Are Pastors Teaching a Watered-Down Gospel?
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In the 19th century Americans started moving west and three institutions went with them. There was vaudeville, traveling entertainment. There was lyceum, traveling education and culture. And there was the itinerant preacher, offering a new style of preaching called "hell fire and brim stone". It was very entertaining, only loosely based on scripture, and pastors didn't even try to compete. Instead they switched to preaching public morality and philosophy. Eventually an entire generation grew up not knowing the first thing about the religion they claimed to believe. That is why most Christian churches don't teach doctrines, and most members don't know what they are supposed to believe.
2 Timothy 4:
3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
2 Timothy 4:
3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
MetalMike
Active Member
The biggest problem with churches in the US is that the focus is on numbers (i.e., how many folks can we get in the seats) vice focusing on Christ and the Gospel. A couple of months ago, I read Francis Chan's Letters To The Church, and it was quite eye-opening. I felt like he was describing my former church to a tee.
My former church is the biggest one in my county. There is a "main campus" and 6 smaller "campuses" in various parts of the county. The "campuses" meet at junior high or high schools except for the "main campus", which got a building 2 years ago. The pastor at the main campus in the sermon right before the new building opened compared the opening of the new building to him being like Moses leading people to the promised land. I was so offended by that sermon that I almost left for good at that point. This new building is what caused my former church to shift focus on numbers and money. The pressure is on for the other "campuses" to find buildings as well, and the elders won't do it unless they have X amount of people attending on a regular basis. Their cure for more numbers? Let's get rid of the cross so as not to offend newcomers. Let's jazz up the worship band. Prayer requests are responded to with scripted answers by email or text, and they are now phasing out prayer in favor of small groups, with the mentality being why have prayer when we can plug people into small groups? Let me give an example - there is a lady at my former church who is dealing with stage 3 cancer. She put in a prayer request for healing and instead of being prayed for, was given the option of joining a small group instead!
We finally left that church about a month ago, and are now attending a church that is very Christ-centered. It's like a breath of fresh air after seeing how my former church has changed in the last couple of years.
My former church is the biggest one in my county. There is a "main campus" and 6 smaller "campuses" in various parts of the county. The "campuses" meet at junior high or high schools except for the "main campus", which got a building 2 years ago. The pastor at the main campus in the sermon right before the new building opened compared the opening of the new building to him being like Moses leading people to the promised land. I was so offended by that sermon that I almost left for good at that point. This new building is what caused my former church to shift focus on numbers and money. The pressure is on for the other "campuses" to find buildings as well, and the elders won't do it unless they have X amount of people attending on a regular basis. Their cure for more numbers? Let's get rid of the cross so as not to offend newcomers. Let's jazz up the worship band. Prayer requests are responded to with scripted answers by email or text, and they are now phasing out prayer in favor of small groups, with the mentality being why have prayer when we can plug people into small groups? Let me give an example - there is a lady at my former church who is dealing with stage 3 cancer. She put in a prayer request for healing and instead of being prayed for, was given the option of joining a small group instead!
We finally left that church about a month ago, and are now attending a church that is very Christ-centered. It's like a breath of fresh air after seeing how my former church has changed in the last couple of years.
The simplicity of the activities pattern in Acts 2.41-42 is the best to stick to...
MetalMike
Active Member
And that's a very fair point, @farouk. From my experience, and I realize that some of you here have been going to church and believed longer than me (15 years), but I see the simplicity of church being overanalyzed and made complicated by humans. The temple laws that were in place when Jesus was on Earth are proof of that. Today's church isn't that different from the days of Jesus' time on Earth, except we're obviously not sacrificing animals at an altar.
Hebrews is a wonderful Epistle which shows so clearly in so many ways how the New Testament order centred on the Person and Work of Christ is better - a keyword - than the Old.
Sometimes clergy with vested interests can easily drag people back into the Old system in their understanding of things, though.
First comes a believing in His existence and then on toward Him?
"But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him." Heb 11:6
Perhaps at the first most simply believe in God without knowing much of anything about Him. That was certainly true in my own case. My first memory of God's presence occurred when at 6 years of age I was water baptized in the Catholic Church. I had no doubt it was God yet I knew nothing at all. I did at that time consciously choose to pursue Him further and I did as a Catholic.
Then another verse that comes mind is this one:
"No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day." John 6:44
I was drawn toward God in that first recalled episode, but the results were limited, or at least they seemed so, for a long time. The real drawing to God occurred some years after I stopped actively practicing my Catholicism. Then I really did begin to make some more definite and long range type of choices. But... as you have said, even that very first recalled episode caused me to make a choice.
Preacher4Truth
Well-Known Member
Same issue in Canada and other countries as well. It's not limited to here, although some would like to look at it this way. The reason Canada is run amok with socialism is due to the failure of the church there.
Church people here are like American church people. Very conservative. But because we live in a harsher climate the tendency is towards a common health care system...like countries in Scandinavia. Very similar. Warmer countries tend to let people fend for themselves.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
Watering down “love”? Seems to me, many more pastors are muddying the waters, hating up the gospel, and exgesising it up the ying yang.
Love God
Love your neighbor as yourself
Go forth
Repeat
Love God
Love your neighbor as yourself
Go forth
Repeat
Preacher4Truth
Well-Known Member
I lived in Canada for a time. There was very little conservatism noted there, they were sold out to liberalism. As for your argument that warmer climates allow for people to fend for themselves? Venezuela? South America? Cuba? China which is like here? Your argument falls short as these are socialist countries. There are more.
Have to say your argument sounds like an excuse that because it is cold we sold out to socialism.
There are many wonderful pastors in this world teaching God's Word in truth. Some tv and radio evangelists who broadcast their sermons before an audience of viewers became popular through motivational messages and has cast a dark shadow on preachers in general...and their motive seems to be more of a sales pitch to get donations than a sermon.
God is raising up HIS CHURCH even now and He is separating the wheat from the tares.
But in regard to pastors preaching a watered down sermon....well those who listen to him or her are accountable for putting up with it! We are to study the Word for ourselves and to be skilled in the knowledge of it. So if your pastor is in err then confront it and correct it and don't let it gain any power.
God is raising up HIS CHURCH even now and He is separating the wheat from the tares.
But in regard to pastors preaching a watered down sermon....well those who listen to him or her are accountable for putting up with it! We are to study the Word for ourselves and to be skilled in the knowledge of it. So if your pastor is in err then confront it and correct it and don't let it gain any power.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
Who would decide who can and who cannot get on TV to teach/preach? It is not much different than this forum, except for the money...
"Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you." Matt 7:6
Everyone of us began as a beast and/or with beastly natures. When we respond to a person who is not really hungry and thirsty for the righteousness of God [Matt 5:6] we are wasting our time and theirs. Such a beast who is not hungry and thirsty in such manner is simply not interested. Leave him alone. God does not force feed anyone... and we are to be like Him, are we not?
"I said in mine heart concerning the estate of the sons of men, that God might manifest them, and that they might see that they themselves are beasts.
For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man hath no preeminence above a beast: for all is vanity." Ecc 3:18-19
Also consider these words:
"And if the house be worthy, let your peace come upon it: but if it be not worthy, let your peace return to you.
And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear your words, when ye depart out of that house or city, shake off the dust of your feet"
Matt 10:13-14
"She [Wisdom] hath killed her beasts; she hath mingled her wine; she hath also furnished her table" Prov 9:2
Today on the morning shows they are saying that some RC Schools are now not allowed to say Father or Son and something else is banned as well. talk show host was real happy about it saying that the RCC has to move with the times. Times of Satan leading he world astray the poor Satanist fools are peddling a lie for a trend that is of Satan.
That's a good point - I honestly hadn't thought of that. I should have looked at the dissension among Christians to realize that there would be no way to really fix it. I had just had such a hard time that I would never want anyone to go through what I did. We were first generational Christians and I had zero discernment. I was a sitting duck for every evangelist on TV and radio. I don't know why God allowed me to go through it. It took a lot of wrong roads before I finally burned everything but the bible in the wood stove.
Churches do seem so compromised - we've also seen a lot of pride. We went to a bible study and my husband & I didn't take to the pastor right away since he was gruff and rather rough around the edges.. But as the study progressed I really grew after I had been in a slump and we came to respect that Pastor. He is a simple country pastor but he does not veer from the truth. Even when three members disagreed with his teaching he stayed steady.
Who concerns me are pastors such as Osteen and others - I think they're misleading a lot of people. Sometimes a charismatic preacher can draw people in.
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