riots in Europe

TribulationSigns said:

If my bluntness offends you, I’m sorry—but the truth doesn’t become less true because it’s uncomfortable.



Smile...

Then if you are correct, then most Bible commentators are engaging in personal opinions, idle speculation, and their own private interpretations. Because the Word of God tells us very clearly who Gog is, and who Magog is also.

Revelation 20:7-8

• "And when the thousand years have been completed, Satan shall be loosed from his prison,
• and shall go out to deceive the nations which [are] in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to the war, whose number [is] as the sand of the sea."

So unless Russia has conquered the whole world and become all the nations from its four corners, then their interpretations has been measured against the Word of God and found wanting. God's word tells us that when Satan is unbound or loosed from his prison, he will go forth deceiving "the nations of the entire world," and God calls them collectively, "Gog and Magog." Why "Gog and Magog" is a subject for another day, but suffice it to say, all the "nations" of the world are gathered together against the camp of the saints, which would be the church. Saints are God's people, and their camp is the church.



(Chuckle) Ah yes, the classic 1970s premillennial approach—keep one eye on Scripture and the other on the evening news, then squeeze today’s nations into biblical prophecy. Sorry to disappoint you, but Christ is exposing a far more sinister spiritual kingdom—one foreshadowed by those Old Testament nations. Perhaps let Scripture interpret the headlines for a change, will ya?!



Really? I do not think you have studied his sources very well.

Yes—Hal Lindsey explicitly discussed Islam in his biblical prophecy teaching. His own ministry website, the Hal Lindsey Report, provides clear examples:

• His teaching series, Ezekiel’s View on the Middle East Crisis, includes topics titled “The Koran Contradicts Several Key Verses of the Bible” and “Muhammad Was a Genius in Spreading Islam,” alongside teachings on Ezekiel 38 and its predicted invasion.
• In “Gog, Magog, and Russia” (September 2023), he identified Russia as leading the Ezekiel 38–39 coalition, with Iran, Turkey, and certain African nations among its allies.
• In “Israel…at War” (October 2023), he discussed radical Islamic terrorism and described the Hamas attack as a precursor to his interpretation of the Russia–Iran war in Ezekiel 38–39.

So, yes, he connected Islam and modern Muslim nations with end-times prophecy.

Selah!

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Douggg said:

The ten horns represent ten kings.

The seven heads represent...
(1) seven mountains on which the woman sits.

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Douggg said:

(2) seven kings associated with that location

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Douggg said:

five have fallen (at the time of John)
one is (king 6) (at the time of John)
one is yet to come


The seven heads as representing seven mountains on which the woman sits - none of the seven mountains fall.

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TribulationSigns said:

Awww. Wanna some tissues?


Marilyn, let’s read God’s words carefully, including what He says in the next chapter:


Notice that Gog—not God—is called the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal. God is speaking against Gog and declares that He will turn him back and bring him against the mountains of Israel. So the question is: Who or what does Gog represent, and what do Meshech, Tubal, and the mountains of Israel signify?

Have you considered how this language connects with Revelation 20:1–3, 7–9? Satan is bound so that he cannot deceive the nations as before; afterward, he is released for a little season and goes out to deceive the nations called Gog and Magog, gathering them against “the camp of the saints” and “the beloved city.” God then judges them with fire.

Do you understand that picture spiritually? During the period when Satan is restrained, Christ builds His church and gathers His elect. After that, Satan is released for a short season, and God permits him to gather the deceived against His people. This is a spiritual assault involving deception and opposition within the congregation, not merely an invasion by modern armies against Israel you thought is a physical nation. Wrong! Compare Matthew 24:24, where false Christs and false prophets deceive, and 2 Thessalonians 2:3–4, 9–12, which describes rebellion and deception connected with the temple of God. it is all about CHURCH! Not nation Israel!

Ezekiel also says that God Himself brings Gog against His land (aka holy city) and then judges him (Ezekiel 38:16, 22–23). God remains sovereign over the entire event, just as Satan’s release in Revelation 20 happens only for the time God permits.

So, Marilyn, have you considered these connections? Or are you assuming from the beginning that “Israel,” “the nations,” and “Gog” must refer to physical territory, modern nations, and a political leader? That conclusion needs to be demonstrated from Scripture, not simply assumed.

Selah!


Why was Satan in prison in the first place? When did that take place?




So you haven’t read Hal Lindsey’s work, yet you assumed he never said anything about Islam?

That’s quite a conclusion to reach without reading what he actually wrote. Go figure!

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Marilyn C said:

In Rev. 20 Gog is the leader of the world`s nations.

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TribulationSigns said:

Marilyn, if you are suggesting that my posts are a “spiritual attack” that God needs to get rid of with fire so everyone can get along, you have misunderstood what I am saying.

I am using Scripture to challenge what I believe is false doctrine. The Bible itself uses fire as a picture of God’s Word:



And again:



My point is that proclaiming the truth of God’s Word exposes and challenges false teaching. Calling that a “spiritual attack” does not answer the Scriptures I have presented.

You may not like hearing the truth, but please address the biblical argument rather than suggesting that God needs to remove me or my post so everyone can get along. Really? LOL.




Marilyn, time out. You’ve made several claims, but where does Scripture establish them?

First, where does the Bible say that Rosh is Russia? Please show me the verse. Ezekiel 38 describes Gog as being from the “north parts” (verse 15, KJV), but the passage does not name modern Russia. Saying that Russia is north of Israel does not, by itself, prove they are the same.

Second, the word translated “chief” in Ezekiel 38:2 is rendered “Rosh” in some translations. But even if you understand Rosh as a place name, you still need to demonstrate why it means Russia. You cannot simply assume that two names refer to the same place.

Third, where does Revelation 20 say Gog is the individual leader of the world’s nations? Revelation 20:8 speaks of “the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog,” being gathered for battle. It does not explicitly call Gog their leader. That is an interpretation you are bringing over from Ezekiel, not a statement Revelation itself makes. So what does God and Magog means to God, then?

Gog and Magog in Revelation as a picture of those deceived by Satan. That's it! Not about naming some countries we know today. They gathered against the saints and the beloved city, which is clearly the New Testament congregation on this side of the Cross, (Revelation 20:7–9). So the question remains: What scriptural evidence identifies Gog with a "modern political leader" or "Rosh with Russia?" Clearly you make it up to fit your literal narrative theories.

Please show me the biblical references, not assumptions based on geography or "similar-sounding names."

Selah!



Of course you can have your own thoughts. But having a thought and establishing a fact are two different things.

Why would Hal Lindsey discussing Islam necessarily have prevented people from talking about the EU? People can hold different prophecy theories, and one subject doesn’t automatically cancel out another.

If you’re going to claim that he didn’t discuss Islam, shouldn’t you first check what he actually wrote? Otherwise, you’re basing your conclusion on an assumption. Admit it.

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TribulationSigns said:

SI? I am not SI. LOL.



YES! It is called deception that Satan brings into God's congregation where people who have not yet sealed by God (eg. professed Christians) will believe a lie and take the mark of the beast on their right hand and forehead, spiritually speaking, of course!



The power of Satan (little horn) will start in the NORTH.

Based upon what I read in scripture (eg. Daniel 8) , it is my view that God doesn't mention North and West "in this context" because they are opposites of the South and East, whom the context shows the "little horn" is coming against.

Allow me to explain. The short version is that in scripture, the King of the north is often a synonym for Satan's Kingdom. While the king of the south, being the direct opposite, is often used to signify those working on God's behalf. An opposite or opposing direction from the North. Likewise the west is opposite of the east. Thus west and north are not used in this context because Satan is coming against those supposed to be working on God's behalf. An example of the south can be seen as Christ used the queen of the south (queen of Sheba who came up to the Kingdom of solomon to worship the Lord) as an example of those coming to repentance.

Matthew 12:42

• "The queen of the south shall rise up in the judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: for she came from the uttermost parts of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and, behold, a greater than Solomon is here."

Or another example, in Daniel when the king of the south is prophesied to be strong and have dominion. Until in the end of years the north and south join forces when the daughter of the king of the south makes an agreement or covenant with the king of the north, signifying a falling away. Just as the ten horns of the south makes an agreement with the beast of the North. Just as segments of the Church are today in agreement with the world, and have (for all intents and purposes) joined forces with them. the sad truth is, in most Churches you can't tell the difference between them and the world. This is why those in the church as agreed to give their kingdom to the beast for a little season of power (little horn). Of course, in Daniel, this makes the queen of the south to then become the enemy of God. For example, we are either in agreement with one kingdom or the other. But not both. Spiritual adulterers who have gone after other gods. Much like the harlot in Revelation. Or even as recorded in James.

James 4:4

• "Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God."

Which is what the Christians of the Church today can't seem to get through their thick skulls!! An agreement with the king of the north, is automatically betrayal and spiritual adultery. North and South, they are at opposite polls.

Likewise, the East has always represented the coming of light, the dawn of illumination. It is where the sun rises, signifying the risen Christ, and the spiritual rebirth, as it is the dawn of a new day. For example, the star in the east foretelling Christ. Those from the east represent God's messengers. In that context of the little horn coming against the east, the west would not be in agreement with the context. It is an opposite of the east. And the little horn is coming against the east, which represents the Lord's people! As for example a like-illustration in Revelation 16, the people of the east signifying God's people.

Revelation 16:12

• "And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared."

Here the kings of the east are God's people that are prepared to LEAVE the unfaithful church when the border that guard her has been gone. Just as the Gentiles has come into the court of the city which is WITHOUT the temple, Revelation 11:1-2.

Likewise, the pleasant land of Daniel is a synonym for the land of Israel, the shadow which was the historical pleasant home of God's people when they came forth out of Egypt (and we being brought out of spiritual bondage). Please understand this. Israel "IS" typed all throughout scripture as the pleasant (meaning beautiful) or glorious land. For exmaple, pleasant, a land pleasurable, flowing with milk and honey, beautiful to the eyes, glorious in it's appearance. That land Daniel speaks of is the land of God's people. Not literal land, but where God's people are all over the world, spiritually speaking. They are spiritually Judea, Spiritual Jersualem, spiritual beautiful land, a spiritual city without bars and gates. The CHURCH! This is where Satan want to come into and rule through the army of false prophets and christs - Gog and Magog!

Ezekiel 20:5-6

• "And say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; In the day when I chose Israel, and lifted up mine hand unto the seed of the house of Jacob, and made myself known unto them in the land of Egypt, when I lifted up mine hand unto them, saying, I am the LORD your God;
• In the day that I lifted up mine hand unto them, to bring them forth of the land of Egypt into a land that I had espied for them, flowing with milk and honey, which is the glory of all lands:"

This is the pleasant land. So when the prophesy is of the little horn "waxing exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land." This signifies the power of Satan (Little Horn) allowed to come up against the Lord's congregations but THIS power which manfiest in false prophets and christs (man of sin that rule/sit in the temple of God - church) only last for a short season! The context also bears this out. As when Satan is loosed in power for this little season, he gathers the world to come up against "the camp of the saints" (churches all over the world, which corresponds to the little horn. Spiritually, this is toward the south, east and pleasant or beautiful land. So this has nothing to do with land surround physical Israel as you think!

Selah!

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