are preaching (again, see 2 Corinthians 11:3-4).

May Yeshua forgive your profound ignorance in saying the Yeshua I preach is not the Yeshua of the Bible.

 

[gadar perets]

Hebrews 6:1-6
1Therefore leaving the elementary teaching about the Christ, let us press on to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God,
2of instruction about washings and laying on of hands, and the resurrection of the dead and eternal judgment.
3And this we will do, if God permits.
4For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit,
5and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come,
6and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame.

In Hebrews chapter 5 Paul is explaining how Jesus is the perfect High Priest.
He explains to the Jews how Jesus became the source for eternal salvation...5:9

He tells the Jews they have BECOME dull of hearing...5:11

The Jews should be more mature by now, but they need milk again...5:12

In chapter 6:1 Paul tells the Jewish converts to Christianity that they are not AGAIN to lay a foundation of DEAD WORKS. Dead works....trying to become saved by WORKING for it and not by trusting in Jesus which is the new way.

Verses 4-6 are referring to those Jews who had heard about Jesus and believed in Him, but they became frightened that they might be making a mistake and were considering going back to the LAW,,,washings, laying on of hands (levitical law), the resurrection of the dead as in the O.T. which was not believed by some (the sadducees).

It would be impossible to renew these persons again to repentence since they would be insulting the cross of Christ and that is blasphemy.

You are soooo wrong. Hebrews 6:1 does NOT say, "that they are not AGAIN to lay a foundation of DEAD WORKS." It says to not lay again, "a foundation of repentance from dead works." Big difference. "Repentance from dead works" is a good thing as are the other things mentioned in verses 1-2. A "foundation of dead works" is a bad thing. The "dead works" are works that UNBELIEVERS do before coming to faith in Yeshua. They are not the good works which ALL believers are ordained to walk in. Hebrews 6:1-3 is an admonishment to believers to not return to the milk they were nourished on, but to go forward to maturity and perfection. Do not repent again of the dead works you already repented of when you first believed. Move on.

 

[gadar perets]

Worldly knowledge gets you no where.
There are enough scholars throughout the centuries to prove you wrong.
You have itchy ears.
You found someone who said what you wanted to hear.
So you are a Mohammedan afterall.

You asked me to expound on John 1:1. I did so in such a way that you are dumbfounded and cannot reply against the truth. So you resort to falsely accusing me. You do the work of Satan in falsely accusing the brethren. May YHWH have mercy on you.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

You asked me to expound on John 1:1. I did so in such a way that you are dumbfounded and cannot reply against the truth. So you resort to falsely accusing me. You do the work of Satan in falsely accusing the brethren. May YHWH have mercy on you.

Christians call him Jesus.
You are an off-shoot of real Messianic Jews.
That makes you a cult.
Orthodox Jews believe in YHWH and not Jesus.
You are no different.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

You asked me to expound on John 1:1. I did so in such a way that you are dumbfounded and cannot reply against the truth. So you resort to falsely accusing me. You do the work of Satan in falsely accusing the brethren. May YHWH have mercy on you.

Here, read this.
It's in the forum rules.
We believe that Christian issues are able to be separated into two descriptions: *open-handed issues* and *close-handed issues*. Close-handed issues (or closed issues) are issues that are central to being a Christian; these issues are simply not up for debate because they are what defines Christianity. If closed-handed issues are debatable, then Christianity is simply yet another religion and nothing more. We will define those below in regards to the community, but this includes doctrines like the divinity of Christ.

 

[APAK]

I'm afraid you're going to have to take it up with Jesus since HE told the parable to teach us many things....It's my favorite in the entire N.T.

Luke 15:24 Jesus said:
24for this son of mine was dead and has come to life again; he was lost and has been found.’ And they began to celebrate.

Dead...not alive, not living, not physically dead because the son was alive,,,but spiritually dead.

Lost...As lost as anyone is when they don't have belief in God and the dwelling of the Holy Spirit.

You have a creative mind that does not match the intent of scripture at times GodsGrace. This is another one of them.

You seem to be obsessed to prosecute and find holes in God's word when it is clearly stated.

The 'dead' and 'lost' and 'found' expressions in this Father and son parable does not focus on salvation at all and you have the audacity of misusing this parable as your litmus test one's salvation? You and many others want to find fault in a believer at all times because they are still seekers and lack faith to bring themselves to God. The son was already saved. He went off and fell out of fellowship with his Father and thus he was considered 'dead.' He became 'alive' and began to walk with the Father once more.

You know this parable actually resembles me to some degree. I was already a believer and did become 'dead' for a while and was found again. I never fell away as this son NEVER FELL AWAY from his Father. He lost himself for a while and rededicated himself. This usually happened to males of youth when they want to 'sow their oats etc.... You have made a mountain to condemn those that are saved. I hope you find rest one of these days in all your condemnation of other believers.

BL: you do not trust scripture and God's word and especially for eternal life. I believe you never will even on your death bed ( not trying to be harsh or offensive - just very blunt)

Bless you,

APAK