Abomination of Desolation

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revturmoil

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The answer to you questions have been given many times on this forum, but you would not want to hear them. Apostasy as used in Thes can not be commited by a non-Christian, look up the way the word is used, the context it is used in.

How do you know what I'm willing to hear? Nobody has answered my question. People have expressed their beliefs, but not one has linked those verses to the apostasy! The word is used in association with the anti-christ! How is the church associated with him! Look at the definition of the word! WE have people on this forum (Mr. Vardo) who think that Christian's will set up the abomination! How misled...and I mean how very misled!

I ask anybody on this forum to give me proof that the apostasy has something to do with the church! Most of you disregard the correct definition of the word.

A false prophet or false christ isn't an apostate. Apostasy has nothing to do with heresy or backslidding. You can't remain in the same religion and become an apostate.
 

Alethos

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You just don't understand what a false christ is. The man of sin or his false prophet will not profess Jesus in any way.
Proof of what? That he can copy and paste scripture? Where's the proof than any of those scriptures apply to the apostasy? Get the question??? Or should I ask it again!!!

A quick observation kaoticprofit.

You expect people to answer your questions, but when asked a question yourself...I only see evasion.

How about less frustration on your part, and a little more brotherly cooperation.

This would be more in the spirit of Christ and it may even bare some fruits to the glory of his name.

Alethos
 

revturmoil

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A quick observation kaoticprofit.

You expect people to answer your questions, but when asked a question yourself...I only see evasion.

How about less frustration on your part, and a little more brotherly cooperation.

This would be more in the spirit of Christ and it may even bare some fruits to the glory of his name.

Alethos

There's no reason for a question that doesn't apply to the issue at hand! Why are you obsessed with something that has nothing to do with the inferior kingdom?

I can answer any question you have. And I expect a question from people that pertains to the issue at hand.

If you think a false christ must come in the literal name of Jesus then you too need a bible lesson. And yes I do get frustrated with people who accuse, presume, misquote, and divert the topic. And it's not just you!
 

Alethos

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There's no reason for a question that doesn't apply to the issue at hand! Why are you obsessed with something that has nothing to do with the inferior kingdom?

I can answer any question you have. And I expect a question from people that pertains to the issue at hand.

If you think a false christ must come in the literal name of Jesus then you too need a bible lesson. And yes I do get frustrated with people who accuse, presume, misquote, and divert the topic. And it's not just you!

Ok, so you need to develope patience which is a form of humility.

And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient 2 Tim 2:24

To prove to you I am willing to listen, tonight I am going to do a another study on the Man of Sin; I will try to put it together plainly and I am happy for you to pick it to pieces. :rolleyes:

Take care

Aelthos
 

revturmoil

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Ok, so you need to develope patience which is a form of humility.

And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient 2 Tim 2:24

To prove to you I am willing to listen, tonight I am going to do a another study on the Man of Sin; I will try to put it together plainly and I am happy for you to pick it to pieces. :rolleyes:

Take care

Aelthos

I'm interested to hear it. Maybe you can explain how the church is involved with the man of sin or the apostasy. That's the question to answer if you can. Other than the extent of his empire, who I say is limited and others say is global, most of us would likely be in agreement about him.
 

Alethos

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I'm interested to hear it. Maybe you can explain how the church is involved with the man of sin or the apostasy. That's the question to answer if you can. Other than the extent of his empire, who I say is limited and others say is global, most of us would likely be in agreement about him.


Before we begin I do not believe in the false teaching of Supernatural Satan and some place of eternal torment. And this is no doubt a separate subject in itself. While some believe the Father doesn’t have all power in Heaven, I myself see no scriptural support for such a teaching.

Man of Sin...

2 Thess 2:3 "For that day [of the Lord's coming] will not come, unless the rebellion comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of perdition".

Why use the term “Son of Perdition”

Why would Paul quote Jesus Christ speaking of Judas? John 17:12

Is Paul allowing us to see the characteristics of this sin made flesh? Man of lawlessness? Who was a false apostle, an adversary (satan) against the truth John 6:70 & Luke 22:3.

If you consider 2 Corinth 12:12 which describes the work of a true Apostle they are almost identical with this verse. I really think this is worthy of deep consideration in terms of the workings of this man of sin. Compare
2 Thess 2:9-10 & 2 Cor 12:12

This alone would reinforce the concept of the "man of lawlessness" could be a powerful believer, but who is instead a traitor like Judas.

Also when you look at Matt 24:24 about the false prophets arising and showing great signs and wonders to lead many astray...even the very Elect. There is a sense of one operating under a disguise acting the role of a great Apostle but actually a manifestation of flesh.

This leave me asking a question.

Whoever this man is to be, is it feasible he may not know his position before God until it is too late? Like Judas. And in some ways like the Apostle Paul himself for imagine if he was allowed to continue persecuting the first believers.

While Paul here focuses on a single man John doesn’t appear to do so.

He speaks of an Anti Christ which appears to be group compare 1 John 4:1 1 John 4:3

1 John 2:18-19 2 John 1:7

It’s a movement, whatever it is and it’s no doubt in my mind Christian.

If you need confirmation you can almost enter into Paul’s apprehension in Gal 2:4 speaking about the treacherous work of false brethren who are secretly brought in, who falsely enter the body of Christ to bring them once again into bondage of law. The Judaizers or better termed by Paul the circumcision party Gal 2:2 & Acts 11:2 who caused unrest at the Jerusalem conference.

But I conclude by suggesting the movement is on earth, and its Christian, it must be large enough to sway the whole earth or a good portion of it.
 

revturmoil

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Truth,

You said,
This alone would reinforce the concept of the "man of lawlessness" could be a powerful believer, but who is instead a traitor like Judas.

If you consider 2 Corinth 12:12 which describes the work of a true Apostle
they are almost identical with this verse.



2 Corinthians 12:12  Truly the signs of an apostle were wrought among you in all patience, in signs, and wonders, and mighty deeds.

13  For what is it wherein ye were inferior to other churches, except it be that I myself was not burdensome to you? forgive me this wrong.

2 Thessalonians 2:9  Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

10  And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

Signs and wonders is just about the only terminology that describes miracles whether they're real or counterfeit. Usually there's another word like 'lying' or 'false' that accompanies counterfeit ones. Are you assuming that because the man of sin performs lying signs and wonders with his side kick false prophet, you associate it with the church because signs and wonders follow the church too? These two verses are talking about two different classes of people doing miracles, Apostles and those after the working of Satan.

You are grossly mistaken and very misled to believe these two are the same people who accept the man of sin. Lumping this altogether saying they are identical is poor judgement and a seriuos misunderstanding for it attributes the workings of Satan to God, His church, and His people. I don't like it because it's not true and of all things I don't like giving the devil credit for anything. In 2 Thes 2:9 the word 'lying' is used and those people didn't receive the truth and weren't saved? Just the opposite of 2 Cor. 12 where we have a clue in the word "TRULY"! Signs and wonders were what followed the apostles and meant for unbelievers to see the power of God at work to help start the church and convert people to Christ. Signs and wonders or "miracles" were typically done in the presence of unbelievers. The word 'lying' implies a counterfeit, and that's why 2 Thes 2:9 attributes it to the one whose coming is after the working of Satan. You attribute it to Christian's and the church!

Signs and wonders are meant to validate that something is from God. Lying signs and wonders are it's counterfeit counterpart. It's a real mistake to associate the two because that mistake leaves you right where you are...attributing the evils of the man of sin to Christian's and the church.

You also quote,

Matthew 24:24  For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

The verse say's that elect are not deceived by the signs and wonders so they have nothing to do with it. You need to understand that a false prophet or false christ usually doesn't come from within the church. Most in New Testament times were not in the group of believers.

A false prophet is...

1) one who, acting the part of a divinely inspired prophet, utters falsehoods under the name of divine prophecies

2) a false prophet

bin Laden and Ahmadinnejad are false prophets. Muhammad is a false Christ and false prophet. David Koresh and Jim Jones were false prophets that also claimed Christ. A false Christ doesn't have to come in the literal name of Christ. They come instead of and against Christ. Anybody who claims the same qualities of Christ or offers the same, more, or better than Christ is a false christ. And no one is more delusional than one who believes in a false prophet who promisses 72 virgins in paradise for killing people by flying jet liners into skyscrapers.

It’s a movement, whatever it is and it’s no doubt in my mind Christian.

1 John 2:18  ¶Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

19  They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.



2 John 1:7  ¶For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.



You don't know what the movement is but you're convinced it's Christian!!! What a shame it is to attribute the evils of the man of sin to the Christian's and the church. But hey! That's what you've all been taught.



If you need confirmation you can almost enter into Paul’s apprehension in
Gal 2:4 speaking about the treacherous work of false brethren who are secretly brought in, who falsely enter the body of Christ to bring them once again into bondage of law. The Judaizers or better termed by Paul the circumcision party Gal 2:2 & Acts 11:2 who caused unrest at the Jerusalem conference.

But I conclude by suggesting the movement is on earth, and its Christian, it must be large enough to sway the whole earth or a good portion of it.


I have no idea why you quote Galatians 2 and Acts 11. They are unrelated to the topic and the church of our time.

There's nothing about the system of the anti-christ that will involve Christian's other than those that are caught within it and forced to be subject to it. Christian's won't accept the man of sin only Muslim's will.

Now I have to ask. Did you come up with this stuff yourself, or did it come from one of 'the experts'?
 

Alethos

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1 John 2:18  ¶Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time. 19  They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

Who are the they?
Who are the us?

Warning: Simple questions above.
 

n2thelight

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Matthew 24:15 "When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place (whoso readeth, let him understand:)"

This reverence to Daniel the prophet, Makes the book of Daniel part of the New Testament. This reference is directed to Daniel 9:27.

The "abomination" is when Satan stands in Jerusalem, and proclaims that he is God, and the world believes it. The "desolation" is an incorrect translation into the English, which should read "desolator", and Satan is the desolator that will make the claim that he is God, the true Christ. "Desolation" is a condition, in the Hebrew manuscripts it is written, "On the wings of the desolator," this is not a condition, but a entity, a person. It is through this individual, Satan that the abomination shall come from. It is the desolator [Satan] that shall cause all but the sealed of God, to become desolate, or deceived.

Daniel 9:27; "And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and the determined shall be poured upon the desolate."

The Holy place is the place that the temple sits, and this is the subject for the very first, when the buildings of the temple were observed by the disciples, and the question of what it would be like at His second advent. This is where the desolation [Satan, the Antichrist] shall sit on mount Zion, making his abominations, or statements that he is the Christ.

Matthew Chapter 24

"Prophecy of End Times, Warnings, the Great Tribulation"

This Bible Study is written by Roger Christopherson, and it's transcription/ location is provided by http://www.theseason.org/plough.htm


Matthew 23 ended with Jesus telling of His second coming, and the disciples were convinced that when He went to the cross, and died and rose again, that there would be a second time of His coming. Some of them did not have the clarity to see the difference between the two advents, and that it would be approximately two thousand years. This confusion between the two advents lead us into Matthew 24, when the disciples ask Jesus, "When shall this be?"

Today there is also much confusion, however Jesus made it clear exactly how things would be, and lets go the the teacher, Jesus Christ for the answers.

Matthew 24:1 "And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and His disciples came to Him for to shew Him the buildings of the temple."

These disciples of Christ were from the country, and visiting the big city of Jerusalem were struck by the awesomeness of the size and shape of the Temple. They were fishermen, and of various other occupations, and now they were standing before these magnificent buildings, observing the stones that were within them.

Matthew 24:2 "And Jesus said unto them, "See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down."

As the disciples were standing and commenting on the magnificence of the structures, Jesus told them that at His coming, after the wrath of God's anger was upon the earth, not one stone of these beautiful structures would be left standing one stone upon another.

Many so-called critics show their ignorance when they tell us that this event happened when The Roman General Titus came against Jerusalem in 70 A.D., and destroyed the city. However one of the points of interest of all tours to Jerusalem is the wailing wall. This is wall that stands as the only part of Jerusalem that was left of old Jerusalem, at it's destruction.

Jesus prophecy in verse two tells us that "there shall not one stone upon another," and that condition has not happened yet. All of the stones of the temple will be turned to dust, at that end of this earth age. Zechariah 14 gives us a profile of how Jerusalem will be, and the events that shall transpire at that time. When Satan has taken his seat in Jerusalem, fulfilling the role of the Antichrist.

Matthew 24:3 "And as He sat upon the mount of Olives the disciples came unto Him privately, saying, "Tell us, when shall these things be and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?"

This mount of Olives is less then a mile from the eastern gate of the temple city. Jesus is alone with His disciples, and this matter bothered them as to what would it be like at His second coming, and the end of this earth age.

Jesus went to great detail of what the events and signs would be just before His second advent, that would mark the end of this flesh age.

Matthew 24:4 "And Jesus answered and said unto them, "Take heed that no man deceive you."

This is the number one warning, "Take heed that no man deceive you." Deception will be the foremost thing to guard against in the latter days, that will consummate the end of this age. This means that these events will not happen all at one time, but will take place over a period of time. These warnings or signs that Jesus is about to give us, are the seven seals that are given us in the Book of Revelation.

These are an exact overlay of the seven events, which are the seven seals that we should be watching for today. At the end of Matthew we will include the thirteenth chapter of Mark, which is an overlay of Matthew twenty four. These events will be spelled out before we are finish, but again, Don't let anyone deceive you.

Matthew 24:5 "For many shall come in my name, saying, 'I am Christ;' and shall deceive many."

How can you make sure you are not deceived? You check it out in God's Word, and the Strong's Concordance with Hebrew and Greek numbered dictionaries are a good place to start. Many ministers teach traditions that just don't check out what Christ said. Though their intentions are good, their doctrine will cause you to be deceived. It is your soul that is at stake here. What value do you place upon your soul.

There are many that will put on the robe of the minister, and call themselves preachers. I come in the name of Christ, to represent He that died on the cross to save your soul. There will be many different denominations at that time, and many different forms of fellowships. But again, What was the first warning? Be careful, don't let them deceive you.

Remember that it was the religious community that brought about the crucifixion of Christ. It was the religious community that stole form the people, and rejected Christ with the strongest voice, and even to this day they reject teaching His Word chapter by chapter and verse by verse. There are some that do teach the right way though.

Most churches today though, teach the traditions of their forefathers, and not the Word of God. They make void the Word of God by their doctrines.

Matthew 24:6 "And ye shall hear of wars and rumors of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet."

There has never been a century of so many wars as there has been in the 1900s. Two of the wars included every nation on the earth, while there have been wars of nations, and peoples within nations. Wars of races, and wars of religions. We see that there are conflicts in Africa, and Europe, and as long as these conflicts are going on, you know that the end simply can not come; "but the end is not yet."

We are entering a different time, in this generation. We hear of wars, but for the first time in History, using the modern technology and the use of satellites, communication is as simple as lifting up a telephone to communicate around the world. When Prime minister Rabin of Israel was killed, and was laid to rest, people in every part of the world observed the events. These conflicts will keep going on in every part of the world, and it is a sign that the time of Christ's return is close, but not yet. There are other things and events [signs] that must come to pass also prior to the second advent.

Before the end comes there will be the cry of peace, and the entire world will go into a "New World Order", a new age government that will govern the affairs of all mankind as equals. This age started over forty years ago, and today has every nation in the world in it's charter as members. What is the opposite of wars and rumors of wars? It is peace, and rumors of peace. When the focus changes from war to peace, then that is the time to pay special attention.

When all these conflicts are settled with peace accords, then the one world order will be locked into it's final position. Peace accords have been settled in the far east between Chinas and England: In South Africa between blacks and whites: In Europe between Catholics and Protestants, and individual nations: Between the Communist and non-communist states, and the World at large is ripe for an end to conflict.

When this happens, the end is near. We will then see the political system, as we know it end, and from it will rise from the people of the world a new beast, a religious best, as spoken of in Revelation 13:3.

Matthew 24:7 "For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilence, and earthquakes, in divers places."

Amos wrote of this famine that shall come in the end times. Remember back in verse four when we were warned against people deceiving us? In Amos 8:11; "Behold, the days come, saith the Lord God, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, But of hearing the words of the Lord: The famine is not for bread, my friend, it is for the truths of God's holy Word. God's truths are becoming deluded down where what is taught is an outright lie. The absolutes of the Commandments and being shaded by the scripture lawyers, the same as happened with the scribes and Pharisees.

Major earthquake intervals are now weekly in the world, where in the past there were centuries between these events. These quakes are now even happening where they are completely unexpected.

Matthew 24:8 "All these are the beginning of sorrows."

This word "sorrows" in the Greek is "Ydin", and means birth pangs. The word is used only here and in Mark 8, and marks the beginning of the travail of childbirth. The number in Strong's Dictionary is 5604, and this is important, because it reflects the intervals between the events of the signs of the end times.

This translation loses the message that Christ is telling us; for He is saying that when we see this happening, it is the start of the birth of a new age. In other words, it marks the approach of the birth of the second advent, or coming. The events that mark the end will be growing closer and closer together, and when it reaches a point, the birth will begin.

Do you want to know how close you are to the end? Then look at the events that are going on around you. Listen to the labor pains of this generation. When you learn it sign of the end times, then the news of any media will come alive, for the political beast is already here in the form of the United Nations, and that beast just celebrated its first fifty years.

Matthew 24:9 "Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake."

Revelation 11 tells us of the two witness that will prophecy, and cause much hardship on the peoples of the world. The two of them will preach against Satan, the Antichrist and they will match Satan's deceiving wonders with wonders that God placed in them. In that day, you will either know them as the witness of God, or you will think them to be trouble makers and against God. There will be no straddling of the fence.

Should you be on the side of the two witnesses, you will be hated by all peoples, including family and friends, not because of your deeds, but because you sided with the two witnesses. Those two witnesses represent "my name sake", which is the true Christ.

In the phrase, "No man knoweth the hour nor the time," though no man knows the instant of the time of Christ's coming, Jesus gives you the exact day to start looking for Him. The key to understanding is in Revelation 11:8, 9.

Revelation 11:8; And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified."

The "street", in the Greek, is better translated "great hall", or "stadium". Jerusalem is the great city where Christ was crucified, and spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, of it is the place where Satan, the Antichrist and his angels and the Kenites will rule from.

When the Antichrist slays the two witness, the world will watch for the three days, and it will be the greatest time of celebration this world has ever seen to that point.

Revelation 11:9; "And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves."

Friend, you will have to be brain dead to miss this event. The entire world will watch, as the television cameras are focused on the dead bodies of the two witnesses, and the signal is beamed into every home on earth.

There is no way you can miss this three and a half day period, for at the end of it the two witnesses will stand to their feet, and rise into the heavens, and this earth age is finished. These witnesses will rise exactly as Christ ascended as recorded in Acts 1:9; "And when He had spoken these things, while they beheld, He was taken up; and a cloud received Him out of their sight."

We know the season, also by the establishment of a political beast, a "one world order". When the political beast stops functioning, a religious beast will rise from it. It will rise out of the peoples of the world. That beast is not a person, but a religious order or system that all the peoples of the world will accept and respect. It will appear on the surface to be of God, however, it is Satan's system; a counterfeit of Christ's kingdom. That is why people will be deceived, because they have not studied God's word to know the difference. There are two Christ's coming, and the first is a fake.

The traditions of men have led them to believe that Satan is out to kill everyone, and destroy the world. They think of Satan to be cruel, ugly and and deformed in certain manners. They think that they can see right through his lies, and all the time they have been fed a lie by Satan's own children, the Kenites. As Ezekiel records in Ezekiel 28:13-15, "Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was they covering, the Sardis, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created"

Satan was in the Garden [or the first earth age] and every precious stone or person was there and Satan was over them. There is no written evidence that this was a "legend", but a reality. It happened. Satan, the Nachash or shining one, was there.

Exekiel 28:14; "Thou are the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; Thou hast hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire."

Satan was created to be the anointed cherub [angel] that protected with supernatural powers, overshadowing and protecting the world that then was, called the first earth age. God gave Satan his supernatural powers [I have set thee so], and Satan's sin was his pride, to try to elevate himself higher then God. What Satan actually did in that first earth age is not recorded, and that is expressed in the Hebrew idiom, "hast walked up and down".

Ezekiel 28:15; "Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee."

Satan was perfect when God created him, and the most beautiful of all God's creations. Then he fell, whoever what we are looking at here is that his beauty is not as the traditions of men have him. They are picturing Satan's spiritual flaws, in a physical realm. Satan has intelligence far beyond physical man, born of woman, and that is why we must learn to check everything out in the Word of God. Satan knows that word, and he will use it to deceive you.

The rest of Ezekiel 28 should be studied, for it gives the true nature of Satan. This is why you are not to out think Satan when you are delivered up before them, for only the Holy Spirit of God can know what should be said, in that moment.

In Mark 13:11; tells us that we will be delivered up in those days. "But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Spirit."

The Holy Spirit will speak through you in that tongue that was spoken on Pentecost Day, where every person of every language heard and understood in their native language and dialect, without the use of an interpreter. It will not be you that speaks then, but the Holy Spirit of God.

This is why you will be hated, it is for that message that will talking against the Antichrist, whom they believe to be the true Christ. Satan came with the powers and wonders of miracles, and they simply do not know the difference between the two Christ's nor the two events. They believe this lie about the image of Satan coming to destroy mankind and the world, and this sets up flesh man to accept Satan as the true Christ.

Satan comes with his policy of peace and prosperity, of caring for the environment, and animal rights, he cares for you, because he is placing your soul under his care. Daniel 8 makes it very clear that the Antichrist will come to earth peacefully, and he wants you successful.

Matthew 24:10 "And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another."

This hatred comes because of their beliefs and their religion. When you tell your relatives that this Antichrist is a fake, you will be branded as a blasphemer, right from the start. They will look to Satan as their savior, because their ministers have taught them to do so. They are ignorant of the truth, they did not study to know the truth, but accepted the false doctrines of demons as the truth.

The church world today is looking for someone to fly them away, and Satan will give them the flight of their life. Can you see it, my friend? it's coming and in your generation, this life time. It is time to wake up.

Mark 13:12; "Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son;..." Satan is death, and he is the destroyer. In ignorance brother will deliver up his brother to Satan, because he simply doesn't know the difference. If they will betray one another today for religious denominations, think of what they will do for a supernatural power that promises them what ever they want. Satan, the Antichrist comes with supernatural powers, and the keys, or authority to use it to deceive the people of the earth [Revelation 9:1-4].

Matthew 24:11 "And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many."

Think of all those ministers that preach the rapture theory. Every last one of them are false prophets. They give you hope where there is no hope, and they make you vulnerable to going after the first Christ to arrive on earth, and that one is Satan, the Antichrist. Jesus is warning His disciples, though He is addressing the twelve, the message is directed to those that are living in the time of the end, to our generation. Almost all of the so-called prophets of our day are looking for this antichrist to appear as one of the men on the earth today, and they have no idea in the world that it will be Satan in all his supernatural being and powers.

Jesus said there would be false prophets, they shall rise and deceive many. Friend you shall be here and face Satan, whether you like it or not. Jesus is making this a fact. You will either face and know exactly who he is, the fake and false Christ; or you will think him to be Jesus Christ, the Son of the Living God. This knowledge is what Jesus calls, "the seal of God in their foreheads". Your brain is in your forehead and that is what you use to think and store knowledge.

Revelation 9:4; "And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads." My friend, did you get it? You will know the difference between the two Christ, or God will turn you over to Satan to be deceived. It is your soul at stake here.

Matthew 24:12 "And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold."

The "iniquity", is "lawlessness" of turning away from God's Word. It will multiply because of the apostasy, or falling away from God's Holy Word. The love of family members and friends shall "wax cold" or turn against those within their own family, or friendship because of their refusal to accept Satan, the Antichrist as the true Christ.

Matthew 24:13 "But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved."

God's elect are destined to endure to the end, and not be deceived by the Antichrist. They know the Word of God, and that the false Christ will come first.

Matthew 24:14 "And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come."

In other words, when one of us, the elect, is delivered up to give account of why he or she will not submit to Satan the Antichrist, without premeditating, the message will be broadcasted throughout the world. Some of you have know that you have had a destiny and a purpose since you were a child. That there was more to God's Word than you have been taught, in the simplicity in which Christ Himself brings it forth. Jesus Christ is telling you that you will be here, with your gospel armor on and in place, to stand against the fiery darts of Satan. You have nothing to worry about, for as it is written in Luke 21:17-19:

Luke 21:17-19; "And ye shall be hated of all men for My name's sake." [17] "But there shall not an hair of your head perish." [18] "In your patience possess ye your souls." [19]

This is why we must see to it that the hatred is for the right cause, and that cause is for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, the true Christ, that will come later at the seventh trumpet, and not the fifth.

Recently the O.J.Simpson trial was broadcasted to every nation on earth, and even in the small villages in Africa saw the results by television. This is an example of what will take place shortly, at the coming of the Antichrist, when blaspheming against him will be considered far worse then murder.

Matthew 24:15 "When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place (whoso readeth, let him understand:)"

This reverence to Daniel the prophet, Makes the book of Daniel part of the New Testament. This reference is directed to Daniel 9:27.

The "abomination" is when Satan stands in Jerusalem, and proclaims that he is God, and the world believes it. The "desolation" is an incorrect translation into the English, which should read "desolator", and Satan is the desolator that will make the claim that he is God, the true Christ. "Desolation" is a condition, in the Hebrew manuscripts it is written, "On the wings of the desolator," this is not a condition, but a entity, a person. It is through this individual, Satan that the abomination shall come from. It is the desolator [Satan] that shall cause all but the sealed of God, to become desolate, or deceived.

Daniel 9:27; "And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and the determined shall be poured upon the desolate."

The Holy place is the place that the temple sits, and this is the subject for the very first, when the buildings of the temple were observed by the disciples, and the question of what it would be like at His second advent. This is where the desolation [Satan, the Antichrist] shall sit on mount Zion, making his abominations, or statements that he is the Christ.

The world will be deceived when Satan claims himself to be Christ, for he does have supernatural powers, and he will use them to to draw the peoples of the world to come to peace. He will say, I am Jesus whom ye have been waiting for, and I have come to bring peace to the world, and the world will be brought to peace and prosperity by Satan, the Antichrist.


http://www.theseason.org/matthew/matthew24.htm
 

n2thelight

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Matthew 24:15 "When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place (whoso readeth, let him understand:)"

This reverence to Daniel the prophet, Makes the book of Daniel part of the New Testament. This reference is directed to Daniel 9:27.

The "abomination" is when Satan stands in Jerusalem, and proclaims that he is God, and the world believes it. The "desolation" is an incorrect translation into the English, which should read "desolator", and Satan is the desolator that will make the claim that he is God, the true Christ. "Desolation" is a condition, in the Hebrew manuscripts it is written, "On the wings of the desolator," this is not a condition, but a entity, a person. It is through this individual, Satan that the abomination shall come from. It is the desolator [Satan] that shall cause all but the sealed of God, to become desolate, or deceived.

Daniel 9:27; "And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and the determined shall be poured upon the desolate."

The Holy place is the place that the temple sits, and this is the subject for the very first, when the buildings of the temple were observed by the disciples, and the question of what it would be like at His second advent. This is where the desolation [Satan, the Antichrist] shall sit on mount Zion, making his abominations, or statements that he is the Christ.


http://www.theseason.org/matthew/matthew24.htm

Sorry bout the double post,this one is what was meant to be conveyed
 

revturmoil

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1 John 2:18  ¶Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time. 19  They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

Who are the they?
Who are the us?

Warning: Simple questions above.

You're the one who need to answer that question for yourself. Read the verse and understand the setting. Then you'll get a better understanding of it. And you think this verse supports your already perverted view of 2 Cor. 12:12 and 2 Thes. 2:9-10.
 

Alethos

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You're the one who need to answer that question for yourself. Read the verse and understand the setting. Then you'll get a better understanding of it. And you think this verse supports your already perverted view of 2 Cor. 12:12 and 2 Thes. 2:9-10.

kaoticprofit

I did not say I was supporting 2 Cor. 12:12 and 2 Thes. 2:9-10.

The closest I have heard you speak critically of the Church is to say "they haven’t always got it right" to that effect.

The point I am making is a simple one.

"They went from us" is reference to Judas leaving the upper room John 13:30. And others who choice these slippery paths.

An interesting point BTW is the the righteous are NOT held guilty when associating with those who hold false doctrine. But their later end will reveal him to be the "son of perdition".

Falsehood is both in and outside of the body of Christ.

Judas inside and the Pharisees outside?

I am yet to hear a balance view from yourself.

Alethos

 

michaelvpardo

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The verse say's that elect are not deceived by the signs and wonders so they have nothing to do with it. You need to understand that a false prophet or false christ usually doesn't come from within the church. Most in New Testament times were not in the group of believers.

This is an interesting idea, but not particularly accurate. There have seen a number of false prophets in the modern church who started out as pastors or other clergy members. We have cults such as the Jehovah's witnesses and the Church of Mormon that were effectively created by false prophets that arose from biblical denominations. I don't believe that these men were born again of the Spirit of God, but they arose from the visible church. I've only named two, but there are hundreds of "churches" that have sprung up around our country (and the world) born out of unique interpretations of scripture that typically deny the divinity of Jesus Christ. Heresy is usually the source of cults and heresy typically arises from within the church, the epistles speak of heresies that were misleading people from the church even while the Apostles were still alive and active in ministry. In the book of the Revelation of Jesus Christ, we even find Jesus rebuking churches for heretical false doctrine. See Revelation 2:14-21. In these passages Jesus distinguishes between true believers and the false ones that hold these doctrines, yet he warns the believers to deal with the doctrines and why is this? The scripture tells us that to show hospitality (welcome) to those who teach false and evil doctrines that deny the Christ, makes a believer share in their guilt.
7 For many deceivers have gone out into the world who do not confess Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. 8 Look to yourselves, that we do not lose those things we worked for, but that we may receive a full reward. 9 Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. 10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine, do not receive him into your house nor greet him; 11 for he who greets him shares in his evil deeds. NKJ 2 John 1:7-11

Does the last passage seem somewhat reminiscent of:

"Nor shall you bring an abomination into your house, lest you be doomed to destruction like it; but you shall utterly detest it and utterly abhor it, for it is an accursed thing. NKJ Deuteronomy 7:26

You also find the Apostle Peter addressing "those who have obtained like precious faith" in his second epistle, tell the same group in the second chapter:

1 But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. 2 And many will follow their destructive ways, because of whom the way of truth will be blasphemed. NKJ 2 Peter 2:1-2

The expression of the kingdom of heaven upon the earth, through the church, attracts those who would take advantage of it for profit or personal power, and we can generally only distinguish them by their evil doctrine or evil actions. Unfortunately, believers who are week in the faith have always been tempted to follow the example of such "leaders" whose appeal is to the flesh rather than to the Spirit. Our carnal nature is powerful, it is our first nature, the one that we were born with, grew up with and learned to live with all of our days until we came to know Jesus through the gospel. I only know one perfect man, and that man is also God, even Jesus Christ Himself. Don't be deceived, our adversary the devil, is clever, "more cunning than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made." If he can appear as an angel of light, then he can certainly appear as a pastor or minister of the visible church. The threat to those who are genuine in their faith, is to compromise our faith, accepting and welcoming those things which God disapproves. The adversary doesn't come to you and say "throw out your Bible and listen to me," he attacks the character of God, by suggesting that God is a biggot and a homophobe or entirely misrepresented in scripture, or that the Apostle Paul "hated women" and was biased by his culture. He tells you that the Jesus of history was a charismatic rebel leader (who might have visited tibet and studied with monks) and has little to do with the Jesus of scripture, etc.
You seem to think that by pointing these things out we're attacking the church, but we are the church. We need to stand in the truth of scripture and be strengthened by it. I don't want to deny my Lord, but the world wants to conform me to its image rather than to be conformed to the image of Christ, and to allow that to happen is to deny christ by your actions. Whoever makes himself a friend to the world makes himself an enemy of God. The warnings of scripture exist for the benefit of the church, the world could care less. If God warns us about falling away, He's warning us about falling away. The world can't fall away, because it is already fallen. Do you tell a dead person not to die?

By the way, Mohammed did believe in a person named Jesus and called Him a prophet sent to the Jews. In the Koran, Mohammed flatly denies that God would ever have a son and denies the divinity of Jesus Christ. Islam has been around for about 1300 years, and while it may be the fastest growing religion in the world today, this is probably more likely due to the vacuum created by a post Christian western culture that places no value upon anything but personal pleasure and money.
I'm not sure that conversions at the point of a sword are any more valid than conversion due to an emperor (Constantine) declaring Christianity to be the religion of Rome. People raised in the context of a formal religion may believe in God, but typically believe in a god of their own imagination or one created for them by religious leaders anxious to control them through fear of punishment and reward. Religion is not what saves, relationship is, and specifically to God through faith in His Son. This is why Muslims (and modern cult members) who hear the gospel can be saved. Radical Islam is more an expression of hatred of Jews, Christians, the West, Americans, etc., veiled with a thin veneer of religion. The leaders of radical Islam rarely martyr themselves. They're more inclined to recruit gullible, fearful, and somewhat ignorant people to become martyrs on their behalf.
While radical Islam is a genuine threat to the lives and safety of people, we should probably consider Islam as a whole to be a rich field ready for harvest. When people have a fear of God, because they believe in Him, but have not known Him, they can be much more receptive to the Truth than those who are indifferent or simply hate everything godly. I've heard stories from the Bible league that suggest that God has been reaching out to Muslims in the middle east directly through dreams and visions, and pointing them to the Bible to receive knowledge of His Son. There's a reason that the Muslim clergy discourage Muslims from reading scripture; the scripture has power to create faith in the Son of God. Personally, I'm not anxious to go to the middle east to try to reach muslims with the gospel. I have no great desire to be a christian martyr, yet God has called men (and women) at times to be martyrs, and the strength of their faith in the face of death has often made a much stronger impression on their captors than threats of retribution, revenge, crusades, inquisitions, etc.
For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places. NKJ Ephesians 6:12

 

revturmoil

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The point I'm trying to make in this reply is that heretical Christian doctrine isn't the typical source of most false prophets and teachers because many of them don't deny the Christ. In Paul's teachings, an undamnable heretic gets a second chance. In Philippian's Paul is joyful that Christ is being preached even though He is preached in contention, in error, or with wrong motives. People who deny Christ are anti-Christ but people who don't deny Christ but teach undamnable heresy are given a second chance. I'm also defending the gospel from those who claim the anti-christ would come from within the church, and those who attribute the evils of the man of sin to the church. I find that teaching repulsive.

That misunderstanding, even among the experts, has been instrumental in misleading people by not differenciating between the two and therefore attribute the emergence of the anti-christ from within the church.

False teachers or prophets that crept into the church and denied Christ were easily identifyable and excommunicated. Be aware that for one to be 'antichrist' they would have to deny the father and the Son and deny that Jesus is the Christ. They come either against Christ or instead of Christ. (Like Muhammad and all Muslim clerics) Most teachers in the church who may have doctrinal differences, improper motives, undamnable heresies, or who may not be teaching Christ in His fullness, are not anti-christ! In 1 John 2:19 the people that left the church were in denial that Jesus was the Christ. Their falseness was easily exposed because John said,

1 John 2:22  Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

23  Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: (but) he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.

At the time John wrote this there were also several false prophets and teachers outside of the church who had a following of their own and some claimed that they were the Messiah. I think they ware called druids.

2 Peter 2:1  ¶But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

2  And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of. That's what you guys are doing. You call good evil and evil good.

There are damnable heresies and un-damnable heresies. An undamnable heretic is someone within the church that doesn't deny Christ. A damnable heretic is one who has chosen a course of thought and action of their own opinion or tenet varying from the true exposition of the Christian faith. They are a body of men separating themselves from others and following their own tenets (a sect or party) (Thayer's) http://www.bluelette...ongs=G139&t=KJV

In other words. False teachers and prophets who teach 'damnable heresies' are typically separated from the church and have their own sects and cults. They aren't within the church.

The teachings of 'heresy' is what caused the division of many churches.

People who teach that all these false teachers come from within the church are those who expose them giving others the perception that they hold themselves to a higher standard than others. It's the, "I'm better than you are and my doctrine is correct and yours is wrong syndrone."

I don't deny that some heretics are in the church, but the heresies that you and they hold onto aren't damnable. But the issue in question is in the last days, will these anti-christ false teachers and prophets emerge from within the church or outside of it? I call it heresy to teach that the evil ones will emerge from within the church. And that actually denies the power of the Holy Spirit.

False christ and false prophets typically come from a false religions. NOT THE CHURCH! Every Imam or Muslim cleric is an imposter, a false christ, a false prophet, and from a false religion. The same is true of all other false religions. If a damnable heretic starts out within the church and denies Christ they usually leave it. I would call many of the television evangelist like Mike Murdock false teachers. Not that all of his teachings are wrong but they are done in false pretense and improper motives. Murdock doesn't deny Christ that I know of.

It was only expected that some false teachers and prophets would arise within the church. The Jews knew all about false prophets and many of the verses dealing with it were directed toward the Pharisees. False prophets were more interseted in gaining popularity than teaching the truth. They told people what they wanted to hear. A man that was considered a heretic in the church was also given a second chance. Most heretics of the New Testament who denied Christ in one way or another and believed what they wanted to believe weren't in the church. In the OT if a prophet even asked for money or lived large he was considered a false prophet.

By their fruits we would know them. The heretics in 2 Peter denied Christ had bought them. That denial was the fruit that exposes them as a false prophet. We have to keep all of this in the context of Titus 3:10 and Philippians 1. The cause of these false teachings was evil ambition. (2 Peter 2:2-3). The word ambition means to 'have more' like in the case of someone like Mike Murdock. It's ok to have more of some things, but the word ambition implies covetousness i.e. the desire to posses something which a person has no right to desire or take. So it can mean to put money or goods ahead of Christ. It only brought upon them immorality and destruction.(damnable heresy)

The following verse speaks of people who "departed from the faith!" Not people within the church!

1 Timothy 4:1  ¶Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

2  Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

The number of Christian's that have accepted Islam since Sept 11 is astounding. You would think that it would be the other way around. A heretical 'christian doctrine' isn't a doctrine of devils. Islamic teachings and doctrine fit this scripture.

Why would anybody think that the anti-christ would come from within the church when Christ said,

Matthew 24:24  For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.25  Behold, I have told you before.

26  Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.21  I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth.22  Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.23  Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: (but) he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.

People with damnable heresies didn't remain in the church.


1 John 2:19  They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

The idea that Mr. Pardo promotes about self-empowerment is just absurd to me. To aasociate it with the anti-christ or his system is even more ludicrous. To say that the man of sin will come from within the church, or that the church will accept the man of sin is blasphemy. That heresy disregards the power of the Holy Spirit in the life of the believer and the chruch. It gives Satan credit for overcoming the church by it producing the man of sin, and calls that which is good 'evil'. It attributes to the church that which can only come from the evils of Satan and the man of sin. Why would any anyone seeking Christ or searching for truth become a Christian when people in the church teach that the anti-christ would come from within itself? I call that blasphemy and slander and it has only hurt the cause of Jesus Christ in our day.

That teaching as well as things like pretribulationism causes people to avoid Christianity like the plague and consider it no better than any other religion.

I attribute the acceptance of the kinds blasphemous false teachings that many of you uphold to the many high proflie Christian teachers who attribute the church to the harlot.

This is why I question everything.

 

Amazing Grace

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The point I'm trying to make in this reply is that heretical Christian doctrine isn't the typical source of most false prophets and teachers because many of them don't deny the Christ. In Paul's teachings, an undamnable heretic gets a second chance. In Philippian's Paul is joyful that Christ is being preached even though He is preached in contention, in error, or with wrong motives. People who deny Christ are anti-Christ but people who don't deny Christ but teach undamnable heresy are given a second chance. I'm also defending the gospel from those who claim the anti-christ would come from within the church, and those who attribute the evils of the man of sin to the church. I find that teaching repulsive.

This misunderstanding, even among the experts has been instrumental in misleading people by not differenciating between the two and therefore attribute the emergence of the anti-christ from within the church.

False teachers or prophets that crept into the church and denied Christ were easily identifyable and excommunicated. Be aware that for one to be 'antichrist' they would have to deny the father and the Son and deny that Jesus is the Christ. They come either against Christ or instead of Christ. (Like Muhammad and all Muslim clerics) Most teachers in the church who may have doctrinal differences, improper motives, undamnable heresies, or who may not be teaching Christ in His fullness, are not anti-christ! In 1 John 2:19 the people that left the church were in denial that Jesus was the Christ. Their falseness was easily exposed because John said,

1 John 2:22  Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

23  Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: (but) he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.

At the time John wrote this there were also several false prophets and teachers outside of the church who had a following of their own and some claimed that they were the Messiah. I think they ware called druids.

2 Peter 2:1  ¶But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

2  And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of. That's what you guys are doing. You call good evil and evil good.

There are damnable heresies and un-damnable heresies. An undamnable heretic is someone within the church that doesn't deny Christ A damnable heretic is one who has chosen a course of thought and action of their own opinion or tenet varying from the true exposition of the Christian faith. They are a body of men separating themselves from others and following their own tenets (a sect or party) (Thayer's) http://www.bluelette...ongs=G139&t=KJV

In other words. False teachers and prophets who teach 'damnable heresies' are typically separated from the church and have their own sects and cults. They aren't within the church.

The teachings of 'heresy' is what caused the division of many churches.

People who teach that all these false teachers come from within the church are those who THINK that by EXPOSING them it gives people the perception that they hold themselves to a higher standard than others. It's the I'm better than you are and my doctrine is correct and yours is wrong syndrone.

I don't deny that some of them are in the church, but the heresies that you and they hold onto aren't damnable. But the issue in question is in the last days, will these anti-christ false teachers and prophets emerge from within the church or outside of it? It's heresy to teach that the evil ones will emerge from within it and that actually denies the power of the Holy Spirit.

False christ and false prophets typically come from a false religions. NOT THE CHURCH! Every Imam or Muslim cleric is an imposter, a false christ, a false prophet, and from a false religion. The same is true of all other false religions. If they start out within the church they usually leave it. I would call many of the television evangelist like Mike Murdock false teachers. Not that all of their teachings are wrong but they are done with false pretense and improper motives. Murdock doesn't deny Christ that I know of.

It was only expected that some false teachers and prophets would arise within the church. The Jews knew all about false prophets and many of the verses dealing with it were directed toward the Pharisees. False prophets were more interseted in gaining popularity than teaching the truth. They told people what they wanted to hear. A man that was considered a heretic in the church was also given a second chance. Most heretics of the New Testament who denied Christ in one way or another and believed what they wanted to believe weren't in the church. In the OT if a prophet even asked for money or lived large he was considered a false prophet.

By their fruits we would know them. The heretics in 2 Peter denied Christ had bought them. That denial was the fruit that exposes them as a false prophet. We have to keep all of this in the context of Titus:310 and Philippians 1. The cause of these flase teachings was evil ambition. (2 Peter 2:2-3). The word ambition means to 'have more' like in the case of someone like Mike Murdock. It's ok to have more of some things, but the word ambition implies covetousness i.e. the desire to posses something which a person has no right to desire or take. So it can mean to put money or goods ahead of Christ. It only brought upon them immorality and destruction.(damnable heresy)

The following verse speaks of people who "departed from the faith!" Not people within the church!

1 Timothy 4:1  ¶Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

2  Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

The number of Christian's that have accepted Islam since Sept 11 is astounding. You would think that it would be the other way around. A heretical 'christian doctrine' isn't a doctrine of devils. Islamic teachings and doctrine fit this scripture.

Why would anybody think that the anti-christ would come from within the church when Christ said,

Matthew 24:24  For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.25  Behold, I have told you before.

26  Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.21  I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth.22  Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.23  Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: (but) he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.

People with damnable heresies didn't remain in the church.


1 John 2:19  They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

The idea that Mr. Pardo promotes about self-empowerment is just absurd to me. To aasociate it with the anti-christ or his system is even more ludicrous. To say that the man of sin will come from within the church, or that the church will accept the man of sin is blasphemy. That heresy disregards the power of the Holy Spirit in the life of the believer and the chruch. It gives Satan credit for overcoming the church by it producing the man of sin, and calls that which is good 'evil'. It attributes to the church that which can only come from the evils of Satan and the man of sin. Why would any anyone seeking Christ or searching for truth become a Christian when people in the church teach that the anti-christ would come from within itself? I call that blasphemy and slander and it has only hurt the cause of Jesus Christ in our day.

That teaching as well as things like pretribulationism causes people to avoid Christianity like the plague and consider it no better than any other religion.

I attribute the acceptance of the kinds blasphemous false teachings that many of you uphold to the many high proflie Christian teachers who attribute the church to the harlot.

This is why I question everything.

Food for thought, Thank you.
 

Alethos

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Mar 8, 2011
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How do you explain the antichrist not believing Jesus Christ came in the flesh?

[sup]2[/sup]Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

[sup]3[/sup]And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. 1 John 4:2-4

What does the flesh & Jesus have to do with the Antichrist?
So a spirit (mind) is out there which will confess that Jesus came BUT not in the flesh????
So they confess Jesus BUT a different Jesus????
This is the mind of the Antichrist? What mind or spirit?
And when John wrote this Epistle it was already in the world? Only 30 or so years after the Masters ascension.



Alethos
 

revturmoil

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Feb 26, 2011
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How do you explain the antichrist not believing Jesus Christ came in the flesh?

[sup]2[/sup]Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

[sup]3[/sup]And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. 1 John 4:2-4

What does the flesh & Jesus have to do with the Antichrist?
So a spirit (mind) is out there which will confess that Jesus came BUT not in the flesh????
So they confess Jesus BUT a different Jesus????
This is the mind of the Antichrist? What mind or spirit?
And when John wrote this Epistle it was already in the world? Only 30 or so years after the Masters ascension.

Alethos

As is often the case. I have no idea what you're getting at or where you're coming from. You come up with these things because of your preconceived ideas. I don't believe as you do so your questions are 'moot'.'
 

Alethos

New Member
Mar 8, 2011
685
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0
Melbourne Australia
As is often the case. I have no idea what you're getting at or where you're coming from. You come up with these things because of your preconceived ideas. I don't believe as you do so your questions are 'moot'.'

For the first time you have stunned me.

Usually you have an answer, an interpration, something....only "moot"

And all those questions were based on Scripture. 1 John 4:2-4

What does the flesh & Jesus have to do with the Antichrist?
So a spirit (mind) is out there which will confess that Jesus came BUT not in the flesh????
So they confess Jesus BUT a different Jesus????
This is the mind of the Antichrist? What mind or spirit?
John wrote this Epistle and it (AntiChrist) was already in the world? Only 30 or so years after the Masters ascension.


Alethos
 

revturmoil

New Member
Feb 26, 2011
816
11
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New Hampshire's North Woods
For the first time you have stunned me.

Usually you have an answer, an interpration, something....only "moot"

And all those questions were based on Scripture. 1 John 4:2-4

What does the flesh & Jesus have to do with the Antichrist?
So a spirit (mind) is out there which will confess that Jesus came BUT not in the flesh????
So they confess Jesus BUT a different Jesus????
This is the mind of the Antichrist? What mind or spirit?
John wrote this Epistle and it (AntiChrist) was already in the world? Only 30 or so years after the Masters ascension.


Alethos

I guess you just don't get the point. You're questions aren't sensible at all. They are ambiguous and don't apply to the topic. You are too much into your own head and it's hard to tell what you're getting at or where you're coming from. I just can't answer something like this.