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LOL You are the one arguing that this only applies to people before Christ (so your objection is to yourself), I'm the one arguing that it is a doctrine the Apostles are to teach the Church going forward, and so it applies to all who have been forgiven through faith in Christ, and that salvation...

Well, to start with, the people who made the film think the same way. LOL

“Behold, the days are coming, declares the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah, It's not even relevant : the parable applies to all believers. Jesus said it applies to all those whom God has forgiven, Jesus's disciples, and Jesus says teach it...

The earliest church, for its first hundreds of years, believed it was the narrow way. I'm sure they would not take your opinion into consideration.

Irrelevant. He knows He would leave, and He's leaving instructions for the Church. Did He have no forethought or knowledge He would leave or knowledge that He would need to leave instructions? Was the guy saved by being forgiven? Was that salvation not lost by having the forgiveness rescinded...

The New Covenant is made with the House of Israel, so, obviously, they are, in what ever way pleases you to see it, included under that--and Christ said if you someone is unrepentantly sinning to bring them before the Church, in Matthew 18, and, so, the following parable (the one we are...

Who cares about Paul being there or not? How is that relevant? Christians, to whom this parable applied, existed before Paul. You're not changing the topic. Was the guy saved when he was forgiven all his debt, and was that salvation not lost when the forgiveness was rescinded?

You already admitted the debt forgiven was due to Christ going to the Cross, so, obviously, Christ is projecting into the future when He will already have gone to the Cross, and is leaving instructions behind for that time that is coming (a roughly 2,000 year period). If Christians do or don't...

LOL Irrespectively, what, pray tell, are the Apostles to teach the "disciples" they are "making", if not all things Jesus had taught the Apostles? Matthew 28 20teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you.

Remnants of the House of Israel were the first members of the Church. There aren't two Churches. All the Jewish believers were the Church, then Gentiles joined the Church. Paul also says the Gentile believers are part of the commonwealth of Israel, so...

How is this relevant? Christ knew there would be Churches, and told His Apostles to go and disciple the nations, teaching them the things He taught them--therefore, this parable was to go out to the nations being discipled, therefore it applies to them. I don't understand how you think you're...

LOL So, Jesus cannot speak to the future at all? Jesus says He's going to come back and judge, but that doesn't apply to the Church, because it addresses the future? And Jesus has no ability to address both the disciples who existed then AND disciples who will exist in the future?

if you can wave literally anything that is problematic for your view away as "symbolic", then, for the purposes of our conversations, any objection you raise I will wave away as "symbolic" as well.

1. Oops, you didn't deal with the point I made : this is right after Jesus tells them "bring an unrepentantly sinning brother BEFORE THE CHURCH", so, yes, it has Christians in view. 2. Yeah, Jesus taught His apostles to go disciple the nations, teaching them THIS PARABLE, so it addresses...

So, your view is that the Church was in error for its first few hundred years, so it fought OSAS as a heresy (as part of Gnosticism), but, later, a former Gnostic heretic (Augustine) "restored" the "truth" of OSAS to the Church--not that he Christianized a Gnostic heresy? How does the...

Actually, Christians are in view : 1. This is just after Jesus teaches to bring an unrepentantly sinning brother before the Church. 2. Jesus taught His disciples to teach everything He taught them to the nations ("teaching them to observe all things")--it's for all His disciples to know. 3...

If it couldn't possibly happen, why is Jesus telling us to imagine God doing it? Is this Jesus's pattern--teaching us things that can never happen, telling us to imagine God in ways that are not in keeping with reality (ie, lying about God), and telling His disciples to go teach that lie the...

Apparently it is conditional, but you go in to the verse thinking otherwise, so you reject what is plainly taught by the Lord. 1 Co 10 shows the two (salvation not due to good works, and dying under wrath for sin aftef having been saved) aren't mutually exclusive. We're literally reading a...

This thread is about how the Church dealt with OSAS for the first few hundred years. Obviously, the first few hundred years of Church history isn't found in the Bible, but try your hand at answering Matthew 18, wherein someone is forgiven all their debt, then, after, the forgiveness is...

Yeah, TO HIS PEOPLE/CHILDREN, He will be with them, and I've already demonstrated that that is not a static reality, but people have always been being, and continue to be, added thereto and removed therefrom. That dynamic has never changed. Why don't you want to answer how the unforgiving...