A Biblical Lesson on Spiritual Discernment

[rwb]

Please read the post I just made (post #357) to see how the Hebrew grammar can be understood. The "he" in verse 27 does not have to refer to the prince in verse 26, but can refer to the Messiah in verse 26 instead. Hebrew grammar allows for either possibility. That's why I believe his view is viable even though I no longer see it that way and agree with you on this. And I don't think it's worth making that big of a deal about it because he still agrees that Jesus is the one who confirms the new covenant in verse 27.

How is that a viable understanding? Whether 'he' refers to Messiah in vs 26 or the prince that shall come, you still haven't explained how 'he' that shall confirm/strengthen the covenant can be anyone other than Christ! Where in Scripture, not history past can we find Titus or anyone else besides Christ the Messiah confirming/strengthening THE covenant?

Post #307 WPM "He is not the same, in my opinion! There is two princes - one the Messiah, and the other Titus. From my studies, and I have read a lot on this, my position would be the traditional Protestant view over the years."

Titus is NOWHERE found in this passage, he is read INTO the Bible using extrabiblical sources by those who defend the doctrine of Preterism.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

How is that a viable understanding? Whether 'he' refers to Messiah in vs 26 or the prince that shall come, you still haven't explained how 'he' that shall confirm/strengthen the covenant can be anyone other than Christ!

I'm not saying it can be anyone other than Christ! You continue to not understand anything I say! Why? I don't believe you are reading what I'm saying very carefully.

Where in Scripture, not history past can we find Titus or anyone else besides Christ the Messiah confirming/strengthening THE covenant?

NOWHERE! I'm not saying that!

Post #307 WPM "He is not the same, in my opinion! There is two princes - one the Messiah, and the other Titus. From my studies, and I have read a lot on this, my position would be the traditional Protestant view over the years."

Titus is NOWHERE found in this passage, he is read INTO the Bible using extrabiblical sources by those who defend the doctrine of Preterism.

He is NOT saying that Titus is referred to in verse 27! Can you not understand that?

 

[rwb]

I am not a preterist. You whine a lot about how people talk to you and then you LIE about people by calling them preterists when they are not.

No, this is how you whine when I label you Preterit for promoting and defending the Preterit doctrine.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

No, this is how you whine when I label you Preterit for promoting and defending the Preterit doctrine.

I do not promote the preterist doctrine. That is a LIE. Why do you think it's okay to lie? Do you not know that it's a sin? I disagree with preterists on most of their understanding of the Olivet Discourse and the book of Revelation. You obviously don't even know what a preterist is. I'll just call you a preterist since you also believe that some Bible prophecy has been fufilled.

 

[Truth7t7]

There is no mention of any future temple being built in Isaiah 66:1-4. Read the text carefully.

Isaiah 66:1 Thus says the Lord: “Heaven is My throne, And earth is My footstool. Where is the house that you will build Me? And where is the place of My rest?

God is not saying any temple will be built in the future. He is saying heaven is His throne and earth is His footstool, so how can anyone think they can build a house/temple for Him to dwell in when He has no need for one? That's all He's saying there. He's not saying that anyone ever was actually going to do that. He's speaking facetiously there and showing that He has no need for anyone to build Him a dwelling place. There is no mention there of any temple being built in the future.

Yes I believe the worthless daily sacrifice was stopped in 70AD, and this is the very reason many reformed preterist claim "Titus" was Daniel's little horn and Daniel's AOD Matthew 24:15 and the great tribulation Matthew 24:21 were fulfilled in the 70AD Roman Destruction of Jerusalem and its temple

It's my belief Israel-Jerusalem will build a 3rd temple on the temple mound presently held by the Muslims with their Mosque on the site, I believe the Jews will take this site and build the 3rd temple, this will cause a world disturbance and Armies will surround Jerusalem in the time of the gentiles
.
Its my belief that Isaiah 66:1-4 speaks directly of this future temple, that will have renewed animal sacrifice for sin, and yes this is a complet abomination to the cross of Calvary

Will A 3rd Temple Be Built In Jerusalem?

Isaiah 66:1-4 strongly suggest a rebuilt house/temple dedicated to God by the Jews, with renewed animal sacrifice, this will be an "Abomonation" to the Lord and the cross of Calvary, God will send them a strong delusion

Point Of Interest: The word "Delusion" is used 2 times in the KJV, and they are both associated with a house/temple, and it appears that the scripture presented could be "Parallel Readings" of the same event?

Isaiah 66:1-4KJV

1 Thus saith the Lord, The heaven is my throne, and the earth is my footstool: where is the house that ye build unto me? and where is the place of my rest?

2 For all those things hath mine hand made, and all those things have been, saith the Lord: but to this man will I look, even to him that is poor and of a contrite spirit, and trembleth at my word.

3 He that killeth an ox is as if he slew a man; he that sacrificeth a lamb, as if he cut off a dog's neck; he that offereth an oblation, as if he offered swine's blood; he that burneth incense, as if he blessed an idol. Yea, they have chosen their own ways, and their soul delighteth in their abominations.

4 I also will choose their delusions, and will bring their fears upon them; because when I called, none did answer; when I spake, they did not hear: but they did evil before mine eyes, and chose that in which I delighted not.

2 Thessalonians 2:10-11KJV

10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

 

[Truth7t7]

I do not promote the preterist doctrine. That is a LIE. Why do you think it's okay to lie? Do you not know that it's a sin? I disagree with preterists on most of their understanding of the Olivet Discourse and the book of Revelation. You obviously don't even know what a preterist is. I'll just call you a preterist since you also believe that some Bible prophecy has been fufilled.

Can't believe you get away with your foul actions and words on this board, like running around calling posters outright liars, not to mention your many other written actions and words, and you stand "Alone" with my claims, there's nobody on this board like you, the truth

Jesus Is The Lord

 

[rwb]

I'm not saying it can be anyone other than Christ! You continue to not understand anything I say! Why? I don't believe you are reading what I'm saying very carefully.

But you are defending WPM who says it is Titus! If you don't want to be linked with him, stop defending the error! In this passage of Daniel 9 there is no mention of any other Messiah, prince or he that is NOT Christ!

NOWHERE! I'm not saying that!

Than why are you defending someone who does say that?

He is NOT saying that Titus is referred to in verse 27! Can you not understand that?

I quoted him, you can read it for yourself. If WPM is not saying Titus is 'he' in vs 27, am I to understand that he is saying Titus is Messiah, or the prince of the people? If Titus is the prince of the people that too does not come from the text but has to be read into the text from extrabiblical sources which is the only way the Preterit can force their doctrine INTO the Bible.

 

[Truth7t7]

Total nonsense. Isaiah 66:1-4 absolutely makes no mention of any temple actually being built. It's God facetiously asking how could anyone build a house for Him when heaven is His throne and earth is His footstool? He's just illustrating how He doesn't need anyone to build a house/temple for Him, that's all. You're reading things into the text that aren't there. Also, you try to turn a reference to God's temple into some fake temple of God instead, which is another case of twisting the text.

Please Respond Question?

1.) Does Isaiah 66:3 below reference animal sacrifice taking place

Point Of Interest: The word "Delusion" is used 2 times in the KJV, and they are both associated with a house/temple, and it appears that the scripture presented could be "Parallel Readings" of the same event?

Isaiah 66:1-4KJV

1 Thus saith the Lord, The heaven is my throne, and the earth is my footstool: where is the house that ye build unto me? and where is the place of my rest?

2 For all those things hath mine hand made, and all those things have been, saith the Lord: but to this man will I look, even to him that is poor and of a contrite spirit, and trembleth at my word.

3 He that killeth an ox is as if he slew a man; he that sacrificeth a lamb, as if he cut off a dog's neck; he that offereth an oblation, as if he offered swine's blood; he that burneth incense, as if he blessed an idol. Yea, they have chosen their own ways, and their soul delighteth in their abominations.

4 I also will choose their delusions, and will bring their fears upon them; because when I called, none did answer; when I spake, they did not hear: but they did evil before mine eyes, and chose that in which I delighted not.

2 Thessalonians 2:10-11KJV

10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

 

[rwb]

I do not promote the preterist doctrine. That is a LIE. Why do you think it's okay to lie? Do you not know that it's a sin? I disagree with preterists on most of their understanding of the Olivet Discourse and the book of Revelation. You obviously don't even know what a preterist is. I'll just call you a preterist since you also believe that some Bible prophecy has been fufilled.

You promote and defend Preterit doctrine but you don't believe you are a Preterit? And you call me a liar? Gee, wouldn't be calling me a Preterit be an insult for you? I mean since you've called not only I but many of the people posting in these forums much worse, belittling, laughing at others, implying we are stupid, gnostic, deceived etc. etc. etc. why stop at Preterit you can and do so much worse!