How Do You Define Death?
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CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
I believe Abraham's Bosom still exists. It is the Throne Room in the Book of Revelation...
The Revelation Throne Room is Abraham's Bosom
Abraham's Bosom (or Paradise) was for Old Covenant saints until Christ came. Now His Church goes to heaven when they die, and all who were watching for the Messiah from the Old Covenant are there too.
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
Hope this clears this up for you so you'll believe the Bible does not contradict itself.
1. Old Covenant saints before Christ went to Abraham's Bosom, also called Paradise. And so did the thief on the cross until Jesus resurrected.
2. Abraham's bosom is now empty because New Covenant saint's spirits go to heaven. And Christ will bring them back with Him in the second coming to reunited with their body which will take on immortality and change.
Philippians 1:
21 For to me, to live is Christ, and to die is gain. 22 But if I live on in the flesh, this will mean fruit from my labor; yet what I shall choose I cannot tell. 23 For I am hard-pressed between the two, having a desire to depart and be with Christ, which is far better. 24 Nevertheless to remain in the flesh is more needful for you. 25 And being confident of this, I know that I shall remain and continue with you all for your progress and joy of faith, 26 that your rejoicing for me may be more abundant in Jesus Christ by my coming to you again.
1 Thessalonians 4:
13 But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen b]">[b]asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.
I agree. Flesh too.
This passage from Job is a good Witness...
Job 10:11
"Thou hast clothed me with skin and flesh, and hast fenced me with bones and sinews."
I believe the whole point of the two trees in the Garden of Eden was for Adam and Eve to choose which parents they wished to be birthed from. In other words, the two trees were two Mothers...
- Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil = Mystery Babylon
- Tree of Life = New Jerusalem
2 Corinthians 5:4
"For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life."
God 'clothed' Adam and Eve with an Earthly Tabernacle as per the choice they made. They were subsequently 're-birthed' into this world.
No, not really as that still doesn't tell me if we go to Heaven directly after death or after the second coming. We're sort of getting off topic though.
Yes. That's the 'Cover Story' that the Church parrots. You will not find any Scripture to support it.
The following verse is *not* about Abraham's Bosom being emptied...
Ephesians 4:8
"Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men."
Abraham did not keep prisoners... lol.
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
our spirit goes to heaven as Paul said he would rather die and be with Christ. Christ is in heaven. Our spirits will return with Christ for the resurrection.
WaterSong
Well-Known Member
It always helps I think to read more learned folk than simple Bible study Christians, as we have in these forums, when seeking understanding about a difficult verse. Also remember sister, context is key in gaining the understanding from any teaching in scripture. I.E. the whole chapter. Psalm 115 Psalm 115:1 Commentaries: Not to us, O LORD, not to us, But to Your name give glory Because of Your lovingkindness, because of Your truth.
Psalm 115:17 Commentaries: The dead do not praise the LORD, Nor do any who go down into silence;
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
It only says that when Jesus was resurrected, many saw the Old Testament saints walking around Jerusalem. That is in the gospels.
I assume they went to heaven. Why would Jesus put them back after being resurrected?
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
According to the "rich man and Lazarus" story, Lazarus was in Paradise with water. The rich man wanted a little water from Lazarus, so Abraham's Bosom or Paradise is not a "prison" by any stretch of the imagination.
Yes, we are together on it thus far. Jesus brought to men the possibilities cast aside by their first carnal parents. Jesus effectively gave to each of us the opportunity to do better than that first man Adam had done... to actually take hold of and to partake of the other Tree, the Tree of Life which was blocked when men were put outside of the garden gate. We still could do it wrong, but without Jesus the opportunity for whosoever will to do it right was not there.
WaterSong
Well-Known Member
There are actually three heavens referred to in scripture. What Does the Bible say Heaven is Like?
The third heaven is God's dwelling place. And that is where the souls of the dead return to.
Bible Gateway passage: Ecclesiastes 12 - English Standard Version
Remember also your Creator in the days of your youth, before the evil days come and the years draw near of which you will say, “I have no pleasure in them”; 2 before the sun and the light and the moon and the stars are darkened and the clouds return after the rain, 3 in the day when the keepers of the house tremble, and the strong men are bent, and the grinders cease because they are few, and those who look through the windows are dimmed, 4 and the doors on the street are shut—when the sound of the grinding is low, and one rises up at the sound of a bird, and all the daughters of song are brought low— 5 they are afraid also of what is high, and terrors are in the way; the almond tree blossoms, the grasshopper drags itself along, and desire fails, because man is going to his eternal home, and the mourners go about the streets— 6 before the silver cord is snapped, or the golden bowl is broken, or the pitcher is shattered at the fountain, or the wheel broken at the cistern, 7 and the dust returns to the earth as it was, and the spirit returns to God who gave it. 8 Vanity of vanities, says the Preacher; all is vanity.
Huh?? Aren't we already with Christ after death and that still doesn't answer my question though. :/
According to 1 Cor 15:46, it is both "natural" and "spiritual".
No.
Paul said,
2Co_5:8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.
1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
Bible (God) doesn't teach that. Satan does though, see Genesis 3.
The word "soul" (Gen 2:7) means living being/creature/person.
The Bible says:
Psa_22:29 All they that be fat upon earth shall eat and worship: all they that go down to the dust shall bow before him: and none can keep alive his own soul.
Psa_30:3 O LORD, thou hast brought up my soul from the grave: thou hast kept me alive, that I should not go down to the pit.
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