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Baptism doesn't save. It's an outward testimony of salvation, not salvation itself.

Tertullian (d. circa 200) rejected the apocryphal protogospel and with it Mary's virginitas in partu and her virginitas post partum (see De carne Christi, 23). There is a common misunderstanding that Irenaeus supported the notion of ever-virginity. He didn't. And if the former [Eve] did...

And yet Catholics do just that. I've heard their prayers. It's creepy the way they glorify Mary...as if they have to go through her to get to Jesus.

Lol... You really like the grade yourself on a curve don't you? The birth of Jesus was the result of a supernatural union between God and Mary. She was a virgin at the time Jesus was conceived. There are some who maintain that Mary remained a virgin throughout her life...The Scriptures...

Ok, let me put it this way; why should I glorify a human that God doesn't ask me to glorify? That's putting someone else in Jesus' place.

Like I said, you have nothing. Tradition, tradition! Tradition isn't truth. Show me from scripture that she never had other children. You can't, so you have the weaker conclusion. I at least can show that it's the most likely situationthat Jesus' brothers were his mother's kids. You have to...

I met him through the introduction of the Holy Spirit, not physically. And you didn't answer my questions.

It's the most likely conclusion. They were with her, they were his brothers. You on the other hand create a whole doctrine from nothing.

Because he chose to... don't add what isn't said. Don't create an unlikely scenerio from silence.

How can I truly love someone I've never met? Jesus I have met. There's no scripture that tells me I can or should have a relationship with Jesus' mother. I can honor and respect my own Mom because I have had a lifelong relationship with her. I don't see how this happens with a woman who died...

Um no, it says plainly that Jesus' mother and his brothers came to see him. To believe they weren't her children is to add to scripture. The plain reading is that she had other children.

Honor might be the wrong word. What I'm really asking is where does scripture say to glorify Mary, put her on a pedestal, call her sinless, make up a story about her going straight to heaven without dying and pray to her?

Of course. Jesus had brothers and sisters, according to scripture, so obviously, she gave birth to other children.

You see a contradiction in God changing how he deals with humans? I see no such contradiction. He's God. You aren't. You don't get to tell him what he can or can't do by picking out the verses that make you feel good.

So, everything that applies to one disciple applies to every believer? Ok, I'm headed out to catch a fish with a gold coin in his mouth so we can pay our taxes...C'mon, get real, this is basic common sense stuff.

Lol, so I'm headed out to kill me some philistines! And then I'm going to jump in with some lions at the zoo. And then I'm gonna tell all my neighbors God is sending a worldwide flood to kill everyone! Thanks for the help! Yes, all scripture is inspired, that doesn't' mean everything in...

Not biblical. You can not just take everything in the Bible that happened and apply it to us. This isn't correct scripture interpretation, it's adding to the Word.

Again: Still have no idea what you're talking about. What is my system of justice? Why would children be killed for parents sins? How and where is God changing? He changed tactics but not who he is. That's his perogative. You never answer anything.

Still have no idea what you're talking about. What is my system of justice? Why would children be killed for parents sins? How and where is God changing? He changed tactics but not who he is. That's his perogative.

Uncalled for insulting again. Who said you have to know everything by heart? But if you studied it as much as you claim, you would know these basic facts.