‘Saved by grace’ is probably the biggest Christian nonsense

[Behold]

Why is this tenet of Christianity so disgusting?

"Christ came into the world to save sinners".

That includes you, @Romanov2488

Its includes us all.

See, ""ALL have sinned"...

So, the wonder of Salvation, one of them.. is that God does not give us entrance into His Eternal Family ((based on the Cross of Christ)))..... because we deserve it.

We don't deserve it.

So, its God's Grace, its God's MERCY, its God's LOVE is the only reason that He gave us Jesus on the Cross, so that by this Sacrifice of His Son for all our SIN...... is the ONLY reason we can become a part of God's eternal family, and remain in it., forever.

John 14:6

 

[Matthias]

I can give you the user names of 11 people who say I am doomed or they question if I would be saved....

And that is because I trust in the shed blood of Jesus and my spirit being born again in God rather then

WATER

So shall I add your name to my list??????????????????????

Jesus is the man who has been appointed by God judge.

Why haven’t you been baptized in water?

 

[Rella ~ I am a woman]

Are you so stupid as to not know this person is not going to reply
back to you or anyone else because them who control speech on here
block them from posting long ago? Just wonderin?

When you see someone suddenly stop responding on here
they have been blocked from posting.

Kind of ironic the christians complain about not having free speech
but the truth is they are all alike. If they don't like what you say
they will cut you off from free speech.

I never have been blocked... watch your own back

Jesus is the man who has been appointed by God judge.

Why haven’t you been baptized in water?

I was with water... but that water did not save me.

And before you site Mark 16:16 read it an know what it does and does not say

NASB 1995
“He who has believed and has been baptized shall be saved; but he who has disbelieved shall be condemned.

It only says if you have disbelieved you will be condemned.

WATER does not save. Water does not give a gift of grace. Water does allow you to give testimony to those who witness that it was done..... But if you disbelieve.... watch out ( I know a man who was of believing age in his teens, who was "properly" submersed with several others. The man will be 81 years of age this coming May and
he sat in our kitchen last year and was talking about it and then he said.... "I was immersed baptized in my teens. I have no idea why or what for.")

Yet he believes in God and he believes in Jesus.

 

[Matthias]

I never have been blocked... watch your own back

I was with water... but that water did not save me.

And before you site Mark 16:16 read it an know what it does and does not say

NASB 1995
“He who has believed and has been baptized shall be saved; but he who has disbelieved shall be condemned.

It only says if you have disbelieved you will be condemned.

WATER does not save. Water does not give a gift of grace. Water does allow you to give testimony to those who witness that it was done..... But if you disbelieve.... watch out ( I know a man who was of believing age in his teens, who was "properly" submersed with several others. The man will be 81 years of age this coming May and
he sat in our kitchen last year and was talking about it and then he said.... "I was immersed baptized in my teens. I have no idea why or what for.")

Yet he believes in God and he believes in Jesus.

Acts 8:12 is the model I followed as a pastor.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Acts 8:12 is the model I followed as a pastor.

I personally would follow John 3

water baptism is what we do after we are saved. Not in order to be saved.

 

[Matthias]

I personally would follow John 3

water baptism is what we do after we are saved. Not in order to be saved.

Your point being, I think, that we are baptized in water in obedience to Messiah.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Your point being, I think, that we are baptized in water in obedience to Messiah.

We do all out good works in obedience to messiah. Not just baptism.

 

[Matthias]

I can give you the user names of 11 people who say I am doomed or they question if I would be saved....

I can do the same for you about me.

And that is because I trust in the shed blood of Jesus and my spirit being born again in God rather then

WATER

And that is because I’m not a trinitarian - I’m a Jewish monotheist who trusts in the shed blood of Jesus and born again.

So shall I add your name to my list??????????????????????

So shall I add your name to my list?

 

[Rella ~ I am a woman]

I can do the same for you about me.



And that is because I’m not a trinitarian - I’m a Jewish monotheist who trusts in the shed blood of Jesus and born again.

Well, no one is perfect. I am a trinitarian and a tripartite....We will never understand each other.

So shall I add your name to my list?

Oh sure. That way I will know there are a dozen of you who never expect to meet me in heaven.

 

[Matthias]

Well, no one is perfect. I am a trinitarian and a tripartite....We will never understand each other.

I understand you well enough. I’m an ex-trinitarian.

Oh sure.

Will do, but, for the record, I think it would be wiser for you (and everyone) to leave it in the hands of Jesus, who is himself a Jewish monotheist and the appointed judge.

That way I will know there are a dozen of you who never expect to meet me in heaven.

My inheritance is the earth, not heaven.

 

[Rella ~ I am a woman]

I understand you well enough. I’m an ex-trinitarian.

Oops my bad

Will do, but, for the record, I think it would be wiser for you (and everyone) to leave it in the hands of Jesus, who is himself a Jewish monotheist and the appointed judge.

And what do you have to show that about Jesus.

My inheritance is the earth, not heaven.

Too many dandelions, pigweed , stink bugs and spotted lantern flies.

 

[Matthias]

Then why in the world all the wasted words' of being baptized in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. A baptism in the name of God should suffice.

You’re thinking like a trinitarian. Jesus is thinking like a Jew.

And what do you have to show that about Jesus.

The same scripture you have that shows everyone that about Jesus.

Q. Who and how many persons is his God?

A. The Father. Only one person. Jewish monotheism is unitarian.

Too many dandelions, pigweed , stink bugs and spotted lantern flies.

That’s a low view of what God has promised to his people, including Jesus.

 

[Matthias]

“[Jesus] was a first-century Jewish monotheist.”

(N.T. Wright, Jesus and the Victory of God, p. 652)

There’s nothing unusual or controversial about this @Rella. Trinitarian scholars and theologians have known it for 1700 years.

 

[Gabriel _Arch]

A pedophile molests a child who is atheist or lgbt. In fact there was a child raped at 10 who went and got an abortion. The pedophile later repents and ‘finds Jesus’. The pedophile is now ‘saved’ but the rape victim is not?

Why is this tenet of Christianity so disgusting? Is this seriously the type of critical thinking believers exude? Why is a supreme being so needy and desperate for recognition?

Is this the part where ‘God works in mysterious ways’?

You presume the rape survivor is somehow condemned by that assault?

 

[Rella ~ I am a woman]

You’re thinking like a trinitarian. Jesus is thinking like a Jew.

edited for a bad description of baptism.

The same scripture you have that shows everyone that about Jesus.

Q. Who and how many persons is his God?

A. The Father. Only one person. Jewish monotheism is unitarian.



That’s a low view of what God has promised to his people, including Jesus.

 

[Peterlag]

A pedophile molests a child who is atheist or lgbt. In fact there was a child raped at 10 who went and got an abortion. The pedophile later repents and ‘finds Jesus’. The pedophile is now ‘saved’ but the rape victim is not?

Why is this tenet of Christianity so disgusting? Is this seriously the type of critical thinking believers exude? Why is a supreme being so needy and desperate for recognition?

Is this the part where ‘God works in mysterious ways’?

The hole you dug into and begin from is that salvation has something to do with being a good person. Or certainly not being a bad person. There's nothing like that written in the New Testament. It might be in our culture because it was started by the Catholics. But it is not biblical. Being good or not being good has nothing to do with salvation.

 

[Matthias]

Yet he told them to go and baptize in the name of the Father, the Son and Holy Spirit.

That’s right. What that means to you, a trinitarian, is not what it means to a Jewish monotheist.

Jesus is a Jewish monotheist. That‘s something that we should have in common.

I’m persuaded that the meaning of his command should be understood in that context. You aren’t persuaded that it should, and that‘s what accounts for the difference in our respective beliefs.

 

[Gabriel _Arch]

What do you believe you are saved by? Or do you admit / acknowledge that you are doomed?

BTW,I don't think Romanov is a member anymore. This revival was quite unnecessary given his motives for the OP.

 

[Matthias]

BTW,I don't think Romanov is a member anymore.

I don’t think he was banned. If he wasn’t, he may return.

I don’t know about you but I often write for a wider audience.

This revival was quite unnecessary given his motives for the OP.

I’m limited - by personal choice as a non-trinitarian Christian, and with the knowledge and approval of the CB staff - to the non-Christian forums. I revive threads if / when there is something in them that I want to comment on. Others - some limited to these few forums, as I am, and some who aren’t - do so as well.

Doing so has sparked conversation with others -> something which doesn’t happen often on the board for me.

This conversation took an unexpected turn when someone asked me to judge him -> something which I declined to do (and recommended that everyone also refrain from doing.) I think that’s been beneficial.

I think that’s probably run its course. I’m not interested in discussing the banned topic and the trinitarian, who might or might not be interested in discussing it, is prohibited by board policy from doing so.

A few other members are currently discussing the OP, and might continue to do so, in @Romanov2488‘s absence. I don’t see anything wrong with that.

 

[Rella ~ I am a woman]

That’s right. What that means to you, a trinitarian, is not what it means to a Jewish monotheist.

Well... I know that there is a spirit in heaven we call our Heavenly Father.

I know that there was a spirit that ... according to King Jimmys translation Gen 1 And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

And this very same Holy spirit descended upon Jesus at His baptism while a voice.... ventriloquism perhaps? ...
while Mathew 3 :17 And a voice from heaven said, “This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased.”

So right here we have an amoeba type happening of self division to be in 3 spots at the same time.

And I know that Genesis.

So if there is only 1... then the self divisions are truly amazing.....

Jesus is a Jewish monotheist. That‘s something that we should have in common.

I’m persuaded that the meaning of his command should be understood in that context. You aren’t persuaded that it should, and that‘s what accounts for the difference in our respective beliefs.