OSAS is the result of the finished work of the cross

[amadeus]

@Jane_Doe22
@Taken

What is the purpose of the lake of fire? What does the scripture say happens to liars?

"But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death." Rev 21:8

Do have a part of that lake for even one unrepented lie? Has anyone lied at all since they first believed and since they first repented?

 

[Taken]

Exodus 20:16

So, the scenario has changed from one converted man lying to another Converted man....

To: One Hebrew making a Lying claim about another Hebrew.

Correct?

When a man sins (which all man can and do), he is no longer of God, but a servant of the devil doing the devil's ways (see the earlier verses in the same chapter). He needs to repent and come back to God. Yes, this happens time and time again.

Disagree.

Definition of sin: To commit sin is to willfully disobey God’s commandments or to fail to act righteously despite a knowledge of the truth (see James 4:17).

See James 1:2
See James 2:1
See James 2:5
See James 3:1

It looks clear to me, James is speaking to his Jewish "brethren". I am not Jewish.

"If ye love me, keep my commandments." -Jesus Christ, John 14:15.

I already addressed this.
1) Love is not the issue.
2) there are a list of Jesus' commandments

The topic is one converted man lying to another converted man....and HOW is that a sin, when Scripture says a man born of God sins no more ?

The man that have violated the commandments of God has violated his (the man's) love of Christ. A man whom truly loves Christ strives to keep his commandments.

A Converted man can not sin, according to Scripture.

You are saying a Converted man CAN sin, how does that not conflict with Scripture?

God Bless,
Merry Christmas,
Taken

 

[Jane_Doe22]

So, the scenario has changed from one converted man lying to another Converted man....

To: One Hebrew making a Lying claim about another Hebrew.

Correct?

Lying is lying. It is a sin. Doesn't matter who the liar is or the person being lied to.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

@Jane_Doe22
@Taken

What is the purpose of the lake of fire? What does the scripture say happens to liars?

"But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death." Rev 21:8

Do have a part of that lake for even one unrepented lie? Has anyone lied at all since they first believed and since they first repented?

For an unrepented lie, yes, the second death. (Note: Such repentance is gauged by the state of heart, not the instantaneous moment).

 

[mjrhealth]

You deliberately fail to qualify what 'it is finished' means because it suits you to make it mean whatever your imagination conjures up to support your point of view yet you will not put it in writing because you know you will be held accountable for what you print.

Either way, credibility hinges on your answer or your non answer.

Dont you understand what finished means. Maybe you need a dictionary explanation.,

• 
  Definition of finished in English:
• 
  
• 
  
• 
  
  finished
  adjective
  • 1(of a task or activity) brought to an end; completed.
    
    ‘a preparatory drawing for the finished painting’
  1. 1.1 (of a person) no longer useful or valued; ruined.
     ‘he was told he was finished at the club’
• 
  
• 2(of a person's work) expert or accomplished.
  
  ‘his highly finished craftsmanship’
  ‘she gave a fine finished performance’

So what is finished.

The works that Jesus came to do.
The end of the law, no more can it condemn anyone who believes in the finished works of Christ. Mainly for the Jews -Rom_7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter. God cant help it that men have made the law alive to them.
Sin - All forgiven no more condemnation for those who believe.
Works -they do nothing anyway, the works we do when in Christ are as Jesus put it, the works of the father, we have none of our own.

But of course the catch is - you must believe - Faith it is what pleases God even if it doesnt please man.

In other words, Gods word achieved everything it came to achieve, it never returns void, it is just that most men walk in unbelief.

 

[Marymog]

God revealed it from the beginning. But Catholicism tried to bury it by declaring themselves the source of salvation and preaching conditional salvation.

Which passage? Read says God foreknew who would love him and predestined them all the way to salvation. That is inescapably OSAS.

According to your theory God revealed it from the beginning. If it was revealed from the beginning then why wasn't it practiced from the beginning? How did the CC teaching become more popular than Gods teaching for 1,500 years? (BTW...thank you for acknowledging that the CC has been The Church since the beginning of Christianity)

Scripture says IF ye continue in the faith grounded and settled (Colossians) and IF ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain (1 Corinthians) IF you do not forgive men, neither will your heavenly Father forgive you your offenses (Matthew). What happens if you DON'T continue in the faith and keep in memory what was preached and don't forgive men? Are you still saved?

What about in Galatians when it talks about falling away from grace? How can you fall away from grace if you are OSAS?

Curious Mary

 

[Marymog]

I am, 2005.

Hi Heb.

Is it impossible for you to now fall from the grace of God?

Mary

 

[Taken]

@Jane_Doe22
@Taken

What is the purpose of the lake of fire? What does the scripture say happens to liars?

"But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death." Rev 21:8

Do have a part of that lake for even one unrepented lie? Has anyone lied at all since they first believed and since they first repented?

I get your point.
However I do not understand as you do.

Speaking from a Hebrew/Jewish point of view, and "under" the OLD covenant, is one thing.

Speaking from a Converted man/ Jew or Gentile, and "under" the NEW covenant, is another thing.

So, addressing the New covenant, to which "I" am "under"... so also, is my understanding.

Sin, lies, cheating, stealing, divorcing, deceiving, leaving, etc. IS about the RELATIONSHIP, between "A" man and the "Lord God Almighty"... thee:
Lord - Jesus
God - Father
Almighty - Spirit

By and through, "A" man 'CHOOSING to "hear" and Become "enlightened", TO the Word of God...such man BECOMES "blessed"..
WITH MEASURES of "a gift of Faith" from God.

Such man WHO "chooses" to "CONTINUED" being "enlightened"...."CONTINUES" receiving
"A gift of INCREASED MEASURES of Faith" from God.

There IS NO "COMMITMENT" on the mans part.

At ANY TIME, the man CAN STOP "hearing", STOP being "enlightened", STOP receiving "Faith" from God.

^ THAT man, is called .... "Fallen Away from Faith".

^ THAT man, is warned .... he is in danger of "LOSING his SALVATION".

"His Salvation"? Yes.
"His Salvation, Because Salvation IS A GIFT,
"OFFERED" by Christ Jesus, TO THE WHOLE World, which the Whole World, is INCLUSIVE of every single man, Ever naturally born.

It is important to understand, the Gift of Salvation ..... IS OFFERED.
It is not a gift Forced, upon a man.

It is OFFERED.
Every Individual man, can Decide for himself, "IF" he desires to ......
"TAKE" the gift...Jesus has "OFFERED"...
OR NOT.

There is NO END to Jesus' "OFFERED" gift, for generation after generations of men who will be naturally born, that THEY ALSO, have right to "TAKE" Jesus' "OFFERED" Gift of Salvation.

"ONCE" "ANY" individual man "CHOOSES" to "TAKE" Jesus' OFFERED Gift of Salvation...

And that mans CONFESSION of TRUE BELIEF,
IN GOD, IN JESUS, the Son of GOD...
(in the mans natural spirit, in his heart....NOT the mans MIND)....

Thee "OFFERED" gift of Salvation, from God,
Becomes, RECEIVED, unto "THAT" individual man, ONCE and FOREVER.

That "RECEIVED" gift of Salvation; is Coupled with "OTHER" gifts, Also RECEIVED unto that individual man, at the SAME TIME....ie

Forgiveness for NOT having believed.
Forgiveness for the Flesh corrupting the Soul.
The Soul, restored to good, as when God gave it life, with His Breath.
A new circumcised heart.
A new truth written in the new heart. (Christ IS the Seed of God, the Word of God, the Power of God, Jesus; God in the Flesh).
The Seed of God planted in the mans new heart.
The Seed of God, RE-births the mans "natural spirit", (subject to death with its natural flesh); TO a 'supernatural spiritual spirit" (Never again, subject to death.)
The Holy Spirit of God, has brought (QUICKENED) the man spirit to everlasting life, (Via Gods Seed and Power) and His Holy Spirit is now IN and WITH the man Forever.

In short...this is called The Baptism of the Holy Spirit...an ACT of GOD, to and within an individual man, WHO Freely Chose to ACCEPT,
The OFFERED GIFT of SALVATION.

In short...this man is NOW called "CONVERTED".

A CONVERTED man IS FREED FROM....WHAT?

SIN.

What SIN?

The SIN...OF:
Rejecting God, Rejecting Jesus, Rejecting Belief, Lying to God, Cheating God, Deceiving God, Divorcing (leaving) God, backstabbing God, becoming Yoked with and Standing with, other gods", other beliefs....

It is an Established, Concrete, Impermeable and Never Ending....RELATIONSHIP formed between thee Lord God Almighty and that ONE Individual man.

That's That... and WHY an Individual man can SAY....ONCE he IS SAVED, it is FOREVER.

God is not a fooled. He does not GIVE His glorious OFFERED gifts, TO Con artists, who perform for an audience, (ie an alter call before a congregation) and tricks the audience into believing he is "Saved". (With his appearence and lying words of a confessed belief.)

While the congregation is ooohing and aaahing, watching a man speak the words "they" believe ....the Lord is searching the mans natural spirit's TRUTH, hidden in the mans heart.

Not a Secret, men are liars. Many a men have LIED to the Lord. And many "onlookers" have been Fooled. The "onlookers", MAY or MAY NOT, find out later, "they were Fooled", should the "LIAR" later "reveal" his own LIE,
That he made TO THE Lord, in "their" presence.

(There is a whole band-wagon of men who have LIE to the Lord, and are finding it "fashionable" in "these times" to come forward, confess their LIE, and low and behold, "they" have gained a group of FOLLOWERS" "LIKE THEM" !! )

While this is Brief...I know you do not care for long posts, which this seemingly is. Sorry, but necessary.

I am not A Hebrew or Jew. My SIN, was NOT the same as a Hebrew or Jew...as is theirs, according to their Laws...of relationships between a Hebrew/Jew and "God AND other men"

My Sin was NOT against "MEN" (for not having BELIEVED in Men)
My Sin was AGAINST God.
ONCE I Freely Chose to ACCEPT the Lord Jesus' OFFERED GIFT...

MY SIN AGAINST God, was FORGIVEN, Covered with HIS LIGHT, (which Overcomes the Darkness of SIN), and He MY GOD, remembers my SIN against Him...NO MORE.

And His, My GOD'S POWER within me,
KEEPS ME from EVER AGAIN being ABLE to COMMIT SIN AGAINST Him, MY Lord God Almighty.

Continued...

Taken

 

[Taken]

Amadeus ~

continued...

So WHAT ABOUT my "RELATIONSHIP" with "other men?

Can lies, cheating, deceiving, backstabbing, stealing, divorcing, leaving, etc.
OCCUR Between A Converted man, and any other man?

Absolutely. IS it a SIN? No.

IS it a Trespass of one man AGAINST another man? Absolutely.

A man is NOT CONDEMNED for NOT believing in OTHER MEN.

It is NOT a SIN, Against God, or Against other men.....for NOT believing IN OTHER MEN.

Trespassing AGAINST "other" men...has a Consequence....TO THE TRESPASSER himself.

Lie to men, Cheat men, Steal from men, Backstabe men, Murder men, Divorce men, etc...

AND WHAT? The Trespasser has to BARE the Consequences....And you should know....the one who has been Trespassed AGAINST, has a multitude of Repercussions he can HEAP upon the Trespasser....personally, legally, binding.

And the Trespasser....has to bare his own BURDEN of those Consequences.

Gal 6:5
For every man shall bear his own burden.

OUCH! Does that AFFECT the mans Established Relationship with the Lord, or the mans Received Conversion? No.

However there is a WHOLE plethora of Scriptures regarding Gods "PRECEPTS", of HOW one man, should and can (for his own benefit of AVOIDING Trespassing BURDENS).

The Scriptures GIVE a Converted man the KNOWLEDGE of Gods "PRECEPTS" AND how to DEAL with being a Trespasser or being Trespassed Against.

And the POWER of God within a Converted man, GIVES THAT MAN, the Power to ACTUALLY UNDERSTAND Gods "PRECEPTS" and "AVOID" BURDENS that "arise" BECAUSE of the "Trespassing" of one man toward another man.

So...WILL, unbelievers, backbitters, cheaters, liars, deceives, rejecters, etc. OF...
Thee Lord God Almighty BE YOKED with Him, and ENTER into His Kingdom, His ever lasting
New earth ? No.

WILL...men WHO have Freely Chosen TO BE YOKED ONCE and FOREVER with THEE Lord God Almighty, Dwell Forever with the Lord God Almighty, in His Kingdom, His New Earth?
Yes.

It is the Converted mans JOB, to continue learning Gods Precepts and IMPROVE their relationship WITH other men....Friend and Foe...It is their Journey, to KEEP Listening to their NEW 'spirit', and SUBDUING their OWN MIND, to change and BECOME "subject" to their "new spirit", Lead by Gods Spirit.

When a Converted man is Journeying though his DAYS on "this" Earth, Speaking the Word of God, Praising His Great Name; it pleases God.

When a converted man is Journeying through his DAYS on "THIS" Earth, Learning HOW TO AVOID Trespassing and Forgiving Trespassers, that man is being PERFECTED in his spirit over his Mind, and being PREPARED to be raised in Glory unto His Lord God.

So, DO I, claim to Coninue to SIN? No.

Do I, claim to Hound God repeatedly, through prayer, For Forgiveness, that He has already given me? No.

Do I continue to read and learn His Precepts, that is pleasing to Him, for relationships between men? Yes.

Do I ask God, through prayer, to strengthen me, or an other, through a hard time? Yes.

Do I ask God, through prayer, to show me His Understanding of His Word? Yes.

Do I remember the gifts He has given men, and give Him acknowledgement of my Thankfulness? Yes.

In brief, I acknowledge the gifts He has given me and the Blessing I continue to Receive...and am well aware of MY DIRECT Relationship with Him, to Praise Him and Thank Him.

Continually Asking for His Forgiveness? AS IF His Power within me Failed? No.

Continually Asking for His Forgiveness FOR my having Trespassed against another man?
No.

Why not? Because that IS MY BURDEN to resolve, make amends, forgive, suffer, between myself and the other man.

The Lord God has ALREADY informed me, via His Word....that SHOULD I Forgive other men their Trespasses AGAINST ME, SO ALSO WILL, the Lord God FORGIVE MY Trespasses Against other men.

It is a GIFT God Already is Promised a Converted man.

I do not ASK the Lord God for Gifts, He has Already given me....AS IF I do not TRUST, His Word is True.

The spiritual communication Opened, and Given a Converted man...IS NOT, for endlessly HOUNDING God for Something He has ALREADY GIVEN THE MAN....(and consequently ONE of the primary things, I object to IN the MODERN DAY TEACHING that permeates MODERN DAY Churches, to endlessly be ASKING God for Forgiveness, that He has ALREADY GIVEN a Converted man.)

God Bless,
Merry Christmas,
Taken

 

[Taken]

Lying is lying. It is a sin. Doesn't matter who the liar is or the person being lied to.

Yes, lying is lying....however it DOES MATTER, to WHOM!

Lying to God...or Lying to another man.

My position is more fully revealed in post # 308 .. #309... if you are interested.

God Bless,
Merry Christmas,
Taken

 

[CoreIssue]

According to your theory God revealed it from the beginning. If it was revealed from the beginning then why wasn't it practiced from the beginning? How did the CC teaching become more popular than Gods teaching for 1,500 years? (BTW...thank you for acknowledging that the CC has been The Church since the beginning of Christianity)

Scripture says IF ye continue in the faith grounded and settled (Colossians) and IF ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain (1 Corinthians) IF you do not forgive men, neither will your heavenly Father forgive you your offenses (Matthew). What happens if you DON'T continue in the faith and keep in memory what was preached and don't forgive men? Are you still saved?

What about in Galatians when it talks about falling away from grace? How can you fall away from grace if you are OSAS?

Curious Mary

I never said God revealed it from the beginning. I said he knew from the beginning.

By that argument Muslim teachings are more popular than Catholic. How did that happen?

Answer is simple, because the people were forced to believe. Believe, die or go to prison.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

Yes, lying is lying....however it DOES MATTER, to WHOM!

Lying to God...or Lying to another man.

My position is more fully revealed in post # 308 .. #309... if you are interested.

Honestly Taken, the more and more of your writing I'm reading, the more and more it seems... *Jane hunts for the right words here*.... suffice it to say that my reading/studying of scripture gives a very different picture.

 

[CoreIssue]

According to your theory God revealed it from the beginning. If it was revealed from the beginning then why wasn't it practiced from the beginning? How did the CC teaching become more popular than Gods teaching for 1,500 years? (BTW...thank you for acknowledging that the CC has been The Church since the beginning of Christianity)

Scripture says IF ye continue in the faith grounded and settled (Colossians) and IF ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain (1 Corinthians) IF you do not forgive men, neither will your heavenly Father forgive you your offenses (Matthew). What happens if you DON'T continue in the faith and keep in memory what was preached and don't forgive men? Are you still saved?

What about in Galatians when it talks about falling away from grace? How can you fall away from grace if you are OSAS?

Curious Mary

Grace, not salvation.

Associate with the saved shares in grace, but that does not make them saved.

Nowhere did I acknowledge the Catholic Church has been here from the beginning.

You love to spin what others say. Or are your listening skills just that bad?

 

[Marymog]

I never said God revealed it from the beginning. I said he knew from the beginning.

By that argument Muslim teachings are more popular than Catholic. How did that happen?

Answer is simple, because the people were forced to believe. Believe, die or go to prison.

Soooo in post #182 when you said, and I quote "God revealed it from the beginning" that means you never said it?????

Someone's got some explaining to do

Mary

 

[Marymog]

Grace, not salvation.

Associate with the saved shares in grace, but that does not make them saved.

Nowhere did I acknowledge the Catholic Church has been here from the beginning.

You love to spin what others say. Or are your listening skills just that bad?

Hmmmmm.......sooooo when you said 'God revealed it from the beginning but Catholicism tried to bury it...' that statement really meant God revealed it from the beginning but when Catholicism was eventually created XXX years later THEN they tried to bury it???

Someone forgot what they wrote and does not have a very good grasp on their own theories......

Mary

 

[CoreIssue]

Hmmmmm.......sooooo when you said 'God revealed it from the beginning but Catholicism tried to bury it...' that statement really meant God revealed it from the beginning but when Catholicism was eventually created XXX years later THEN they tried to bury it???

Someone forgot what they wrote and does not have a very good grasp on their own theories......

Mary

And someone forgot I already answered them.

God did not reveal it from the beginning, he flugelhorn knew it from the beginning.

Revealed what from the beginning? You love to do incomplete quotes.

 

[Marymog]

And someone forgot I already answered them.

God did not reveal it from the beginning, he flugelhorn knew it from the beginning.

Revealed what from the beginning? You love to do incomplete quotes.

If God did not reveal it from the beginning then why did you say he did?

Curious Mary

 

[CoreIssue]

If God did not reveal it from the beginning then why did you say he did?

Curious Mary

Complete quote please so that I know what subject we were talking about.

 

[Taken]

Honestly Taken, the more and more of your writing I'm reading, the more and more it seems... *Jane hunts for the right words here*.... suffice it to say that my reading/studying of scripture gives a very different picture.

I can not speak for you.
I can speak for myself.

Anyone ... even Satan, can hear, read, learn every single word in Scripture.

I trust Every Word in Scripture is TRUE.

The More difficult part, IS DOES EVERY WORD in Scripture YOU READ, APPLY TO YOU?

Many absolutely DO READ, and APPLY every word in Scripture TO THEMSELVES....(and others).

I don't. I DO NOT apply to me...
Laws, given the Hebrews.
Laws, given the Jews.
Requirements for Sabbaths, Traditions, Feasts, given the Jews to Observe.
Words about men worshiping other gods.
Moses' laws.
Arron's laws of consequences for violating Moses' laws.
The expected raising up to damnation the bodies of men who rejected Christ.

And ON and ON and ON.

I apply to me specific, and ONLY that WHICH DOES APPLY to a Converted man.

All the others Scripture, WHILE stand Fast in the TRUTH....DO not apply to me.

I do not SIN against men. Nor do I ask men to forgive me of SIN against them.

I have elected to call on the Lord God, for MY SIN, against HIM....and by and through my Faith IN HIM, I trust He has Forgiven MY SIN ONCE, and FOREVER that "WAS" AGAINST HIM.

You claim to "continue" in Sin-ning. Committing SIN.

I posed questions to you. Your answer should have been, in regard to "behaviors".... lying, cheat, stealing, divorcing, etc....BETWEEN MEN.

You didn't come out and say....BETWEEN MEN....or say, between you and God. It was just left as a simply term.....lying.

A Converted man CAN NOT....lie, cheat, steal, divorce, leave, GOD.

Any UNCONVERTED man CAN.

You project, a Belief...
1) that ANY man Can become CONVERTED, and THEN LEAVE God.
There is NO Scripture that Teaches that.
And why I repeatedly asked you to show me one.

You project, a Belief...
2) that behaviors BETWEEN men ARE SINS, and continually a man needs to ASK God for forgiveness for his BEHAVIOR toward another man, that you call SIN.
Jewish Law, given the Jews, DOES TEACH THAT, under the OLD Covenant.

The OLD Jews Laws were NOT DESTROYED.
Many Jews "then, in Jesus' day, and today", continue UNDER OLD Jewish Laws".

And even in the NT, (which is NOT ONLY FOR Christ Converts), continued to SPEAK to Jews, REMAINING UNDER OLD Jewish Laws)

I asked, and was WAITING for you to quote a Scripture, regarding, a SIN, being called a SIN, for an ACT between men....SO I COULD THEN ask you....to LOOK and SEE, 'WHAT MEN" the Scripture was SPEAKING ABOUT....

Jews...STILL considering? the OLD JEWISH Laws, that they had been Steeped in for 4,000 years, while trying to Learn about this NEW Covenant, and Good News from Jesus...
That He was Able, Willing, and Wanting to GIVE THEM THE. GIFT OF SALVATION....RIGHT THEN!......

OR, was the Scripture about any Jews who HAD ALREADY received the Lords Gift of Salvation....and ALREADY UNDERSTOOD....the Law WAS FULFILLED...and Arron's LAWS of punishments was VOID for them.

The NT....is NEW INFORMATION and KNOWLEDGE....

TO ALL....Both Jews, who received their Salvation AT the END of their LIVES, "IF" they continued in "GOD'S" Word, "ACCORDING" to Moses' Law.

And new to Gentiles, NOT having had 4,000 years of Gods Word, Mose's law, Arron's pronouncement of consequences, observing Sabbaths, Traditions, Feasts, Festivals, Passover, etc.

THE GOOD NEWS IS COME....Salvation IS Offered NOW to ANY MAN who desires to Take the Lords OFFERING, and for a man TO RECEIVE Salvation NOW.

I accepted the Lords Offering. I am not WAITING, and Enduring to the end of my "natural flesh life" to end, to SEE, if I am worthy....obeying all the Laws of Moses' satisfactorily, to THEN receive Salvation.

Nor am I SUBJECT TO, all the laws and consequences of Mosaic Laws.

THAT ^ is NOT what Jesus OFFERED me, NOR, do I pretend what does not Scripturally apply to me,
Does apply to me.

IF YOU want to APPLY to yourself, EVERYTHING Scripture says, that is you.

However, Scripture itself teachs to RIGHTY DIVIDE the Word of Truth.

Which is to say....ALL of Scripture IS TRUE...
But ALL of Scripture WILL NOT APPLY TO:
A Converted man IN Christ...
A Jewish man "Under" the Law....
A man who rejects BOTH God and Christ.
A man who exalts gods Above God and Christ.

You have to KNOW your own Convictions to KNOW "WHAT IS" your own Standing, so you are prepared and ABLE, to Rightly DIVIDE the Word of Truth, and Apply Scripture THAT does APPLY to you, FROM Scripture THAT does NOT APPLY to you.

You certainly Appear to have Accepted Jesus' Offering of Salvation....

But yet you also Appear to have Accepted applying the Word of God, that Does not Apply to a Converted man....

And that is where, our disagreement hinges.
I see you AS my brother IN Christ....
But I do not agree with your understanding of some things inparticular you have stated.

God Bless,
Merry Christmas,
Taken

 

[Jane_Doe22]

You certainly Appear to have Accepted Jesus' Offering of Salvation....

But yet you also Appear to have Accepted applying the Word of God, that Does not Apply to a Converted man....

And that is where, our disagreement hinges.
I see you AS my brother IN Christ....
But I do not agree with your understanding of some things inparticular you have stated.

I think I've gotten a fairly good idea of what and why you believe what you do. I do thank you for further my understanding of you in that regard. If you have any more questions on my explaining my beleifs, I'm happy to answer.

Of course trying to "win over" another person here isn't my goal at all (such efforts are downright silly on forum debate venues).