Gods Standard is...

[bbyrd009]

God has seen fit to leave such a definition out of scripture

again, dont be Absolute Truth there imo ok. yikes p20 bbyrd lol, sorry guys, bye

 

[amadeus]

That there are three "personages" that are called God in scripture, is clear. How they relate to one another, and our human attempts to 'explain' or define their existence together, is where we get into difficulty. God has seen fit to leave such a definition out of scripture, and I would suggest it is because if He did, we still wouldn't understand it and would disagree with our interpretation of it. We can't even agree on what we define...how can we possibly understand what God defines?

Just to be clear (LOL) the phase highlighted in blue and underlined may well be clear to you, but it is not to me even though I may be able to see where you are coming from on it...

 

[amadeus]

funny to me that i can agree yes, there is a difference; yet no, i am absolutely no different! In a way at least, the important way imo. I mean i talk a good stripe, but really thats about it prolly. I consciously seek life, more abundantly and dont worry about DMA, and thats about it.

I would have to add that this has produced many changes in my life, but at the same time i am currently someone's "project," to their minds, too, i'm prolly even pitied! Ha! But i ate filet last night, even took a pitcher
Life is funny

Yes, I am also included among those who are as you say, "no different" yet...? The course, our courses are, your course and my course is, not ended yet. Sometimes we may yearn for the end but at other times we seem to desire that we could be allowed a bit more time. No filet nor pitcher for me last night, but sometimes God provides that as well...

 

[amadeus]

well i guess by def those who have completely left the world walk with God, and was no more?" And here i am. So obv i am still confused i guess. On Babylon, a theory i have is that any um plate that we set spinning, gotta keep spinning? Is maybe not Babylon per se but a good door to realizing what that is.

MAybe kinda hard to see, but habits make a kind of tower? So, a personal even if shared by many kind of babylon, maybe. One might even see shades of DMA in their mutual habits i guess, even what we might call "good" habits, which i dont mean stop doing them, but more like consciously doing them? They can easily become indulgences i think.

As you say "even what we might call 'good' habits" we need to pay closer attention to... This lack of attention leads I would guess to a weariness in well doing which needs to be avoided. When we are doing 'well' according to God we should not grow weary. When we seem to be doing just that it is certainly time to ask God one more time for His help.

 

[amadeus]

guess i'm in trouble!

Admitting that is a necessary step in the right direction as I see it. Until we admit the possibility that something we believe or that something which we do, or want to do, could be in error, God is blocked. He cannot [I believe] force anyone to serve Him in every point as He would like. That is what "free will" as I understand it is all about. There is God and there is mammon, ultimately just those two choices. As we really strive to move away from mammon and toward God, God will help us... but only as much and/or as often as we allow Him to do so. He, I believe, gave His Word to us that the choice is ours. He will not stop us from doing it wrong... unless we really want to badly enough that we really surrender to Him, each every time we come up against an obstacle we cannot overcome alone.

 

[101G]

In other words the Fatherhood and Sonship of Christ to you is merely metaphorical. When Peter declared "Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God"

GINOLJC, to all.
First, the apostle Peter declared correctly, Jesus is the Christ. but did not Thomas declear correctly also? John 20:28 "And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God".
now think brakelite, if Jesus is the Christ, (which he is), and he is God, (as Thomas said), how can the person you call Father be the Christ Father when, Christ, according to your doctrine is co-equal with the Father?.

but here's another catch to consider, Jesus the Christ is the ONLY one who is "ETERNAL". let us say this again, Jesus the Christ is the ONLY one who is "ETERNAL". the same Jesus whom Peter declared. here's the scriptures, 1 Timothy 6:13 "I give thee charge in the sight of God, who quickeneth all things, and [before] Christ Jesus, who before Pontius Pilate witnessed a good confession;
1 Timothy 6:14 "That thou keep [this] commandment without spot, unrebukeable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ:
1 Timothy 6:15 "Which in his times he shall shew, [who][ is] the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords;
1 Timothy 6:16 "Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom [be] honour and power everlasting. Amen.

so how can someone who is IMMORTAL be someone else Son?

do you see the dilemma your doctrine is in? note "IMMORTAL" means, the ability to live forever; eternal life. and Jesus the Christ is the ONLY ONE who have it. now don't argue with me, argue with the scripture, which are holy and God breathed.....

so how can someone ETERNAL be someone else son? will be looking for your answer.

PICJAG.

 

[bbyrd009]

Sometimes we may yearn for the end but at other times we seem to desire that is would all be over.

hmm, i'm confused at the diff, sorry

No filet nor pitcher for me last night, but sometimes God provides that as well...

ha, by "Pitcher" i mean self-serving picture, i guess

 

[bbyrd009]

now your answer.

well my replie might be that you could like the um posts you dont really like, sometimes maybe. Hard when we're Standing There i guess...but um, ya

 

[amadeus]

hmm, i'm confused at the diff, sorry

My mistake! Instead of presenting two apparently opposite goals or desires, I repeated one using different wording and left the other out completely. I have input a correction.

 

[amadeus]

ha, by "Pitcher" i mean self-serving picture, i guess

I took it to mean perhaps a pitcher of beer. Between wrongly expressed thoughts and typos we are having a communication problem. Those are of course in addition to any communication problems that may exist when our thoughts are properly stated and flawlessly typed.

 

[APAK]

@101G : Not really trying to get into all your discussion with @brakelite over your own compelling doctrine, although I would reconsider who you think is the source of immortality once more.

I Tim 6:11 introduces YHWH the Father of Jesus Christ. He is the source of all immortality as stated in verse 16, not Jesus. YHWH gives immortality to whomever he wants, including our Lord and Saviour, and he did.

The underlined wording in 1 Timothy is about YHWH not Jesus Christ.

(1Ti 6:11) But you, O man of God, flee these material things and instead pursue after righteousness, reverence towards God, faith, love, patience, meekness.
(1Ti 6:12) Fight the good fight of the faith, lay hold on the everlasting life, whereunto you were called and did confess the good confession in the sight of many witnesses.
(1Ti 6:13) I urge you in the sight of God, who gives life to all things, and of Christ Jesus, who before Pontius Pilate made the good confession:
(1Ti 6:14) Keep the commandment without stain, without reproach, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ.
(1Ti 6:15) In due time He shall reveal him, He who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings and Lord of lords,
(1Ti 6:16) who only has immortality, dwelling in light unapproachable. Whom no one has seen, nor can see. To whom be honour and power eternal. Amen.

Also, Thomas never called Jesus YHWH, as did not the other disciples. You really think all the disciples thought Jesus was YHWH, don't you? There are only two viable explanations as I've told you in the past for Thomas' outburst, 1: the translation should be 'god' or 'might one' not 'God' for YHWH, or secondly, Thomas suddenly realized Jesus is the Lord indeed and his Father actually raised him back to life.

Good luck with your doctrines.

Bless you,

APAK

 

[101G]

Let me share somthing with the group here.

#1. we all know it's one God, who is Spirit, we all agree on that. it's just that the person(s) we don't agree on.

you and I was first taught 3 persons, because we was shown scriptures like Genesis 1:26 & 27 combined with Matthew 3:16 & 17, and Matthew 28:19 and some others. our brains recorded 3 persons WHY? because we were told that it was three person, NEVER TAKEN THE TIME TO READ IT FOR OURSELVES.
but we were never taught scriptures Like John 1:3 and Isaiah 44:24 combined with Revelation 1:17 & 18 and Isaiah 48:12 and many more scripture. I wonder why?. when we were taugh the 3 person, even now when we read the bible we look over the evidence staring us right in the face. our minds subliminally ignor the facts as to what we read. I did it for years, so I'm no better than anyone else. but when the Lord Jesus allowed me to see fully, I was shocked. my first thought was, how come I never saw that before. and that was my problem, I was sawing ..... excuse my English, (smile) seeing what I was told instead of what I was really reading. it's subliminal.

I was reading what I was taught, and not what I was reading in knowledge and understanding. I was reading blind. as the bible state "RENEW" your mind. it was not until the Lord Jesus taught me did I not see 3 but ONE person. now I see diversity of God all over the bible, OT and NT. it was like someone opening the curtians so that one can really see outside.

just like Eve, and her husband, they was BLINDED by the devil lies to the truth. the power of persuasion.

I'll admit it, I was persuaded into thinking it was three person, and not one Person with two titles. the trinity is nothing but modalism in reverse. yes, look at it closley.

it was not until the Lord Jesus himself taught me differently. at first, it was scary. but I TRUSTED in the Lord knowing that he is RIGHT all the time. and yes, he made me to study, and search things out and to compare with what I was first taught to what to what I'm now being taught. to make sure that what he was teaching was true. meaning by the holy scriptures.

see I'm like the apostle Paul. he knew the Law inside and out, because he was taught by the best law teacher. so when the Lord change him he knew the law that why he could deal with those of the law. likewise me. I know the trinity, hence why I can catch it in many errors.

#2. next time we will reveal why the CHRIST always referes to the Spirit as him or he, and why if he God don't know while in flesh and blood Godly things as in his return date, and ect....

know your God.

PICJAG.

 

[Preacher4Truth]

And since no one among those who strongly support a Trinity can really explain it so it makes sense to anyone, why should anyone insist that another person must embrace it as God's Truth? Are we to have faith in God or in people?

It's easy to see the three persons of the Godhead in Scripture. For us to think that these things should be simple to understand and explain, (since after all, we're talking about God here) well, that's a misnomer. Thus casually dismissing it for these reasons is rather unwise.

 

[101G]

@101G : Not really trying to get into all your discussion with @brakelite over your own compelling doctrine, although I would reconsider who you think is the source of immortality once more.

I Tim 6:11 introduces YHWH the Father of Jesus Christ. He is the source of all immortality as stated in verse 16, not Jesus. YHWH gives immortality to whomever he wants, including our Lord and Saviour, and he did.

The underlined wording in 1 Timothy is about YHWH not Jesus Christ.

(1Ti 6:11) But you, O man of God, flee these material things and instead pursue after righteousness, reverence towards God, faith, love, patience, meekness.
(1Ti 6:12) Fight the good fight of the faith, lay hold on the everlasting life, whereunto you were called and did confess the good confession in the sight of many witnesses.
(1Ti 6:13) I urge you in the sight of God, who gives life to all things, and of Christ Jesus, who before Pontius Pilate made the good confession:
(1Ti 6:14) Keep the commandment without stain, without reproach, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ.
(1Ti 6:15) In due time He shall reveal him, He who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings and Lord of lords,
(1Ti 6:16) who only has immortality, dwelling in light unapproachable. Whom no one has seen, nor can see. To whom be honour and power eternal. Amen.

Also, Thomas never called Jesus YHWH, as did not the other disciples. You really think all the disciples thought Jesus was YHWH, don't you? There are only two viable explanations as I've told you in the past for Thomas' outburst, 1: the translation should be 'god' or 'might one' not 'God' for YHWH, or secondly, Thomas suddenly realized Jesus is the Lord indeed and his Father actually raised him back to life.

Good luck with your doctrines.

Bless you,

APAK

first thanks for the reply and not an attack, which is good, so I in like will do the same. I have considered this, but i would like for you to consider this.

it's the lord Jesus who the apostle is speaking of, and here;s why. the apostle Paul said, 1 Timothy 6:15 "Which in his times he shall shew, [who][ is] the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords". understand scripture confirm scripture, and here's the confirming scripture that this is the Lord Jesus. scripture, Revelation 19:11 "And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him [was] called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
Revelation 19:12 "His eyes [were] as a flame of fire, and on his head [were] many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.
Revelation 19:13 "And he [was] clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.
Revelation 19:14 "And the armies [which were] in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.Revelation 19:15 "And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
Revelation 19:16 "And he hath on [his] vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS".

There's our comfirmation that this is the Lord JESUS, he's King of kings and Lord of lord's.

so I ask in return to reconsider your assessment. will be looking to hear from you.

PICJAG.

 

[101G]

Also, Thomas never called Jesus YHWH, as did not the other disciples. You really think all the disciples thought Jesus was YHWH, don't you? There are only two viable explanations as I've told you in the past for Thomas' outburst, 1: the translation should be 'god' or 'might one' not 'God' for YHWH, or secondly, Thomas suddenly realized Jesus is the Lord indeed and his Father actually raised him back to life.

first the second half of your question. we must disagreee. for JESUS is YHWH the ONLY true God. and Hers's why. Hebrews 2:9 "But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man".

as we have said before, there are only three entities. 1. God. 2. angels/spirits. and 3. Us humans. now, if the Lord Jesus was made Lower than the angels, then he must have been above the angels in order to be made lower than them. and that position is God.

so we must disagree with your assessment.

now if you have another explination, please put it on the table.

PICJAG.

 

[bbyrd009]

Sometimes we may yearn for the end but at other times we seem to desire that we could be allowed a bit more time.

ya and i guess we have that 180 out too lol

 

[bbyrd009]

so we must disagree with your assessment.

ah, Legion, are you?

"Take back the boy you left behind," bro

 

[bbyrd009]

It's easy to see the three persons of the Godhead in Scripture.

persons in God
i mean do i need to Quote It bro, or what

Thus casually dismissing it for these reasons is rather unwise.

maybe more like thus casually insisting upon 3 "persons" is, wadr

 

[amadeus]

It's easy to see the three persons of the Godhead in Scripture. For us to think that these things should be simple to understand and explain, (since after all, we're talking about God here) well, that's a misnomer. Thus casually dismissing it for these reasons is rather unwise.

Is it easy to see three persons? Perhaps for you, but not for me. Should I believe in the Trinity because you do or because so many others are saying that they do? Is that a good reason for having faith in that doctrine?

I have never casually dismissed the Trinity although some people have pressed me in that as well as in other directions. I have studied this and discussed it with people on different sides of the issue as well as prayed for guidance from God for many years. There is probably no argument I have not heard before. The things I have pointed out in scripture are simply presented to show that it is not a clear cut thing. People are to live by faith, but where is the correct place to focus that faith? In the position of this man or this church group or that one? Herein is the problem for a person, isn't it? I do look to God, but so far He has shown me no precise or certain position to take other what I have already expressed here. I don't condemn people for being Trinitarians nor for being Oneness nor for being something else. That is not my job... at least not until God has given it to me. I continue to study and to pray and as much as I am able but leaving the final result in God's capable hands.

 

[bbyrd009]

As you say "even what we might call 'good' habits" we need to pay closer attention to... This lack of attention leads I would guess to a weariness in well doing which needs to be avoided. When we are doing 'well' according to God we should not grow weary. When we seem to be doing just that it is certainly time to ask God one more time for His help.

i mean like even eating a bowl of oatmeal, good stuff, same "time" every day, too. Change your mind imo, mix it up, experience the suffering, if any, and like um go into that, question it or whatever cross examine it maybe

He cannot [I believe] force anyone to serve Him in every point as He would like. That is what "free will" as I understand it is all about.

hmm, i dunno about what God would "like," that is uncomfortably close to manifesting a god with a soul to me...dunno.
what you bless will be blessed, curse will be cursed
maybe

There is God and there is mammon, ultimately just those two choices.

hmm. Molech? Baal? etc? dunno there either G, imo lotta sins are not Mammon oriented?