Being 'Born Again'

[Karl Peters]

1.) If you are not born again, then you are not in Spiritual Union with "God, who is a Spirit".... So yes, being born again is the Spiritual Fruit of the Cross of Christ and the only certain proof that a person has become a real CHRISTian.

2.) God who is Christ, "would that all would come to the knowledge of Salvation", and "you must be born again".

3.) Can you stop being born? ?.... Can you stop being born again?? ... Only if you caused it.

4.) Begin born again, is the result of : "repenting from Unbelief to Faith in Christ", and then your "Faith is counted as righteousness by God".

5.) Jesus IS Eternal Life. So, if He is in you, then you are joined spiritually to Eternal Life, which is the same as becoming : "One with God".

6.) I teach my students that the Apostles were born again, in John 20:22-24. And the reason i do is because Paul teaches that : "he that hath not the Spirit of God (in him) does not belong to God".. And in John 20:22-24, we read that Jesus gave them the Spirit., telling them to " receive" it... And they did.
Later, in Acts 2:38, you have the imbuement of Power (the special anointing) that was given to Peter, during Pentecost, when the Comforter (Holy Spirit) was poured out, and you have... "tongues are for a sign to the JEWs", 1 Corinthians 14:22 and 1 Corinthians 1:22.... being given to the Disciples in front of a large group of Jews who saw all this, heard it, and 3000 JEWS believed in Jesus The JEW, and were later water baptized.

The above post is pretty much right, but when actually compared to the Bible it's missing something and that something is actually hearing the words of God spoken to us!!!

For example: If I read the Bible do I rind out that "Jesus IS Eternal Life"? -- Well that is kind of right - specifically we read:

Jn 6:63 “It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing; the words that I have spoken to you are spirit and are life.

Well - that is pretty much the same thing, but not exactly!! I mean saing 'Jesus, Jesus, Jesus' is not the same thing as actually hearing His Holy Spirit speak His words to your spirit!!!

Of course I am not against away one saying 'Jesus, Jesus, Jesus', but just saying that name Jesus is not actually the same thing as hearing His Holy Spirit speak words to your spirit!!! - The actually hearing Jesus speaks to you through His Holy Spirit to your spirit is critical!! That is Eternal Life to you!!!

And that is why when Jesus talked to Nicodemus about what it means to be "Born Again" He explained that it meant:

Jn 3:8 “The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”

And if you look at the above post, which again is kind of ok, is missing the "hearing" part.!!

Now the above post covers "faith', and I like that. However it tell you:

Rom 10:17 So faith comes from hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ.

Now there is something in the post I really don't like and it is: "Begin born again, is the result of : "repenting from Unbelief to Faith in Christ"

Now there is something very important about repenting!!! But a person does not really repent of "Unbelief". A person repents of their ways!!! Oh- some person might see that as "Unbelief", but no way the person see it that way. What actually happens is that we as people come across the reality that we really don't know how to solve our problems. It's like 'I have these problems and I need help with them, so who could help me?' When you get to that situation, the Lord might then be able to get through to you. He has been standing there trying to get through to us the whole time, but as long as we think 'we know' we are not going to pick up what He has to say to us!! So we don't repent of "Unbelief" but we repent of our ways!! Maybe that sound like I am getting picky, but it is not.

I remember an excellent testimony I heard from a really neat lady that came to know the Lord. She had been working in Vegas and her life was a mess. She was looking to kill herself and took a lot of drugs and started driving as fast as she could down the freeway. In this sad drugged out state, while speeding down the freeway and about to die in an accident, she just cried out loud "Isn't there anybody out there who could help?"

It wasn't a statement of belief or unbelief! It was a cry for help. Maybe it was to God, but she didn't believe in God, she just needed help - and instantly she got it. The opening enabled the Lord to come into her life, because He was always there just waiting for an opportunity!!! Instantly she came out of the influence of drugs and she started hearing from the Lord.

Now the thing I like most about the above post is: ""he that hath not the Spirit of God (in him) does not belong to God"

Of course, that is from the Scriptures, and it is correct. If you don't have the Holy Spirit operating in your life you don't belong to God. But if the Holy Spirit is operating in your life then you hear from Him because the Holy Spirit gets the words from Jesus Christ and speaks them to our spirit!!!

Jn 16:13,14,“But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come. “He will glorify Me, for He will take of Mine and will disclose it to you.

The Holy Spirit speaks!! That is a fact!! I know it is a fact because He speaks to me regularly!! The Holy Spirit is like a living telephone line, because He doesn't speak on His own initiative but as He hears He speaks, and He takes the words of God which belong to and thus come from our Lord Jesus Christ, and He speaks those words to my spirit!! So that hearing from Him every day and a number of times each day is how I know I have the Holy Spirit operating in me!!!

How can anyone write about being "Born Again" and not mention the hearing words from the Holy Spirit???

While I kind of like the post, it is missing the one thing that should be the most obvious to anyone who actually has the Holy Spirit operating in them, which is that He speaks - so we hear Him!!

It is written that He sheep hear His voice - of course they do. He was talking to me about how to solve a problem my business was having. He doesn't. If you seek first the Kingdom of God, which includes the King and His Holy Spirit, those things we need are added to us. The Lord takes care of us. That has gotten me rich, but He has given me my own little business and told me how to run it. And incase you are worry about the Scriptures, the first words He told me was "Read Your Bible" and He goes over it, which is why I used a lot of Scriptures to point out that if we are "Born Again" you hear the Holy Spirit bring you words from our Lord Jesus Christ!! Yet mentioning hearing from Jesus Christ via His Holy Spirit is soooooo often the very thing missing in sooooo many posts from "Christians"!!

 

[Carl Emerson]

Find anywhere in the Bible where it says that Christ's righteousness is IMPUTED to us. You have simply been indoctrinated into a human religious reasoning that seeks to justify itself in its sinful state.

Romans 4:11
And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while still uncircumcised, that he might be the father of all those who believe, though they are uncircumcised, that righteousness might be imputed to them also,

 

[Carl Emerson]

@Carl Emerson When did he breathe on them?

21 So Jesus said to them again, “Peace to you! As the Father has sent Me, I also send you.” 22 And when He had said this, He breathed on them, and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. 23 If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained.”

 

[Carl Emerson]

Wouldn't you say that when someone is born again, they not only are made a new creature, but also receive the Holy Spirit at the same time? Being in Christ is being born again. Spiritually one could not be in Christ otherwise.

Yes agree...

 

[Episkopos]

Romans 4:11
And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while still uncircumcised, that he might be the father of all those who believe, though they are uncircumcised, that righteousness might be imputed to them also,

Do the glasses you read with add in the word God into the text? I asked you to supply a verse that says that God's righteousness is imputed to anyone other than God Himself.

You don't seem to understand righteousness. God will indeed impute righteousness...on those who He deems are righteous..like Abraham or Phinehas. It is impossible for God to consider anyone as righteous as Himself.

 

[Pearl]

21 So Jesus said to them again, “Peace to you! As the Father has sent Me, I also send you.” 22 And when He had said this, He breathed on them, and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. 23 If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained.”

@Carl Emerson Thank you I had forgotten that passage but did look for it after you said.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Do the glasses you read with add in the word God into the text? I asked you to supply a verse that says that God's righteousness is imputed to anyone other than God Himself.

You don't seem to understand righteousness. God will indeed impute righteousness...on those who He deems are righteous..like Abraham or Phinehas. It is impossible for God to consider anyone as righteous as Himself.

20 He did not waver at the promise of God through unbelief, but was strengthened in faith, giving glory to God, 21 and being fully convinced that what He had promised He was also able to perform. 22 And therefore “it was accounted to him for righteousness.”

23 Now it was not written for his sake alone that it was imputed to him, 24 but also for us. It shall be imputed to us who believe in Him who raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead, 25 who was delivered up because of our offenses, and was raised because of our justification.

It seems to me that it was Abraham's faith that was reckoned as righteous, as it is with us.

Faith comes from Him as a gift.

Faith comes from hearing the Word of Christ.

2 Corinthians 5:21
For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

 

[Enoch111]

Here is a few more questions.

1. What becomes 'new' ??? The person who is born again (heart, mind, soul, spirit)

2. What happens to our sin from that point on ??? Sins must be confessed and repented of.

3. Is our salvation 'recorded' ??? Absolutely

4. What is our new spiritual status ??? Child of God, heir of God, joint heir with Christ, Royal Priest

5. What keeps us saved ??? The indwelling Holy Spirit and the power of God

6. Should we be immediately baptised ??? Absolutely

7. What does baptism achieve that being born again didnt ??? Obedience to Christ

 

[Pearl]

6. Should we be immediately baptised ??? Absolutely

Not necessarily. I was filled with spirit but I wasn't baptised for about seven years as I wasn't told I needed to be. i belonged to the Anglican church and believed I had been baptised as a baby until i was convicted by God and then I left the Anglican church and joind a new Testament church and got properly baptised asap.

 

[Enoch111]

Not necessarily. I was filled with spirit but I wasn't baptised for about seven years as I wasn't told I needed to be.

That was unfortunate. I was referring to the New Testament pattern, where Paul went ahead and baptized at midnight or thereabouts (Acts 16) and all the apostles made it their practice to never delay baptism.

 

[Pearl]

That was unfortunate. I was referring to the New Testament pattern, where Paul went ahead and baptized at midnight or thereabouts (Acts 16) and all the apostles made it their practice to never delay baptism.

Where at all possible baptism should not be delayed for long after somebody is born again. But is unfortunate that not all church groups tell you that. And the RCC don't practice believers' baptism as to them all babies are born again when they are so-called 'baptised' at a few weeks old.

The church I belong to now - and where I was eventually baptised - like to make certain that the 'conversion' is genuine befor the baptism take place. And i had the wonderful privilege of baptising a lady who I had helped to come to Jesus.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Where at all possible baptism should not be delayed for long after somebody is born again. But is unfortunate that not all church groups tell you that. And the RCC don't practice believers' baptism as to them all babies are born again when they are so-called 'baptised' at a few weeks old.

The church I belong to now - and where I was eventually baptised - like to make certain that the 'conversion' is genuine befor the baptism take place. And i had the wonderful privilege of baptising a lady who I had helped to come to Jesus.

Nice story... How many years passed between coming to faith and being baptised ?

 

[Enoch111]

It is impossible for God to consider anyone as righteous as Himself.

Yet that is exactly what the Bible says. When God IMPUTES righteousness to the sinner, that is in fact the righteousness of Christ (who is God). And unless a person has that "robe" of righteousness, he or she cannot enter Heaven. Just as Abraham believed God and it was imputed to him for righteousness, every person who believes on the Lord Jesus Christ is deemed righteous by God. Indeed DECLARED righteous. And that is precisely the meaning of justification by grace through faith.

 

[Pearl]

Nice story... How many years passed between coming to faith and being baptised ?

I was born again in December 1977 after being given a booklet by a local vicar who was Spirit filled and taught me about the gifts of the Holy Spirit I had to leave to get baptised, which I did in May 1984. So it was six and a half years before I was baptised. But it was wonderful and probably even more precious as I was then a lot more mature in the faith.

 

[Behold]

Romans 4:11
And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while still uncircumcised, that he might be the father of all those who believe, though they are uncircumcised, that righteousness might be imputed to them also,

Grace through Faith.

 

[Behold]

It is impossible for God to consider anyone as righteous as Himself.

On the day a Believer believes, God causes them to become this..
This is SALVATiON... Day 1... Instantly... "The righteousness of God in Christ"..... "made Righteous".

Its completed., and the born again have become a SON/Daughter of God. = the Born again SPIRIT.
Same as Adam, in the Garden before he rebelled, = no sin...... RIGHTEOUS.

 

[farouk]

I was born again in December 1977 after being given a booklet by a local vicar who was Spirit filled and taught me about the gifts of the Holy Spirit I had to leave to get baptised, which I did in May 1984. So it was six and a half years before I was baptised. But it was wonderful and probably even more precious as I was then a lot more mature in the faith.

@Pearl Great to be able to look back and think 'EBENEZER' 'Hitherto hath the LORD helped us' (1 Samuel 7.12).

 

[Pearl]

@Pearl Great to be able to look back and think 'EBENEZER' 'Hitherto hath the LORD helped us' (1 Samuel 7.12).

i used to have an 'ebebezer' on my hearth in the form of a dish with small pebbles denoting all the time God had been there and answered prayers.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Well I opened this thread after seeing 300+ posts on OSAS and realising that understanding what born again is will largely solve the dispute.

Sadly the strong proponents of Once Saved Not Saved were not willing to come and join the thread.

 

[Grailhunter]

I do not think you have had anyone correctly define born again. Did I miss anyone?
And no one believes in Once Saved Not Saved.
Most people do not believe in once saved.....sin all you want and go to heaven.
How do you reason with the Ludacris?
OSAS is not biblical, there is no part of the Bible or Christianity that is about sin all you want and go to heaven.
Christ did not go to cross to start a religion of sin.
Christ and the Apostles never spoke of tolerance to sin or rewarding it with heaven.
OSAS is a corruption of the scriptures, a heresy that can lead people to hell.

So if some that has been saved, and they then return to sinning....LOL
Like a dog that returns to its vomit Is a fool who repeats his folly. Psalms 26:11

For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world by the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and are overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. 2nd Peter 2:20