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  1. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    I believe I already answered it when I said IMHO.
  2. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    My apologies, but I don’t understand what you mean. You asked a question and I responded.
  3. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    I never said we don’t change. There is a change for the living and the dead. The dead rise first as quick as a twinkling. You’re taking the “we” when both groups are told they will change and applying the living to it (the twinkling of an eye) which is not in the text. Something that may happen...
  4. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    Of course not, but I was giving a basic definition to the translation of the word “ouranos”. However, it is never described as a well watered park like Eden.
  5. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    As a scroll of ownership, yes I do in a way. Christ was granted worthy to receive and open it. The scroll IMHO, is the the earth and it’s inhabitants. Meeting the prerequisites brings about the Kingdom.
  6. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    It won’t matter. Joel 2 tells us, The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come. Do you see that in Rev 3, 4 or 5? That’s a rhetorical question. Christ told us not to worry when we see these things. The end is not yet...
  7. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    Have to disagree with you there. The context is all will be changed, but the twinkling of an eye, which is for the resurrection of the dead, is separate. Honestly, it’s important to interpret correctly but this issue isn’t one that should cause diversity. In a moment, in the twinkling of an...
  8. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    Enoch111, Here’s another. The writer said, Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and...
  9. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    Enoch, That giant wall of text you posted, I realize you didn’t write it but you did post it. There’s plenty to comment on it, but here is one. The writer said, The Rapture will happen “in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye.” “Moment” is the Greek atomos, from whence the word “atom” is...
  10. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    For myself, possibly 15+ years ago, I felt if we are Israel that it was a grey area that was too closely linked with replacement theology. This was when I was Pre-TB. The idea that Israel is precious, Israel receives the blessing, Israel is the promised nation, Israel is given the land and...
  11. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    He needs to understand the word tribulation is thlipsis. Biblehub lists it as It means ("compression, tribulation") carries the challenge of coping with the internal pressure of a tribulation, especially when feeling there is "no way of escape" ("hemmed in"). It is never used as God's wrath. It...
  12. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    But you dd not answer the question, Where do you put the "great beasts" at? You think that the first seal is the Nicolaitans. Yet we are told there are 4 judgments: For thus saith the Lord GOD; How much more when I send my four sore judgments upon Jerusalem, the sword, and the famine, and the...
  13. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    But David, look at what scripture says. Rev 6:8 And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth. 1. 2nd seal: sword 2. 3rd seal: famine/hunger 3. 4th seal: death/pestilence But where do...
  14. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    Naomi25, So well written above. Truly, what came 1st: 1. Pre-TB or; 2. Dispensationalism It’s very difficult to have one without the other. And it can trap (perhaps there’s a better word) the reader into seeing it that way because of it. I attend a dispensationalist church. But I no longer...
  15. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    Obviously, my name shows that I don’t follow the Pre-TB theory. And if you think that theory is in error, why would you say to someone you don’t know, “go fill yourself up” with it? You really need to humble yourself. Your arrogance is not walking like Christ. Don’t take that as an attack, but...
  16. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    When you started off with, your ideas are wrong, there’s no point reading anything else you write. For one, you did not approach gracefully but instead through pride lifted yourself up. I did not even mention the scripture, and instead of inquiring, you try to silence anyone with a different...
  17. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    Finally, a logical statement. I was waiting to see if anyone understood why the first 4 or 5 seals were opened when Christ ascended. But, I didn’t see you actually explain scripturally why. I have my own reasons but would love to hear yours. For me, there are at least 3, maybe 4. You have listed...
  18. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    Pro beheadings? I am a Christian. We are to be self-controlled and walk in Christ likeness which is against violence.
  19. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    Marks, if you don't mind..what verse or verses do you place the rapture and why?
  20. No Pre-TB

    The Pre-Trib Rapture

    Rev 7:14 14And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation,