Teresa of Avila and Watering the Garden

[VictoryinJesus]

You're very lucky to have each other. My hubby is not saved.
So great to have a mate you can talk to about God.
Blessings.

Four years ago I hated to hear my husband mention God. It seriously made me uncomfortable and embarrassed whenever he brought up God around other people. For a major part of our marriage he believed and I didn’t. It was not until a couple of years ago I had any desire to read His word. Don’t give up hope as you don’t maybe realize the seed you are planting in him by your loving God.

 

[GodsGrace]

Four years ago I hated to hear my husband mention God. It seriously made me uncomfortable and embarrassed whenever he brought up God around other people. For a major part of our marriage he believed and I didn’t. It was not until a couple of years ago I had any desire to read His word. Don’t give up hope as you don’t maybe realize the seed you are planting in him by your loving God.

I know. It's been many years now.
It might even happen after my death...who can know?
The odd part is that he likes to listen to Christian speakers...Ravi Zacharias is one.
Also some Catholic speakers on Italian radio.

He was raised in atheism and can't seem to let go.
But hope is the last thing to die....

 

[Stan B]

What does sanctify mean?

Sanctify means to be made holy. The word also carries the connotation of being separated onto God.

 

[GodsGrace]

Sanctify means to be made holy. The word also carries the connotation of being separated onto God.

Yes,,,separated to do God's work is the correct meaning.

My point is: How is my husband sanctified through me?
Being set aside to do God's good deeds are of a personal nature.
I've never understood this verse completely, but the rest of the N.T. does not teach that a spouse is saved by the other spouse...so I've never paid too much attention to it.

 

[Nancy]

Yes,,,separated to do God's work is the correct meaning.

My point is: How is my husband sanctified through me?
Being set aside to do God's good deeds are of a personal nature.
I've never understood this verse completely, but the rest of the N.T. does not teach that a spouse is saved by the other spouse...so I've never paid too much attention to it.

Hi GG,
I have often wondered about that verse too. What I get from the NT is that if a Christian is married to an unsaved spouse, they should stay married and the saved one.

1 Peter 3:1 - "Likewise, ye wives, [be] in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they also may without the word be won by the conversation of the wives;"

1 Corinthians Chapter 7

12 But to the rest speak I, not the Lord: If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she be pleased to dwell with him, let him not put her away.

13 And the woman which hath an husband that believeth not, and if he be pleased to dwell with her, let her not leave him.

14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.

15 But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such [cases]: but God hath called us to peace.

 

[Stan B]

Yes,,,separated to do God's work is the correct meaning.

My point is: How is my husband sanctified through me?
Being set aside to do God's good deeds are of a personal nature.
I've never understood this verse completely, but the rest of the N.T. does not teach that a spouse is saved by the other spouse...so I've never paid too much attention to it.

GodsGrace >> My point is: How is my husband sanctified through me?

Sanctified has nothing to do with doing God's work. I simply means that he is part of the family of God!

The is idea probably conflicts with anything you have ever heard from a pulpit. My approach to Scripture is when it says something that seems to be wrong, that's usually a red flag signaling there is a truth there that I should study to discover. It's sort of like going to church with a congregation of one or two thousand. And when you get home who do you recall seeing there? Now, if you go to a service and everyone is sitting there quietly, except for one person up in a front row, who instead of being seated was on the seat, was standing on their head. So who do you pay attention to? The one that seems out of place.

We are taught that salvation is a personal matter between you and God, but the Bible reveals something different: the concept of vicarious Atonement. And where did I find it? The concept of vicarious atonement goes all the way back to the first chapter of Job the oldest book of the Bible. On behalf of his sons and daughters, Job would sanctify/consecrate them, rising up early in the morning and offering burnt offerings according to the number of them all; for Job said, “Perhaps my sons have sinned and cursed God in their hearts.” Thus Job did continually." Job 1 The righteousness of Job extended to his entire family.

And this concept permeates the entire Old Testament. The people did not all offer a personal sacrifice, but the sacrifices offered in the Temple, provided Atonement for all of Israel; and likewise at Passover, one Lamb was sacrificed for the entire family. The final sacrifice, was that of the Lamb of God who was sacrificed once and for all, for the entire world.

 

[amadeus]

@GodsGrace

Four years ago I hated to hear my husband mention God. It seriously made me uncomfortable and embarrassed whenever he brought up God around other people. For a major part of our marriage he believed and I didn’t. It was not until a couple of years ago I had any desire to read His word. Don’t give up hope as you don’t maybe realize the seed you are planting in him by your loving God.

Back in the 1970's when our two children were quite small, my wife and I regularly picked up a sister in the Lord and gave her a ride to church meetings. She was a funny little lady and became a very good friend of my wife's. What I did not know and probably never would have learned, had not my wife told me, was that the sister in question was married to a man who drank heavily, cursed and physically beat her routinely in his efforts to get her to stop attending church and serving God. This had been going on for a few years before we met her. She refused to leave him and she refused to call the law against him.

When we followed the Lord to another place we lost touch with that sister and her very sad situation. Some years later we had occasion to return to that community and my wife recontacted her. After more than 25 years of marriage in that very abusive situation, the sister's trust in God had been rewarded. Her husband had gone to church and repented turning his life over to God. He became the hardest worker and best witness for God in the assembly.

I would not recommend such a pathway for anyone, but we can see that God still does miracles for those who trust Him. We are never wrong to trust God.

 

[GodsGrace]

GodsGrace >> My point is: How is my husband sanctified through me?

Sanctified has nothing to do with doing God's work. I simply means that he is part of the family of God!

The is idea probably conflicts with anything you have ever heard from a pulpit. My approach to Scripture is when it says something that seems to be wrong, that's usually a red flag signaling there is a truth there that I should study to discover. It's sort of like going to church with a congregation of one or two thousand. And when you get home who do you recall seeing there? Now, if you go to a service and everyone is sitting there quietly, except for one person up in a front row, who instead of being seated was on the seat, was standing on their head. So who do you pay attention to? The one that seems out of place.

We are taught that salvation is a personal matter between you and God, but the Bible reveals something different: the concept of vicarious Atonement. And where did I find it? The concept of vicarious atonement goes all the way back to the first chapter of Job the oldest book of the Bible. On behalf of his sons and daughters, Job would sanctify/consecrate them, rising up early in the morning and offering burnt offerings according to the number of them all; for Job said, “Perhaps my sons have sinned and cursed God in their hearts.” Thus Job did continually." Job 1 The righteousness of Job extended to his entire family.

And this concept permeates the entire Old Testament. The people did not all offer a personal sacrifice, but the sacrifices offered in the Temple, provided Atonement for all of Israel; and likewise at Passover, one Lamb was sacrificed for the entire family. The final sacrifice, was that of the Lamb of God who was sacrificed once and for all, for the entire world.

I like the idea of one lamb being sacrificed for the entire family in Exodus.
Withoiut a doubt, when Paul spoke of the sanctifying grace of the spouse saved...he was referring to Job. I didn't even think of this.

Thanks for such a good post.
Will study up on this.

 

[GodsGrace]

@GodsGrace


Back in the 1970's when our two children were quite small, my wife and I regularly picked up a sister in the Lord and gave her a ride to church meetings. She was a funny little lady and became a very good friend of my wife's. What I did not know and probably never would have learned, had not my wife told me, was that the sister in question was married to a man who drank heavily, cursed and physically beat her routinely in his efforts to get her to stop attending church and serving God. This had been going on for a few years before we met her. She refused to leave him and she refused to call the law against him.

When we followed the Lord to another place we lost touch with that sister and her very sad situation. Some years later we had occasion to return to that community and my wife recontacted her. After more than 25 years of marriage in that very abusive situation, the sister's trust in God had been rewarded. Her husband had gone to church and repented turning his life over to God. He became the hardest worker and best witness for God in the assembly.

I would not recommend such a pathway for anyone, but we can see that God still does miracles for those who trust Him. We are never wrong to trust God.

Sounds just like the story of a catholic saint,,,can't remember which one; I'm not very interested in saints to that degree.

She was also very mistreated but stayed with her husband for the sake of her children and because she knew marriage was forever.

I'm happy most marriages today do not experience this sad situation...but the attitude toward marriage should be the same. Persons are just too ready to walk away if they're unhappy and they are not "compatible".

 

[VictoryinJesus]

@GodsGrace


Back in the 1970's when our two children were quite small, my wife and I regularly picked up a sister in the Lord and gave her a ride to church meetings. She was a funny little lady and became a very good friend of my wife's. What I did not know and probably never would have learned, had not my wife told me, was that the sister in question was married to a man who drank heavily, cursed and physically beat her routinely in his efforts to get her to stop attending church and serving God. This had been going on for a few years before we met her. She refused to leave him and she refused to call the law against him.

When we followed the Lord to another place we lost touch with that sister and her very sad situation. Some years later we had occasion to return to that community and my wife recontacted her. After more than 25 years of marriage in that very abusive situation, the sister's trust in God had been rewarded. Her husband had gone to church and repented turning his life over to God. He became the hardest worker and best witness for God in the assembly.

I would not recommend such a pathway for anyone, but we can see that God still does miracles for those who trust Him. We are never wrong to trust God.

Takes incredible Faith ...against everything screaming to leave. No. I would not recommend it to everyone but if God supplies the Faith and strength then who better to trust. 1 Peter 3:1-2 Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they also may without the word be won by the conversation of the wives; [2] While they behold your chaste conversation coupled with fear.

That has always caused a pause...without the word ...be won by the conversation of the wives.

 

[GodsGrace]

Hi GG,
I have often wondered about that verse too. What I get from the NT is that if a Christian is married to an unsaved spouse, they should stay married and the saved one.

1 Peter 3:1 - "Likewise, ye wives, [be] in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they also may without the word be won by the conversation of the wives;"

1 Corinthians Chapter 7

12 But to the rest speak I, not the Lord: If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she be pleased to dwell with him, let him not put her away.

13 And the woman which hath an husband that believeth not, and if he be pleased to dwell with her, let her not leave him.

14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.

15 But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such [cases]: but God hath called us to peace.

Yes, I also understand that a wife or husband should not leave the spouse just because they are not Christian. What good would that do? Better to stay with them and MAYBE with their help the spouse could become saved.

I have heard of cases where the saved person passes away and THEN the other becomes saved by thinking back on the life they had together and maybe God seems more "real".

It seems to me that scripture is concerned with the welfare of the children involved, and keeping the family together.

 

[Nancy]

Yes, I also understand that a wife or husband should not leave the spouse just because they are not Christian. What good would that do? Better to stay with them and MAYBE with their help the spouse could become saved.

I have heard of cases where the saved person passes away and THEN the other becomes saved by thinking back on the life they had together and maybe God seems more "real".

It seems to me that scripture is concerned with the welfare of the children involved, and keeping the family together.

The only objection I have with staying in a marriage "for the children" is that if the unbelieving spouse is abusive then, the children are learning that too. The saved spouse can leave her husband/wife, not necessarily to seek divorce, but can live apart from the abuser to protect her/his children. Nothing honorable about continuing to allow abuse especially if their are children involved...just sayin!

 

[GodsGrace]

The only objection I have with staying in a marriage "for the children" is that if the unbelieving spouse is abusive then, the children are learning that too. The saved spouse can leave her husband/wife, not necessarily to seek divorce, but can live apart from the abuser to protect her/his children. Nothing honorable about continuing to allow abuse especially if their are children involved...just sayin!

I think I said IF CHILDREN ARE INVOLVED...
maybe not.
Anyway, of course you're right.

 

[Stan B]

@GodsGrace

I would not recommend such a pathway for anyone, but we can see that God still does miracles for those who trust Him. We are never wrong to trust God.

I am not suggesting that anyone remain with an abusive drunk, but knowing how sacred God regards His inseparable design of marriage, what is His perfect will? Sometimes honouring His perfect will is not a pleasant task.

The Apostle Paul tells us that it is permissible for us to separate from an unbelieving spouse, but is this God's perfect will, or is Paul only expressing a "Because of your hardness of heart" option??

Paul says, "All things are lawful for me, but not all things are expedient/edifying/beneficial"
1 Corinthians 6:12

 

[Stan B]

I think I said IF CHILDREN ARE INVOLVED...
maybe not.
Anyway, of course you're right.

Nancy and GG, I am reluctant to get into this on the basis of "Honour your father and your mother" but since no one knows who I am, I suppose it is okay to share.

I grew up in an abusive family, and like my siblings, I was kicked out of the house as my 16th birthday present, with no assets or education. I started my new life all alone on the streets of Toronto because that is where the jobs were. But with my few possessions, I brought my Bible with me. One day, I read where God said He would be a father to the fatherless. I didn't have anything to lose, so I claimed that promise.

Wow! As I review my life as I approach my 8th decade, I can see where my new Father has been with me every step of the way, which to tell it all would require an entire book, which my DIL (PhD kind of chick) thought I should write. But the short story, is that my new Father took me from a hopeless uneducated street kid to a successful wealthy person with the most wonderful family one could imagine. He gave me a most awesome wife, the wife of His choice, custom made exactly for me. We enjoyed 49 wonderful years together, seven shmitas, one year short of the Year of Jubilee which we will celebrate when we are again together for the Marriage Supper.

When I started my family, I was determined to break the family curse which had plagued our family. We all worked together on that, a blessing that has now been passed on to the second and third generation. And seeing my grandchildren's dedication to the Lord, I am sure it will pass on to the fourth generation.

So remember, that God has promised to be a father to the fatherless!

 

[amadeus]

Sounds just like the story of a catholic saint,,,can't remember which one; I'm not very interested in saints to that degree.

She was also very mistreated but stayed with her husband for the sake of her children and because she knew marriage was forever.

I'm happy most marriages today do not experience this sad situation...but the attitude toward marriage should be the same. Persons are just too ready to walk away if they're unhappy and they are not "compatible".

She was a very special lady and most of the time full of fun and cheer. After my wife told me the trouble she had I started to watch and got to where I could tell when things were worse at home. She loved God.

 

[amadeus]

Takes incredible Faith ...against everything screaming to leave. No. I would not recommend it to everyone but if God supplies the Faith and strength then who better to trust. 1 Peter 3:1-2 Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they also may without the word be won by the conversation of the wives; [2] While they behold your chaste conversation coupled with fear.

That has always caused a pause...without the word ...be won by the conversation of the wives.

Give God the glory, sister!

 

[GodsGrace]

Nancy and GG, I am reluctant to get into this on the basis of "Honour your father and your mother" but since no one knows who I am, I suppose it is okay to share.

I grew up in an abusive family, and like my siblings, I was kicked out of the house as my 16th birthday present, with no assets or education. I started my new life all alone on the streets of Toronto because that is where the jobs were. But with my few possessions, I brought my Bible with me. One day, I read where God said He would be a father to the fatherless. I didn't have anything to lose, so I claimed that promise.

Wow! As I review my life as I approach my 8th decade, I can see where my new Father has been with me every step of the way, which to tell it all would require an entire book, which my DIL (PhD kind of chick) thought I should write. But the short story, is that my new Father took me from a hopeless uneducated street kid to a multi-millionaire with the most wonderful family one could imagine. He gave me a most awesome wife, the wife of His choice, custom made exactly for me. We enjoyed 49 wonderful years together, seven shmitas, one year short of the Year of Jubilee which we will celebrate when we are again together for the Marriage Supper.

When I started my family, I was determined to break the family curse which had plagued our family. We all worked together on that, a blessing that has now been passed on to the second and third generation. And seeing my grandchildren's dedication to the Lord, I am sure it will pass on to the fourth generation.

So remember, that God has promised to be a father to the fatherless!

What a wonderful testimony!
This is what is meant by God working all things for the good.
It sounds like your wife has gone on to be with God and I am sorry for this but God is helping you even with that.

I don't know what a shmita is...I'm kind of hoping it's not a CHILD!
7 would be quite a little bunch.

God bless you.
I do believe you've achieved your God-given goal.

 

[Stan B]

What a wonderful testimony!
This is what is meant by God working all things for the good.
It sounds like your wife has gone on to be with God and I am sorry for this but God is helping you even with that.

I don't know what a shmita is...I'm kind of hoping it's not a CHILD!
7 would be quite a little bunch.

God bless you.
I do believe you've achieved your God-given goal.

GTG said >> It sounds like your wife has gone on to be with God and I am sorry for this but God is helping you even with that.

Yeah, He took her 4 years ago, but even in that, God revealed His plan from the outset, every step of the way. A few days before she was diagnosed with cancer, author Karen Kingsbury had sent her a series of books as a gift, which Karen had signed, along with a Jeremiah 29:11 postscript. My wife was diagnosed with pancreatic cancer, 7 days after her 71st birthday. At the end of the first evening in hospital the front cover of the book she had been reading, curled up revealing Karen's postscript. My wife asked "What is Jer 29:11?" I didn't have a clue, so I looked it up on my tablet. The complete paragraph starts at vs 10:

"You will be in exile for seventy years. But then I will come and do for you all the good things I have promised and bring you home. For I know the plans I have for you, says the Lord. They are plans for good and not for evil, to give you a future and a hope." Jeremiah 29:10, 11

God even revealed the day she was going to die. On her last morning on earth, although she had been pain-free and feeling fine, she knew it was time to say goodbye as she put her arms around me one last time, weeping and shaking, said "This is not fair. God's going to take me away without you." :-( That was her last morning on earth.

I still trust the same Father I trusted so many decades ago, and I fully trust the plan He has for my wife and I.

The shmita or Shemitah is the Jewish 7 year cycle, ending with a sabbath year where the land is left to lie fallow and all work activity is to cease by Jewish law. It is a sabbath year in which all debts are cancelled, looking forward to the Cross, in which ALL debts, were cancelled. After 7 shmitas, 7x7 years comes the 50th year sabbath called the Year of Jubilee, a year of celebration, in which no work is to be done, and all land reverts to it's original owner; the year I celebrate with my wife in our new Home.

 

[Nancy]

Nancy and GG, I am reluctant to get into this on the basis of "Honour your father and your mother" but since no one knows who I am, I suppose it is okay to share.

I grew up in an abusive family, and like my siblings, I was kicked out of the house as my 16th birthday present, with no assets or education. I started my new life all alone on the streets of Toronto because that is where the jobs were. But with my few possessions, I brought my Bible with me. One day, I read where God said He would be a father to the fatherless. I didn't have anything to lose, so I claimed that promise.

Wow! As I review my life as I approach my 8th decade, I can see where my new Father has been with me every step of the way, which to tell it all would require an entire book, which my DIL (PhD kind of chick) thought I should write. But the short story, is that my new Father took me from a hopeless uneducated street kid to a multi-millionaire with the most wonderful family one could imagine. He gave me a most awesome wife, the wife of His choice, custom made exactly for me. We enjoyed 49 wonderful years together, seven shmitas, one year short of the Year of Jubilee which we will celebrate when we are again together for the Marriage Supper.

When I started my family, I was determined to break the family curse which had plagued our family. We all worked together on that, a blessing that has now been passed on to the second and third generation. And seeing my grandchildren's dedication to the Lord, I am sure it will pass on to the fourth generation.

So remember, that God has promised to be a father to the fatherless!

I'm so sorry to hear of your lousy childhood or should I say - lack there of? Best decision you ever made was to remember that bible!
God has blessed you abundantly, and surely will continue to, as that is what a Good, Good Father does ❤

In Him always,
nancy
P.S. Why not write a book? Memoires?