Are Jehovah's witnesses real Christians?

[Keiw]

I agree! MOst people know God the Father is God.

But interestingly enough, the majority of people who call themselves evangelicals do not believe Jesus is God!

In all the world, it is only followers of Jesus Christ and believe th eBible is the literal word of God given to ALL mankind, that believe in the deity of Jesus.

Jesus didnt know--John 17:3-- He teaches the Father is THE ONLY TRUE GOD--John 4:22-24--Warns all that their God is false, then teaches-The TRUE followers would worship the Father in spirit and truth.--Paul warns all their God is false at 1 Cor 8:5-6, then names only the Father as God.

 

[Keiw]

There you have it.
This sounds exactly like something satan would say.

Except its 100% facts.

 

[Keiw]

Well those are the biblical truths. UNless of course you reinterpret the bible to suit your agenda.

But those are the more minor of false teachings the Watchtower holds to.

The big one that sends all JW's to the lake of fire to suffer for all eternity is the fact they teach you Jesus did not rise from the daed!

We know Jesus rose from the dead 100%. You believe errors translated in over what Jesus teaches.

 

[Robert Gwin]

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Continued From 1079


• Col 2:9 . . It is in him that all the fullness of the divine quality dwells
bodily.

The Greek word for "divine quality" is theóteetos which means: divinity

Seeing as how theóteetos is modified by the Greek definite article "teés" then
what we're looking at here in Col 2:9 isn't nondescript divinity, but rather
the divinity. In other words: we're looking at all the fullness of Jehovah's
divinity. So then Jesus' qualities aren't merely like a god's, they're the real
McCoy.
_

Sometimes it helps reading the surrounding verses Weber, notice who raised him up from the dead sir verse 12. Several versions of Bibles alter the passages to support a belief. They try to make Jesus God, as you are implying, but if Jesus is God what hope do we have? You can't trust the Bible, he definitely lied, which of course is a serious sin, I sincerely hope you are in error sir. I do have more information on it if you are interested.

 

[Robert Gwin]

Well that still won't save you. You strain at Christians gnats to swallow watchtower camels. YOu seem to want to be so prim and proper and correct, but yet you use a name that m ay not even be close to Gods name.

Which doesn't matter now anyway for Yahweh has given Jesus the name that is above all names-even Yahweh!

Not at all sir, ever read this?: 1co 15:27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith * all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
Or more understandably: For God “subjected all things under his feet.” But when he says that ‘all things have been subjected,’ it is evident that this does not include the One who subjected all things to him.

 

[Robert Gwin]

Even the most biblically illiterate can give a fairly accurate answer as to who Satan is. and your point?

That is a logical answer Ron, and at one time I would have agreed with you, but I find that so many do not understand the simplest of words, especially when dealing with the Bible. Saved is likely one of the most misunderstood words ever. I fully believe that you and I might answer the same when asked who satan is, so lets put it to the test, who is satan sir? Give me a fairly detailed synopsis of who you believe he is.

 

[Robert Gwin]

Too bad because Jesus never said--"means" that is a lousy mistranslation from the lousy mistranslators of the New Word Mistranslation.

How bout your selected version, do you believe it Ron?: Lu 22:19 And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Jesus didnt know--John 17:3-- He teaches the Father is THE ONLY TRUE GOD--John 4:22-24--Warns all that their God is false, then teaches-The TRUE followers would worship the Father in spirit and truth.--Paul warns all their God is false at 1 Cor 8:5-6, then names only the Father as God.

So Jesus is called God in John1
Is called equal to God in John 2
says He existed as god in Phil 2
is God with us in Luke and God in human flesh in timothy.

So to you he is a false Gopd! OK then.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

We know Jesus rose from the dead 100%. You believe errors translated in over what Jesus teaches.

No you do not believe He rose 100% for some to be resurrected- what was laid down has to stand again- HIs body.

John 2:

18 Then answered the Jews and said unto him, What sign shewest thou unto us, seeing that thou doest these things?

19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.

20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?

21 But he spake of the temple of his body.

22 When therefore he was risen from the dead, his disciples remembered that he had said this unto them; and they believed the scripture, and the word which Jesus had said.

Teh Jews did not destroy (kill) an invisible spirit creature but a flesh and blood person.

So Jesus said if you destroy this flesh and blood person, in three days I will raise up this flesh and blood person.

Thios are not HIs exact words, but based on verse 21 we know that is what He declared

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Not at all sir, ever read this?: 1co 15:27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith * all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
Or more understandably: For God “subjected all things under his feet.” But when he says that ‘all things have been subjected,’ it is evident that this does not include the One who subjected all things to him.

Yes I love that passage! but that has nothing to do with Philippians 2 and the Father giving Jesus the name which is above all names!

It means the Father is above the Son, but as it says in Phil. 2 it pleases the Father to give Jesus the name even above YHWH. That is the bible as written and unaltered.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

That is a logical answer Ron, and at one time I would have agreed with you, but I find that so many do not understand the simplest of words, especially when dealing with the Bible. Saved is likely one of the most misunderstood words ever. I fully believe that you and I might answer the same when asked who satan is, so lets put it to the test, who is satan sir? Give me a fairly detailed synopsis of who you believe he is.

Well I understand why you would find it hard for people to understand the simplest of words Robert.

Satan:

4th highest being in the universe.
the highest created being.
the anointed cherub who covered the throne
the serpent of Gen.
the dragon of rev.
the god of this world
the deceiver of the brethren
the angel of light

He is a being not an idea

 

[Ronald Nolette]

How bout your selected version, do you believe it Ron?: Lu 22:19 And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me.

Yes I do, knowing it in its context and historical setting and the particular pita he took and the particular cup of wine he took at the Passover seder.

 

[Keiw]

So Jesus is called God in John1
Is called equal to God in John 2
says He existed as god in Phil 2
is God with us in Luke and God in human flesh in timothy.

So to you he is a false Gopd! OK then.

In the Greek lexicons-The true God called Ho Theos( God) in the 2nd line at John 1:1, plain theos( a god) in the last line, clearly showing the word was not being called the true God, same in 2Cor 4:4--Plain Theos( god) to satan and Ho Theos( God) to the true God--translating works the same at both spots. a god is correct at John 1:1--your scholars know its fact. They are the deceivers.

 

[Keiw]

No you do not believe He rose 100% for some to be resurrected- what was laid down has to stand again- HIs body.

John 2:

18 Then answered the Jews and said unto him, What sign shewest thou unto us, seeing that thou doest these things?

19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.

20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?

21 But he spake of the temple of his body.

22 When therefore he was risen from the dead, his disciples remembered that he had said this unto them; and they believed the scripture, and the word which Jesus had said.

Teh Jews did not destroy (kill) an invisible spirit creature but a flesh and blood person.

So Jesus said if you destroy this flesh and blood person, in three days I will raise up this flesh and blood person.

Thios are not HIs exact words, but based on verse 21 we know that is what He declared

Peter says he was killed in the flesh and raised in the spirit.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

In the Greek lexicons-The true God called Ho Theos( God) in the 2nd line at John 1:1, plain theos( a god) in the last line, clearly showing the word was not being called the true God, same in 2Cor 4:4--Plain Theos( god) to satan and Ho Theos( God) to the true God--translating works the same at both spots. a god is correct at John 1:1--your scholars know its fact. They are the deceivers.

Yes in JOhn 1:1 the Father is given teh definite article. that designated He is a particular person. Jesus is God (without an indefinite article) in that He is equally divine as the Father.

God the Father is above the Son but is not more "god" or divine than Jesus is. Just like I may be above you (example only) but that does not make you less human than me. I may hold a higher position, but we are 100% equal in our nature,

That is the same with the Father and Son and Spirit. They all hold separate positions, they are all separate "people" but they are all 100% equally divine in their nature and only those three share that same essence.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Peter says he was killed in the flesh and raised in the spirit.

Well then if we are to take it as English says then either Jesus or Peter is lying.

But neither one is lying.!

Jesus declared destroy HIs physical body and in three days what they destroyed He would raise up!

Now in Romans 8:

Romans 8:11
But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
It says the Spirit raised Jesus from the dead.
Now for 1 Peter 3:18

1 Peter 3:18
King James Version

18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:


Now that little word in, is also translated as "by" when it serves as an adjective or adverb. So by allowing the rest of SCripture speaks about the resurrection of Jesus from teh dead- by is the correct translation here. I know most newer translations use "in" but hermeneutically and exegetically that is wrong.

 

[Keiw]

Yes in JOhn 1:1 the Father is given teh definite article. that designated He is a particular person. Jesus is God (without an indefinite article) in that He is equally divine as the Father.

God the Father is above the Son but is not more "god" or divine than Jesus is. Just like I may be above you (example only) but that does not make you less human than me. I may hold a higher position, but we are 100% equal in our nature,

That is the same with the Father and Son and Spirit. They all hold separate positions, they are all separate "people" but they are all 100% equally divine in their nature and only those three share that same essence.

In 1822 a Greek scholar( A.Kneeland) translated the NT, comparing Greek to English side by side to prove to the world-a god was correct-19 other translations had a god, 3 had was divine-Rejected by trinity clergy because the truth exposes them as false religion.

 

[Keiw]

Well then if we are to take it as English says then either Jesus or Peter is lying.

But neither one is lying.!

Jesus declared destroy HIs physical body and in three days what they destroyed He would raise up!

Now in Romans 8:

Romans 8:11
But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
It says the Spirit raised Jesus from the dead.
Now for 1 Peter 3:18

1 Peter 3:18
King James Version

18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:


Now that little word in, is also translated as "by" when it serves as an adjective or adverb. So by allowing the rest of SCripture speaks about the resurrection of Jesus from teh dead- by is the correct translation here. I know most newer translations use "in" but hermeneutically and exegetically that is wrong.

Matt 6:33 proves trinity religions are false, as are their translations.

 

[Robert Gwin]

So Jesus is called God in John1
Is called equal to God in John 2
says He existed as god in Phil 2
is God with us in Luke and God in human flesh in timothy.

So to you he is a false Gopd! OK then.

What hope do we have then Ron? Best research why your version states conflicting statements. You do realize what your version states about what happens to those who do not know God upon Jesus' return, correct?

 

[Robert Gwin]

Yes I love that passage! but that has nothing to do with Philippians 2 and the Father giving Jesus the name which is above all names!

It means the Father is above the Son, but as it says in Phil. 2 it pleases the Father to give Jesus the name even above YHWH. That is the bible as written and unaltered.

Show me, as I know of no version that says that.