What Keeps Us From Sinning In Heaven?

[CharismaticLady]

He backslid.

You are free to marry, but only in the Lord as per the passage in 1 Cor 7:39.

I didn't divorce him, he divorced me without cause. The divorce isn't valid in the eyes of God. Besides, he isn't dead. He is living in perpetual adultery and so is his mistress.

39 A wife is bound by law as long as her husband lives; but if her husband dies, she is at liberty to be married to whom she wishes, only in the Lord.

 

[Waiting on him]

That is dodging the question. Lies can be about the past, present or future. Even if I agreed with you that it applied only to the future, the question still needs to be answered: Why not?

Please try to come to terms with it. God cannot lie. Why not? If we come closer to the answer for that, we may find ourselves closer to answering the question in the OP.

May also help to know what heaven is?

 

[Truther]

This is where we agree on one point, but don't agree on another.

The carnal flesh is our carnal corrupted spirit nature. It is not our body. Our body must put on immortality just like our spirit/nature became alive unto Christ and has already put on immortality.

We no longer have to struggle against the old nature of sin, because the Spirit freed us from sin.

Sorta...

Our body(flesh) is the house of the sin nature.

We are controlled by it pre born again.

The born again nature of God helps us battle it.

Our spirit is saved but the corrupt flesh dies.

We saw that when Jesus' human spirit left his mangled body, which body did not want to be mangled, and had a will of it's own.

 

[Truther]

I didn't divorce him, he divorced me without cause. The divorce isn't valid in the eyes of God. Besides, he isn't dead. He is living in perpetual adultery and so is his mistress.

39 A wife is bound by law as long as her husband lives; but if her husband dies, she is at liberty to be married to whom she wishes, only in the Lord.

Same chapter...


15 But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases: but God hath called us to peace.

 

[Giuliano]

But, you see, I don't agree that it only applies to the future. Linear time is God's plaything, if He so chooses. He is not bound by the constraints of His own conceptions. No dodging required.

You are dodging. You are still not telling us why God cannot lie. You want to introduce other things into the discussion like time, etc. Indeed, by saying He is not "bound by the constraints of His own conceptions," you seem to think God could lie.

I also wonder why you introduced the "future" if it applies to past, present and future. You wrote, "No, what it means is that whatever He says comes to pass." Why complicate matters if you really think it applies to past, present and future?

It is an important question. Eve would not have been deceived by the serpent if she had "grasped" that it was impossible for God to lie. She allowed her mind to entertain alternatives, "Well, maybe God was deceiving us when He said we would die if we ate of that tree." How could she have faith in God if she thought maybe He had lied?

I say God's purpose in creating man was Love. God wanted people He could love. It would be wonderful too if they loved Him back; and since genuine love is a matter of choice and cannot be programmed or compelled, man was given that choice. If God lied to people, He'd be undermining His own purpose in creating man. Why would He do that? If He wanted what was best for them, He wanted them to trust him and to believe in Him. God is Love. It is what He is. For God to lie would be betraying Himself. It is God's Love that "constrains" Him from lying.

Eve began her way down by doubting God's goodness and truth. That suspicion led to other things. For me, it seems simple: God is Love -- there is no reason to doubt what He says since He loves us and wants us to love Him.

 

[Giuliano]

May also help to know what heaven is?

Few seem willing to come to terms with that. We have seen assertions that Adam and Eve were sinless and perfect creatures in Heaven. Were they? According to the Bible, I think we'd have to answer no.

It is a glaring omission when God does not pronounce the man "good" after making him. Why didn't God say of the man that he was good?

Then why, when Eden contained the serpent and the forbidden fruit, did God look at the totality of it all and say it was very good?

 

[BarneyFife]

You are dodging. You are still not telling us why God cannot lie. You want to introduce other things into the discussion like time, etc. Indeed, by saying He is not "bound by the constraints of His own conceptions," you seem to think God could lie.

I also wonder why you introduced the "future" if it applies to past, present and future. You wrote, "No, what it means is that whatever He says comes to pass." Why complicate matters if you really think it applies to past, present and future?

It is an important question. Eve would not have been deceived by the serpent if she had "grasped" that it was impossible for God to lie. She allowed her mind to entertain alternatives, "Well, maybe God was deceiving us when He said we would die if we ate of that tree." How could she have faith in God if she thought maybe He had lied?

I say God's purpose in creating man was Love. God wanted people He could love. It would be wonderful too if they loved Him back; and since genuine love is a matter of choice and cannot be programmed or compelled, man was given that choice. If God lied to people, He'd be undermining His own purpose in creating man. Why would He do that? If He wanted what was best for them, He wanted them to trust him and to believe in Him. God is Love. It is what He is. For God to lie would be betraying Himself. It is God's Love that "constrains" Him from lying.

Eve began her way down by doubting God's goodness and truth. That suspicion led to other things. For me, it seems simple: God is Love -- there is no reason to doubt what He says since He loves us and wants us to love Him.

Believe what you like. Perhaps you can read my mind. Do you really think there is some deficiency within the make-up of God that won't permit Him to speak whatever He desires? You opened the "lie" can of worms, not me. You're making arguments from silence. I never said God could lie and I feel no burden to explain to you any further than I have why He cannot. Try to embrace that.

 

[BarneyFife]

@Giuliano You're playing with fire and I'm not interested.

 

[BarneyFife]

Gen 1:31 KJV And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

 

[Waiting on him]

Few seem willing to come to terms with that. We have seen assertions that Adam and Eve were sinless and perfect creatures in Heaven. Were they? According to the Bible, I think we'd have to answer no.

It is a glaring omission when God does not pronounce the man "good" after making him. Why didn't God say of the man that he was good?

Then why, when Eden contained the serpent and the forbidden fruit, did God look at the totality of it all and say it was very good?

He knew it would lead to the proclamation of the Son!

 

[michaelvpardo]

True enough. But since you have not said anything about this, the answer is found in 1 John 3:1-3:

THE SAINTS WILL BE PERFECTED AND GLORIFIED AT THE RESURRECTION/RAPTURE
1 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.
2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when He shall appear, we shall be like Him; for we shall see Him as He is.
3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.

"We shall be like Him" is possibly the most awesome phrase in scripture and also one of the hardest for me to imagine. While I could be content to hide in the Lord's shadow for all eternity, He has greater plans for us.
"For both He who sanctifies and those who are being sanctified are all of one, for which reason He is not ashamed to call them brethren," Hebrews 2:11

 

[Giuliano]

Believe what you like. Perhaps you can read my mind. Do you really think there is some deficiency within the make-up of God that won't permit Him to speak whatever He desires? You opened the "lie" can of worms, not me. You're making arguments from silence. I never said God could lie and I feel no burden to explain to you any further than I have why He cannot. Try to embrace that.

I never said you said God could lie. You asked how men could get to the point of sinlessness. In other words, how can men become like God, no? I do not need to read your mind -- I can see how you dodge. I know there is a reason for dodging, but I cannot say for sure what it is.

@Giuliano You're playing with fire and I'm not interested.

If you understood why it was impossible for you to lie to people you love, surely you would understand why God cannot lie. Can you discern this? If not, then I fear you may be the one playing with fire.

Gen 1:31 KJV And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

I already referred to that verse. What is your explanation for it? The Garden contained the serpent and the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil.

Oh, it was very good -- including the dust God collected from the earth to make the man before placing him in Eden.

 

[bbyrd009]

Well, yes.

Every one who has THIS HOPE purifies himself, even as He is pure. What hope is that? He said, everyone who has THIS HOPE.

That hope is that when we see Him, we WILL BE like Him.

Hope . . . the expected end of our faith.

For instances . . . our faith is in Jesus, and His promise of the resurrection. Our hope is the be raised from the dead. We believe what Jesus said, so this is what we are expecting to happen. We hope in the resurrection is another way to say, I believe when the Bible promises us resurrection, and so I expect to be raised from the dead.

We know that when we see Him, we will be like Him. But how can we even be certain we'll be transformed to be like Him when we see Him, if we can't be sure we will "remain saved"?

Much love!

your bargain with death will be cancelled; and when the overwhelming scourge passes through...
just sayin

 

[CharismaticLady]

Sorta...

Our body(flesh) is the house of the sin nature.

We are controlled by it pre born again.

The born again nature of God helps us battle it.

Our spirit is saved but the corrupt flesh dies.

We saw that when Jesus' human spirit left his mangled body, which body did not want to be mangled, and had a will of it's own.

The sin nature produces the sin. Romans 6:2 we are dead to sin, so what produces the sin no longer controls us. There is no battle. We partake of the divine nature because that old sin nature has been born again. The old is gone as long as we do not revive it and quench the Spirit like a dog returning to its vomit.

 

[BarneyFife]

I already referred to that verse. What is your explanation for it? The Garden contained the serpent and the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil.

There is no Scriptural evidence that reveals the tree of the knowledge of good and evil and the serpent were in the garden at the end of the 6th day.

 

[CharismaticLady]

Same chapter...


15 But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases: but God hath called us to peace.

He is not an unbeliever, that's the point. He even takes his wife to church.

 

[BarneyFife]

I can see how you dodge. I know there is a reason for dodging, but I cannot say for sure what it is.

If you continue to twist my words and accuse me of dodging, the discussion is definitely coming to a close shortly.

 

[BarneyFife]

He is not an unbeliever, that's the point. He even takes his wife to church.

Thanks for your participation.

 

[Giuliano]

There is no Scriptural evidence that reveals the tree of the knowledge of good and evil and the serpent were in the garden at the end of the 6th day.

Are you thinking before posting?

Are you proposing two creators? That somehow the serpent broke into Eden and put the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil in later? Or are you proposing that God's works were not completely finished on the sixth day?

Genesis 2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

Genesis 3:1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?

The serpent was necessary. Jesus compared himself to the serpent on the pole which Moses made. He exercised dominion over it, something Adam and Eve did not do.

1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

 

[Giuliano]

If you continue to twist my words and accuse me of dodging, the discussion is definitely coming to a close shortly.

Have it however you want it; but when I ask a question, I appreciate a straightforward answer, not a dodging response. You are definitely a dodger who sometimes posts without thinking very much. First, when I asked the question, you said that "God cannot lie" "meant" that He would do what He said He would do as if the meaning of the statement referred to future events only. When pressed on it, you said it "meant" God also did not lie about the past or present. That means your first statement was not well thought out. Don't blame me for that. You can always reflect more before posting.