The Righteousness of God

[quietthinker]

If I would summarise 'the righteousness of God' I would say it is self denial to the max. This gives me much to chew on.

 

[justbyfaith]

Unless you claim to be sinlessly perfect (which is claimed by some deluded people), you will sin from time to time

Jesus said,

Jhn 8:24, I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

But if the doctrine of entire sanctification is not faithful, as you would seem to imply, it is true that everyone will die in their sins.

I think that Jesus is saying here that you can escape that fate if you will place your trust in the doctrine of His Deity.

 

[Enoch111]

Jesus said,

Jhn 8:24, I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

But if the doctrine of entire sanctification is not faithful, as you would seem to imply, it is true that everyone will die in their sins.

I think that Jesus is saying here that you can escape that fate if you will place your trust in the doctrine of His Deity.

This post makes no sense at all. One must absolutely believe in the deity of Christ in order to be saved. And one is saved (justified) by grace through faith. After that begins the process of sanctification, yet no saint will be sinlessly perfect before the Resurrection/Rapture. Which is not an excuse to sin, but a recognition of reality.

 

[justbyfaith]

This post makes no sense at all. One must absolutely believe in the deity of Christ in order to be saved. And one is saved (justified) by grace through faith. After that begins the process of sanctification, yet no saint will be sinlessly perfect before the Resurrection/Rapture. Which is not an excuse to sin, but a recognition of reality.

What does it mean to not die in your sins?

Think about this for a while and then get back to me.

 

[Episkopos]

If I would summarise 'the righteousness of God' I would say it is self denial to the max. This gives me much to chew on.

Actually the righteousness of God comes with the power of judgment and much more personal responsibility. For myself to be justified I only need to be righteous of myself. But to minister to others ...and teach others...I need a higher qualification and power.

So then with the righteousness of God comes the responsibility for others. But many brothers will abuse this impartation from God treating it as common or human (and so judging themselves). But this kind of righteousness is Christ ON a person. It is HE doing the work.

What I found is that trying to be godly for myself was very hard indeed. There's not enough grace for me to be a full overcomer. But as I surrendered to be used sacrificially for others...God gave me of His righteousness, truth, love...and power ...for THEM. So then the righteousness of God is not for us, but for others as the power flows through us to others.

A spiritual gift is not for us...but for others through us. That is the secret to overcoming I believe. When we care for ourselves we lack. But when we give away we have enough for ourselves.


God is looking for sacrificial consecration to Himself and to others. God Himself is selfless...and doesn't approve of our selfishness. A selfish person doesn't remain with God in the Spirit for long...if at all.

So then our teachings are far too self-oriented to be of any use to advancement in the knowledge and experience of God.

 

[Episkopos]

This post makes no sense at all. One must absolutely believe in the deity of Christ in order to be saved. And one is saved (justified) by grace through faith. After that begins the process of sanctification, yet no saint will be sinlessly perfect before the Resurrection/Rapture. Which is not an excuse to sin, but a recognition of reality.

More unbelief on this thread...which must be corrected.

1. Jesus is not a religious idol that people must bow down to for salvation. So you are on a different plane...not the truth. Acknowledging deity for an invisible Jesus has no merit...but acknowledging Christ ON a person and submitting to His anointing on another....does. Anybody can worship an absent God. Anybody can love an invisible person. But we will be judged by how we treated the least of His brethren. Look into this...

2. The saint who walks in Christ has already put on His perfection....the perfection of Christ. You are leaving Christ out of the equation as so many do these days. Those who walk IN Him take on His power. Those who abide Him take on His life.

There's a reason you never speak of these things or acknowledge Christ in your walk...a lack of experience of Him. And you are against the testimony of both the bible that testifies of this walk and the brethren who know that walk.

What a joy it would be if one of the naysayers here such as yourself actually encountered the resurrected Lord and walked in Him even for just a moment. What a testimony that would bring. :) That one moment would change everything.

But God gives this grace to the humble and resists the proud...who teach the doctrines of men.

 

[quietthinker]

Actually the righteousness of God comes with the power of judgment and much more personal responsibility. For myself to be justified I only need to be righteous of myself. But to minister to others ...and teach others...I need a higher qualification and power.

So then with the righteousness of God comes the responsibility for others. But many brothers will abuse this impartation from God treating it as common or human (and so judging themselves). But this kind of righteousness is Christ ON a person. It is HE doing the work.

What I found is that trying to be godly for myself was very hard indeed. There's not enough grace for me to be a full overcomer. But as I surrendered to be used sacrificially for others...God gave me of His righteousness, truth, love...and power ...for THEM. So then the righteousness of God is not for us, but for others as the power flows through us to others.

A spiritual gift is not for us...but for others through us. That is the secret to overcoming I believe. When we care for ourselves we lack. But when we give away we have enough for ourselves.


God is looking for sacrificial consecration to Himself and to others. God Himself is selfless...and doesn't approve of our selfishness. A selfish person doesn't remain with God in the Spirit for long...if at all.

So then our teachings are far too self-oriented to be of any use to advancement in the knowledge and experience of God.

The righteousness of God is the quality of God, not me. Romans 1:16-17 tells us that in the Gospel God's righteous is revealed. Without looking closer at the Jesus event, not my event, we misunderstand what righteousness consists of. Our focus is too easily turned onto ourselves.

 

[amadeus]

See, I have a problem with an attitude that I will always sin. It's (to me) defeatist. I think the goal should be to abide in Him more and more and thereby not sin. This doesn't mean I drive myself nuts if I stumble in trust/stop abiding. I get up and start trusting again, looking ahead, not backwards. But I don't start running again with the thought in my mind that I absolutely will stumble again - the thought in my mind is to remain in trust so I WON'T stumble again.

Indeed, the key is that in spite of a stumble, we never quit.

 

[Nancy]

Indeed, the key is that in spite of a stumble, we never quit.

Even in human races, they may stumble or fall, but they get right back up again to continue the race. It should be the same in the "race" that has been set before us, no matter HOW MANY times we fall, or stumble. ♥

 

[amadeus]

Even in human races, they may stumble or fall, but they get right back up again to continue the race. It should be the same in the "race" that has been set before us, no matter HOW MANY times we fall, or stumble. ♥

"...but he that endureth to the end shall be saved." Matt 10:22

 

[justbyfaith]

Of course, in normal races, if the person stumbles or falls repeatedly, they may be injured and also the chances that they will win the race is deeply damaged.

1Co 9:24, Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain.

 

[Nancy]

"...but he that endureth to the end shall be saved." Matt 10:22

Amen to that...it matters not that we DO stumble, daily! - as long as we stay in the race...be it the turtle or the hare, I don't care...just as long as we STAY in the race and do not "become weary in well doing"
In Him Forever!
nancy

 

[Nancy]

Amen to that...it matters not that we DO stumble, daily! - as long as we stay in the race...be it the turtle or the hare, I don't care...just as long as we STAY in the race and do not "become weary in well doing"
In Him Forever!
nancy

Uh-oh..sorry about the rhyme @bbyrd009

 

[bbyrd009]

Amen to that...it matters not that we DO stumble, daily! - as long as we stay in the race...be it the turtle or the hare, I don't care...just as long as we STAY in the race and do not "become weary in well doing"
In Him Forever!
nancy

By "stay in the race" would you say that self-examination is implied? @charity

I ask Bc Paul's "I don't even judge myself" seems patently easy four believers to find and...burp up, the other One, not so much lol

 

[Nancy]

By "stay in the race" would you say that self-examination is implied? @charity

I ask Bc Paul's "I don't even judge myself" seems patently easy four believers to find and...burp up, the other One, not so much lol

Maybe Paul said that because he knew that 'mans' judgement (including himself) was not to be trusted?
Proverbs 16:25
"There is a way that seems right to a man, but its end is the way of death."

Isaiah 55:8-9
"8 “For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, declares the Lord.
9 “As the heavens are higher than the earth,
so are my ways higher than your ways
and my thoughts than your thoughts."

 

[complete]

By "stay in the race" would you say that self-examination is implied? @charity

I ask Bc Paul's "I don't even judge myself" seems patently easy four believers to find and...burp up, the other One, not so much lol

'Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith;
Who for the joy that was set before Him
.. endured the cross,
.... despising the shame,
and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.'
(Heb 12:2)

Hello @bbyrd009,

To, 'Stay in the race', requires that we faithfully endure unto the end, by 'standing fast', being 'thankful' and 'rejoicing' in the finished work of Christ, and not by self examination. For we look unto the Lord Jesus Christ who has run the race before us, enduring the cross, despising the shame, Who looked to 'the joy that was set before Him'. That is how we endure. That is how we are able to remain faithful. By looking to Him, and to the joy that is set before us also, in Him, as heirs of God in Christ Jesus.

Praise God!

Thank you for including me. :)
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[bbyrd009]

Maybe Paul said that because he knew that 'mans' judgement (including himself) was not to be trusted?
Proverbs 16:25
"There is a way that seems right to a man, but its end is the way of death."

Isaiah 55:8-9
"8 “For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, declares the Lord.
9 “As the heavens are higher than the earth,
so are my ways higher than your ways
and my thoughts than your thoughts."

Maybe, dunno. I observe that i judge myself as in self-examine my interactions with others, which might often result in a confession iow, and i don't judge myself when i'm, oh, smoking pot or something. If someone were to complain about that i might, but most of my almost universally lapsed Catholic non-smoking friends, hmm, wonder when that happened, seem to encourage me in the practice! And when i overdo it i am the one who suffers anyway lol. So, just a pov there

 

[bbyrd009]

'Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith;
Who for the joy that was set before Him
.. endured the cross,
.... despising the shame,
and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.'
(Heb 12:2)

Hello @bbyrd009,

To, 'Stay in the race', requires that we faithfully endure unto the end, by 'standing fast', being 'thankful' and 'rejoicing' in the finished work of Christ, and not by self examination. For we look unto the Lord Jesus Christ who has run the race before us, enduring the cross, despising the shame, Who looked to 'the joy that was set before Him'. That is how we endure. That is how we are able to remain faithful. By looking to Him, and to the joy that is set before us also, in Him, as heirs of God in Christ Jesus.

Praise God!

Thank you for including me. :)
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Well, I happen to disagree, out of time but i could dig up the relevant vv and get your response to them later maybe, ok? I'm sure you mean to reflect that we should not torture ourselves about certain things, and there i agree

 

[farouk]

'Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith;
Who for the joy that was set before Him
.. endured the cross,
.... despising the shame,
and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.'
(Heb 12:2)

Great passage from Hebrews 12. :)

 

[farouk]

No flesh will glory in his presence

Good verse to remember, indeed.