The Four Stages of Mankind's Redemption:
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Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Well as I have been saying- just sahow me when the termso f the covenant God declared in Jer. 31 and Heb 8 were fulfilled and you win!!! I have asked that over several threads and all you covenant theology believers refuse to answer.
Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
No, I don't believe that. Who would ever say that the gospel doesn't need to be preached anymore? Of course I'm not saying that. I'm saying that the new covenant has been fully in effect since Christ shed His blood of the new covenant which provides for the forgiveness of sins (Matt 26:28). People come under the new covenant that was established by the blood of Christ long ago when they put their faith in Christ and then have their sins forgiven and covered by His blood.
Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
So, explain it then. What did you mean when you said "Jesus' blood is not the New Covenant, but the purchase price of the covenant."?
Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
If only you actually understood what is written in Hebrews 8 to 10 then I would win. But, you don't. Ask God to explain it to you since I apparently am not able to do so.
Paul makes a certain strong case for us all being one in Ephesians 2, as a current reality
as in this
Brought Near by His Blood
11 Therefore remember that you, once Gentiles in the flesh—who are called Uncircumcision by what is called the Circumcision made in the flesh by hands— 12 that at that time you were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.Christ Our Peace
14 For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, 15 having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace, 16 and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity. 17 And He came and preached peace to you who were afar off and to those who were near. 18 For through Him we both have access by one Spirit to the Father.Christ Our Cornerstone
19 Now, therefore, you are no longer strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God, 20 having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief cornerstone, 21 in whom the whole building, being fitted together, grows into a holy temple in the Lord, 22 in whom you also are being built together for a dwelling place of God in the Spirit.
If you're unaware that historical orthodox Christianity pre-dates "roman Catholic teaching", then you've unequivocally confirmed the abject ignorance of your modernist revisionist dispensatanist cultism.
Why would the blind ask the blind?
As a denier of the fulfilled reality of Christ's New Covenant and Blood of His New Covenant, your partaking of the Lord's Supper is condemned according to 1 Corinthians 11:27-29.
Such hypocrisy is blasphemous, detestable, and appalling.
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shepherdsword
Well-Known Member
I am sure it wasn't simply a scriptural rebuttal if it was deemed inappropriate. Can you repost it with just the scriptures and your interpretation? I am interested in what you have to say.
Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
He's quite sensitive, isn't he? He thinks only he should be allowed to make insulting comments.
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
I don't recall the specific details and couldn't be bothered investing time to regurgitate them.
Where our focus is, is important....even as students of scripture, nay, particularly as students of scripture. It is a high possible to miss the trees for the forest.
Jesus made this statement regarding this; 'You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me; and you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life'. John 5:39-40
When Jesus met up with the guys on the road to Emmaus in Luke 24:13-35, what was it he brought to their attention from the scriptures? ie where was his focus?
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
Actually, I think he's quite polite. He does however believe that the scriptures are a crystal ball to primarily reveal the ins and outs of the present day political trajectory in Palestine and cosmic activity.
shepherdsword
Well-Known Member
Wow....you dont have time to back up this statement?
Then stop condemning someone and present yours
Where is your focus?
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Well you are saying the New Covenant is fulfilled! One of the provisions of the Covenant is that Jews no longer would need evangelizing anymore for they would all know th eLord. You can't have it both ways.
The Covenant doesn't say anywhere about them putting faith! It simply says they would all know the Lord from the least to the greatest- this is post faith in Christ and th eCovewnant promises all will know. Can't call it fulfilled if some Jews do not know Jesus.
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
It means exactly what I said. Jesus blood is the price paid to insure the Covenant would go into effect.
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Yes in the church age all believers become one body in Christ! But in the Millennial kingdom, God will fulfill His promises to the nation and people and land of Israel that were prophesied many many times. This would be Jews from the birth of Israel to the church and then from the rapture to the physical return of Jesus.
There are differences in status in the millennial kingdom.
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Well then you show from the pre RCC writings that the ante Nicene Fathers believed what you say. And please gorw up and try to discuss as a Christian and not one who just wishes to vomit out ad-hominems
I didn't know god appointed you the discerner of blasphemy.
If the New Covenant as spelled out in Jer.31 and Hebrews 8, I have just been asking show me when the Jews are all saved and know the Lord as the covenant demands.
Because you hurled an implied insult and I decided to answer your prepubescent false accusation.
But let me aks- Is Jesus new Covenant teh same as spelled out in Jer. 31:31-37?
Justin Martyr
Dialogue with Trypho
If, therefore, God proclaimed a new covenant which was to be instituted, and this for a light of the nations, we see and are persuaded that men approach God, leaving their idols and other unrighteousness, through the name of Him who was crucified, Jesus Christ, and abide by their confession even unto death, and maintain piety. Moreover, by the works and by the attendant miracles, it is possible for all to understand that He is the new law, and the new covenant, and the expectation of those who out of every people wait for the good things of God.
Irenaeus of Lyons
Against Heresies Book IV
And the cup likewise, which is part of that creation to which we belong, He confessed to be His blood, and taught the new oblation of the new covenant; which the Church receiving from the apostles, offers to God throughout all the world, to Him who gives us as the means of subsistence the first-fruits of His own gifts in the New Testament...
And those of them who declare that God would make a new covenant with men, not such as that which He made with the fathers at Mount Horeb, and would give to men a new heart and a new spirit; and again, "And remember ye not the things of old: behold, I make new things which shall now arise, and ye shall know it; and I will make a way in the desert, and riven in a dry land, to give drink to my chosen people, my people whom I have acquired, that they may show forth my praise," -plainly announced that liberty which distinguishes the new covenant, and the new wine which is put into new bottles, [that is], the faith which is in Christ, by which He has proclaimed the way of righteousness sprung up in the desert, and the streams of the Holy Spirit in a dry land, to give water to the elect people of God, whom He has acquired, that they might show forth His praise...
There are two.
Your turn.
Just one from the entirety of pre-1800 historical orthodox Christianity who agrees with you that the New Covenant is not fulfilled.
Just one.
Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
You don't understand what that means. All believers are under the new covenant because there is no other way for anyone to have their sins forgiven except by the blood of the new covenant that Christ shed long ago. All of us under the new covenant know the Lord.
Say what? How else can someone's sins be covered by Christ's blood of the new covenant without having faith in Him?
You read what it says without having any idea of what it means. I apparently am unable to help you see what it means. Ask God to show you. You currently have no understanding whatsoever about the new covenant.
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