Are Jehovah's witnesses real Christians?

[Robert Gwin]

The JW false religion used to believe that Jesus was on a cross.
According to JW's older books, they show pictures of Jesus on the cross.
You can look these images up on Google if you like. Start with the Harp of God.

1927 Picture of Christ on a cross. (Creation; 1927; 2,175,000 ed.; p. 265)

1927 Picture of Christ on a cross. (Creation; 1927; 2,175,000 ed.; p. 336)

1928 Picture of Christ on a cross. (The Harp of God; 1921; 1928 ed.; p. 113)

1929 Picture of Christ carrying a cross. (Life; 1929; 1,000,000 ed.; p. 198)

1929 "Jesus was crucified upon the cross; but it is a well-known fact that, contrary to the custom in respect to the victims of crucifixion, not one bone of his body was broken." (Life; 1929; 1,000,000 ed.; p. 216)​

So it looks like you guys were deceived for a very long time.
Therefore, you cannot be the one true followers of God.

Source:
Doctrinal Flip Flops of Jehovah's Witnesses!



It says right in your own English translation this fact. If you don't believe your own English translation and you favor the original manuscripts that you should not tell people to believe the English translation alone (Seeing it can deceive them with lies).

I already showed you that your JW religion LIED to you with a picture of Jesus having ONE NAIL in his hands and yet your own JW translation on John 20:25 says NAILS in his hands. But your excuse is that even your own English JW translation is not perfect and has errors in it? The translation on your JW website does not say to not trust this translation entirely or give you a warning to not believe it. Therefore, this is a lie if they do not put a disclaimer with a pop up window telling the reader that not all words in this Bible may reflect the originals. Think. They placed that translation on their website for people to believe in it. Are you saying that your JW organization is telling us to believe lies? That's what it sounds like to me.

Make no mistake BH, we still are. We won't be perfect for quite a while yet. May I ask which faith has the absolute truth right now? If you know sir, I would sure like to attend there.

 

[Robert Gwin]

Col 1:16, in talking about Jesus, says that "... All [other] things have been created through him and FOR HIM". If Jesus was Michael the Archangel at the time of creation, would an angel have created all things for himself? Isa 43:7 says God created "everyone ... for my OWN glory...".

If Jesus Christ is Michael the Archangel, how can Mt 25:31 say, "When the Son of man arrives in his glory, and ALL the angels with him, ...". Since "all the angels" would certainly include Michael the Archangel, is it possible that Jesus could return with himself?

Source:
Stumper questions Jehovah's Witnesses do not like to be asked!

Is Jesus Michael
The Archangel?
Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
The Bible tells us that God sent His son to the earth. This means he existed prior to becoming a human here on earth. Knowing how seriously God takes names; no doubt Jesus would have had a name in heaven, yet no mention of Jesus occurred prior to his birth on earth. An angel was very explicit to Mary when he said: Lu 1:30 And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found favour with God. Lu 1:31 And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS.
Jehovah’s Witnesses feel that Jesus’ name in heaven is Michael. Michael is closely associated to Jehovah; and actually has the meaning Who is like God. Michael is the name given to the Archangel and it only occurs 1x in direct application to the Archangel and 4x as a heavenly being; with 3 of those times in Daniel as being Jehovah’s prince, and the other as leading the fight against satan in the battle that cast satan and the demons to the earth. The term Archangel only occurs 2x in the Bible and it was translated from the Grk word ajrcavggeloß Archaggelos
and is defined as: archangel, or chief of the angels Michael then was very high in rank over all the angels; the highest angel. The Bible clearly teaches Jesus is only subject to Jehovah and is above all angels: 1co 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God. also Php 2:9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name
The first prophecy in the Bible occurs at Gen 3:15 which reads: And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel Jehovah was talking to satan, making it known that there would be a seed that would eventually crush him; most of the “Christian” faiths believe this seed to be Jesus. Michael is recorded as clashing with satan more than once and led the attack in which satan was cast to the earth as mentioned in the last paragraph:
Re 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, Re 12:8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. Re 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. Notice how the angels were referred to as his angels, all subject to him. Notice Mat 28:18:And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.



At 1 Thessalonians 4:16 the voice of the resurrected Lord Jesus Christ is described as being that of an archangel, suggesting that he is, in fact, himself the archangel. This text depicts him as descending from heaven with “a commanding call.” It is only logical, therefore, that the voice expressing this commanding call be described by a word that would not diminish or detract from the great authority that Christ Jesus now has as King of kings and Lord of lords. (Mt 28:18; Re 17:14) If the designation “archangel” applied, not to Jesus Christ, but to other angels, then the reference to “an archangel’s voice” would not be appropriate. In that case it would be describing a voice of lesser authority than that of the Son of God.
Soon this will be fulfilled: Re 20:1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. Re 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years. Daniel, after making the first reference to Michael (Da 10:13), recorded a prophecy reaching down to “the time of the end” (Da 11:40) and then stated: “And during that time Michael will stand up, the great prince who is standing in behalf of the sons of [Daniel’s] people.” (Da 12:1) Michael’s ‘standing up’ was to be associated with “a time of distress such as has not been made to occur since there came to be a nation until that time.” (Da 12:1) In Daniel’s prophecy, ‘standing up’ frequently refers to the action of a king, either taking up his royal power or acting effectively in his capacity as king. (Da 11:2-4, 7, 16b, 20, 21) This supports the conclusion that Michael is Jesus Christ, since Jesus is Jehovah’s appointed King, commissioned to destroy all the nations at Har–Magedon. Re 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever. Re 16:14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth (5738) (5625) unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty. Re 16:15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame. Re 16:16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon. The horses mentioned in Chap 6 also reveal it is Jesus and satan. Jesus receiving the crown, and satan taking peace away from the earth:Re 6:2 And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was given unto him: and he went forth conquering, and to conquer. 6:4 And there went out another horse that was red: and power was given to him that sat thereon to take peace from the earth, compare Rev 12:12. The Bible states it will be Jesus leading the way: 2th 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, 2th 1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ
There is more information, but I have tried to keep it simple, informative, and to the point as to why Jehovah’s people believe that the Bible really teaches that Jesus is named Michael in heaven.

 

[Brakelite]

Is Jesus Michael
The Archangel?
Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
The Bible tells us that God sent His son to the earth. This means he existed prior to becoming a human here on earth. Knowing how seriously God takes names; no doubt Jesus would have had a name in heaven, yet no mention of Jesus occurred prior to his birth on earth. An angel was very explicit to Mary when he said: Lu 1:30 And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found favour with God. Lu 1:31 And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS.
Jehovah’s Witnesses feel that Jesus’ name in heaven is Michael. Michael is closely associated to Jehovah; and actually has the meaning Who is like God. Michael is the name given to the Archangel and it only occurs 1x in direct application to the Archangel and 4x as a heavenly being; with 3 of those times in Daniel as being Jehovah’s prince, and the other as leading the fight against satan in the battle that cast satan and the demons to the earth. The term Archangel only occurs 2x in the Bible and it was translated from the Grk word ajrcavggeloß Archaggelos
and is defined as: archangel, or chief of the angels Michael then was very high in rank over all the angels; the highest angel. The Bible clearly teaches Jesus is only subject to Jehovah and is above all angels: 1co 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God. also Php 2:9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name
The first prophecy in the Bible occurs at Gen 3:15 which reads: And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel Jehovah was talking to satan, making it known that there would be a seed that would eventually crush him; most of the “Christian” faiths believe this seed to be Jesus. Michael is recorded as clashing with satan more than once and led the attack in which satan was cast to the earth as mentioned in the last paragraph:
Re 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, Re 12:8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. Re 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. Notice how the angels were referred to as his angels, all subject to him. Notice Mat 28:18:And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.



At 1 Thessalonians 4:16 the voice of the resurrected Lord Jesus Christ is described as being that of an archangel, suggesting that he is, in fact, himself the archangel. This text depicts him as descending from heaven with “a commanding call.” It is only logical, therefore, that the voice expressing this commanding call be described by a word that would not diminish or detract from the great authority that Christ Jesus now has as King of kings and Lord of lords. (Mt 28:18; Re 17:14) If the designation “archangel” applied, not to Jesus Christ, but to other angels, then the reference to “an archangel’s voice” would not be appropriate. In that case it would be describing a voice of lesser authority than that of the Son of God.
Soon this will be fulfilled: Re 20:1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. Re 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years. Daniel, after making the first reference to Michael (Da 10:13), recorded a prophecy reaching down to “the time of the end” (Da 11:40) and then stated: “And during that time Michael will stand up, the great prince who is standing in behalf of the sons of [Daniel’s] people.” (Da 12:1) Michael’s ‘standing up’ was to be associated with “a time of distress such as has not been made to occur since there came to be a nation until that time.” (Da 12:1) In Daniel’s prophecy, ‘standing up’ frequently refers to the action of a king, either taking up his royal power or acting effectively in his capacity as king. (Da 11:2-4, 7, 16b, 20, 21) This supports the conclusion that Michael is Jesus Christ, since Jesus is Jehovah’s appointed King, commissioned to destroy all the nations at Har–Magedon. Re 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever. Re 16:14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth (5738) (5625) unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty. Re 16:15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame. Re 16:16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon. The horses mentioned in Chap 6 also reveal it is Jesus and satan. Jesus receiving the crown, and satan taking peace away from the earth:Re 6:2 And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was given unto him: and he went forth conquering, and to conquer. 6:4 And there went out another horse that was red: and power was given to him that sat thereon to take peace from the earth, compare Rev 12:12. The Bible states it will be Jesus leading the way: 2th 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, 2th 1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ
There is more information, but I have tried to keep it simple, informative, and to the point as to why Jehovah’s people believe that the Bible really teaches that Jesus is named Michael in heaven.

Not another name necessarily. Do not our children inherit our name?
KJV Jeremiah 23:5-6
5 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth.
6 In his days Judah shall be saved, and Israel shall dwell safely: and this is his name whereby he shall be called, THE LORD OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS.

Robert, you and I agree that Jesus was called Michael before He came to this earth. Compare the following...

KJV Revelation 12:7
7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

“The LORD is a man of war: the LORD is his name.”, “The LORD shall go forth as a mighty man, he shall stir up jealousy like a man of war: he shall cry, yea, roar; he shall prevail against his enemies.”, “Or what king, going to make war against another king, sitteth not down first, and consulteth whether he be able with ten thousand to meet him that cometh against him with twenty thousand?”, “... the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.”, “And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.” see Exo. 15:3; Isa. 42:13; Luke 14:31; Rev. 17:14, 19:11

KJV Psalms 24:7-10
7 Lift up your heads, O ye gates; and be ye lift up, ye everlasting doors; and the King of glory shall come in.
8 Who is this King of glory? The LORD strong and mighty, the LORD mighty in battle.
9 Lift up your heads, O ye gates; even lift them up, ye everlasting doors; and the King of glory shall come in.
10 Who is this King of glory? The LORD of hosts, he is the King of glory. Selah.

 

[Robert Gwin]

Your organization places their own words on the same level as Scripture. If your organization is lying to you then they have proven to not be God's true followers and therefore, you are following a destructive cult and that is a salvation issue. Look at the abuses of the JW religion online. People have left the Watch Tower because of the abuse by them. Granted, it is unfortunate many of them abandoned even the Bible, but the point here is that your JW religion is not as you are making it out to be. You can see testimonies of people who came out of the Watch Tower and read their stories of the abuse. That does not sound like the true followers of God to me if they abuse people. How do you discount this kind of thing? Do you just say they are all lying? Watch their testimonies on YouTube and or read about them online. Get the real facts and do not blindly follow your leaders who are lying to you.

1 Thessalonians 5:21 (WEB)
“Test all things, and hold firmly that which is good.”

Do you believe God identifies His people in Scripture BH?

 

[Robert Gwin]

As I said to you before, Catholics idolize the cross.
This is not generally case with those who believe the Bible Alone as their final Word of authority and they seek to obey Jesus as a part of entering the Kingdom.

Idolizing the cross would be bowing down to a cross. In either case, you guys also used to believe in the cross, and so you are only criticizing your own selves. Think. You guys used to use the King James Bible that had the word “cross” in it. This is why you needed to create a new translation that fit your new pet doctrines that popped into your heads.

Perhaps you forgot what the Bible is sir, It is authored by Jehovah, penned by His witnesses for His witnesses BH. The KJV of the Bible is severely altered.

 

[Robert Gwin]

There are many names of God found in the Bible and so this would not be a true statement.

There you have it, you say I say, but only one of us can be correct. Show another name if you are able

 

[Robert Gwin]

In the Bible: We can see a pattern of God preserving copies of His Word, and not the original autographs.

(a) Moses destroyed the original 10 Commandments on tablets of stone (the original autograph) (Exodus 32:19), and yet a copy was perfectly made to replace it (Exodus 34:1-4).​

(b) King Jehoiakim burns the scroll of Jeremiah (Jeremiah 36:22-23), but God had Jeremiah make another copy (Jeremiah 36:27-28).​

(c) Proverbs 25:1 says, “These are also proverbs of Solomon, which the men of Hezekiah king of Judah copied out.” (Proverbs 25:1).​

In the New Testament, Philip heard the Ethiopian eunuch read from a manuscript of Isaiah.

“And Philip ran thither to him, and heard him read the prophet Esaias, and said, Understandest thou what thou readest?” (Acts of the Apostles 8:30).​

Although Scripture does not specifically say this was a copy of Isaiah, and not the original autograph of Isaiah, logic dictates that the most plausible explanation is that the Ethiopian eunuch had a copy of a manuscript of Isaiah (and not the original). For the odds of him just happening to have the original would seem highly unlikely.

Philip calls this copy of Isaiah he possessed as Scripture.

“Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus.” (Acts of the Apostles 8:35).​

2 Timothy 3:16 says all Scripture is given by inspiration of God.
So the copy of this Scripture was inspired by God.

So the belief of “OAO (Original Autograph Only) Proponent” that says that we need to look to the original autograph because it is perfect, and the copies are flawed and full of errors is unbiblical. Believers in God's Word can trust that God has preserved a copy of His Word for us today that is perfect (Which would be consistent in the way God operates involving the preservation of His Word). This then leads us to conclude that there must be a perfect Bible that we can find today. Well... that is if you believe the Bible and not the teachings of men.



I don't have a Watch Tower. You do. Your Watch Tower organization has shown to be liars ten times over. There are tons of ways you can find this out for yourself.

You believe that Jesus rose in a spiritual body. Yet, your JW bible on your own website says this:

Luke 24:39 (New World Translation)
“See my hands and my feet, that it is I myself; touch me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones just as you see that I have.”

So are you going to say this bible does not exist? Are you telling people to not trust the JW translation? If so... I agree. It's a false translation. It’s a false bible.

I am glad that you agree that the Bible does not actually exist. See how progress can be made if you approach things honestly sir.

 

[Robert Gwin]

First, your blind trust in your organization is your downfall.
Many previous JW’s have found reason to doubt the JW organization and left them.
You do not research to see if your JW organization is potentially lying to you.

Second, you guys used to follow the King James Bible before you created your own translation that catered to your Pet Theologies. So if you criticize the King James Bible you are only criticizing your own organization because that was their chosen Bible that they used for a long time in history. This is why your blind trust in the JW organization has not allowed you to see any kind of reason.

Christians come and go sir that is true. Make no mistake however, satan was proved wrong by Jesus, and although the road is narrow and few will be on it, Jehovah will always have people who will stand on His side of the issue.

 

[Robert Gwin]

KJV Exodus 34:5-7
5 And the LORD descended in the cloud, and stood with him there, and proclaimed the name of the LORD.
6 And the LORD passed by before him, and proclaimed, The LORD, The LORD God, merciful and gracious, longsuffering, and abundant in goodness and truth,
7 Keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, and that will by no means clear the guilty; visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children's children, unto the third and to the fourth generation.

Are you saying LORD is another name for Him Brake?

 

[Robert Gwin]

And like Jesus said, He had the authority to lay down his life and to take it back again ! He got that from His Father and like Jesus also said:

John 2:18-22
King James Version

18 Then answered the Jews and said unto him, What sign shewest thou unto us, seeing that thou doest these things?

19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.

20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?

21 But he spake of the temple of his body.

22 When therefore he was risen from the dead, his disciples remembered that he had said this unto them; and they believed the scripture, and the word which Jesus had said.


JESUS SAID, YOU DESTROY HIS BODY, AND IN THREE DAYS HE WOULD RAISE HIS BODY FROM THE GRAVE!!!!!!! wHEN JESUS ROSE FROM TEH DEAD PHYSICALLY, HIS DISCIPLES REMEMBERED HE SAID THIS AND BELIEVED.

JESUS SAID: DESTROY MY BODY AND IN THREE DAYS I WILL RAISE MY BODY FROM THE GRAVE!!!!

DESTROY MY BODY AND IN THREE DAYS I WILL RAISE MY BODY FROM THE GRAVE.

Don't let a man made organization steal your salvation from you by teaching you Jesus body was not raised from the grave!

As I stated sir, I do not side with your watchtower

 

[Robert Gwin]

I have and now you are resorting to lying about things I have written multiple times!!!!!

One of us is for a fact sir. You are unable to do it, because it is simply not a Bible teaching

 

[Brakelite]

Are you saying LORD is another name for Him Brake?

By whose Spirit did Noah peach righteousness to the people of his day? Who spoke to and called Abraham out of Babylon? Who fought with Jacob, and changed his name to Israel?
Who led Israel out of Egypt? Who was in the fire and in the cloud? Who spoke to Moses on the mount? Who covered Moses eyes so he could only see his back, and proclaimed His name as LORD, then gave Moses the tables of stone? Who appeared to and spoke with Joshua? Manoah? So yes. Absolutely I am saying that Yehovah is a correct and proper name for the Son of God.

 

[WalterandDebbie]

Let me ask you Walt, why do you think they chose to alter Jehovah's name in their version, and why do you think it is found in it in it's entirety 4 times sir?

Sir, do you have an answer? and why do you use the name Jehovah as often as you do?

Robert, I thought in post #231 I explained that.

Walter

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Make no mistake BH, we still are. We won't be perfect for quite a while yet. May I ask which faith has the absolute truth right now? If you know sir, I would sure like to attend there.

I believe today we are living in the last days and it is hard to find true believers who are striving to follow Jesus and treat sin as if it can destroy our souls. Why? Well, I believe we are in the last days described in 2 Timothy 3:1-9. There are few who are walking according to His Word. So finding believers of a similar mindset is extremely difficult. But nothing is impossible with God. If we keep seeking and knocking.

Anyways, the faith I describe is simply called believing all of the King James Bible by faith without changing any of it based on what others say. If you allow the Bible to simply speak for itself and you believe ALL of it (even, then you will start to see changes in your life). Romans 10:17 says, Faith comes by hearing, and hearing the Word of God. Hebrews 11:6 says without faith it is impossible to please him (GOD). So start by believing all of the Bible. The Scriptures say, seek ye out the book of the Lord (Isaiah 43:16). Do you have it?

Unfortunately, you have been taught that the King James Bible is inaccurate. But you guys (the JWs) used to use this Bible for a hundred years before you created your own bible translation that caters to your extra biblical pet theologies. This is the real reason you created your JW translation. The King James Bible you guys used for 100 years approximately was not enough because it did not fit the ramblings of your JW leaders.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Is Jesus Michael
The Archangel?
Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
The Bible tells us that God sent His son to the earth. This means he existed prior to becoming a human here on earth. Knowing how seriously God takes names; no doubt Jesus would have had a name in heaven, yet no mention of Jesus occurred prior to his birth on earth. An angel was very explicit to Mary when he said: Lu 1:30 And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found favour with God. Lu 1:31 And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS.
Jehovah’s Witnesses feel that Jesus’ name in heaven is Michael. Michael is closely associated to Jehovah; and actually has the meaning Who is like God. Michael is the name given to the Archangel and it only occurs 1x in direct application to the Archangel and 4x as a heavenly being; with 3 of those times in Daniel as being Jehovah’s prince, and the other as leading the fight against satan in the battle that cast satan and the demons to the earth. The term Archangel only occurs 2x in the Bible and it was translated from the Grk word ajrcavggeloß Archaggelos
and is defined as: archangel, or chief of the angels Michael then was very high in rank over all the angels; the highest angel. The Bible clearly teaches Jesus is only subject to Jehovah and is above all angels: 1co 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God. also Php 2:9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name
The first prophecy in the Bible occurs at Gen 3:15 which reads: And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel Jehovah was talking to satan, making it known that there would be a seed that would eventually crush him; most of the “Christian” faiths believe this seed to be Jesus. Michael is recorded as clashing with satan more than once and led the attack in which satan was cast to the earth as mentioned in the last paragraph:
Re 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, Re 12:8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. Re 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. Notice how the angels were referred to as his angels, all subject to him. Notice Mat 28:18:And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.



At 1 Thessalonians 4:16 the voice of the resurrected Lord Jesus Christ is described as being that of an archangel, suggesting that he is, in fact, himself the archangel. This text depicts him as descending from heaven with “a commanding call.” It is only logical, therefore, that the voice expressing this commanding call be described by a word that would not diminish or detract from the great authority that Christ Jesus now has as King of kings and Lord of lords. (Mt 28:18; Re 17:14) If the designation “archangel” applied, not to Jesus Christ, but to other angels, then the reference to “an archangel’s voice” would not be appropriate. In that case it would be describing a voice of lesser authority than that of the Son of God.
Soon this will be fulfilled: Re 20:1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. Re 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years. Daniel, after making the first reference to Michael (Da 10:13), recorded a prophecy reaching down to “the time of the end” (Da 11:40) and then stated: “And during that time Michael will stand up, the great prince who is standing in behalf of the sons of [Daniel’s] people.” (Da 12:1) Michael’s ‘standing up’ was to be associated with “a time of distress such as has not been made to occur since there came to be a nation until that time.” (Da 12:1) In Daniel’s prophecy, ‘standing up’ frequently refers to the action of a king, either taking up his royal power or acting effectively in his capacity as king. (Da 11:2-4, 7, 16b, 20, 21) This supports the conclusion that Michael is Jesus Christ, since Jesus is Jehovah’s appointed King, commissioned to destroy all the nations at Har–Magedon. Re 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever. Re 16:14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth (5738) (5625) unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty. Re 16:15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame. Re 16:16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon. The horses mentioned in Chap 6 also reveal it is Jesus and satan. Jesus receiving the crown, and satan taking peace away from the earth:Re 6:2 And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was given unto him: and he went forth conquering, and to conquer. 6:4 And there went out another horse that was red: and power was given to him that sat thereon to take peace from the earth, compare Rev 12:12. The Bible states it will be Jesus leading the way: 2th 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, 2th 1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ
There is more information, but I have tried to keep it simple, informative, and to the point as to why Jehovah’s people believe that the Bible really teaches that Jesus is named Michael in heaven.

This is a standard tactic by JWs and false cults. Instead of dealing with the challenge text that refutes your false belief, you run off into other verses skewed from the JW mindset and or from the JW translation.

Again, you first need to deal with these truths before we can discuss these other verses:

Col 1:16, in talking about Jesus, says that "... All [other] things have been created through him and FOR HIM". If Jesus was Michael the Archangel at the time of creation, would an angel have created all things for himself? Isa 43:7 says God created "everyone ... for my OWN glory...".

If Jesus Christ is Michael the Archangel, how can Mt 25:31 say, "When the Son of man arrives in his glory, and ALL the angels with him, ...". Since "all the angels" would certainly include Michael the Archangel, is it possible that Jesus could return with himself?

Source:
Stumper questions Jehovah's Witnesses do not like to be asked!

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Do you believe God identifies His people in Scripture BH?

You are moving on to another point without really addressing my original points first. I am happy to address you point, but you first need to face the fact of the original points I made to you. Once you do so, I will address you point.

I said, I quote:

“Your organization places their own words on the same level as Scripture. If your organization is lying to you then they have proven to not be God's true followers and therefore, you are following a destructive cult and that is a salvation issue. Look at the abuses of the JW religion online. People have left the Watch Tower because of the abuse by them. Granted, it is unfortunate many of them abandoned even the Bible, but the point here is that your JW religion is not as you are making it out to be. You can see testimonies of people who came out of the Watch Tower and read their stories of the abuse. That does not sound like the true followers of God to me if they abuse people. How do you discount this kind of thing? Do you just say they are all lying? Watch their testimonies on YouTube and or read about them online. Get the real facts and do not blindly follow your leaders who are lying to you.” Quote by: Bible Highlighter.​

My points broken down that you need to address or explain are:

• Has your Watch Tower organization ever lied to it’s followers?
• Have their been abuses inside the JW religion whereby it forces many to leave the Watch Tower?
• The JW organization has lied to all people (even now).

Again, to prove that the JW organization is lying to people even now: Compare nails (plural) in his hands written in the JW Translation for John 20:25 and compare that with the ONE NAIL in his hands as displayed by the JW picture at JW.org. You can see even see previous JW books of showing how Jesus was on a cross. Now, you guys don’t believe that? So you guys are not consistent in what you believe. Your beliefs change with time. If you truly had the truth back then, then it would be true today.

Look at the testimonies online of those who left the Watch Tower and the abuse that has happened to them. If the JW organization truly was of an organization by God, then people in your JW religion would not have been abused on such a massive scale. There are stories after stories of the abuse by the Watch Tower upon their own people. All I can do is encourage you to read their testimonies online. Type into Google… ex JW testimonies or do so at YouTube. Be informed and don’t just blindly follow your cult leaders. Remember what happened to the followers of Jim Jones?

Jim Jones - Wikipedia

Anyways, here is a place to start reading.

Ex-Jehovah’s Witnesses

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Perhaps you forgot what the Bible is sir, It is authored by Jehovah, penned by His witnesses for His witnesses BH. The KJV of the Bible is severely altered.

Then the JW’s are in error for 100 years if that is the case because they used to use the KJB for 100 years approximately.
Think. Why did they use the KJB? Because that was the only Bible for hundreds of years until Westcott and Hort (Who were into Catholicism) showed up and created their New Testament Greek translation. Westcott and Hort hated the King James Bible. They created their English translation (the ASV) in 1901. You guys (the JW’s) did not come out with your own translation NT (1950), and complete bible (1961). So you came late into the game basing your NT off the work of two pro Catholic men and who were into the occult. Your JW translation only was created to fit your pet theologies that are extra biblical. You use the Westcott and Hort text but not even the ASV totally agrees with your translation. Your translation is biased to your extra biblical beliefs. We know that the words of the Watch Tower are not on the same level of Scripture because their history is filled with the JW founder being immoral by sleeping around, and lying (in court - which is documented), and failing to make accurate prophecies multiple times.

 

[Webers_Home]

.
Continued From No.254

• John 3:5-6 . . . Jesus answered: Most truly I say to you: Unless anyone is
born from water and spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. What
has been born from the flesh is flesh, and what has been born from the spirit
is spirit.

Some years ago I asked an experienced Jehovah's Witness if he was born of
the spirit. He answered no, plus added that he did not expect to undergo a
spirit birth in either this life or the next because his hope is a kingdom on
Earth.

My friend was somehow unaware that everything Jesus and Nicodemus
discussed in John 3:3-8 was related to earthly things.

• John 3:12 . . . If I have told you earthly things and yet you do not believe,
how will you believe if I tell you heavenly things?

In other words: the kingdom of God, to which Jesus related the spirit birth,
will be on Earth rather than up in Heaven.

It's both tragic and ironic that the Watchtower Society's rank and file door to
door missionaries go worldwide advertising a kingdom that they themselves
will never be allowed to enter: not because they didn't work hard enough to
deserve it, but simply because they were led to believe themselves exempt
from the spirit-birth requirement.
_

 

[Bible Highlighter]

There you have it, you say I say, but only one of us can be correct. Show another name if you are able

First, in Hebrew, some different names of God would be:

#1. Yᵊhōvâ (a.k.a. YHWH) (a.k.a. Tetragrammaton) (Example: The English word Jehovah in Exodus 6:3 - KJB).
#2. ĕlōhîm (Example: The English word God in Genesis 1:1 - KJB).
#3. 'ēl (Which sounds like a shortened version of ĕlōhîm) (Example: The English word God in Genesis 35:1 - KJB).
#4. ăḏōnāy (Example: The English word Lord in Genesis 18:31).
#5. šaday (a.k.a. Shaddai) (Example: The English words the Almighty - Numbers 24:4).

Note 1: This is not meant to be an exhaustive list nor an exhaustive set of examples.

Note 2: You can search these words above by typing into Google the name of God provided as the first word as shown in the list above along with the following words Strong’s Number.

Here is an example of what this would look like:

But it’s even more than this:

Second, (while this may not be you) some believers wrongfully assume that the KJB translators made a mistake on translating YHWH (Yᵊhōvâ) (a.k.a. Tetragrammaton). They think that just because they translated that word differently is somehow mistake. However, we see that the writers of Scripture themselves had used different words to describe God involving the same event between 2 Samuel 5:19 and and 1 Chronicles 14:10.

2 Samuel 5:19 says: "And David inquired of the LORD" (Jehovah) but in 1 Chron. 14:10 the same verse reads: "And David enquired of God".
Both of these verses describing the same event each use a different Hebrew word for the name of God.

Seven is the number of spiritual perfection and in the KJB the name JEHOVAH is found 7 times.

Three in one is the Trinity and we have the name JAH found only once. Eight is the number of a new beginning, and it is through the redeeming grace of JEHOVAH that we are made new creatures in Christ and begin a new life in Him.

In addition to this, another interesting thing found only in the King James Bible is the name JEHOVAH in capital letters is found four times in the Old Testament - Exodus 6:3; Psalms 83:18; Isaiah 12: 2 and 26:4. Likewise the name JESUS standing in capital letters all by itself and not in a longer phrase is found only four times in the New Testament - Matthew 1:21, 25; Luke 1:31 and 2:21. Four is the number of the earth and JEHOVAH God Himself has come to this earth to save His people from their sins.

The name of JESUS in capital letters is found in two phrases "And set up over his head his accusation written, THIS IS JESUS THE KING OF THE JEWS." (Matthew 27:37) and in John 19:19 "And Pilate wrote a title, and put it on the cross. And the writing was, JESUS OF NAZARETH THE KING OF THE JEWS." This brings the total to six and six is the number of man. Thus Jehovah God our Redeemer (7) came to earth (4) as a man (6).

So, only in the King James Bible do we have these precious truths revealed. This is just one of the many marks of God on this Book that shows it is indeed His inspired word in the English language.

Sources used:
Another King James Bible Believer
King James Pure Bible Search WebChannel Server

While this example on biblical numerics may not float your boat and make you go,“Wow,” there are others examples of biblical numerics in the King James Bible that will blow your mind and show that it is indeed a divine book.

Check out these two videos here by Pastor Mike Hoggard:

Please keep in mind that I do not believe everything Mike Hoggard says or teaches. I do not agree with his view on salvation. I also reject his belief on the Dual Nature Theology, as well. But Mike’s teaching on biblical numerics is simply a showing of the facts involving the numbers in the King James Bible. He will present the numbers in the KJB and it should blow the mind of any reader out there (After hearing his case).

This truth on biblical numerics is not just in the English bible, but it can also be demonstrated in the original languages, as well.

Now, some confuse this with numerology (Which is false). Numerology is about living your life under the guidance by numbers (Which is wrong). I believe biblical numerics helps us primarily to see that God's Word is divine in origin. In this case, it helps to prove the KJV is God's Word.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I am glad that you agree that the Bible does not actually exist. See how progress can be made if you approach things honestly sir.

Now you are putting words in my mouth. You say that I believe that the Bible does not exist but that is not what I said and nor is it what I believe. I believe the Bible exists today and it exists in the preservation of God’s Word by the power of God with the King James Bible. I believe the KJB is perfect and without error and is God’s Word and that the KJB does exist today and is His Word.