Why Christians Disagree

[Vince]

The verse you like to try and quote rebuts you.

Stranger

How?

 

[Vince]

It means what it says. Our faith is from God. It is proof and evidence of things not seen that too are from God.

So?

Stranger

So are you saying that your proof that god exists is that you believe in or have faith in god?

 

[Vince]

Answer my question, prove your story and stop being evasive. Thing is you're found out.

You claimed to be this and that (and for the record, I do not buy it because of many factors including your utter lack of knowledge or relevancy). You should, according to your alleged past, have many answers to your own questions. But you have none, and I know why.

So do you.

Just admit it, you don't know because you were never Reformed, you were never "christian" and have never listened to James White debate.

This is simply untrue. Now where is your evidence that god exists?

 

[Vince]

What does evidence mean in that passage? It's right there staring you in the face. Can you see it?

Non answer. Why not just answer the question?

By the way, all reasoning is circular. This "logical fallacy" is only pulled on opponents, yet all use it in argumentation. You knew this, right? Or no?

Yes, Scientists use logic and reason to determine that logic and reason will lead us knowledge. However, science and reason has proven over and over again that it is a valid system to gain knowledge about our universe. Saying that god exists because I have faith in god is circular and not helpful. There is no way to verify the reasoning.

 

[Vince]

Still waiting Vince:

So you waited five minutes here. This comes across as hostility? Why? Is it OK that I left the internet and spent time with my family last night? I got to your answers. I have been trying my best to ignore your outright and implied insults and be civil myself. Can you have a civil conversation with someone you disagree?

 

[Vince]

Hi Vince, how are you doing?

Good thanks. I hope you are doing well.

I'm going to throw my two cents in here, regarding evidence of God.

If the Holy Bible, and the world around you, is not sufficient proof of the existence of God for you to believe, I'm going to focus more on the future, instead of the past and present.

In the book of Revelation, God-the-Father and God-the-Son predicted the arrival of a being that will copy God-the-Father and God-the-Son, in the near future. If you are alive to see this, with a being in the form of a man, uniting the world, and displaying supernatural abilities, this "live, and in sight" evidence is "evidence of God", and people who didn't believe, will now do so, with the proof that they can see and hear (which is what they want from God nowadays, in order to believe).

I just want to clarify that I do not require proof. I require sufficient evidence.

If you see this, or when I should say, know that this being is an imposter, a cheap imitation of God, and is false. However, please realize, that this is "evidence of God" of God-the-Father and God-the-Son, which wrote to us in the book of Revelation around 90-95 AD to warn us about. If this event were foretold almost 2000 years ago, and occurs in your lifetime, that is proof that God exists, no?

That may be sufficient evidence if this person met all of the requirements of the prophecy.

God-the-Father and God-the-Son will still welcome you into the kingdom of Heaven up until the "mark of the beast" system is implemented that one can only "buy/sell" if you have a "mark". I pray for you (and others) that future events in reality that you can see and hear is sufficient proof of evidence of God.

In Christ Jesus.

I do appreciate your tone and concern. Why can't he provide sufficient evidence for each individual in their lifetime? God would know what evidence I would need.

 

[bbyrd009]

So are you saying that your proof that god exists is that you believe in or have faith in god?

tares are like LSD sorta I guess

 

[bbyrd009]

Why can't he provide sufficient evidence for each individual in their lifetime? God would know what evidence I would need.

I would suggest a good place to seek it if I still thought that's what you were really seeking here fwiw

 

[Willie T]

Good thanks. I hope you are doing well.

I just want to clarify that I do not require proof. I require sufficient evidence.

That may be sufficient evidence if this person met all of the requirements of the prophecy.

I do appreciate your tone and concern. Why can't he provide sufficient evidence for each individual in their lifetime? God would know what evidence I would need.

Since you already understand that, you should also know He has provided you with all the "evidence" you need. I imagine it is just a matter of ignoring your pride long enough to be willing to look at it.

 

[Vince]

Since you already understand that, you should also know He has provided you with all the "evidence" you need.

The thing about evidence is that it is up to the person reviewing the evidence to make the determination if it is sufficient. No one else can determine that. This is why we have hung juries.

"I imagine it is just a matter of ignoring your pride long enough to be willing to look at it.

Why was this necessary? Why do Christians call people names use derogatory terms with non believers? I have been called a liar, stupid, goo goo head and now prideful as you have said. The tone by you and others has been confrontational. Why the animosity if what you believe is true? I have tried to be respectful and I don't think I have ever called anyone a name.

 

[ScottA]

Why was this necessary? Why do Christians call people names use derogatory terms with non believers? I have been called a liar, stupid, goo goo head and now prideful as you have said. The tone by you and others has been confrontational. Why the animosity if what you believe is true? I have tried to be respectful and I don't think I have ever called anyone a name.

The tone is not confrontational, but actually very natural.

We are acting like older siblings act with younger siblings. It's not your fault that you are unaware of things you have never experienced. But it is equally wrong to place the burden on the older sibling - it's not their problem, and where they do try to help, they are not to blame...we, are not to blame.

So, you are under the wrong impression if you think you can set the terms of just how you come to know things you have yet to experience. The merry-go-round does not stop for you - you need to step up according to what is before you, not the other way around. Deal with it. We, nor God, is saying you have to do it before you are ready, or at all, for that matter. But making demands of terms and respect...that's just not how this is going to happen. It's not real, and we are just being honest.

Pretend you are a kid among teens purposing to go to the next level. It would be a mistake to take your toys and go home, though many do...simply because they don't see themselves as they actually are, and are offended. Don't be offended. Adolescence is awkward. It's okay.

 

[Vince]

The tone is not confrontational, but actually very natural.

We are acting like older siblings act with younger siblings.

When I hear my older children calling my younger children names I step in to stop it. I bet you do too if you have children.

It's not your fault that you are unaware of things you have never experience. But it is equally wrong to place the burden on the older sibling - it's not their problem, and where they do try to help, they are not to blame...we, are not to blame.

I am not blaming you or anyone. I am just asking for sufficient evidence of which you say I already have as if you get to decide for me what my level of evidence is to be sufficient.

So, you are under the wrong impression if you think you can set the terms of just how you come to know things you have yet to experience. The merry-go-round does not stop for you - you need to step up according to what is before you, not the other way around. Deal with it. We, nor God, is saying you have to do it before you are ready, or at all, for that matter. But making demands of terms and respect...that's just not how this is going to happen. It's not real, and we are just being honest.

Where did I make any demands? I just asked a question as to why the tone needs to be adversarial for some. Christians can call me names all they want (I am used to it) and I will know who they are by their love for one another, right?

 

[Taken]

This is simply untrue. Now where is your evidence that god exists?

Do you have evidence God did not create the World?

Taken

 

[Vince]

Do you have evidence God did not create the World?

Taken

I don't need it because I have not made that claim.

 

[ScottA]

When I hear my older children calling my younger children names I step in to stop it. I bet you do too if you have children.

That is not what the problem is here. The problem is not recognizing that it is completely normal and to be expected that the younger child not expect the older child to "prove" their coming reality to them.

I am not blaming you or anyone. I am just asking for sufficient evidence of which you say I already have as if you get to decide for me what my level of evidence is to be sufficient.

Where did I make any demands? I just asked a question as to why the tone needs to be adversarial for some. Christians can call me names all they want (I am used to it) and I will know who they are by their love for one another, right?

You just made your demand (again) in the sentence above, expecting that we should show you evidence you are not mature enough to process.

If you will honestly take to heart just how adolescent behavior works, I am sure you already know that older children cannot do what you are asking: we can't make you more mature and up to the challenges of growing as an individual, by simply spitting out the answers - we have, and now you want us to prove it. Again...it doesn't work that way.

 

[Vince]

That is not what the problem is here. The problem is not recognizing that it is completely normal and to be expected that the younger child not expect the older child to "prove" their coming reality to them.

This is a problem. Wanting others to believe something without evidence. I also have never said I wanted proof.

You just made your demand (again) in the sentence above, expecting that we should show you evidence you are not mature enough to process.

What is your definition of demand? I am asking if you have some. Now you say that you do have evidence for gods existence but won't show it to me even though I am asking and then blaming me for not seeing the evidence in front of me. Sorry but this is not logical.

If you will honestly take to heart just how adolescent behavior works, I am sure you already know that older children cannot do what you are asking: we can't make you more mature and up to the challenges of growing as an individual, by simply spitting out the answers - we have, and now you want us to prove it. Again...it doesn't work that way.

What evidence has anyone shown me other than to look at creation or quoted Bible verses that cannot be substantiated? When I was a Christian I thought I had the answer to eternal life. I told everyone I knew about the gospel. If they had questions I would do my best to answer them because I thought it affected their eternity. Why is this not important to you?

 

[Dave L]

@Atheist. I'm curious about your church affiliation before you became an atheist. Because you are probably better off as an atheist than you would be in certain church affiliations. Is it possible you reject a false Christ, which btw makes perfect sense, if not having been presented with the true?

 

[Taken]

I don't need it because I have not made that claim.

Ok. Who do you think created the world?

Taken

 

[Vince]

@Atheist.

You can call me Vince.

I'm curious about your church affiliation before you became an atheist. Because you are probably better off as an atheist than you would be in certain church affiliations. Is it possible you reject a false Christ, which btw makes perfect sense, if not having been presented with the true?

I did not reject a false Christ. What I came to conclude is that I didn't have sufficient reasons to believe any god existed. It wasn't that I rejected a particular idea of god because I did not like it.

 

[Vince]

Ok. Who do you think created the world?

Taken

I don't know. It could have been a god or it could have been natural processes. I think the evidence points to a natural process but I am open to other answers if the evidence warrants that belief.