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  1. R

    The Conundrum of Zechariah Ch. 14

    I read what you wrote Marty. It was the cross/resurrection that brought to an end of the physical because that's when the New Covenant through His blood was ushered in. To this day Christ rejecting Jews continue to observe parts of the Old Law even without the temple. The Olivet Discourse is...
  2. R

    The Conundrum of Zechariah Ch. 14

    Marty, it was not the final physical end of the literal city and temple that brought to end the sacrificial and ceremonial laws of Moses. The Old was brought to an end with the advent of Christ. It was by His birth with the war in heaven, His death and resurrection that salvation came for...
  3. R

    The Conundrum of Zechariah Ch. 14

    Yes, but that is not all the must be fulfilled in that generation according to Preterits.
  4. R

    The Conundrum of Zechariah Ch. 14

    When Jesus said that it would be???
  5. R

    The Conundrum of Zechariah Ch. 14

    Telling His disciples to pray their flight would not be in winter or on the Sabbath is not of concern for the whole world! Christ is speaking this message to HIS DISCIPLES, Christians. Why would disciples of Christ throughout ALL the ages need to SPIRITUALLY understand winter and Sabbath...
  6. R

    The Conundrum of Zechariah Ch. 14

    While I totally agree that we, the church are living stones, I see Christ's warning to His disciples when He was asked about the literal city, temple, and surrounding buildings. It is my opinion that Christ plainly tells them these literal physical things will be thrown down because these first...
  7. R

    The Conundrum of Zechariah Ch. 14

    This is why I tried to make a point about Preterits adding "the" or "A" with the mention of great tribulation. Some call themselves Amillennial/Partial Preterit, so they try to find agreement between the two by arguing great tribulation Christ says His disciples will be called to endure as...
  8. R

    The Conundrum of Zechariah Ch. 14

    Yes, we are in agreement, and I too understand the living waters of Zechariah as the outpouring of the Holy Spirit man receives through hearing and believing the Gospel of the Kingdom of God through the coming of Christ, the promised Messiah foretold of Old. John 4:10 (KJV) Jesus answered...
  9. R

    The Conundrum of Zechariah Ch. 14

    Yes, Rev 7:14 are saints who have endured "great tribulation" unto death! The Olivet Discourse is directed to the disciples of Christ throughout all ages and makes no mention of apostate Israel, other than to say Israel shall be thrown down and not one stone shall be left standing of the...
  10. R

    The Conundrum of Zechariah Ch. 14

    Both Matthew and Luke record Jesus’s words from the Mount of Olives, but they do so in different ways and with different emphasis. In both the words of Jesus are directed to the Church of what shall be directed toward faithful saints as the Gospel of the Kingdom of God through Christ is being...
  11. R

    The Conundrum of Zechariah Ch. 14

    Can you explain from the Bible how the destruction in 70 AD fits "such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be"? Mark writes that "those days of affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall...
  12. R

    The Conundrum of Zechariah Ch. 14

    Then do you also agree that great tribulation spoken by Christ to His disciples is not about 70 AD?
  13. R

    The Conundrum of Zechariah Ch. 14

    Greetings TS, I am doing well, thank you for asking. Your reply is very helpful because it confirms what I believe Christ was meaning when He says there would be great tribulation for faithful saints in this world. Christ was not speaking of great tribulation that would come against Israel...
  14. R

    The Conundrum of Zechariah Ch. 14

    Don't know what version you're using but according to the Strong's Concordance linked to KJV "the" is NOT there. And in fact "the" great tribulation is found nowhere in KJV of the Bible. Revelation 7:14 (KJV) And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which...
  15. R

    The Conundrum of Zechariah Ch. 14

    The Bible does NOT indicate "A" or "THE" great tribulation. Strong's Concordance confirms this. Nowhere in the Bible can you find (KJV) a or the great tribulation. Why? I believe it's because "great tribulation" is NOT limited to any single event or period throughout history. But is what...
  16. R

    The Conundrum of Zechariah Ch. 14

    When considering "great tribulation" not since the beginning of the world to that particular time, how can 70 AD qualify, since it did not destroy all but eight human souls as the world wide flood in the days of Noah had? How can it be said "as was not since the beginning of the world to this...
  17. R

    The Conundrum of Zechariah Ch. 14

    Do you believe that any other great tribulation imaginable is like nothing ever before or shall ever be again? How can any tribulation event in this world throughout human history be compared with great tribulation that has come against the church as the Gospel of the Kingdom of God is being...
  18. R

    Judgement Seat of Christ for who ?

    We are saved by grace through faith that comes from the power of God when we hear the Gospel of the Kingdom of God proclaimed and spiritually enter therein through Jesus Christ our Lord, believing in Him we repent of our sins and turn to Christ for EVERLASTING life which every born again...
  19. R

    Judgement Seat of Christ for who ?

    I agree! When the temp climbs it's better to end the discussion, because it's so easy in these discussions to retort in kind. When that happens, we no longer resemble Christians debating doctrine, and more like we're doing the bidding of Satan!