HammerStone said:
I agree,
and perhaps the thread is not a 'let's bash Catholics about Mary' thread. We have enough of them.
Rex,
just for information:
What an astonishing mystery! There is one Father of the universe, one Logos of the universe, and also one Holy Spirit, everywhere one and the same; there is also one virgin become mother, and I should like to call her "Church."262
The 'one virgin become mother' that Clement is referring to is the Church not Mary. Try reading his words in context. It's the same analogy of the Church as our mother that I referred to earlier.
Back to the topic:
In my experience there are several areas where serious misunderstandings by Protestants arise, and can cause frustration, when trying to discuss issues with Catholics. Below I have tried to identify some of these in simple terms (perhaps over simplified).
Doctrine and Practices
It is useful to distinguish between doctrine and practices.
Doctrine is what we believe concerning faith and morals and once formally defined it becomes dogma and is unchangeable.
Practices can and do change.
Doctrines are universal.
Practices can be local and “inculturated”.
Practices can become corrupt and wrong, and in need of reform – which does happen.
Magisterial Teaching
What is authentic Magisterial teaching on an matter of doctrine?
The Magisterium is the teaching office of the Catholic Church and consists of the Bishops and Pope. They alone can pronounce on matters of doctrine.
Not everything they say are infallible statements. It depends on the topic and purpose of any document they produce.
Infallible definitions of doctrines are clearly signalled as such by words such as I/we declare and define….
Only documents that originate from the Magisterium can be considered as fully authoritative, such as documents of Ecumenical Councils, Papal Apostolic Constitutions and the Catechism of the Catholic Church.
There is a huge amount of authoritative material on the Vatican web site (www.vatican.va), including the Catechism of the Catholic Church, the documents of Vatican II and the encyclicals etc. of recent Popes
Writings of theologians, lay apologists, canonised Saints or non magisterial publications such the New Catholic Encyclopaedia, Wikipedia and various websites run by Catholics are not Magisterial documents. These writings have value depending on the quality of the source they originate from but they do not necessarily correctly reflect Catholic beliefs and practices.
It is extremely irritating to be told that I must believe "X" because it says so on some web site run by Joe Smith who is a Catholic.
Even the statements of individual Bishops are not in themselves Magisterial documents and can be wrong or misleading (though one would hope not).
Words
Catholics sometimes use words in a way that is different from the way that Protestants use them.
Words change over time and the meaning of a word in an old document may not be the same as current usage
The originals of Magisterial documents are normally in Latin (or sometimes Italian). Sometimes translations are poor, especially of older documents.
If those discussing with Catholics would bear these points in mind it would be helpful.
