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Baptism is it required?

Discussion in 'Christian Theology Forum' started by Alpha and Omega, Jun 30, 2008.

  1. treeoflife

    treeoflife New Member

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    Hard to talk with someone when all they do is say that their own arguements are in the Spirit and everyone else is using flesh, isn't it? Perhaps now you realize that saying so means absolutely nothing.Stop telling people they use flesh and that you are inspired by the Holy Spirit, and come up with some valid arguements. I think the collective body of Christ on these boards would overwelmingly agree (being a vast majority), that you are the one who has a plethora of false and misconstrued doctrine.Stop saying it. It isn't an argument. Quite frankly, you are full of yourself, and not the Spirit of God.
     
  2. watt

    watt New Member

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    IN THE NAME OF THE FATHER AND OF THE SON AND OF THE HOLY SPIRITHERE I AM AGAIN AGAIN TO SHARE THE TRUTH OF GOD LOVE(treeoflife;55990)
    Hard to talk with someone when all they do is say that their own arguements are in the Spirit and everyone else is using flesh, isn't it? Perhaps now you realize that saying so means absolutely nothing.Stop telling people they use flesh and that you are inspired by the Holy Spirit, and come up with some valid arguements. I think the collective body of Christ on these boards would overwelmingly agree (being a vast majority), that you are the one who has a plethora of false and misconstrued doctrine.Stop saying it. It isn't an argument. Quite frankly, you are full of yourself, and not the Spirit of God.
    OH NO....I AM INSPIRED BY THE HOLY SPIRIT OF GOD.WELL... in your post you HIGHLIGHT part of this :-Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in CHRIST JESUS, because through CHRIST JESUS the LAW of THE SPIRIT who gives life has set you free from the LAW of sin and death. For what the law was powerless to do because it was weakened by the sinful nature, GOD did by sending his own SON in the likeness of sinful humanity to be a sin offering. And so he condemned sin in human flesh, 4 in order that the righteous requirement of the LAW might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the sinful nature but according to THE SPIRIT (Roman 8:1-4)I believe you've keep this in your heart all this while....SO HOLD IT VERY FIRM ... DONT LET IT GO. GOD BLESS ALLAMENFROM WATT
     
  3. treeoflife

    treeoflife New Member

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    Thank you. By God's Word, it's quite firm. I have complete security in God's power to save, and His Word to keep all those who have called on His Name, by His Spirit. The only reason that I can see for you to think such advice or confirmation is necessary is by the same arrogance that you use to claim you are inspired by the Holy Spirit.Let me ask you, are you 100% right, 100% of the time?If you are not 100% right 100% of the time (if you can concede to that notion, perhaps), does that not mean that you do, in fact, act in the flesh since the Spirit of God is never wrong, and you are?If, however, you do not concede to the fact that you can be, have been, and will be wrong... and you still hold fast to the notion that you are 100% right 100% of the time... then perhaps you can write us a new epistle. If you are 100% right, your word must be as good as God's (because you are inspired by the Holy Spirit, of course).So, which is it... are you 100% right 100% of the time, not capable of sin just like God... or are you guilty of acting on the flesh?
     
  4. watt

    watt New Member

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    IN THE NAME OF THE FATHER AND OF THE SON AND OF THE HOLY SPIRITHERE I AM AGAIN AGAIN TO SHARE THE TRUTH OF GOD LOVE(treeoflife;55996)
    Thank you. By God's Word, it's quite firm. The only reason that I can see for you to think such advice or confirmation is necessary is by the same arrogance that you use to claim you are inspired by the Holy Spirit.Let me ask you, are you 100% right, 100% of the time?If you are not 100% right 100% of the time (if you can concede to that notion, perhaps), does that not mean that you do, in fact, act in the flesh since the Spirit of God is never wrong?If, however, you do not concede to the fact that you can be, have been, and will be wrong... and you do hold fast that you are right 100% of the time, then perhaps you can write us a new epistle. If you are 100% right, your word must be as good as God's (because you are inspired by the Holy Spirit, of course).So, which is it... are you right 100% of the time... or are you guilty of acting on the flesh?
    Well...I AM JUST LIKE YOU, NORMAL HUMAN BEING...AND I AM NOW SHARING THE SUFFERING OF JESUS ON THE CROSS(SPIRITUALLY) .It is so good for you 've noticed that....as we are talking about GOD WHO IS OUR CREATOR, THE ALMIGHTY AND THE MOST HOLY. THEREFORE WE MUST ALWAYS REALLY SURRENDER OURSELF, OUR HEART, MIND AND SOUL TO HIS WILL....THEN ONLY WE WILL EXPERINCE HIS LOVE, HIS MERCY....FOR HE PROMISE TO BE WITH US HERE ON EARTH....IF ANY ONE USE FLESH....FOR SURE THOSE WHO IS INSPIRED BY HOLY SPIRIT WILL CLEARLY SEE "THE SHADOW OF THE DARKNESS" WITHIN HIS ACTION..BUT JESUS DID NOT ASK TO JUDGE THEM...BUT TO HELP THEM CARRY THE CROSS WITH TRUTH AND LOVING KINDNESS. AS WE ALL KNOW JESUS IS THE LIGHT OF THE WORLD AND WHO EVER FOLLOW HIM WILL NOT WALK IN THE DARKNESS BUT HAVE LIGHT AND LIFE...AND THOSE WHO ARE INSPIRED BY THE HOLY SPIRIT WILL KNOW WHAT KIND OF SPIRIT IS WITHIN OTHERS. HE KNOWS THE DARKNESS AND HE REJECTED AND OVERCOME THE DARKNESS...HE ENJOY IN GOD GLORY....AND HE WILL PRAY FOR EVERYBODY SURROUNDING HIM...MAY GOD BLESSAMENFROM WATT
     
  5. treeoflife

    treeoflife New Member

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    I agree with you on this part. More often then not it does require that we receive confirmation of the Truth from God's Spirit (the Spirit He has put in us). What you need to stop doing, however, is telling people they dont use that Spirit. You need to stop saying that other people who disagree with you use the flesh, unlike yourself who uses the Holy Spirit. It is arrogant, proud, and profoundly false. I have seen you say many times, falsly, "You're using the flesh" and claim that you yourself are inspired of the Spirit. This only comes off as ignorant and arrogant (because it is indeed both), and it's not an argument either.As you said... we interpret things by God's Word and the Spirit He has given us to determine what is the flesh and what is the Spirit... AMEN! If that is the case (and we agree, it is the case), and we do indeed see that someone is using the flesh... is our doctrine alone in accordance with God's Spirit and His Word not enough to win the matter? Must we repeat it, over and over? Must we continually say that we use the Spirit and the person we disagree with uses the flesh? Does saying a mantra over, and over, and over the way you do, actually help your case, prove it, or in any way get others to see it? No, no, no. It doesn't, help at all. In fact, it can only hurt it your case, and it can only hurt you. It brings nothing to the discussion at all (it proves nothing and only scorns those you speak with).As you said, you are only human. Now, I am taking you at your word that you truly believe that when you say it. You are only human, and can make mistakes like any person. That being so, what if you are, in fact, making a mistake? And, in making a mistake, what if you continue in the mantra that everything you say is of the Spirit, and anyone who disagrees with you uses the flesh? Do you not deceive yourself? You see, it only brings harm to you, and never good because it never helps your case, and can only potentially bring yourself harm. It is useless. What is of the Spirit is of the Spirit whether we claim it is or whether we don't. If it is it is, if it isn't it isn't. Let all men be liars and only God be true.Once you do this, I think you will find (like many of us have) that there is a good amount of what you are saying that is simply not true... and there is also an amount of what you are saying that is true, too. Hopefully we can all sort that out together.
     
  6. verzanumi24

    verzanumi24 Advanced Member

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    (Alpha and Omega;54012)
    Is baptism required for our salvation or is it a sign of loyalty? The way that I like to see things is if Jesus did it then we should also. He got baptized, so should we?P.S. I was baptized into the Catholic church when I was very young but I suspect that does not count. Mark 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.This verse I am particularly interested in. We see that we are saved by believing and baptism but we are damned by unbelief. I am confused really. Please shed some light on the subject.
    The question I would ask is why would one not want to get baptized if they have had a change of mind? A person that claims to have repent of his past ways, but refuse to get baptized have not really repented. Baptism is a public and out ward expression of what has taken place in the mind of the individual.
     
  7. watt

    watt New Member

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    IN THE NAME OF THE FATHER AND OF THE SON AND OF THE HOLY SPIRITHERE I AM AGAIN TO SHARE THE TRUTH OF GOD LOVE(treeoflife;55999)
    I agree with you on this part. More often then not it does require that we receive confirmation of the Truth from God's Spirit (the Spirit He has put in us). What you need to stop doing, however, is telling people they dont use that Spirit. You need to stop saying that other people who disagree with you use the flesh, unlike yourself who uses the Holy Spirit. It is arrogant, proud, and profoundly false. I have seen you say many times, falsly, "You're using the flesh" and claim that you yourself are inspired of the Spirit. This only comes off as ignorant and arrogant (because it is indeed both), and it's not an argument either. As you said... we interpret things by God's Word and the Spirit He has given us to determine what is the flesh and what is the Spirit... AMEN! If that is the case (and we agree, it is the case), and we do indeed see that someone is using the flesh... is our doctrine alone in accordance with God's Spirit and His Word not enough to win the matter? Must we repeat it, over and over? Must we continually say that we use the Spirit and the person we disagree with uses the flesh? Does saying a mantra over, and over, and over the way you do, actually help your case, prove it, or in any way get others to see it? No, no, no. It doesn't, help at all. In fact, it can only hurt it your case, and it can only hurt you. It brings nothing to the discussion at all (it proves nothing and only scorns those you speak with).As you said, you are only human. Now, I am taking you at your word that you truly believe that when you say it. You are only human, and can make mistakes like any person. That being so, what if you are, in fact, making a mistake? And, in making a mistake, what if you continue in the mantra that everything you say is of the Spirit, and anyone who disagrees with you uses the flesh? Do you not deceive yourself? You see, it only brings harm to you, and never good because it never helps your case, and can only potentially bring yourself harm. It is useless. What is of the Spirit is of the Spirit whether we claim it is or whether we don't. If it is it is, if it isn't it isn't. Let all men be liars and only God be true.Once you do this, I think you will find (like many of us have) that there is a good amount of what you are saying that is simply not true... and there is also an amount of what you are saying that is true, too. Hopefully we can all sort that out together.
    SEE!!! YOU DID NOT UNDERSTAND HOW ORIGINAL MAN WAS CREATED..Now...Look, Please dont use FLESH AGAIN AND AGAIN...as you said "(the Spirit He has put in us).".... NO WAY FOR THE SPIRIT IS SIMPLY PUT IN YOU OR SIMPLY GIVEN TO YOU IF YOU DID NOT FOLLOW JESUS COMMANDMENT AND INSTRUCTION.!! IF THE SPIPIT IS IN YOU OR GIVEN TO YOU....YOU WILL SEE THE LIGHT OF CHRIST, YOU WILL FOREVER WILL BE WITH JESUS THE SON OF GOD, AND GOD WILL GIVE YOU WISDOM... THERE IS NO SHADOW OF DARKNESS IN YOU...THIS IS WHAT IS SPIRIT ISALL ABOUT!!!THOSE WHO DID NOT BELIEVE IN JESUS AND DID NOT DO WHAT HE INSTRUCTED ANDCOMMANDED US TO DO....SORRY HE WILL NEVER HAVE THE SPIRIT. WHAT HE HAVE IS ONLY SOUL...NOT SPIRIT.PLEASE ...GO AND LOOK FOR THOSE WHO HAVE THE AUTHORITY IN HEAVEN AND ONEARTH TO BAPTIZE YOU "IN THE NAME OF THE FATHER AND OF THE SON AND OF THE HOLY SPIRIT"... THEN ONLY YOU WILL SEE THE TRUTH AND UNDERSTAND GOD LOVINGKINDNESS.MAY GOD FORGIVE ALL OUR SIN.AMENFROM WATT
     
  8. treeoflife

    treeoflife New Member

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    You are hopeless. Thank you denominational brainwashing. Nevertheless, there is free will, and the choice is yours.
     
  9. watt

    watt New Member

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    IN THE NAME OF THE FATHER AND OF THE SON AND OF THE HOLY SPIRITHERE I AM AGAIN TO SHARE THE TRUTH OF GOD LOVE(treeoflife;56132)
    You are hopeless. Thank you denominational brainwashing. Nevertheless, there is free will, and the choice is yours.
    Thanks...for saying I AM HOPELESSS. That GOOD....at least you voice up something in you.TO MAKE THING CLEAR TO YOU...I AM HERE TO SHARE THE TRUTH OF GOD LOVE....I AM NOT BRAIN WASH YOU OR ANY BODY HERE..BUT TO REVEAL THE TRUTH TO YOU AND OTHERS, FOR THE TRUTH THAT WILL SET YOU AND ME FREE.IN MY PREVIOUS POST IT IS ABOUT LORD JESUS AND THE KINGDOM OF GOD. HERE, THERE IS NO SUCH THINGS AS WHAT YOU HAVE SAID "Thank you denominational brainwashing. Nevertheless, there is free will, and the choice is yours"... For your info. please read my post #146, which related with JOHN 7:63 AND MATTHEW 28:18-20. IF WE DID NOT BELIEVE WHAT JESUS HAVE SAYS....THEN WE ARE NOT BELONG TO JESUS AND HIS KINGDOM....MAY GOD FORGIVE ALL OUR SINAMENFROM WATT
     
  10. Jordan

    Jordan Active Member

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    (treeoflife;56132)
    You are hopeless. Thank you denominational brainwashing. Nevertheless, there is free will, and the choice is yours.
    What's wrong with you? Yes, Watt is brainwashed by many lies. But nobody in this world is hopeless. As long there is breathe, there is hope. Don't make a mistake that God can't even opened the eyes of a soul who is blinded by Satan.
     
  11. watt

    watt New Member

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    in The Name Of The Father And Of The Son And Of The Holy SpiritHere I Am Again To Share The Truth Of God Love(thesuperjag;56193)
    what's Wrong With You? Yes, Watt Is Brainwashed By Many Lies. But Nobody In This World Is Hopeless. As Long There Is Breathe, There Is Hope. Don't Make A Mistake That God Can't Even Opened The Eyes Of A Soul Who Is Blinded By Satan.
    See!! In My Previous Post I Share About God Love...but You Guys....hahaha!! The Flesh Is Fighthing With The Spirit Within Both Of You...the Truth Is There.... In Your Own Words!!!May God Bless AmenFrom Watt
     
  12. treeoflife

    treeoflife New Member

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    (thesuperjag;56193)
    What's wrong with you? Yes, Watt is brainwashed by many lies. But nobody in this world is hopeless. As long there is breathe, there is hope. Don't make a mistake that God can't even opened the eyes of a soul who is blinded by Satan.
    You're right. I should have said, "You seem hopeless," or, "This seems hopeless." Not, "You *are* hopeless." :shepard:
     
  13. watt

    watt New Member

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    In The Name Of The Father And Of The Son And Of The Holy SpiritHere I Am Again To Shere The Truth Of God Love(treeoflife;56263)
    you're Right. I Should Have Said, "you Seem Hopeless," Or, "this Seems Hopeless." Not, "you *are* Hopeless." :shepard:
    In My Previous Post I Quoted The Word Of God As He Said:-"truly I Say To You: Unless One Is Born Again Of Water And Spirit He Cannot Enter The Kingdom Of God" (john3:5)Well Now..as Your Brother Is Christ I Would Like To Ask You This Question.It Look Like That You Guys Did Not Believe The Word Of God In John 3:5 As Quoted Above.. And You Guy Keep Telling Me I Am Hopeless....for Me Whatsoever You Say About Me..it Up To Your Own Consideration. But!! Why You Claim You Are Christian If You "rejected The Word Of God In John 3:5"?? See The Truth!! This Is Exactly What Jesus Will Ask You On The Last....please Repent For The Kingdom Of God Is Here Among Us.May God Forgive All Our SinAmenFrom Watt
     
  14. treeoflife

    treeoflife New Member

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    (watt;56372)
    In The Name Of The Father And Of The Son And Of The Holy SpiritHere I Am Again To Shere The Truth Of God LoveIn My Previous Post I Quoted The Word Of God As He Said:-"truly I Say To You: Unless One Is Born Again Of Water And Spirit He Cannot Enter The Kingdom Of God" (john3:5)Well Now..as Your Brother Is Christ I Would Like To Ask You This Question.It Look Like That You Guys Did Not Believe The Word Of God In John 3:5 As Quoted Above.. And You Guy Keep Telling Me I Am Hopeless....for Me Whatsoever You Say About Me..it Up To Your Own Consideration. But!! Why You Claim You Are Christian If You "rejected The Word Of God In John 3:5"?? See The Truth!! This Is Exactly What Jesus Will Ask You On The Last....please Repent For The Kingdom Of God Is Here Among Us.May God Forgive All Our SinAmenFrom Watt
    I was born of water when I was brought into this world by my mother and father. You on the other hand *think* you were born of water (which Jesus speaks of) when you were baptized, but you were not. We were both born of water when we were brought into this world. You misunderstand the Word of God when you say that the water Jesus speaks of is a water baptism performed by John the Baptist. The water being spoken by Jesus is that of our fleshly birth (when our mother and father conceive us). We must be born of water, and also of spirit. The water birth, again, is not talking about baptism that John the Baptist was performing... Jesus was speaking about coming into this world, as a living soul. We must both be born (brought into existance in this life), and we must be born again by God's Spirit.We have an expression that says that a woman's "water breaks" just before giving birth. Regardless, however, when speaking of the water birth Jesus said, "What is born of the flesh is flesh..." He was speaking of our conception into this world.I'll say it agian, and then I am done here. We must be born of water (brought into this world, in this life), and we MUST BE BORN OF GOD'S SPIRIT. Being born of God's Spirit takes place when we are saved, by grace, through faith in Him. The water baptism that we perform, which John the Baptist performed, is not required for salvation--it is a work. We are saved by grace, through faith; not of works, lest any man boast. If you continue to teach that we must be baptized in the baptism that John the Baptist baptized in, you err greatly, knowing not the scriptures or the power of God.
     
  15. watt

    watt New Member

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    IN THE NAME OF THE FATHER AND OF THE SON AND OF THE HOLY SPIRITHERE I AM AGAIN TO SHARE THE TRUTH OF GOD LOVE(treeoflife;56516)
    I was born of water when I was brought into this world by my mother and father. You on the other hand *think* you were born of water (which Jesus speaks of) when you were baptized, but you were not. We were both born of water when we were brought into this world. You misunderstand the Word of God when you say that the water Jesus speaks of is a water baptism performed by John the Baptist. The water being spoken by Jesus is that of our fleshly birth (when our mother and father conceive us). We must be born of water, and also of spirit. The water birth, again, is not talking about baptism that John the Baptist was performing... Jesus was speaking about coming into this world, as a living soul. We must both be born (brought into existance in this life), and we must be born again by God's Spirit.We have an expression that says that a woman's "water breaks" just before giving birth. Regardless, however, when speaking of the water birth Jesus said, "What is born of the flesh is flesh..." He was speaking of our conception into this world.I'll say it agian, and then I am done here. We must be born of water (brought into this world, in this life), and we MUST BE BORN OF GOD'S SPIRIT. Being born of God's Spirit takes place when we are saved, by grace, through faith in Him. The water baptism that we perform, which John the Baptist performed, is not required for salvation--it is a work. We are saved by grace, through faith; not of works, lest any man boast. If you continue to teach that we must be baptized in the baptism that John the Baptist baptized in, you err greatly, knowing not the scriptures or the power of God.
    From WATT:HA..HAHA..HA...VERY SORRY MY FRIEND... that is your own understanding again...again and again you use FLESH NOT THE SPIRIT...SORRY YOU DONT HAVE THE SPIRIT AT ALL.You know WHAT??...READ PROPERLY!!!That why JESUS said, TRULY I SAY TO YOU, NO ONE CAN SEE THE KINGDOM OF GOD UNLESS HE IS BORN AGAIN FROM ABOVE."( JOHN 3:3) MAY GOD FORGIVE ALL OUR SINAMENFROM WATT
     
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