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BloodBought 1953

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I believe the gospel as preached by the Apostles in the scriptures:

Acts of the Apostles 2:22-39
Acts of the Apostles 3:13-26
Acts of the Apostles 4:11-12
Acts of the Apostles 10:36-43
Acts of the Apostles 13:16-41
Acts of the Apostles 17:24-31
John 3:16-21
Romans 1:16
Romans 3:23-26
Romans 4:25
1 Corinthians 15:1-26
Ephesians 1:7-14
Colossians 1:13-20
Galatians 1:4
2 Timothy 1:9-10


A tip of the hat to you,my well- meaning but ignorant friend....you are believing many good verses....you err however, when you think that any good sounding verse is the Gospel .....the Gospel That SAVES .....the Gospel God is going to ASK you about on that Day when you will be standing before Him shaking like a French Soldier ......THAT GOSPEL is very exact and specific.....it’s Pauls Gospel and it’s found in 1cor15:1-4....no place else.
You seem to have a fondness for commandments as do all of the religionists ( as opposed to “ Christians” ) do in here. So....in the spirit of Commandment Keeping that you love, thrive and depend on, here is the grand- Daddy of them all....
In the book of Hebrews God Commands us to REST in the Gospel Of Paul ( “MY” Gospel, Paul proclaims ) or be declared “ Disobedient” and Guilty Of UNBELIEF. Serious stuff .....you BEST get to Resting......pronto!
That myriad of verses that you concocted as your personal “ gospel” is all great stuff .....it just may not be all that relevant come Judgement Day.....Between now and that dreadful day for you, try to concentrate on just that ONE verse.....that way, instead of just having a hodge podge of confusion , you will have The Real Deal......
If we meet in Heaven, you can thank ol’ BB for Turning you on to the Verses that were Relevant to your Salvation.....
 

BloodBought 1953

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I love the "attack" accusations. And I would never say a "Pure Grace Gospel" Christian should be thrown out of Christian sites, or call them "springboards." That's the difference between the "lovers" and the "lawyers."


Think again,Chester.....the “difference” you self - righteously proclaim is between those that understand the allegory Of Isaac and Ishmael and those that do not...
This is Old Testament 101 stuff......do just some Basic research .....I do not have the time nor inclination to discuss “ Milk” stuff....
 

Ferris Bueller

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All of this Pablum as a result of not understanding Hebrews 6 and 10...... I give up on the “ stiff-necked” willfully ignorant in here....the TRUTH about Hebrews is SO EASY to see, a ten year old could “ get” it.....I hope Newbies will Google “ Andrew Farley Heb 6 and 10” and find the proper teaching in regard to these needlessly “ scary” verses.....then you won’t find it necessary to TWIST everything the Bible stands for on order to accommodate one mistaken verse.....God will bless those who strive to “ Rightly Divide”.....
No unbeliever will inherit the kingdom of God. It doesn't matter if you stopped believing or never believed. You are an unbeliever. You will go to the left and into the lake of fire when Jesus returns. None of our once saved always saved arguments, for or against it, will change that. He who has ears......

As I've shown in the Bible, people who sin willfully and deliberately and defiantly are in unbelief in a denial of Jesus Christ. They have no inheritance to look forward to no matter how much they claim with their mouth that they do.
 
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Ferris Bueller

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By you rlogic then we are under the Mosaic Law governing marital and servant relationships.
Only as is applicable to our culture. There are laws in the law of Moses that governed what they did at that time. In those cases, we don't read those laws and then start doing the thing being governed. You govern what you are doing (if you are doing those things) according to how the law says to govern them. And don't forget, various laws can also find their fulfillment in the eyes of God according to the spiritual truth the literal law is pointing to.
 

Ferris Bueller

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1 Cor 15- Jesus died for our sins according to the scriptures. It’s right there in Paul’s opening statement on the gospel that saves.

hope this helps !!!
I knew that before I got saved. But I did not know what that meant. I was under heavy conviction about not going to be with the Lord when I died and so I wanted to be saved but I knew nothing about Christianity. I did not know that Christ dying for me meant Christ died as a substitutionary sacrifice in place of me dying for my sins. I used to wonder, "what does him dying for me mean?"
 
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justbyfaith

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A tip of the hat to you,my well- meaning but ignorant friend....you are believing many good verses....you err however, when you think that any good sounding verse is the Gospel .....the Gospel That SAVES .....the Gospel God is going to ASK you about on that Day when you will be standing before Him shaking like a French Soldier ......THAT GOSPEL is very exact and specific.....it’s Pauls Gospel and it’s found in 1cor15:1-4....no place else.
You seem to have a fondness for commandments as do all of the religionists ( as opposed to “ Christians” ) do in here. So....in the spirit of Commandment Keeping that you love, thrive and depend on, here is the grand- Daddy of them all....
In the book of Hebrews God Commands us to REST in the Gospel Of Paul ( “MY” Gospel, Paul proclaims ) or be declared “ Disobedient” and Guilty Of UNBELIEF. Serious stuff .....you BEST get to Resting......pronto!
That myriad of verses that you concocted as your personal “ gospel” is all great stuff .....it just may not be all that relevant come Judgement Day.....Between now and that dreadful day for you, try to concentrate on just that ONE verse.....that way, instead of just having a hodge podge of confusion , you will have The Real Deal......
If we meet in Heaven, you can thank ol’ BB for Turning you on to the Verses that were Relevant to your Salvation.....

1 Corinthians 15:1-4 was included in the verses that he had set forth...

.I do not have the time nor inclination to discuss “ Milk” stuff....

And yet, you are out to help "newbies"? So, you intend to feed steak to infants? This is your plan?
 

justbyfaith

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@Blood Bought 1953,

Have you made the following your prayer? If you haven't, you should...

Psa 119:133, Order my steps in thy word: and let not any iniquity have dominion over me.

If that is not your prayer and the desire of your heart, then there is something wrong with your heart.

I hate to say it; but it's true.
 
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Michiah-Imla

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the Gospel God is going to ASK you about on that Day when you will be standing before Him shaking like a French Soldier ......THAT GOSPEL is very exact and specific.....it’s Pauls Gospel and it’s found in 1cor15:1-4....no place else

Not so.

No where in the New Testament does it say that 1 Corinthians 15 is the only scripture God is going to ask us about; that’s an invention of man.

And it is astonishing that you have been fooled into believing that the scriptures contain multiple gospels despite the warning in scripture itself that says if anyone preaches any other gospel let him be accused (Galatians 1:8-9). Thus you have placed the Holy Ghost himself under this curse because these so called other gospels that you imagine are in the scripture where inspired by the Holy Spirit.

This is a GRAVE error because, if you really believe there is more than one gospel in scripture, you effectively have placed a curse on the Holy Spirit.

Mark 3:29 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation

You better sober up from whatever cup a false teacher gave you to drink and watch what you’re saying. Playing around with scripture is dangerous.

Revelation 22:18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

Revelation 22:19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
 

BarneyFife

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Think again,Chester.....the “difference” you self - righteously proclaim is between those that understand the allegory Of Isaac and Ishmael and those that do not...
This is Old Testament 101 stuff......do just some Basic research .....I do not have the time nor inclination to discuss “ Milk” stuff....
More of that "love." Good stuff. Can't get enough. The spirit which actuates you is evident.
 

Ferris Bueller

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But we are not under the Mosaic Law. If you love your neighbor based on a desire to keep the Mosaic Law- you accomplish nothing.
I'm not defending keeping the law in the power of the flesh, but how does even that accomplish nothing? Even in the flesh that means you're not guilty of not loving your neighbor. The Spirit was sent so we could keep that commandment. He wasn't sent so we don't have to keep that commandment.

17Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law (of Moses) or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.

It doesn't matter that you know about that law from reading the law of Moses and then seeking to do it because you read it. That is not what defines the works gospel. But that's what the church has been taught. The church thinks he did come to abolish the Law of Moses. And that if you try to keep it you're guilty of trying to save yourself. I'm sorry, but that's a joke. You're only guilty of that if you are expressly trying to earn your salvation by keeping God's commands.

So, we can still read the law and seek to keep it (of the things that remain to be kept by us). The difference is we have the power to do that now. The difference is not that the law went away and we don't have to keep it anymore and now we obey a different law. The fact is, Christ came so that we might uphold the law of Moses, through the new way of faith (Romans 3:31, Romans 7:6). He did not come to bring a new and different law. He came to bring us a new way to 'keep' it. One that sets us free from the bondage of sin that kept us from keeping it.

If you love your neighbor because of Jesus command to the church- you do well.
Sounds like you're thinking of James 2:8. But even James makes it plain right in that verse that he is talking about keeping the very law of Moses.

James 2:8
8If you really keep the royal law found in Scripture, “Love your neighbor as yourself,” a you are doing right.

YOu are doing the same in both! ONe leads nowhere, while the other leads to exalting Jesus and drawing you closer to Him.
Surely, you glorify God when you keep the law of Moses motivated by the power of the Holy Spirit. That has nothing to do with not reading the law and then keeping it. As a believer, you now have the power of the Spirit to do what you read in the law. Reading the law of Moses and then doing it is not what defines the works gospel. As I showed you, James himself references the law of Moses when instructing the church to do what it says. And we know he was not teaching a works gospel.

YOu need to understand that the whole of the Mosaic Law was ended! It longer exists.
If this were true James would not reference the very law of Moses to tell the church what they are to do as believers.
 
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justbyfaith

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@Blood Bought 1953,'

I would encourage you to read Matthew, chapters 5-7 and also make obedience to its tenets, the foundation of your Christianity.

For this is what Jesus said at the end of the Sermon on the Mount (Matthew chapters 5-7):

Mat 7:24, Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
Mat 7:25, And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.
Mat 7:26, And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
Mat 7:27, And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.


And you should consider also what He said immediately before it:

Mat 7:21, Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22, Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23, And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
 
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Ferris Bueller

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The church lives under the law of Christ!
Do you know what that means? What do you suppose is different about the law of Christ than the law of Moses, since we know from scripture that we do not nullify, but uphold the law of Moses? The difference is Christ does need a law about what to do when he sins. Neither do we. Not because the law of Moses was cast down and destroyed. But because Christ and his body (us) don't need laws to instruct us how to atone for sin. In our case that's already been done for us. Those laws are still the law of Moses but those laws just aren't needed anymore for believers. They have been fulfilled, not removed from the law.

What remains to be kept by us are laws summed up in the one law 'love your neighbor as yourself'. That is the law of Christ. The law of Christ is not a new law. It's the law of Moses minus the laws governing payment for sin and various other things that have already been done for us through our faith in Christ.


If anything from the old was RE-established for the church, then it is a command for the church that is found in both. But make no mistake we do nothing to follow the Mosaic Law.
James and Paul both disagree with you.

James 2:8
8If you really keep the royal law found in Scripture, “Love your neighbor as yourself,” a you are doing right. 9But if you show favoritism, you sin and are convicted by the law as lawbreakers.

1 Corinthians 14:34
Women are to be silent in the churches. They are not permitted to speak, but must be in submission, as the law says.

Romans 3:31
31Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Certainly not! Instead, we uphold the law.

Why are they making an appeal to the law if it is as you say that it is gone and done away with and non-existent now? The law as a covenant is what is gone now. Don't confuse the two.

Example. California and Massachusetts both have 65mph speed limits on their highway. When I am in Massachusetts, I drive 65MPH not because California (the Mosaic LAw) says to drive 65 but because Mass. (the law of christ) says to drive 65.
Here's a better analogy. Driving a new electric car doesn't cast down and remove laws requiring you to pass gasoline engine emissions requirements. They remain but you simply don't need them anymore. And so they are set aside for you as obsolete and not needed now, not removed from the law. But owning an electric car does not relieve you of satisfying the lawful requirement for you drive 55 MPH (or whatever the speed limit is) and to stop at stop signs out of concern for the safety of yourself and others. Your electric car didn't relieve you of your obligation to obey those laws.

Our old selves are like cars powered by gasoline that require laws to maintain and correct the output of the dirty emissions they emit. Our new selves are like cars powered by electric (think Holy Spirit) that don't require laws to deal with dirty emissions, not because those cars are allowed to break those laws, but because those dirty emissions have already been taken care of for us and so those laws simply don't apply to us. They have been set aside as unneeded for us, not erased from the law. And so the law governing the output of emissions is marked 'satisfied' for us. God....I mean, the Dept. of Transportation.....looks at our electric car and says, "I see no violation of emission laws here". And so the law of emissions is satisfied, not removed out of the law, and certainly not allowed to be broken by us.

Even though all this is true, we are still required to drive our cars according to the rules governing how to drive your car. Those laws didn't get fulfilled for us by owning an electric car. We have to keep those ourselves. But even then we're doing that in the power and efficiency of our new electric car. And that's how it is in regard to our new 'cars' and the law of Moses. Our new lives in Christ don't remove the law of Moses, it upholds it. ALL of it. It doesn't erase any law, or get replaced by a different law.

If you read this, thank you for taking the time to read it.
 
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Ronald Nolette

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Only as is applicable to our culture. There are laws in the law of Moses that governed what they did at that time. In those cases, we don't read those laws and then start doing the thing being governed. You govern what you are doing (if you are doing those things) according to how the law says to govern them. And don't forget, various laws can also find their fulfillment in the eyes of God according to the spiritual truth the literal law is pointing to.


So you are saying culture determines which laws of god we obey or not? So abortion is okay then and gay marriages are okay then? After all they are both legal in our culture.
 

Ronald Nolette

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Only as is applicable to our culture. There are laws in the law of Moses that governed what they did at that time. In those cases, we don't read those laws and then start doing the thing being governed. You govern what you are doing (if you are doing those things) according to how the law says to govern them. And don't forget, various laws can also find their fulfillment in the eyes of God according to the spiritual truth the literal law is pointing to.


And who gets to decide which ones are which? Who sits on that governing board making those decisions binding to the church or body of Christ?
 
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Ronald Nolette

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Sounds like you're thinking of James 2:8. But even James makes it plain right in that verse that he is talking about keeping the very law of Moses.

But you said culture determinies if all the laws are applicable or not.

Do you know what that means? What do you suppose is different about the law of Christ than the law of Moses, since we know from scripture that we do not nullify, but uphold the law of Moses? The difference is Christ does need a law about what to do when he sins. Neither do we. Not because the law of Moses was cast down and destroyed. But because Christ and his body (us) don't need laws to instruct us how to atone for sin. In our case that's already been done for us. Those laws are still the law of Moses but those laws just aren't needed anymore for believers. They have been fulfilled, not removed from the law.

What remains to be kept by us are laws summed up in the one law 'love your neighbor as yourself'. That is the law of Christ. The law of Christ is not a new law. It's the law of Moses minus the laws governing payment for sin and various other things that have already been done for us through our faith in Christ.

If you uphold the law of moses- then you do keep the festivals and Sabbath and not eat certain foods. Or are they just cultural things done away by who?

I do not think you know what fulfilled means. And you also do not realize the law of Moses is one thing not 613 separate items.

ful·fill
/fo͝olˈfil/
Learn to pronounce

verb
  1. 1.
    bring to completion or reality; achieve or realize (something desired, promised, or predicted).
As Paul said the law was a schoolmaster till faith came. NOw that we are under faith we no longer need a schoolmaster!

Paul also said the laws in stone minister death not life!~ Don't think I want to be under something that kills instead of making me alive.
 
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Ferris Bueller

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But you said culture determinies if all the laws are applicable or not.
The law of Moses doesn't go away and get erased just because you aren't practicing that which the law governs. The law still exists, it just isn't applicable to you if you aren't even doing that which the law has rules about how to do. For example, Leviticus 19:9. Does that law get erased from the law because I do not own a piece of land to sow and harvest according to the rules of how to do that? Of course not. It simply becomes unneeded and inapplicable to me. Can it find it's fulfillment in another way, or in a spiritual way? Sure. And so it is with other laws in the law of Moses.
 

Ronald Nolette

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The law of Moses doesn't go away and get erased just because you aren't practicing that which the law governs. The law still exists, it just isn't applicable to you if you aren't even doing that which the law has rules about how to do. For example, Leviticus 19:9. Does that law get erased from the law because I do not own a piece of land to sow and harvest according to the rules of how to do that? Of course not. It simply becomes unneeded and inapplicable to me. Can it find it's fulfillment in another way, or in a spiritual way? Sure. And so it is with other laws in the law of Moses.

The law was for Israel alone, so if you are a gentile, it never applied to you at any time anyway, unless you wish to convert to Judaism before Jesus died! But Jesus fulfilled the law thus completed it and as the write of Hebrews says is obsolete.

The church is under teh New law of Christ and not the old law of Moses for Israel.
 
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Ferris Bueller

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If you uphold the law of moses- then you do keep the festivals and Sabbath and not eat certain foods. Or are they just cultural things done away by who?
Good question. I do not HAVE to keep the festivals and Sabbaths anymore, because what God gave them to his people to accomplish for them is already done for them through our faith in Christ. For example, when we believed in Christ's work on the cross we entered into the Sabbath Rest required by God. So there's no reason to try to enter into Sabbath rest through the old way of doing that. That's already done for you. You're already in Sabbath Rest! That's like saying you must try to continue to fix the emissions output of a car that already has those requirements satisfied through the new way of electric technology. Your electric car didn't erase those laws from the books. They simply aren't needed by you anymore and are seen and marked as 'satisfied' by the Dept. of Transportation (or whoever governs those laws, lol). I'm literally brought to tears just thinking how gracious God is in fulfilling his spiritual requirements for Sabbath Rest, circumcision, sacrifice for sin, etc. for us, marking them 'fulfilled to God's complete and total satisfaction' setting us free from the obligation to do that ourselves. How Great is our God!
 

justbyfaith

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The law was for Israel alone, so if you are a gentile, it never applied to you at any time anyway,

Gentiles are indeed under the law. Romans 3:19-20 tells us that all the world will be found guilty because of the law (not just the Jewish people). Also, in Galatians 3:23, it should be clear that if you have come to faith, you were once kept under the law; whether you are a Jew or Gentile. And then, in Romans 3:30, the uncircumcision are justified "THROUGH" faith. But in Romans 3:31, we do not make the law void "THROUGH" faith. We establlsh it. Therefore the Gentiles (the uncircumcision) are supposed to establish the law (they are under it).

It is those who have come to be in the church who are no longer under the law (Romans 3:9, 1 Corinthians 10:32; Romans 3:19, Romans 6:14).
 
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