So what's so new about the new Covenant, and is it better, really?

[justbyfaith]

It should be obvious, @Tong2020, that in Hebrews 8:8-10 specifically, the Old Testament law is written on the hearts and in the minds of those who are alive under the New Covenant.

Maybe address that passage.

Other passages that address this issue are Hebrews 10:16, Romans 8:7, Romans 8:4, 1 John 5:3, 2 John 1:6, Romans 13:8-10; Romans 5:5.

Romans 8:7 applies to Gentiles as well as Jews and is in conjunction with Hebrews 8:8-10. So does Romans 8:4.

If you want to make a distinction between the law of Moses and the law of Christ, the law of Christ is more burdensome and the only reason why His yoke is easy and His burden is light is because we have the Holy Spirit. The law of Moses is included in the law of Christ (Matthew 5:17-20) and the law of Christ (Matthew 5-7) brings the law of Moses down to the nitty gritty in addressing heart issues where the law of Moses only addresses what is external.

 

[justbyfaith]

Hi JBF,

There are many denominations, such as Calvary Chapel, that believe communion is symbolic. In the Bread of Life discourse he TOLD us we must eat his body and then at the Last Supper he showed us HOW to eat his body. Very simple instructions!! He told us what to do to have life in us and then he showed us how to do it!! What a great teacher!

Does your denomination teach that it would be cannibalism if communion is treated as His body?

Mary

PS....Do you belong to the denomination that Chuck Smith started? Or is it another Calvary Chapel you belong to?

Yes, the one by Chuck Smith.

I don't know anything about cannibalism being the argument.

I think that the argument is more along the lines of being that we are saved through faith in Jesus Christ Himself and not by partaking in a sacrament.

The problem with the doctrine of trans-substantiation is that it makes the person dependent on a denomination that will pray to turn the bread into the body of Christ; and through that doctrine all other denominations that believe that communion is symbolic would not be procuring salvation for its members; even though it may preach faith in Jesus as the way to salvation.

Such a thing makes communion central rather than faith in Jesus Christ.

 

[Philip James]

Such a thing makes communion central rather than faith in Jesus Christ.

Hello jbf,

Can one claim faith in Christ while ignoring Him, present on the altar?

I do not understand how you can suggest that communion with Christ, and through Him with each other is not central to our faith in Him..

The cup of blessing that we bless, is it not a participation in the blood of Christ? The bread that we break, is it not a participation in the body of Christ?

Because the loaf of bread is one, we, though many, are one body, for we all partake of the one loaf.

Peace be with you!

 

[Enoch111]

Can one claim faith in Christ while ignoring Him, present on the altar?

The only altar on which Christ -- the Lamb of God -- was sacrificed was the altar of Mount Calvary and the cross on which He was crucified. Since that was ONE SACRIFICE FOR SINS FOREVER all other altars are a mockery of the one true altar.

 

[Marymog]

Yes, the one by Chuck Smith.

I don't know anything about cannibalism being the argument.

I think that the argument is more along the lines of being that we are saved through faith in Jesus Christ Himself and not by partaking in a sacrament.

The problem with the doctrine of trans-substantiation is that it makes the person dependent on a denomination that will pray to turn the bread into the body of Christ; and through that doctrine all other denominations that believe that communion is symbolic would not be procuring salvation for its members; even though it may preach faith in Jesus as the way to salvation.

Such a thing makes communion central rather than faith in Jesus Christ.

Thanks JBF,

Thank you for your articulate and sincere response. I think I better understand your stance now.

Would you believe in trans-substantiation if scripture said any Christian could "turn the bread into the body of Christ"?

 

[Cooper]

Don't you realize 'love your neighbor as yourself' is 'Old Testament stuff', as you put it? Leviticus 19:18.

You don't have to keep the laws that Christ fulfilled. So if there's any 'Old Testament stuff' you don't have to get into it's those. But 'love your neighbor as yourself' and all the laws that are kept by doing that are exactly what we Christians are to be getting into.

Romans 3:31
31Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Certainly not! Instead, we uphold the law.​

You aren't getting it. The teaching that flows from the Old and into the New Testament, is from the King of kings and Lord of lords. One day, when I have time I will find it out. There are several themes that are consistent all the way through the Bible. Old Testament law is not one of them.
.

 

[justbyfaith]

Would you believe in trans-substantiation if scripture said any Christian could "turn the bread into the body of Christ"?

Does it?

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Best to keep it simple I think.
.

Here’s something simple......” Flirting with Moses is cheating on Jesus “

 

[BloodBought 1953]

You aren't getting it. The teaching that flows from the Old and into the New Testament, is from the King of kings and Lord of lords. One day, when I have time I will find it out. There are several themes that are consistent all the way through the Bible. Old Testament law is not one of them.
.

Here’s THE “ Consistent Theme”......” The Righteous shall live by Faith”

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Therefore, the law applies to all of us (Jew and Gentile alike).

“ By The Works Of The Law, NO Flesh shall be Justified”

 

[BloodBought 1953]

The preacher of the ten commandments may be instrumental in the salvation of a person.

Only if the teacher makes it clear that the Ten Commandments were given to show a person that they can never keep them.....they need a Savior.....they need Grace......that’s the Lesson we take from the Law....

 

[Ferris Bueller]

You aren't getting it. The teaching that flows from the Old and into the New Testament, is from the King of kings and Lord of lords. One day, when I have time I will find it out. There are several themes that are consistent all the way through the Bible. Old Testament law is not one of them.
.

The old testament law is literally taught in the new testament.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

“ By The Works Of The Law, NO Flesh shall be Justified”

Is this the only thing about the law that you know?

 

[Cooper]

Here’s something simple......” Flirting with Moses is cheating on Jesus “

Jesus used Moses to achieve his purpose in the same way he used Judas.
.

 

[Cooper]

Here’s THE “ Consistent Theme”......” The Righteous shall live by Faith”

I will try to find out the various themes that go right through the Bible. I did make a list once, but where it is now I do not know. I may have to go back to the beginning and turn to my Thompson Study Bible. But you are right to say the righteous shall live by faith and not by law.
.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

The preacher of the ten commandments may be instrumental in the salvation of a person.

Only if the teacher makes it clear that the Ten Commandments were given to show a person that they can never keep them.....they need a Savior.....they need Grace......that’s the Lesson we take from the Law....

The law has more than one purpose than just convicting us of our slavery to sin and our need for a savior...

2 Timothy 3:16
15From infancy you have known the Holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. 16All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for instruction, for conviction, for correction, and for training in righteousness, 17so that the man of God may be complete, fully equipped for every good work.
​

You seem to only know about the 'conviction' part.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Jesus used Moses to achieve his purpose in the same way he used Judas.
.

I think he has a higher opinion about Moses than that.....

5Now Moses was faithful as a servant in all God’s house, testifying to what would be spoken later. Hebrews 3:5

46If you had believed Moses, you would believe Me, because he wrote about Me. John 5:46​

 

[Cooper]

Therefore, the law applies to all of us (Jew and Gentile alike).

“ By The Works Of The Law, NO Flesh shall be Justified”

READ IT AGAIN.

It is saying nobody shall be justified by works of the law.
.

 

[Cooper]

The preacher of the ten commandments may be instrumental in the salvation of a person.

Only if the teacher makes it clear that the Ten Commandments were given to show a person that they can never keep them.....they need a Savior.....they need Grace......that’s the Lesson we take from the Law....

Correct. "Jesus Saves." NOT the law.
.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

READ IT AGAIN.

It is saying nobody shall be justified by works of the law.
.

The church thinks this means we don't do any works of the law for any reason. And that we're sinning if we do.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Correct. "Jesus Saves." NOT the law.
.

He saves us to do what then, break the law? The law he said he did not come to destroy? (Matthew 5:17-18)