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And still no biblical proof....

I'm not mad, I'm frustrated. Frustrated that you are saying things almost outright, then denying you are saying them. You say you are not calling people who "attend church" unsaved, and yet you refer to us in such ways that clearly show you percieve us in this light. Witness: "or do something...

Well......um. He kinda is alreadly ruling and reigning right now..... that he worked in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly places, far above all rule and authority and power and dominion, and above every name that is named, not only in this...

And yet, by saying what you just did, you just proved to me that you don't have a clue what I'm saying or where I'm coming from. Religion....pfffst! Religion sucks..... :rolleyes: And I couldn't be more divorced from it....

Oh for goodness sake. Clearly the words you are speaking do not make sense to me, and the words I am speaking do not make sense to you. Therefore, there is zero point continuing this... Cheers.

I find your seeming disregard for the bible somewhat distressing. The bible is much more than just an 'ancient record'....incomplete at that. Why would God give us a book that was incomplete? That did not have within it everything Christians down the line of history would need to live a life for...

Well, If you're that learned on the subject, please comment on the following. Allowing that when I say "church" (small 'c') I am talking of a gathering of THE Church (capital 'C'). If "church" is not biblical, then: Why does Paul write to churches, rather than individual people? Why does Paul...

Huh....it's interesting to hear all that about America. Here in Australia we have War Memorial days. They are held before the plaque with the names of the fallen (local) on it, and in town halls. We do sing some hymns...there is a definite 'Christian' feel to it....from a time when Christian...

I don't feel condemned. My point was simply that you are all but saying outright that those who disagree with you...or those who 'attend church'...are, in your opinion, not saved. If you truly think the people who you are addressing, are Christians...and then go on to say the things you...

Oh let me count the ways!! Translation: "just because you're attending a church doesn't mean you belong to THE Church"......if a person does not belong to THE Church, we are not children of God..therefore we are not saved. Translation: "If you attend a church you are trying to build your way...

I'm sorry, but I just can't take anything you say seriously anymore. Because we quote scripture, it means that Jesus, God and The Holy Spirit has taken back seat to our 'religious organisation'???? Let me assure you....there is nothing....NOTHING, in my life that means more to mean than...

It's probably just that I disagree with you... Either way....any suggestion that salvation comes through, or is upheld (or "maintained") by us...is salvation by works, and it is unbiblical.

Oh...so you're just saying that the Spirit only tells you how to interpret that which is not important anyway...that which you keep quoting. Yup...still not making sense.

Why are we told to come to Jesus for salvation, grace and forgiveness of sins, if doing so makes absolutely no difference between us and unsaved people? We are also told that in Christ we HAVE fogiveness for our sins....not that we WILL have forgiveness...as long as we shape up... That whole...

I feel like maybe there might be some crossed wires here...like maybe you're not really understanding what I'm trying to say. I have already said (twice actually) that there is nothing wrong with the Jewish laws. That the Jews were not discouraged from following their traditions. After all, they...

Wait..wait. Your argument here is that I can't possibly understand what you've written...your point...because the ways of God cannot be understood by men? With the possible exception of you apparently. That is, hands down, the weirdest, most illogical rebuttle, that I have ever come across...

I did not phrase what I said very well, sorry. I did not mean to say they were the Pharisees, but like them...we often call people today 'Pharisees' when they are law bound...but they're not 'actually' Pharisees!! I agree with what you've said above, but disagree with your concluded outcome...

Ok...I agree that the passage is talking about how we are no longer 'slaves to sin'. But I'm still wondering what that has to do with this topic... ...unless you are saying that now we are 'slaves to righteousness' instead, in effect, being obediant to God....and you are tying that with our need...

You do realise that your post makes no sense, right? The only reference in it that relates to the topic at hand, is the small paragraph at the end, and even that is just a vague comment based on your apparent aversion, rather than any real biblical content about believers coming together.

Did I say everyone who comes to church is of the Church?? No...don't remember ever saying that. Just as you didn't ever say that everyone walking around the countryside claiming to be 'christian' is saved. Church buildings are not there to 'please' God...they are there so his children can come...