Are you predestined or did you make a choice?

[Scott Downey]

here is what foreknew means in Romans 8:29 not what you have claimed about from Strongs/Thayers

Strong's Concordance
proginóskó: to know beforehand
Original Word: προγινώσκω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: proginóskó
Phonetic Spelling: (prog-in-oce'-ko)
Definition: to know beforehand
Usage: I know beforehand, foreknow.

4267 proginṓskō (from 4253 /pró, "before" and 1097 /ginṓskō, "to know") – properly, foreknow; used in the NT of "God pre-knowing all choices – and doing so without pre-determining (requiring) them"

προγινώσκω; 2 aorist 3 person singular προέγνω; perfect passive participle προεγνωσμενος; to have knowledge of beforehand; to foreknow: namely, ταῦτα, 2 Peter 3:17, cf. 2 Peter 3:14, 16; τινα, Acts 26:5; οὕς προέγνω, whom he (God) foreknew, namely, that they would love him, or (with reference to what follows) whom he foreknew to be fit to be conformed to the likeness of his Son, Romans 8:29

God foreknows His people, as in foreknows them as His people before they are born as God leaves nothing to chance.
He determined Christ to have brothers and we are adopted into His family. Sure, it is willingly but only due to the creature being created in Christ as a new creation, only then do they believe as the Holy Spirit then teaches them about Christ. You must be born again to enter that family, otherwise you have enmity, (hatred) against the true God and Christ. The unsaved world Jesus says, hates him.

How do we get saved, by confession of Christ as Lord and believing God raised Him from the dead. Someone with enmity, not born again first, will have no desire to do that.
v9 here is very descriptive of that, notice 'holy calling' , 'not of our works', so then God's works, purpose given to us to be in Christ before the beginning of time, or in other words at the beginning, this was determined for us, who do end up believing to have this holy calling, and this is not for the unsaved world.
2 Timothy 1:8-10
New King James Version

8 Therefore do not be ashamed of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me His prisoner, but share with me in the sufferings for the gospel according to the power of God,

9 who has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace which was given to us in Christ Jesus before time began,

10 but has now been revealed by the appearing of our Savior Jesus Christ, who has abolished death and brought life and immortality to light through the gospel,

Then we see it again here, very clearly spoken, how God chose us from the beginning to believe, with written reason of His Great Love towards US, not all did God love like this, or else all would be born again. Being born again is not of your will, and it comes first. John 1:13, they received Christ due to God creating them as new creations in Christ because of His great Love for them, and not the others.
Fight it all you want; you cannot win against God. God caused us to be born again due to his love and mercy towards those He has foreknown, foreknew them, not what they did in life. That is why he made the choices He made; God foreknew them personally. It is not about their deeds. We don't get saved by our works. Ephesians 2, 1 Peter 1, Titus 3,

1 John 4:9
In this the love of God was manifested toward us, that God has sent His only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through Him.

And might here is not a possibility as we think of the meaning of that word today, this means that we will absolutely live thru Him.

2 Thessalonians 2
13 But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God from the beginning chose you for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth, 14 to which He called you by our gospel, for the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. 15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast and hold the traditions which you were taught, whether by word or our epistle.

16 Now may our Lord Jesus Christ Himself, and our God and Father, who has loved us and given us everlasting consolation and good hope by grace, 17 comfort your hearts and establish you in every good word and work.

 

[Scott Downey]

1 John 4:19
New King James Version
19 We love Him because He first loved us.

Otherwise, we would hate Christ and God.


1 John 4:9
New King James Version
9 In this the love of God was manifested toward us, that God has sent His only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through Him.

'WE MIGHT LIVE' is an english phrase, the greek though says zaō
G2198 - zaō - Strong's Greek Lexicon (kjv) (blueletterbible.org)

The KJV translates Strong's G2198 in the following manner: live (117x), be alive (9x), alive (6x), quick (4x), lively (3x), not translated (1x), miscellaneous (2x), variations of 'live' (1x).

 

[Ferris Bueller]

There is nothing in any passage that jesus chooses us on the basis we choose Him. or that He picks us because we pick Him first.

He chooses us on the basis of our faith, not on the basis of us having chosen him first, and certainly not on the basis of our works.
He provides the free gift of faith through the testimony of the Holy Spirit (faith comes by hearing), and if we receive and retain that testimony he chooses us on the basis of that faith.

"11Yet before the twins were born or had done anything good or bad, in order that God’s plan of election might stand, 12not by works but by Him who calls, she was told, “The older will serve the younger.”d 13So it is written: “Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated.”e" Romans 9:11-13​

Esau represents gaining the inheritance in the natural, expected way, the way of works. Jacob, on the other hand, represents gaining the inheritance by way of election via faith in the promise, apart from any consideration of works whatsoever.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

No one can come to Christ unless the Father draws them to Jesus. So it is either merely empotionasl impulses, self righteous religion or mere playing.

And so what that means is no one can successfully come to Christ unless the Father draws them. For surely there are many who approach God without God drawing them. Somewhat like the Pharisees of John's day:

"7But when John saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his place of baptism, he said to them, “You brood of vipers, who warned you to flee from the coming wrath?" Matthew 3:7​

 

[Scott Downey]

He chooses us on the basis of our faith, not on the basis of us having chosen him first, and certainly not on the basis of our works.
He provides the free gift of faith through the testimony of the Holy Spirit (faith comes by hearing), and if we receive and retain that testimony he chooses us on the basis of that faith.

"11Yet before the twins were born or had done anything good or bad, in order that God’s plan of election might stand, 12not by works but by Him who calls, she was told, “The older will serve the younger.”d 13So it is written: “Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated.”e" Romans 9:11-13​

Esau represents gaining the inheritance in the natural, expected way, the way of works. Jacob, on the other hand, represents gaining the inheritance by way of election via faith in the promise, apart from any consideration of works whatsoever.

God chose us for salvation from the beginning of time to have faith, and this agrees in many scriptures.

2 Thessalonians 2
13 But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God from the beginning chose you for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth, 14 to which He called you by our gospel, for the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. 15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast and hold the traditions which you were taught, whether by word or our epistle.

16 Now may our Lord Jesus Christ Himself, and our God and Father, who has loved us and given us everlasting consolation and good hope by grace, 17 comfort your hearts and establish you in every good word and work.

 

[Scott Downey]

9 who has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace which was given to us in Christ Jesus before time began,

So before time began in eternity past, God foreknew His people.
Because of that, His grace was given to us to come to Christ, we were granted to come to Christ, and not the others.

John 6, the ones who remained with Christ in belief, God had granted them their continued faith, otherwise Christ would have eventually offended them, and they would have left unbelieving. Christ says it is God's Spirit that gives life, no man knows the Lord of Life as Christ unless God grants them to know Himself.

61 When Jesus knew in Himself that His disciples complained about this, He said to them, “Does this offend you? 62 What then if you should see the Son of Man ascend where He was before? 63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life. 64 But there are some of you who do not believe.” For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were who did not believe, and who would betray Him. 65 And He said, “Therefore I have said to you that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted to him by My Father.”

66 From that time many of His disciples went back and walked with Him no more. 67 Then Jesus said to the twelve, “Do you also want to go away?”

68 But Simon Peter answered Him, “Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life. 69 Also we have come to believe and know that You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”


Luke 10
21 In that hour Jesus rejoiced in the Spirit and said, “I thank You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and prudent and revealed them to babes. Even so, Father, for so it seemed good in Your sight. 22 All things have been delivered to Me by My Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father, and who the Father is except the Son, and the one to whom the Son wills to reveal Him.”

 

[Ronald Nolette]

He chooses us on the basis of our faith, not on the basis of us having chosen him first, and certainly not on the basis of our works.
He provides the free gift of faith through the testimony of the Holy Spirit (faith comes by hearing), and if we receive and retain that testimony he chooses us on the basis of that faith.

"11Yet before the twins were born or had done anything good or bad, in order that God’s plan of election might stand, 12not by works but by Him who calls, she was told, “The older will serve the younger.”d 13So it is written: “Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated.”e" Romans 9:11-13​

Esau represents gaining the inheritance in the natural, expected way, the way of works. Jacob, on the other hand, represents gaining the inheritance by way of election via faith in the promise, apart from any consideration of works whatsoever.

Spiritualizing the passage does no good. god chose Jacob. Paul was simply showing that the choice is Gods! Remember Jacob got the inheritance be deception!

If you can't see that here (because you are busy mysticizing the text) the restr of 9 may help:

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.

18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.

19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?

20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?

21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?

22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:

23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,

24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?

this is not hard language. It clearly shows teh choice is Gods.

whyt it is hard for you is that you are seeking to salvage something of your flesh and show you could do something. We can't until gopds changes our heart ot make us willing.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

And so what that means is no one can successfully come to Christ unless the Father draws them. For surely there are many who approach God without God drawing them. Somewhat like the Pharisees of John's day:

"7But when John saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his place of baptism, he said to them, “You brood of vipers, who warned you to flee from the coming wrath?" Matthew 3:7​

Well you can choose to believe the Word of god or not!

But ytou sound like Satan to Eve: "Did god really say that"? YOu just changed it a mite to say did God really mean no one? If He didn't why do you think He inspired Matthew to write it that explicit and plain????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????