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  1. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    I like to say the scriptures weren't written last year in LA or New York for Yankee Doodle Americans. It seems obvious, but is often forgotten, leading to many errors, the trinity being but one. But then again, even in America there has never been the idea that a son can be his own father...
  2. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    As you say, God does not change. Almost paradoxically, part of His not changing is His prerogative to change certain things depending on the choices people make. Jer 18:6-10, 6 O house of Israel, cannot I do with you as this potter? saith the LORD. Behold, as the clay [is] in the potter's...
  3. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    Or we could just as easily say that God does not change in the sense that He will always be whatever Israel needed Him to be. Yes I did misspell YHWH again. You caught me yet again making a mistake. On the other hand you keep making the same mistake every time you tell me that God matters...
  4. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    I take it you've still not researched how the ancient Jews viewed pre-existance? You really should, given that the scriptures were given to them some time ago and written in their terms. They certainly weren't weren't written last year in LA or New York.
  5. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    I'm glad I don't have to stand before you at the end. 1 Cor 4:3-5, 3 But with me it is a very small thing that I should be judged of you, or of man's judgment: yea, I judge not mine own self. 4 For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified: but he that judgeth me is the Lord. 5...
  6. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    Either I wasn't clear (highly possible :)) or you misunderstood. What I said about YHWH is that He would be whatever Israel needed Him to be in order to get them out of Egypt and into the Promised Land. This is in direct contrast with all the other Ancient Near East Gods who had set functions...
  7. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    1 Cor 2:14, But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know [them], because they are spiritually discerned. Where does it say the scriptures don't make sense? It certainly doesn't say that once born again, a person...
  8. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    Not so fast my friend! It is a linguistic fact that "I am" can be translated as "I will be." The Tyndale Bible (the first English translation from Hebrew & Greek) translates it that way. There are other versions that also translate it that way. Understanding the nature of all the other gods...
  9. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    You mentioned my use of the word "with" instead of "in." So why do you mention "the person of the Father" and "the person of the Word?" Those phrases aren't in the scriptures anymore than "they be one WITH us." While astute enough to spot my error of changing "in" to "with," you don't seem as...
  10. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    I see your point. So you and I are not one with Jesus and God. OK. However, you and I (and all other Christians) are actually one person? Or should I say millions of people with one essence to keep with the traditional verbiage? Does that even make any difference, let alone sense? I'm thinking...
  11. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    Since the scriptures were given to the Jews (Rom 3:2), you may want to see what they thought of preexistence. You are coming from a Greek philosophy perspective. I know you wrote a lot more, but it's all from tradition, a dangerously unreliable source indeed. You appear to be OK with that, so...
  12. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    Let's try to go point by point. I quoted 6 verses that said Jesus has both a God and a Father, the same God and Father as you and I have. If Jesus is 100% God, then who is God's God and Father?
  13. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    Well, I've given many verses that call the trinity into question, but I'll try to summarize for you. Verses that say Jesus had a God: (How can Jesus “be God” and “have a God” at the same time?) John 20:17, Jesus saith to her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended unto the Father: but go...
  14. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    It's ironic that John is the goto book for trinity. He stated why he wrote his Gospel, namely: John 20:30-31, 30 And many other signs truly did Jesus in the presence of his disciples, which are not written in this book: 31 But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ...
  15. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    But what does it mean to be one? If being one makes two or more people really one person, then what to we do with John 17:11 and 22? 11 "And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me...
  16. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    I'm thinking that we should figure out who God's God is. Why should we worship a lesser God? Let's get to the big one. :) There's just no end to the confusion caused by making God like 3 in 1 oil.
  17. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    All very true, but where does it say all three are actually one? I mean take John 14:6 for instance; was God talking to Himself? I don't think so. It looks like one guy named Jesus was talking to another guy, his Father, named YHWH. That's two folks there. What's wrong with that? Acts 2:22...
  18. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    Very true. Jesus is the Bread of Life. He says so in John 6:35. Interestingly enough, verse 38 says Jesus does not do his own will, but he does the will of his Father. God has two different wills. So God has two different wills but one is subjugated to the other? Something's wrong with that. Of...
  19. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    Gosh, it took me many weeks to learn about the Greek vs. Hebrew view of personification. You seem to have done it in about 10 minutes. Or, did you do any research at all? I'm thinking that's the case. Assuming that to be true, why would I care at all that you compare my thought to the Greek thought?
  20. Rich R

    A Curious Question For Non-Trinitarians

    Reason numbers 1, 2, and 3 do not understand an image of something. An image is just that, an image. It is not the thing itself. Look at your image in the mirror. Break the mirror and the image goes away. But you're still there. Caesar's image was on a coin, but the coin was not Caesar. We are...