Who is Christ instructing?

Them which be in Judea is the "abomination of desolation" timing, not the Zech.14 timing of Christ's coming.

In Luke 21 He says for those outside that area in the countries to not enter in that area during that event.

veteran,

Let's say that you are correct (I don't believe that Christ's instructions,in Luke 21, are for believers to flee from Jerusalem but rather to flee to Jerusalem). Christ is coming to fight for someone In Zech 14 and He is instructing them to "flee" using the earthquake (in Jerusalem). If no believers are left in Jerusalem (Luke 21), then who are these people that Christ is coming for in Zech 14?

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Since when did "let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto" mean... go to that area?

Luke 21:20-22
20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.
21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.
22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.
(KJV)


You cannot just reverse what He said there because you may want to it to fit some doctrine of man. Seeking to flee TO Jerusalem in that time is a doctrine of men, not of Christ. Here's why...

First of all, you have... to include those Luke 21:20-22 verses in the context. This section is different than when you see the "abomination of desolation" setup that He mentioned in the Matt.24 and Mark 13 warnings. Instead what is He warning about seeing here? Armies compassing Jerusalem about. And then He reveals that time is the "days of vengence", and to make sure we note that specific timing He includes the idea of that event completing the prophecies for this world; i.e. the day of His return. So it directly relates to the Zech.14 timing of destruction of the gathered armies around Jerusalem on the day of His return (see also Zephaniah 3:8 and Ezekiel 39).

What specific time is that when armies surround Jerusalem in final? It's the last day of this world, even later than the "abomination of desolation" event which takes place prior to this time. That timing is the battle of Armageddon, related to the events of Gog-Magog of Ezekiel 38 & 39. Something is going to happen during the tribulation time after the abomination of desolation is setup to cause it to suffer a wound. I think God's two witnesses that prophesy in Jerusalem for the last half of the trib will cause quite a stir there in Jerusalem. To end that they are killed, which I believe will be the time of those armies out of the northern quarters surrounding Jerusalem to destroy all of God's people in final. Swat! Christ steps in.

So if you're in that area when those armies surround there, GET OUT!, He is saying, and those in the countries don't enter that area.

veteran,

I’ve had some time to refine my questions.


You stated: Them which be in Judea is the "abomination of desolation" timing, not the Zech.14 timing of Christ's coming.


My response:


1. If it's not safe for these believers to be in Judea at the beginning of the GT, when does it become safe for a believer to travel to Jerusalem after the GT starts.

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It won't be safe for the believer to be there during ANY time of the great tribualtion our Lord Jesus warned of. Why? Because the "abomination of desolation" warning is about falling to idol worship. That's specifically what's going to be happening in Jerusalem when the abomination idol is setup per the Book of Daniel, and the pseudo-Christ is set in place of our Lord Jesus. It becomes safe on the day of our Lord Jesus' return there, after the destruction He will cause there by His vengeance upon that area.

2. And how (once the GT starts) does a believer get to Jerusalem without the mark (with no way to purchase gas, food or a plane ticket)?

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You're being coy. On the day of Christ's return there, you'll know either way, of what fold you are of.

3. Why would any believer (that is familiar with Luke 21) be in Judea in the first place, only to turn around and flee?

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Simply because there are Christians living there. They may not be a majority, but they are there. It's their homeland, so why should they not be there? Your question really doesn't make common sense, but apparently is only acting as a type pry bar to continue the false premise you have about fleeing to Jerusalem during the tribulation time. If you want to be gathered to where the eagles are, i.e., taken with the deceived, then go to, trust those false prophets you're probably listening to on that which would have us go to Jerusalem during the tribulation timing.

No one will be fleeing because the version of Zechariah 14:5 you provided is not what Zechariah wrote; it is a perversion of the original manuscripts, and a fairy tale. This is what he really said:

The valley between the hills will be filled in, yes, it will be blocked as far as Jasol [Azal], it will be filled in as it was by the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah. Zechariah 14:5, New Jerusalem Bible

This event has already happened (see Mystery of Azal link below), and it has nothing to do with Matthew 24:15.

The reason that there are two different renderings of Zechariah 14:5 is because the Hebrew verb נסתם (nstm) that occurs three times in this verse can be pronounced two different ways, which results in two different meanings. The Septuagint (LXX), which is a Greek translation of the ancient Hebrew scrolls made nearly 1000 years before the Masoretic Text (MT) was fully redacted, has one meaning (it shall be blocked, or closed, up), and the MT has the other (you shall flee). It is beyond obvious now that the former is the correct version.

HeRoseFromTheDead said:

No one will be fleeing because the version of Zechariah 14:5 you provided is not what Zechariah wrote; it is a perversion of the original manuscripts, and a fairy tale. This is what he really said:

The valley between the hills will be filled in, yes, it will be blocked as far as Jasol [Azal], it will be filled in as it was by the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah. Zechariah 14:5, New Jerusalem Bible

This event has already happened (see Mystery of Azal link below), and it has nothing to do with Matthew 24:15.

The reason that there are two different renderings of Zechariah 14:5 is because the Hebrew verb נסתם (nstm) that occurs three times in this verse can be pronounced two different ways, which results in two different meanings. The Septuagint (LXX), which is a Greek translation of the ancient Hebrew scrolls made nearly 1000 years before the Masoretic Text (MT) was fully redacted, has one meaning (it shall be blocked, or closed, up), and the MT has the other (you shall flee). It is beyond obvious now that the former is the correct version.

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Even MORE JUDAISM I see.

It's very clear of what timing the events of Zechariah 14 are about in relation to Christ's second coming and establishing His reign over ALL the earth, and gathering of His saints.

But of course the unbelieving Jews of Judahism discount that because they still refuse Jesus of Nazareth as The Christ Messiah.

I can't wait to see them bow to Christ when He returns, whether they like it or not!

veteran said:

Even MORE JUDAISM I see.

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Judaism? Hardly. The version of Zechariah 14:5 I provided is found in bibles used by the entire Eastern Orthodox Church (225-300 million members in Belarus, Bulgaria, Cyprus, Georgia, Greece, Macedonia, Moldova, Montenegro, Romania, Russia, Serbia, Ukraine, and minority populations in Jordan, Israel, Lebanon and Syria.); is found in two prominent Catholic bibles (New Jerusalem Bible and New American Bible); and appears in at least two protestant bibles (the New English Bible, the Concordant Literal Version).

It actually runs counter to Jewish tradition. The stated editorial policy of the Jewish Publication Society (JPS) is to favor the Masoretic Text (that has the version that you think is correct, and that appeared in all of their publications prior to about 1985), but their translators used the LXX version of this verse in the following publications: 1985 and later versions of Tanakh: The Holy Scriptures, JPS Hebrew-English Tanakh (1999), Etz Hayim Torah and Commentary (2001), and The JPS Bible Commentary Haftarot (2002). Again, this represents a significant break from Jewish tradition.

Contemporary biblical archaeologists have determined Azal's location to be south of ancient Jerusalem and southwest of the Mount of Olives (based on a discovery by Charles Clermont-Ganneau in 1873-1874), which renders impossible the version that says people will flee east from Jerusalem through a split Mt of Olives to Azal. They call it Nahal Azal (nahal is the Hebrew word for river or valley).

Jerusalem's residents know where Azal is (link is to Hebrew Wikipedia entry for Nahal Azal):

Wikipedia (Hebrew version): נחל אצל (Nachal Atzal): “Atzal River (Arabic: Wadi Yasul) is one of the tributaries of the Kidron Valley southeast of Jerusalem, between the Armon Ha'Natziv ridge and the neighborhood of Abu Tor, in the Peace Forest. … This name originates in the prophet Zechariah’s end-time prophecy, ‘[content of the LXX version of Zechariah 14:4-5]‘. The biblical name of the river was preserved by the Arabs as Wadi Yasul.”

It's even on Google Maps. Its Hebrew spelling (נחל אצל) appears directly below the red marker (A) in the screenshot below. Again, this location runs counter to Jewish tradition that locates Azal east of Jerusalem and the Mount of Olives.

guysmith said:

Who is Christ instructing to flee in Zechariah 14?

Zechariah 14:4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.
5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

And who is Christ instructing to flee in Matthew 24?

Matthew 24: 15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand
16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:

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Who is Christ instructing to flee in Zechariah 14?

The elect - beginning in 30AD at the time of the crucifixion and all of the elect since the cross. All of the second half of the book of Zechariah
was entirely prophetic of the coming day of the Messiah - which happened about 500 years after Zechariah wrote his book. This prophesy
was fulfilled in 30AD at the time of the crucifixion.

Zechariah 14:4
And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in
the midst thereof toward theeast and toward the west,

This is a prophesy of the crucifixion; and no Jesus' feet did not descend to the top of the Mount of Olives, but rather He walked there by Himself.

..and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

This is the valley of escape that was created by Jesus when he died on the cross. The elect could now escape sin and uncleanness
through this valley. Zechariah uses the phrase In (or on) that day 23 times in his book. Each time this means the exact day of the crucifixion
when the great New Covenant was brought into existence.

5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the
earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah:

Those elect that flee through the valley end up at Azel. This ties in with the ritual of the scapegoat because one goat by lottery became a sacrifice for sin
and the other goat was set free in Azazel. It's a parallel picture of the redemption of Christ. Those not deserving were both set free in the same geographical
area south of Jerusalem. Zechariah is making a simile between the literal, historical great landslide that occurred in the day of Uzziah to the spiritual escape
of the New Covenant.

And finally...

and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

On the very day of the crucifixion from noon until three o:clock the sky was darkened with the massive swarm of heavenly witnesses and God Himself was
there cloaked in thick clouds. That is what made it dark that day on Nissan 14th 30AD.

HeRoseFromTheDead said:

Judaism? Hardly. The version of Zechariah 14:5 I provided is found in bibles used by the entire Eastern Orthodox Church (225-300 million members in Belarus, Bulgaria, Cyprus, Georgia, Greece, Macedonia, Moldova, Montenegro, Romania, Russia, Serbia, Ukraine, and minority populations in Jordan, Israel, Lebanon and Syria.); is found in two prominent Catholic bibles (New Jerusalem Bible and New American Bible); and appears in at least two protestant bibles (the New English Bible, the Concordant Literal Version).

It actually runs counter to Jewish tradition. The stated editorial policy of the Jewish Publication Society (JPS) is to favor the Masoretic Text (that has the version that you think is correct, and that appeared in all of their publications prior to about 1985), but their translators used the LXX version of this verse in the following publications: 1985 and later versions of Tanakh: The Holy Scriptures, JPS Hebrew-English Tanakh (1999), Etz Hayim Torah and Commentary (2001), and The JPS Bible Commentary Haftarot (2002). Again, this represents a significant break from Jewish tradition.

Contemporary biblical archaeologists have determined Azal's location to be south of ancient Jerusalem and southwest of the Mount of Olives (based on a discovery by Charles Clermont-Ganneau in 1873-1874), which renders impossible the version that says people will flee east from Jerusalem through a split Mt of Olives to Azal. They call it Nahal Azal (nahal is the Hebrew word for river or valley).

Jerusalem's residents know where Azal is (link is to Hebrew Wikipedia entry for Nahal Azal):

Wikipedia (Hebrew version): נחל אצל (Nachal Atzal): “Atzal River (Arabic: Wadi Yasul) is one of the tributaries of the Kidron Valley southeast of Jerusalem, between the Armon Ha'Natziv ridge and the neighborhood of Abu Tor, in the Peace Forest. … This name originates in the prophet Zechariah’s end-time prophecy, ‘[content of the LXX version of Zechariah 14:4-5]‘. The biblical name of the river was preserved by the Arabs as Wadi Yasul.”

It's even on Google Maps. Its Hebrew spelling (נחל אצל) appears directly below the red marker (A) in the screenshot below. Again, this location runs counter to Jewish tradition that locates Azal east of Jerusalem and the Mount of Olives.

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Blah, blah, blah, your false twist of Zech.14 TRIES to keep everyone focused only on those first few Zech.14 verses, while DISREGARDING THE WHOLE OF THE REST OF THE CHAPTER!


Zech 14:6-21
6 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the light shall not be clear, nor dark:
7 But it shall be one day which shall be known to the LORD, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light.

THIS ALREADY HAPPENED?!? Nope, afraid not. That's referring to Christ's Message about the day of His coming, and that no man knows when that will occur. And the Judaizers here say it was history already?!? It's EASY to know those Judaizers are LYING.


8 And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be.

Living waters? out from Jerusalem? What's that? It's the River of The Waters of Life Christ covered in Revelation 22 and Ezekiel 47! That's for Christ's future Millennium reign, the "thousand years" of Revelation 20.


9 And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and His name one.
10 All the land shall be turned as a plain from Geba to Rimmon south of Jerusalem: and it shall be lifted up, and inhabited in her place, from Benjamin's gate unto the place of the first gate, unto the corner gate, and from the tower of Hananeel unto the king's winepresses.
11 And men shall dwell in it, and there shall be no more utter destruction; but Jerusalem shall be safely inhabited.

THAT HAS NEVER HAPPENED YET in history. Is Jerusalem safely inhabited today??? Of course not! Is Christ Jesus now King over all the earth and one LORD? Need I even ASK that stupid question to believers here???


16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.
17 And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain.
18 And if the family of Egypt go not up, and come not, that have no rain; there shall be the plague, wherewith the LORD will smite the heathen that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.
19 This shall be the punishment of Egypt, and the punishment of all nations that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.
20 In that day shall there be upon the bells of the horses, HOLINESS UNTO THE LORD; and the pots in the LORD's house shall be like the bowls before the altar.
21 Yea, every pot in Jerusalem and in Judah shall be holiness unto the LORD of hosts: and all they that sacrifice shall come and take of them, and seethe therein: and in that day there shall be no more the Canaanite in the house of the LORD of hosts.
(KJV)

Has Christ Jesus returned to Jerusalem with those events now taking place on this earth? I know, that's another stupid question to ask, isn't it brethren?


All the Judaizer RoseFromTheDead is trying... to do, is to use a small section of questionable translation at the first part of Zechariah 14 to try and make you believe the WHOLE chapter has been FULFILLED ALREADY! That's his/her aim, where admitted or not! And THAT is an example of the workings of false Jew Judaizers crept in unaware here on this very... Forum! Don't you just love... the nice map layout he provided? Makes it sound all the more scientific and irrefutable doesn't it? That's what that kind of thing is designed... to do, but the Zechariah 14 chapter stands on its own without the need for all that false eye candy used to trick-or-treat the deceived!

veteran said:

All the Judaizer RoseFromTheDead is trying... to do, is to use a small section of questionable translation at the first part of Zechariah 14 to try and make you believe the WHOLE chapter has been FULFILLED ALREADY! That's his/her aim, where admitted or not! And THAT is an example of the workings of false Jew Judaizers crept in unaware here on this very... Forum! Don't you just love... the nice map layout he provided? Makes it sound all the more scientific and irrefutable doesn't it? That's what that kind of thing is designed... to do, but the Zechariah 14 chapter stands on its own without the need for all that false eye candy used to trick-or-treat the deceived!

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You're a false witness. I never said anything about any verse beyond Zechariah 14:5, and really only focused on verse 5. I didn't say that the whole chapter has been fulfilled, and I actually don't believe that.

Again, before GOD and this forum I repeat, you are a false witness. And you have an ungodly attitude. Repent.

HeRoseFromTheDead said:

You're a false witness. I never said anything about any verse beyond Zechariah 14:5, and really only focused on verse 5. I didn't say that the whole chapter has been fulfilled, and I actually don't believe that.

Again, before GOD and this forum I repeat, you are a false witness. And you have an ungodly attitude. Repent.

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You said above and I quote - "This event has already happened (see Mystery of Azal link below), and it has nothing to do with Matthew 24:15. (Post #5 above).



Well let's see... if it has already happened...

Zech 14:1-3
1 Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.
2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.
3 Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.
(KJV)

That "day of the LORD" event and gathering of all nations against Jerusalem has EVERYTHING to do with the day of Christ's FUTURE SECOND coming, and the Matthew 24 Scripture. None of those Zechariah 14 events were history.

The ONLY historical references in those first 5 verses there are plainly mentioned ("as when He fought in the day of battle", and the historical reference to "the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah" which is directly referred to by the prophet Amos (Amos 1:1).


Those Zechariah 14 events are in DIRECT relation to the following prophecies for the time of Christ's future SECOND coming...

Joel 3:1-2
1 For, behold, in those days, and in that time, when I shall bring again the captivity of Judah and Jerusalem,
2 I will also gather all nations, and will bring them down into the valley of Jehoshaphat, and will plead with them there for My people and for My heritage Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations, and parted My land.
(KJV)

Zeph 3:8
8 Therefore wait ye upon Me, saith the LORD, until the day that I rise up to the prey: for My determination is to gather the nations, that I may assemble the kingdoms, to pour upon them Mine indignation, even all My fierce anger: for all the earth shall be devoured with the fire of My jealousy.
(KJV)

Ezek 38:14-16
14 Therefore, son of man, prophesy and say unto Gog, Thus saith the Lord GOD; In that day when My people of Israel dwelleth safely, shalt thou not know it?
15 And thou shalt come from thy place out of the north parts, thou, and many people with thee, all of them riding upon horses, a great company, and a mighty army:
16 And thou shalt come up against My people of Israel, as a cloud to cover the land; it shall be in the latter days, and I will bring thee against My land, that the heathen may know Me, when I shall be sanctified in thee, O Gog, before their eyes.
(KJV)

Joel 3:9-12
9 Proclaim ye this among the Gentiles; Prepare war, wake up the mighty men, let all the men of war draw near; let them come up:
10 Beat your plowshares into swords, and your pruninghooks into spears: let the weak say, 'I am strong.'
11 Assemble yourselves, and come, all ye heathen, and gather yourselves together round about: thither cause thy mighty ones to come down, O LORD.
12 Let the heathen be wakened, and come up to the valley of Jehoshaphat: for there will I sit to judge all the heathen round about.
(KJV)

Micah 4:11-13
11 Now also many nations are gathered against thee, that say, Let her be defiled, and let our eye look upon Zion.
12 But they know not the thoughts of the LORD, neither understand they His counsel: for He shall gather them as the sheaves into the floor.
13 Arise and thresh, O daughter of Zion: for I will make thine horn iron, and I will make thy hoofs brass: and thou shalt beat in pieces many people: and I will consecrate their gain unto the LORD, and their substance unto the Lord of the whole earth.
(KJV)

Rev 16:14-16
14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.
15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
16 And He gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
(KJV)


So what was that you wrongly claimed about me being a "false witness"???

veteran said:

You said above and I quote - "This event has already happened (see Mystery of Azal link below), and it has nothing to do with Matthew 24:15. (Post #5 above).

Well let's see... if it has already happened...
...

So what was that you wrongly claimed about me being a "false witness"???

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The version of Zechariah 14:5 that you use to support your opinion is meaningless because Zechariah didn't write it. He wrote:

The valley between the hills will be filled in, yes, it will be blocked as far as Jasol [Azal], it will be filled in as it was by the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah. Zechariah 14:5, New Jerusalem Bible

You have only your opinion that the other version is true, whereas historical, archaeological, theological, linguistic, geologic, cartographic, and photographic evidence proves the above version is true.

Like anyone, you are free to have and express an opinion. However, when an opinion obviously conflicts with reality a wise person will reevaluate that opinion in light the facts, whereas a foolish person will not.

HeRoseFromTheDead said:

The version of Zechariah 14:5 that you use to support your opinion is meaningless because Zechariah didn't write it. He wrote:

The valley between the hills will be filled in, yes, it will be blocked as far as Jasol [Azal], it will be filled in as it was by the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah. Zechariah 14:5, New Jerusalem Bible

You have only your opinion that the other version is true, whereas historical, archaeological, theological, linguistic, geologic, cartographic, and photographic evidence proves the above version is true.

Like anyone, you are free to have and express an opinion. However, when an opinion obviously conflicts with reality a wise person will reevaluate that opinion in light the facts, whereas a foolish person will not.

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The reality here is that it's your... opinion on Zech.14 that is conflicting with the rest... of God's Word...

Rev 11:13-15
13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.
14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.
15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of His Christ; and He shall reign for ever and ever.
(KJV)

Rev 16:17-18
17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.
18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great.
(KJV)

The first 7 verses of Zechariah 14 are for the DAY of Christ's second coming to end the wicked one's reign over this present world. The rest of the Zech.14 verses are about Christ's future Milennium reign. Most of that is not linked to tribulation time of Matt.24, but instead to the time of Christ's coming and our gathering in Matt.24.

veteran said:

The first 7 verses of Zechariah 14 are for the DAY of Christ's second coming to end the wicked one's reign over this present world.

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That is your opinion that is insupportable by the evidence. Verses 1-2 accurately describe Jerusalem's destruction in 70 AD, and verses 4-5 were fulfilled during a past landslide on the Mount of Olives. You have no warrant to ignore past fulfillments in order to bolster your fantasy views of eschatology.

ChristRoseFromTheDead said:

That is your opinion that is insupportable by the evidence. Verses 1-2 accurately describe Jerusalem's destruction in 70 AD, and verses 4-5 were fulfilled during a past landslide on the Mount of Olives. You have no warrant to ignore past fulfillments in order to bolster your fantasy views of eschatology.

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You're still teaching vanity I see. The 'day of The Lord' events of Zechariah 14:1-2 will occur with Christ's SECOND COMING, as written by Apostles Paul and Peter in The New Testament Books. Acts 1 gives the account about Christ's coming being how He ascended, which was from the Mount of Olives per Acts 1.

What you're actually pushing is a lie from men's doctrines like Full Preterism. They don't believe in a literal second coming of Christ Jesus back to this earth, which is WHY they deny the Zechariah 14 events of Christ's future return. Those against the idea of Christ's literal second coming back to this earth to take reign over all peoples and nations just so happens to be a teaching the false Jews love also, since they deny and hate Christ Jesus.

veteran said:

The 'day of The Lord' events of Zechariah 14:1-2 ...

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A day of the lord in Zechariah 14:1, not THE day of the lord - http://www.christianityboard.com/topic/17608-chapter-14/#entry188535

There 'they' go again, trying to pry... a different meaning into... the Scripture that does not exist.


The Zech.14:1 "the day of the LORD cometh" is the SAME day as this one to come...

Isa 13:9-13
9 Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and He shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it.
10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.
11 And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible.
12 I will make a man more precious than fine gold; even a man than the golden wedge of Ophir.
13 Therefore I will shake the heavens, and the earth shall remove out of her place, in the wrath of the LORD of hosts, and in the day of His fierce anger.
(KJV)

It is the SAME day Apostles Paul and Peter spoke of in 1 Thessalonians 5:1-5 and 2 Peter 3:10, the SAME timing when Christ Jesus returns as a thief in the night. What do you think brethren, do you think 'they' are looking for that day of The LORD? Clearly not by what they chosen to follow instead!

veteran said:

There 'they' go again, trying to pry... a different meaning into... the Scripture that does not exist.
The Zech.14:1 "the day of the LORD cometh" is the SAME day as this one to come...
Isa 13:9
Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and He shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it. (KJV)

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Again, just like Zechariah 14:4, the Hebrew of Isaiah 13:9 says A day (יום) of the lord, not THE day (היום) of the lord. - http://www.christianityboard.com/topic/17608-chapter-14/#entry188611