The Sabbath Day and Jesus

[justbyfaith]

Did you know that God's seal is embodied in the Sabbath Commandment?

Chapter and verse, please.

I'm not saying you're wrong; I just want to be the Berean and do the study for myself.

 

[Michael1985]

In another thread this was the discussion I though deserved its own thread.

@justbyfaith made some unbiblical claims against Jesus below in response to Watersong.

@WaterSong said

Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath. Mark 2: 27-28 If anyone had a right to "work" on Sabbath day it was he.
In doing this he demonstrated doing the work of God did not violate Sabbath.

@justbyfaith responds below:

That's right, He did not violate the spirit of the sabbath day laws; although He did violate the letter.

That is plain for all to see.

Exo 20:10, But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

Jhn 5:16, And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus, and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the sabbath day.
Jhn 5:17, But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work.
Jhn 5:18, Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.

I consider that verse 18 is the estimation of the apostle under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.

Again, Romans 7:6 is paramount to our understanding here.

As well as Hebrews 7:12 and context.

Jde 1:24, Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,
2Pe 1:10, Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
1Jo 2:10, He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.


And here is my response to justbyfaiths unbiblical claims:

jbf has no idea of what the sabbath day means nor what work means in the commandments. Here are my top 10 reasons why below:

1- you shall not do any work- as in the same work of the other 6 days of the week
2- the Priest's " worked " in the temple on the sabbath
3- that day was a break for man from his work to devote to God
4- doing Gods work on that day is not a violation of the sabbath
5- Jesus healing the man was doing Gods work hence no violation.
6- turn your foot from the Sabbath, from doing your pleasure on My holy day, and call the Sabbath a delight, the holy day of the Lord honorable, and shall honor Him, not doing your own ways, nor finding your own pleasure, nor speaking your own words (Isaiah 58:13)
7- honoring and worshipping God on the sabbath is not a violation but indeed is a command which Jesus was obeying.
8- Jesus healing on the sabbath was fulfilled the Sabbaths design not breaking its command
9- Jesus answers His self righteous critics- "If a man receives circumcision on the Sabbath, so that the law of Moses should not be broken, are you angry with Me because I made a man completely well on the Sabbath? Do not judge according to appearance, but judge righteous judgment" (John 7:23-24).
10- This is how one should look at Scripture with understanding and proper exegesis understanding its context.

BTW- Jesus did not violate the letter of the law- He fulfilled the law perfectly down to the very letter of the law. To say otherwise is to accuse Jesus of sin just like the Pharisees who were religious hypocrites did numerous time to the Son of God. He is Holy and Perfect just like the Father which is why He said My Father is working and so am I working and I only say and do what I hear and see My Father saying and doing.

hope this helps !!!




All comments, thoughts appreciated by forum members. Thanks !

I've always understood this passage as saying that He was the ultimate arbiter of what actually constituted work on the Sabbath.

 

[Ziggy]

I'm not sure what Paul was getting at, but I do know there are different sabbaths.
It shall be "A" sabbath to you.. this is not the 7th day Sabbath.
You have to go back to the "law" of Moses and the "Levitical" laws to find them.

Jhn 19:31 The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away.

Exo 12:40 Now the sojourning of the children of Israel, who dwelt in Egypt, was four hundred and thirty years.
Exo 12:41 And it came to pass at the end of the four hundred and thirty years, even the selfsame day it came to pass, that all the hosts of the LORD went out from the land of Egypt.
Exo 12:42 It is a night to be much observed unto the LORD for bringing them out from the land of Egypt: this is that night of the LORD to be observed of all the children of Israel in their generations.
Exo 12:43 And the LORD said unto Moses and Aaron, This is the ordinance of the passover: There shall no stranger eat thereof:
Exo 12:44 But every man's servant that is bought for money, when thou hast circumcised him, then shall he eat thereof.

Col 2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
Col 2:15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

Jesus removed the part about strangers.. uncircumcised.. being able to take part in the, ultimately the resurrection.
Which is what the Resurrection is, our being free from the bondage and slavery of sin. The night you came out of Egypt.
What Paul is saying is,
No one has the right to say you can't be partakers in the Passover or any of the Holy Days just because you are a Gentile or uncircumcised.

But somebody twisted it all and now they say there are no more Holy Days..
We made NEW Holidays...
well God got something to say about those as well..

Isa 1:14 Your new moons and your appointed feasts my soul hateth: they are a trouble unto me; I am weary to bear them.

Notice he doesn't say MY, he says YOURS,

Just saying...
I am neither Jew nor Gentile.
I belong to the Lord.
Amen
Hugs

 

[ChristisGod]

I've always understood this passage as saying that He was the ultimate arbiter of what actually constituted work on the Sabbath.

Absolutely since He was the One Who made the Law in the first place.

 

[michaelvpardo]

Pretty sure that most people on the planet haven't got a clue about the difference between the spirit of the law and the letter of the law. You need the Spirit to understand the difference.
7 But if you had known what this means, ‘I desire mercy and not sacrifice,’ you would not have condemned the guiltless. 8 For the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath. Matthew 12:7-8
You can't make the assumption that people who read scripture actually understand what it means with regard to any spiritual truth.
62 What then if you should see the Son of Man ascend where He was before? 63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life. 64 But there are some of you who do not believe.” For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were who did not believe, and who would betray Him. John 6:62-64

5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think of anything as being from ourselves, but our sufficiency is from God, 6 who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life. 2 Corinthians 3:5-6

 

[justbyfaith]

Absolutely since He was the One Who made the Law in the first place.

And it only substantiates my viewpoint that Jesus re-defined the law (Hebrews 7:12) so that we are not any longer bound by the letter but will be obedient to the spirit of what is written (Romans 7:6, 2 Corinthians 3:6).

 

[quietthinker]

Chapter and verse, please.

I'm not saying you're wrong; I just want to be the Berean and do the study for myself.

Thank you for your curiosity jbf.

Seals are used to give a document authority, particularly that of Monarchs.
A seal consists of three primary pieces of information namely:-

1. Title of the the authority
2. Name of the authority
3. Domain of the authority

for example.....Queen Elizabeth of England

1 Title:- Queen
2 Name:- Elizabeth
3 Domain:- England

Exodus 20:8-11
Remember the Sabbath day by keeping it holy. Six days you shall labor and do all your work but the seventh day is a sabbath to the Lord your God. On it you shall not do any work, neither you, nor your son or daughter, nor your male or female servant, nor your animals, nor any foreigner residing in your towns. For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day.Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.

1. Title :- Lord
2. Name:- God
3. Domain:- Heaven and Earth

 

[quietthinker]

I'm not sure what Paul was getting at, but I do know there are different sabbaths.
It shall be "A" sabbath to you.. this is not the 7th day Sabbath.
You have to go back to the "law" of Moses and the "Levitical" laws to find them.

Jhn 19:31 The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away.

Exo 12:40 Now the sojourning of the children of Israel, who dwelt in Egypt, was four hundred and thirty years.
Exo 12:41 And it came to pass at the end of the four hundred and thirty years, even the selfsame day it came to pass, that all the hosts of the LORD went out from the land of Egypt.
Exo 12:42 It is a night to be much observed unto the LORD for bringing them out from the land of Egypt: this is that night of the LORD to be observed of all the children of Israel in their generations.
Exo 12:43 And the LORD said unto Moses and Aaron, This is the ordinance of the passover: There shall no stranger eat thereof:
Exo 12:44 But every man's servant that is bought for money, when thou hast circumcised him, then shall he eat thereof.

Col 2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
Col 2:15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

Jesus removed the part about strangers.. uncircumcised.. being able to take part in the, ultimately the resurrection.
Which is what the Resurrection is, our being free from the bondage and slavery of sin. The night you came out of Egypt.
What Paul is saying is,
No one has the right to say you can't be partakers in the Passover or any of the Holy Days just because you are a Gentile or uncircumcised.

But somebody twisted it all and now they say there are no more Holy Days..
We made NEW Holidays...
well God got something to say about those as well..

Isa 1:14 Your new moons and your appointed feasts my soul hateth: they are a trouble unto me; I am weary to bear them.

Notice he doesn't say MY, he says YOURS,

Just saying...
I am neither Jew nor Gentile.
I belong to the Lord.
Amen
Hugs

THE Sabbath was instituted at Creation.....as was Marriage (btw, interesting connection)

The Commandment in Exodus 20:8 is a reminder to remember (ie, not forget) the institution initiated in Eden.
It opens 'Remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy..........'

 

[Enoch111]

jbf has no idea of what the sabbath day means nor what work means in the commandments.

That's correct. I already pointed this out to him, but do you think he learns any lessons?

 

[justbyfaith]

That's correct. I already pointed this out to him, but do you think he learns any lessons?

I learn my lessons from the word of the Lord and will not be swayed by the teachings of man...

Psa 118:8, It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man.
Psa 118:9, It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in princes.

Jhn 16:13, Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

1Jo 2:27, But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

 

[ChristisGod]

That's correct. I already pointed this out to him, but do you think he learns any lessons?

no- is unteachable and refuses any correction.

I cannot tell you how much I have learned form others over the years on forums when I've been challenged and re-examined my position in light of what someone has brought to my attention from a different perspective.

And by definition a teacher is a learner and does not know everything. And said person is our self proclaimed resident " teacher ", " pastor " .

PS- even if I have/had the gift of teaching I would never say that on a forum and try and lord that over anyone. And in my church and small groups leading a group is more of an open discussion going through Q/A and examining Scriptures in light of questions/objections and allowing God to convict someone if something is true or not. It becomes a time of self examination to see if ones beliefs line up with the scriptures. None of us it all and have allot to learn. We will learn new things until we take our last breath.

hope this helps !!!

 

[justbyfaith]

You do not even know me, @Christophany...

I know that I have changed my position quite a few times over the years of frequenting message boards such as these.

So, your accusation against me that I am "unteachable" remains unfounded.

If you want to teach me, teach me with the word of God.

That...I will pay attention to and heed.

But as I said, I am not going to be easily swayed by the teachings of man.

I am too immersed in the word of the Lord from day to day for such a thing as that to occur.

 

[Marymog]

In another thread this was the discussion I though deserved its own thread.

@justbyfaith made some unbiblical claims against Jesus below in response to Watersong.

@WaterSong said

Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath. Mark 2: 27-28 If anyone had a right to "work" on Sabbath day it was he.
In doing this he demonstrated doing the work of God did not violate Sabbath.

@justbyfaith responds below:

That's right, He did not violate the spirit of the sabbath day laws; although He did violate the letter.

That is plain for all to see.

Exo 20:10, But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

Jhn 5:16, And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus, and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the sabbath day.
Jhn 5:17, But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work.
Jhn 5:18, Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.

I consider that verse 18 is the estimation of the apostle under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.

Again, Romans 7:6 is paramount to our understanding here.

As well as Hebrews 7:12 and context.

Jde 1:24, Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,
2Pe 1:10, Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
1Jo 2:10, He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.


And here is my response to justbyfaiths unbiblical claims:

jbf has no idea of what the sabbath day means nor what work means in the commandments. Here are my top 10 reasons why below:

1- you shall not do any work- as in the same work of the other 6 days of the week
2- the Priest's " worked " in the temple on the sabbath
3- that day was a break for man from his work to devote to God
4- doing Gods work on that day is not a violation of the sabbath
5- Jesus healing the man was doing Gods work hence no violation.
6- turn your foot from the Sabbath, from doing your pleasure on My holy day, and call the Sabbath a delight, the holy day of the Lord honorable, and shall honor Him, not doing your own ways, nor finding your own pleasure, nor speaking your own words (Isaiah 58:13)
7- honoring and worshipping God on the sabbath is not a violation but indeed is a command which Jesus was obeying.
8- Jesus healing on the sabbath was fulfilled the Sabbaths design not breaking its command
9- Jesus answers His self righteous critics- "If a man receives circumcision on the Sabbath, so that the law of Moses should not be broken, are you angry with Me because I made a man completely well on the Sabbath? Do not judge according to appearance, but judge righteous judgment" (John 7:23-24).
10- This is how one should look at Scripture with understanding and proper exegesis understanding its context.

BTW- Jesus did not violate the letter of the law- He fulfilled the law perfectly down to the very letter of the law. To say otherwise is to accuse Jesus of sin just like the Pharisees who were religious hypocrites did numerous time to the Son of God. He is Holy and Perfect just like the Father which is why He said My Father is working and so am I working and I only say and do what I hear and see My Father saying and doing.

hope this helps !!!




All comments, thoughts appreciated by forum members. Thanks !

Colossians 2:16

 

[ChristisGod]

Colossians 2:16

And Jesus is the Lord of the Sabbath. It all points to Him in the O.T.

Jesus said the OT was about Himself

Luke 24:25-27
25 And He said to them, "O foolish men and slow of heart to believe in all that the prophets have spoken! 26 " Was it not necessary for the Christ to suffer these things and to enter into His glory?" 27 Then beginning with Moses and with all the prophets, He explained to them the things concerning Himself in all the Scriptures.

John 5:39-40
39 "You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me; 40 and you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life.

Luke 24:44-45
44Now He said to them, "These are My words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all things which are written about Me in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms must be fulfilled." 45 Then He opened their minds to understand the Scriptures,

hope this helps !!!

 

[justbyfaith]

Colossians 2:16

This scripture does indeed show that we are not to let anyone judge us in regard to a sabbath day; which indicates that any judgment of us in regard to a sabbath day is unfounded.

I don't believe that Jesus did away with the law of the sabbath; but I do believe that He did re-define it (Hebrews 7:12).

We are no longer bound by the letter but will be obedient to the spirit of what is written (Romans 7:6).

And, this means that there is no condemnation for us over violating the letter; either for the Lord or for us.

Because we are justified by His blood (whereas He was justified in the Spirit) and therefore there is no condemnation for us who walk not after the flesh but after the Spirit (Romans 8:1).

Our Lord was in fact the Lord of the sabbath and was able to re-define the law of the sabbath according to His new understanding as both God and man.

 

[Ziggy]

Paul was still keeping the Sabbath and the feasts and the Holy Days.
This isn't over yet. We need to still be watching.
Perpetual generations didn't end at the cross.
Jesus said He would return..
and there are signs to let us know what to look for.

But somebody decided we shouldn't keep watch, we should just go to sleep and forget about it.
And do these new ones instead. That have nothing in them but vanity.
Or they get you deleted because they don't agree with what your watching for.
amazing..
Once upon a time if you was caught Judaising, they burn you at the stake.. or put you in an oven.
You think things are different now?
Watch..
Danger signs ahead...
History IS repeating itself.
Only this time, there is neither Jew nor Greek.
They are coming after all of us who have faith in God Almighty.

Keep that armour ready, we're going to need it.
Specially the shield.


Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.
Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness;
And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace;
Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.
And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:
Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;


Gen 15:1 After these things the word of the LORD came unto Abram in a vision, saying, Fear not, Abram: I am thy shield, and thy exceeding great reward.
Jer 46:3 Order ye the buckler and shield, and draw near to battle.
Psa 91:4 He shall cover thee with his feathers, and under his wings shalt thou trust: his truth shall be thy shield and buckler.

 

[justbyfaith]

And Jesus is the Lord of the Sabbath. It all points to Him in the O.T.

Jesus said the OT was about Himself

Luke 24:25-27
25 And He said to them, "O foolish men and slow of heart to believe in all that the prophets have spoken! 26 " Was it not necessary for the Christ to suffer these things and to enter into His glory?" 27 Then beginning with Moses and with all the prophets, He explained to them the things concerning Himself in all the Scriptures.

John 5:39-40
39 "You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me; 40 and you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life.

Luke 24:44-45
44Now He said to them, "These are My words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all things which are written about Me in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms must be fulfilled." 45 Then He opened their minds to understand the Scriptures,

hope this helps !!!

You forgot what it says in Hebrews 10:7.

 

[Enoch111]

Paul was still keeping the Sabbath and the feasts and the Holy Days.

If that were true he would not be telling Christians that they were mere shadows, and that the reality is Christ. Paul was definitely not a hypocrite.

 

[Enoch111]

...according to His new understanding as both God and man.

With God there is no such thing as a "new understanding". So there would be none for the God-Man Christ.

 

[Ziggy]

If that were true he would not be telling Christians that they were mere shadows, and that the reality is Christ. Paul was definitely not a hypocrite.

The mere shadow was Gentiles being judged for keeping the Holy Days.
Which is a fact.
People are judged for keeping the Holy Days instead of the pagan holidays.

Col 2:16
Let no man therefore judge you

in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: