Estimated Dates of the Events of the 1 Year Great Tribulation of the Earth
- Thread starter gaviria.christian
- Start date
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
By what the apostles themselves revealed are not required anymore. Circumcision, food, drinks, feasts, new moons, and shabbaths. Also the sacrifices and offerings were abolished by the sacrifice of the Messiah in accordance to them and the book of Daniel, "and he will cause sacrifices and offerings to cease". And there are also changes to the Torah, such as polygamy and remarriage being forbidden under the new covenant. And so, after identifying everything that is no longer required or what has changed, all you are left with are the required commands of the Torah, the "commands of God". I am working on finishing an excel spreadsheet that identifies all the commands of the Torah that are still binding, and which are no longer required.
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
I believe the surface commandments of the Ten Commandments were changed by Jesus to be much deeper and why instead of hard stone, they are written on our hearts. In other words, the bottom line of murder under the Old Law, is now deeper to the source - hate. The law made no man righteous, but the law of the Spirit of life in Christ does. It is the difference between Romans 7 and Romans 8. They are contrasts of the LAW vs. SPIRIT.
No, whats dumb is attempting to do the very thing Jesus said can't be done. Do you know who Harold Camping was? Or any of the other date setters? They were all wrong and you are too. No one knows the day or the hour...Pretty clear. But then it appears youre trying to dip your toe into both the old covenant and the new. You just pick and choose what you'll adhere to. You want to keep the torah, but eat pork. Okay
I already told you, the Messiah said "no one knows the day nor the hour" way before the book of Revelation was given laying out the day and the hour. Do you not understand that the apostle Paul probably never even laid eyes on the book of Revelation? The book of Revelation lays out the complete order of events related to the second coming, in the context of the appointed times of the Torah. That is how I know the day and the hour, because I know the Torah and its appointed times, and through that knowledge I then understand the book of Revelation plainly, but because you don't know the Torah nor understand its appointed times, to you the book of Revelation is like a series of random events, not understanding that they happen in accordance to the appointed times of the Torah. Its ignorance and its finest, as a result of torahlessness. And what makes it worse is stubbornness, even someone who doesn't know how to read has more hope than someone stubborn in their torahlessness.
Certainly there were men that were righteous according to the Torah, such as David, who was commended for being righteous, and sinned only perhaps 2 times in his life, but their righteousness was nothing compared to the righteousness that now comes through belief in Yeshuah, because through belief in him the set-apart airflow is given, which then cuts away sin in the inward man, thus perfecting a man inwardly, which is a greater righteousness than even Abraham who was still in subjection to sin, even though he too was commended for being righteous.
Nancy
Well-Known Member
" and we will thus fulfill the requirement of the Torah" (Bold mine) We ?
"We" cannot keep the Law, that was given to the "Israelite's". Why did Christ die??...
because it was, and remains impossible for man to keep The Law!
Love God, Love neighbor.
Peace, and Gods grace
The Messiah didn't die so that we could disobey the Torah, he died so that we can be given a chance to obey it.
bbyrd009
Groper
- Nov 30, 2016
- 33,943
- 12,081
- 113
- Faith
- Christian
- Country
- United States Minor Outlying Islands
Prayer Warrior
Well-Known Member
Thanks for answering my question. Can you give me references (Book and verse) that you consider to be the "commands of the Torah" that are still binding under the New Covenant? For instance, Leviticus 20:9-21 or Leviticus 13:45-46 or Leviticus 24:13-16 or Leviticus 24:19-20.... Do you consider these "required commands of the Torah" that Christians must observe?
Last edited:
Nondenom40
Active Member
And i already told you Jesus is God, He knew exactly what Revelation was going to say because He told John to write it. And nowhere does Revelation 'lay out' the day and the hour. That is pure speculation on your part. Against scriptural admonitions.
Who brought up Paul?
This vision of John's is taking place in heaven. Heaven runs on torah time? God is obligated to run on a time table that was done away with? I'd rethink this if i were you.
I've never said anything that happens in Revelation or with God in general is 'random.' My God is not the God of randomness. Your God seems to be stuck in the old covenant. What did Jesus die for if you have to obey the torah and its 'time table'?
Defiance at its finest. The bible clearly says no one knows the day or the hour. But you come along and say thats nonsense. Slap God in the face if you want. I'll take the plain reading of the bible instead of the forced conjectures of fallible men.
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
What I mean is, it is not through keeping the Ten Commandments which was the Old Covenant Exodus 34:28, but through the Law of the Spirit of life in Christ. The Ten Commandments were to show us our sin. Christ takes away our sin by changing our nature, and that I believe we agree on.
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
Hi Nancy, if it is impossible to keep the law, how do you believe Christ's death helps us?
Yes, except two things, the command regarding lepers, because "clean and unclean" is identified in the new covenant as sin, not animals nor diseases. And the command regarding putting to death sinners, for we are in a time of mercy to call sinners to repentance. Once the Messiah returns, then the death penalty of the Torah will be enforced again under his rulership, including "eye for an eye and tooth for a tooth".
The Torah has not been done away with, and until you understand this you will never understand how the Messiah will fulfill the autumn appointed times of the Torah in his second coming.
Nondenom40
Active Member
That was never the purpose of the law. I thought you were an expert on the torah? Its purpose seems to have flown right over your head. Read Romans or Galatians lately?
If you put your trust in your works to save you, then you are not placing your trust in the finished work of the Cross (Jesus' shed blood).
If you are not placing your trust in the finished work of the Cross (Jesus' shed blood) to save you,
Then you are not saved.
Thus, if anyone thinks that they will enter in to the kingdom on the basis of their keeping of the Torah (works),
They will not enter in on the basis of Christ's shed blood,
And therefore will not enter in at all.
Now those who are redeemed will not be violators of any just law (Galatians 5:22-23); because the love of the Lord is shed abroad in their hearts (Romans 5:5) and this love is the fulfilling of the righteousness of the law within them (Romans 13:8-10, Galatians 5:14, 1 John 5:3, 2 John 1:6, Romans 8:4).
But if anyone seeks to enter in to the kingdom not based on the forgiveness that Christ offers but rather on the basis of their own worthiness or merit,
they will find that their own righteousnesses are as filthy rags before Him (Isaiah 64:6);
And they will hear the words, I never knew you; depart from me, ye that work iniquity. Matthew 7:23.
and/or,
Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels. Matthew 25:41.
If you are not placing your trust in the finished work of the Cross (Jesus' shed blood) to save you,
Then you are not saved.
Thus, if anyone thinks that they will enter in to the kingdom on the basis of their keeping of the Torah (works),
They will not enter in on the basis of Christ's shed blood,
And therefore will not enter in at all.
Now those who are redeemed will not be violators of any just law (Galatians 5:22-23); because the love of the Lord is shed abroad in their hearts (Romans 5:5) and this love is the fulfilling of the righteousness of the law within them (Romans 13:8-10, Galatians 5:14, 1 John 5:3, 2 John 1:6, Romans 8:4).
But if anyone seeks to enter in to the kingdom not based on the forgiveness that Christ offers but rather on the basis of their own worthiness or merit,
they will find that their own righteousnesses are as filthy rags before Him (Isaiah 64:6);
And they will hear the words, I never knew you; depart from me, ye that work iniquity. Matthew 7:23.
and/or,
Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels. Matthew 25:41.
Last edited:
The purpose of the Torah was to reveal what sin is through its commands, not to free us from sin, and because we were still slaves to sin when the Torah was given, then the Torah merely brought death, because the Torah says for example, "if a man commits adultery, he shall be put to death". Which is why the death of the Messiah was necessary, not to permit us to disobey the Torah, but to free us from sin, through his blood, by the set-apart airflow, which the blood of animals was never able to do, and so cause us to obey the Torah perfectly. You have completely misunderstood the writings of Paul, and have gone into torahlessness.
Prayer Warrior
Well-Known Member
What is the purpose of keeping the "required commands of the Torah" under the New Covenant?
To be righteous. It is necessary to stop stealing, it is necessary to stop committing adultery, it is necessary to begin giving to the poor. These are all commands that define the "righteousness" of God. Unless you obey the commands of God that define righteousness you cannot inherit the kingdom of God, because the kingdom of God is a kingdom of righteousness, not torahlessness as you people surmise, which is why you have no clue why you need to obey.
Similar threads
