Power of prognostication

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lforrest

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Ok, now this is different. Since I last posted, I've been sort of searching around to see who prophesied what, and none of them struck me as having much authority. But Charlie Shamp is on a different level, and I was not aware of the visions he mentions here. The trouble is the following two things, which came up in what Selveraj prophesied as well:

1. The outcome depends on if the church prays or not, and
2. There is an uncertainty about what the words "Trump will triumph" mean. Shamp mentions an unsureness about what is meant by the words just like Selveraj did. They could simply mean Trump ends up being vindicated for challenging the election, but not that he necessarily wins. The latter is dependent on what the church does (watch from the beginning). The former is prophesied without qualification.

Anyway, what he states from 15:56 - 19:48 witnesses as being genuine prophecy. I won't transcribe it yet, but maybe later.


Not only does Shamp have a very strong track record, but this prophecy also appears to be confirmed by the other dream I mentioned being aware of regarding the state of Pennsylvania (10:25 - 11:58):


This one I transcribed already. The wording is as follows:

"I had been in prayer in my bedroom, and I had been praying in the Spirit; praying in tongues. Petitioning the Lord for clarity, not so that I could say 'I got the word,' but I just really feel like the church needs some direction... and so, in prayer after about an hour or so, I went into an open vision... The first thing that I saw is, I saw these steps coming downhill, and the first thing that I saw in the vision was I saw a white robe, and feet, and they were bare feet but they were bright, I mean just shining, golden-brass bright... and He was walking down these steps... and I heard the voice of the Lord... 'As I said to you before, so say I again. Watch Pennsylvania, particularly Philadelphia. And what I said to the church of Philadelphia in the Book of Revelation, so say I to My church in this season, about the city of Philadelphia and the nation in the days ahead.'"

He references the passage in Revelation. Here it is:

7 And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write; These things saith He that is Holy, He that is True, He that hath the key of David, He that opens, and no man shuts; and shuts, and no man opens; 8 I know thy works: behold, I have set before thee an open door, and no man can shut it: for thou hast a little strength, and hast kept My word, and hast not denied My name. 9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee. 10 Because thou hast kept the word of My endurance, I also will keep thee from the hour of trial, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth. 11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown. 12 Him that overcomes will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of My God, and the name of the city of My God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him My new name. 13 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

This prophecy in Revelation is about the church in Philadelphia having gone through Hell in the form of persecution, until they have very little strength left to persevere. But His promise to them is about Heaven, and that they will be rewarded in eternity for staying faithful to him...

I'm working through all this atm, but I find it very interesting...

@Prayer Warrior. I know you are praying, and my apologies if I have seemed overly pessimistic about the church in America praying enough to turn the tide in Trump's favor. This is based on what I have seen happen elsewhere. The church in Australia was warned to pray for their situation, and they unfortunately did NOT do so, and my fear has been that the American church will likewise make the same mistake. But there is still a chance, so I wanted to say God bless you in your efforts.

@Josho. I know you keep track of Charlie Shamp, so I thought you might be interested in this post as well.

I rest in Psalm 57 and wait with eager expectation because we have endured his chastising.
 
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GTW27

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I rest in Psalm 57 and wait with eager expectation because we have endured his chastising.

Just today," Lord what shall I do?" "you shall rest, my son". All I see is blind guides hooked in the snare, pay them no mind. Instead of praying for evil men, with blood on their hands, pray for your neighbor. They are falling sick and many are dying. Day and by night this is passing through the land. Let us all come to the throne of grace as One voice, to ask for mercy from The King of mercies, that He may turn that which was meant to destroy to that we can endure, like a cold. Is this a hard thing for The Lord to do? I say no. If we truly love our brother in our heart how can we not bring this petition before Him? I remember in times past Him speak to me these words,"I have heard the voice of my people and I will do....... And then it came to pass. I am sorry to derail this thread but sometimes the smallest voice needs to be heard, especially in a time as this.
 
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David H.

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I hadn't planned on posting about this until I came back, but Marks is correct here. It's the crux of the problem for many of the "prophets" who said Trump would win in 2020.

Great Comment, I feel James 4:1-5 applies here, and all should examine their own motives, and why they are praying for what they are praying for. God's will or their own will. After walking with the LORD for 40+ years of my life, he has answered "no" more than once. His will does not always align with my will despite how much I plead with Him, that is because my motives have been wrong. A seed cannot grow unless it is broken and dies, Trial and hardship are often the means by which the seed is allowed to germinate and grow, the church in this country has not grown and has remained largely complacent and stagnant, Tribulation will bring Spiritual growth... Note: I am not speaking of church growth as in numbers but Spiritual growth as in Maturity in Christ Jesus.

Judgment begins at the House of God, the fiery trial being the start of this, read 1 Peter 4:12-19, all those Prophets who prophesied lies will be among the first.

Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away. For we know in part, and we prophesy in part. But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away. When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things. For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known. (1 Cor. 13:8-12)
 

Heart2Soul

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I rest in Psalm 57 and wait with eager expectation because we have endured his chastising.
That is a great chapter in Psalms to rest in!
I personally do not believe for one second that ALL the prophets who saw, heard, or had dreams and visions of a second Trump presidency got it wrong. We just don't see what He is doing behind the scenes at this time. God's ways are far above ours and He sees everything even to the end.
When I prayed and asked Him what is going on He said don't fear what you see or hear just trust in Me and watch what I do.
I see Him allowing this election to happen in such a way as to make the corrupt politicians expose themselves. He is bringing to light what they have been doing in darkness.
He needs America still to be with Israel and stand with her until the appointed time. Then when that time comes He will appoint a wicked one to become president who will turn America's back on Israel.
That's what has been spoken to me in my Spirit. I am not afraid or ashamed to put my faith in Him.
 
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Hidden In Him

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A seed cannot grow unless it is broken and dies, Trial and hardship are often the means by which the seed is allowed to germinate and grow, the church in this country has not grown and has remained largely complacent and stagnant, Tribulation will bring Spiritual growth... Note: I am not speaking of church growth as in numbers but Spiritual growth as in Maturity in Christ Jesus.

Yes. I have a sister who is very concerned about the future now, but I'm trying to reassure her that what is likely coming now will actually be very good for the church, at least for those who will draw closer to Him in the storm instead of falling away. The prophecy to Laodicea was a warning to start seeking something greater than earthly blessings - spiritual ones - and the first one is a faith tried in the fires of adversity.
Judgment begins at the House of God, the fiery trial being the start of this, read 1 Peter 4:12-19, all those Prophets who prophesied lies will be among the first.

I'm getting increasingly interested in studying the dynamics of prophecy now. There are some who have blatantly prophesied falsely, but there are others who received genuine visions who have been far more guarded not to put words in the Lord's mouth. Many reading those visions have had no qualms about immediately jumping to conclusions, but that's on them. It's not a refection on what was actually spoken.

It's also possible that the enemy altered his plans in some areas after certain things were brought to light through undercover work, and I honestly wouldn't be surprised if some of the prophecies that were put in print have caused them to take further steps to ensure that things go their way, making matters even more complicated.

But yes, there are some upon whom judgment has already begun.
 

David H.

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Yes. I have a sister who is very concerned about the future now, but I'm trying to reassure her that what is likely coming now will actually be very good for the church, at least for those who will draw closer to Him in the storm instead of falling away. The prophecy to Laodicea was a warning to start seeking something greater than earthly blessings - spiritual ones - and the first one is a faith tried in the fires of adversity.

Amen! What is seen as calamity, will be the church's finest hour, to those who are in his presence and seeking the truth.

I'm getting increasingly interested in studying the dynamics of prophecy now. There are some who have blatantly prophesied falsely, but there are others who received genuine visions who have been far more guarded not to put words in the Lord's mouth. Many reading those visions have had no qualms about immediately jumping to conclusions, but that's on them. It's not a refection on what was actually spoken.
That is why I posted the video on the prophecy Forum, I believe many are genuine in what they are saying and seeing, in the videos case a dream of a coming storm. Others do so to make money and or gain notoriety and fame (Balaam's error). Discerning this is sometimes hard, as the person can seem genuine. We must be careful not to Judge to quickly, but yet must not fail to judge. Paul writes:

Let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other judge. If any thing be revealed to another that sitteth by, let the first hold his peace. For ye may all prophesy one by one, that all may learn, and all may be comforted. And the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets. For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints. (1 Corinthians 14:29-33)

In other words we should hear them out, and not immediately judge them as false, as some do denying the word of Prophecy, And Yet we cannot tolerate the false ones for too long or they will lead astray many.

God Bless
 

Bobby Jo

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...
But there will come a president who will turn this nation against her. Obama had started by funded Israel's enemies.
Then will America be cursed and judgment come upon her along with the other nations who rise up against Israel.

Your cited Turn-About, in essence, is what I'd propose is embedded in Prophetic Scripture as PROGNOSTICATION. It's not an ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY that we're IN THE TRIBULATION, although Scripture & History Point to that Circumstance. It's not an ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY that Trump & Pence are the TWO WITNESSES, although Scripture & History Point to that Circumstance. And it's not an ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY that a Democrat Speaker of the House (apparently Pelosi) will SUCCEED as the New President to join the United Nations against Israel, although Scripture & History Suggest that Circumstance.

And so where GOD says to "come, let us reason together", we are given Wisdom, Discernment, and Understanding to perceive the shadows as we "see through the glass darkly".

With Very Best Regards,
Bobby Jo
 
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Ziggy

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The only One who has no bounds is God.
Even Satan himself was cast to the earth and is bound by God's playbook.
Everyone, every tribe, every nation, every government has a part to play.
Whether for good or evil.. it is all confined on one playing field.

You have to have dusk in order to have dawn.
You need down for there to be up.
darkness, light wrong/right

Everything has a purpose and a season.
There is nothing that is not in God's control.
And even the devil has his own role to play.
But he has limits and bounds in which to move.

The ultimate chess game.
Even a pawn can bring down a king. And sometimes God uses the unskilled and the unwise to confound the high and mighty.
Everything that is happening is for one purpose and one purpose alone. To draw people to Jesus.
It may look like we're losing the battle. That the "hour" of the power of darkness will prevail.
But God is the Ruler of the board an which all is put in play.

Never doubt, never lose faith.
The war has already been won..
it just needs to be manifested into the material world for us to see it's reality.
Well, maybe not "us" , but the world needs to see and to learn
who is.. King of Kings and Lord of Lord's.

No worries :)
HUGS
 

Heart2Soul

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Your cited Turn-About, in essence, is what I'd propose is embedded in Prophetic Scripture as PROGNOSTICATION. It's not an ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY that we're IN THE TRIBULATION, although Scripture & History Point to that Circumstance. It's not an ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY that Trump & Pence are the TWO WITNESSES, although Scripture & History Point to that Circumstance. And it's not an ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY that a Democrat Speaker of the House (apparently Pelosi) will SUCCEED as the New President to join the United Nations against Israel, although Scripture & History Suggest that Circumstance.

And so where GOD says to "come, let us reason together", we are given Wisdom, Discernment, and Understanding to perceive the shadows as we "see through the glass darkly".

With Very Best Regards,
Bobby Jo
There are so many signs to consider happening world wide...waters are turning blood red, swarms of desert locusts of historical proportion have invaded Russia, Africa and even the middle east, hurricanes, tsunamis, earthquakes, volcanic eruptions...
Historic blood moons....
Is this all coincidence that it's all happening simultaneously? I don't think so.
 
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Heart2Soul

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Luke 21 (KJV)
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
⁸ And he said, Take heed that ye be not deceived: for many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and the time draweth near: go ye not therefore after them.
⁹ But when ye shall hear of wars and commotions, be not terrified: for these things must first come to pass; but the end is not by and by.
¹⁰ Then said he unto them, Nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom:
¹¹ And great earthquakes shall be in divers places, and famines, and pestilences; and fearful sights and great signs shall there be from heaven.
¹² But before all these, they shall lay their hands on you, and persecute you, delivering you up to the synagogues, and into prisons, being brought before kings and rulers for my name's sake.


²⁵ And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;
²⁶ Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.
²⁷ And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
²⁸ And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
 
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Ziggy

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for the powers of heaven shall be shaken

I hear "heaven" as government...
Eph 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

It's time to pray... because the enemy is looking for prey.

Hugs
 

Bobby Jo

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There are so many signs to consider happening world wide...waters are turning blood red, swarms of desert locusts of historical proportion have invaded Russia, Africa and even the middle east, hurricanes, tsunamis, earthquakes, volcanic eruptions...
Historic blood moons....
Is this all coincidence that it's all happening simultaneously? I don't think so.

EXACTLY CORRECT! And that GOD given Wisdom, Discernment, and Understanding will help guide us in the coming days! :)


With VERY Best Regards,
Bobby Jo
 
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Heart2Soul

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I hear "heaven" as government...
Eph 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

It's time to pray... because the enemy is looking for prey.

Hugs
I like your oxymoron there:D
 
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