Bible alone question

[theefaith]

Replying to appollatard
Quote:
Therein lies the problem … the RCC claims to still be receiving “smoke signals, sign language, radio waves, TV transmissions, Internet messages and personal meetings” from the Apostles that tell them crazy things like Mary was assumed into Heaven, the Pope is Christ on Earth, Mary is Queen of Heaven, all prayers should go through Mary to reach God, the Church saves rather than the blood of Christ, Mary is co-redemptrix alongside Jesus Christ, and we should confess to men rather than God if we want our sins forgiven … all of which are contradicted by what the Apostles WROTE when they were alive.

the apostles shall remain until end and Christ returns Matt 28:19 acts 1:8

christ gave men the power to forgive sin Jn 20:23

Jesus Christ extends his mission, power, and authority to His church of His apostles!

Even His judging!
Matt 19:28 and 1 cor 6:2
His teaching authority!
Matt 28:19 and Jn 20:21
His power to forgive sins!
Jn 20:23
His being the light of the world!
Matt 5:14
His ministry of reconciliation!
2 cor 5:18
His authority in governing the church and administering the kingdom!
Matt 16:18-19 & 18:18 Jn 21:17
Lk 22:29
Apart from me you can do nothing. Jn 15:5
So the church is subject to Christ!
Eph 5:24
Christ shares His glory! 2 thes 1:10 rev 12:1


Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Matt 18:17 Acts 1:17 acts 8:31 & 35 acts 9:4 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20 acts 2:42
1 Tim 3:15

Fundamentalism drives a wedge between Christ and his church, separates Christ from His kingdom, and the authority of Christ from the new covenant!

1 Corinthians 16:22
If any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be Anathema

Extends to the truth and the church

Cos Christ is the truth and His church teaches the truth without error! Jn 14:6 matt 28:19 matt 18:17 1 Tim 3:15 Jn 29:21-23 Jn 16:13

Christ and His church are one! Acts 9:4 eph 5:32

Authority of the Apostles!

What authority does Christ have?
What power does Christ have?
What mission / ministry does Christ have?

Peter, the apostles and their successors have the same authority, power, and mission! Jn 20:21 as my father sent me, even so send I you!

John 17:18
As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.

The apostles are Christ’s successors!
They have authority to send others as well, apostle means one who is sent!

Therefore the apostles have authority to send more apostles or successors!
Apostolic succession!

The nations still need to be taught, disciples still need to be baptized and the church the new covenant kingdom of christ still needs to be governed!

Hebrews 3:1
Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus;

Christ is an apostle, and has authority to send other apostles, the apostles also have this authority, so the apostles continue down thru the centuries as Christ promised! Matt 28:19-20

Keys of authority! And power to bind and loose! Matt 16:18 and Matt 18:18 matt 28:19 Isa 22:21-22

Moral authority:
(Teaching)
Necessity of being taught by Christ:
Two edge sword: defining truth and condemning errors, and Interpreting scripture.

Jurisdictional authority:
(Governing / administering)
Necessity of Peter and the apostles and their successors to govern the holy church.

Spiritual authority:
(Life of Grace)
Sanctifying thru the mass and Sacraments

The apostles teaching is Christ’s teaching, Christ and His church are one! Acts 9:4

Christian rule of faith is not the Bible alone! But the doctrine of the apostles! Acts 2:42

Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Acts 1:17 acts 8:31 & 35 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20



Jesus is the truth!

Jn 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

Jn 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

To know the truth it is required to know Jesus Christ!

The truth is not some thing but somebody! Jesus Christ!

The church was a the extension of this truth! 1 Tim 3:15
Must hear Christ thru his church! Matt 18:17

 

[David H.]

you confuse redemption with salvation They are not the same

Though I like in general most of the points you make here, your understanding of justification is not within the definition of justification. Justification is a just judge (Jesus Christ) saying we are worthy of salvation, not by our own effort, but by the blood of the lamb. Although redemption, justification, sanctification, and salvation are all diverse concepts, they are all tied directly to the grace of God (Unmerited favor) and intricately tied together to one another.

As for the one true church and your catholic agenda You know I disagree with this, for the Body has many members each diverse from one another yet one in Spirit and Truth. I Believe a Baptist can be wonderfully saved as can a Roman Catholic or a Methodist or a Calvinist.... We are all one Body in Christ Jesus so long as they have not misplaced their relationship with Christ with belonging to a church organization.... Going to church and being a member of a church will not save you, knowing the person of Jesus Christ will save you.... In that day he will say "I never knew you".

 

[theefaith]

Though I like in general most of the points you make here, your understanding of justification is not within the definition of justification. Justification is a just judge (Jesus Christ) saying we are worthy of salvation, not by our own effort, but by the blood of the lamb. Although redemption, justification, sanctification, and salvation are all diverse concepts, they are all tied directly to the grace of God (Unmerited favor) and intricately tied together to one another.

As for the one true church and your catholic agenda You know I disagree with this, for the Body has many members each diverse from one another yet one in Spirit and Truth. I Believe a Baptist can be wonderfully saved as can a Roman Catholic or a Methodist or a Calvinist.... We are all one Body in Christ Jesus so long as they have not misplaced their relationship with Christ with belonging to a church organization.... Going to church and being a member of a church will not save you, knowing the person of Jesus Christ will save you.... In that day he will say "I never knew you".

then why don’t we all have the same faith?
Thee faith eph 4:5 revealed by Christ Jude 1:3 and taught / proposed by holy church Matt 28:19 without error Jn 16:13

 

[Jim B]

Replying to appollatard
Quote:
Therein lies the problem … the RCC claims to still be receiving “smoke signals, sign language, radio waves, TV transmissions, Internet messages and personal meetings” from the Apostles that tell them crazy things like Mary was assumed into Heaven, the Pope is Christ on Earth, Mary is Queen of Heaven, all prayers should go through Mary to reach God, the Church saves rather than the blood of Christ, Mary is co-redemptrix alongside Jesus Christ, and we should confess to men rather than God if we want our sins forgiven … all of which are contradicted by what the Apostles WROTE when they were alive.

the apostles shall remain until end and Christ returns Matt 28:19 acts 1:8

christ gave men the power to forgive sin Jn 20:23

Jesus Christ extends his mission, power, and authority to His church of His apostles!

Even His judging!
Matt 19:28 and 1 cor 6:2
His teaching authority!
Matt 28:19 and Jn 20:21
His power to forgive sins!
Jn 20:23
His being the light of the world!
Matt 5:14
His ministry of reconciliation!
2 cor 5:18
His authority in governing the church and administering the kingdom!
Matt 16:18-19 & 18:18 Jn 21:17
Lk 22:29
Apart from me you can do nothing. Jn 15:5
So the church is subject to Christ!
Eph 5:24
Christ shares His glory! 2 thes 1:10 rev 12:1


Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Matt 18:17 Acts 1:17 acts 8:31 & 35 acts 9:4 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20 acts 2:42
1 Tim 3:15

Fundamentalism drives a wedge between Christ and his church, separates Christ from His kingdom, and the authority of Christ from the new covenant!

1 Corinthians 16:22
If any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be Anathema

Extends to the truth and the church

Cos Christ is the truth and His church teaches the truth without error! Jn 14:6 matt 28:19 matt 18:17 1 Tim 3:15 Jn 29:21-23 Jn 16:13

Christ and His church are one! Acts 9:4 eph 5:32

Authority of the Apostles!

What authority does Christ have?
What power does Christ have?
What mission / ministry does Christ have?

Peter, the apostles and their successors have the same authority, power, and mission! Jn 20:21 as my father sent me, even so send I you!

John 17:18
As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.

The apostles are Christ’s successors!
They have authority to send others as well, apostle means one who is sent!

Therefore the apostles have authority to send more apostles or successors!
Apostolic succession!

The nations still need to be taught, disciples still need to be baptized and the church the new covenant kingdom of christ still needs to be governed!

Hebrews 3:1
Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus;

Christ is an apostle, and has authority to send other apostles, the apostles also have this authority, so the apostles continue down thru the centuries as Christ promised! Matt 28:19-20

Keys of authority! And power to bind and loose! Matt 16:18 and Matt 18:18 matt 28:19 Isa 22:21-22

Moral authority:
(Teaching)
Necessity of being taught by Christ:
Two edge sword: defining truth and condemning errors, and Interpreting scripture.

Jurisdictional authority:
(Governing / administering)
Necessity of Peter and the apostles and their successors to govern the holy church.

Spiritual authority:
(Life of Grace)
Sanctifying thru the mass and Sacraments

The apostles teaching is Christ’s teaching, Christ and His church are one! Acts 9:4

Christian rule of faith is not the Bible alone! But the doctrine of the apostles! Acts 2:42

Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Acts 1:17 acts 8:31 & 35 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20



Jesus is the truth!

Jn 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

Jn 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

To know the truth it is required to know Jesus Christ!

The truth is not some thing but somebody! Jesus Christ!

The church was a the extension of this truth! 1 Tim 3:15
Must hear Christ thru his church! Matt 18:17

The church is the body of Christ. It is not the Catholic denomination.

 

[theefaith]

The church is the body of Christ. It is not the Catholic denomination.

how do you get into the body of Christ?

 

[JunChosen]

No I rather believe the Bible and that the author is Jehovah

Jehovah and Jesus are one and the same! Isaiah 43:11 reads:
I, even I, am the LORD [JEHOVAH]; and beside me there is no saviour.
Jesus came as the Savior of the world, hence Jesus IS God according to Isaiah 43:11.

what do you find fictitious in his teachings? And since you feel Jesus lied, what hope do any of us have?

As I've said, you've twisted most of what I've stated in the past and have added words which I have NEVER said. NOT only do you speak "with a forked tongue", you "bear false witness, as well!

Show me in what post, chapter, and verse did I say that Jesus' teachings are fictitious and without hope? Unless you purported the whole matter!

 

[Taken]

then why don’t we all have the same faith?

Because we don’t all HAVE the Same Holy Father or Pray TO the Same.

 

[JunChosen]

how do you get into the body of Christ?

Individually! And these individuals must be drawn by the Father [Joh. 6:44]. In turn, these individuals become into groups, and these groups form into one gigantic group called the church, and this church is called the "Israel of God" consisting of the totality of all believers [Gal. 6:16].

And, as @Jim B has said: The church is the body of Christ. It is not the Catholic denomination.

 

[Robert Gwin]

Jehovah and Jesus are one and the same! Isaiah 43:11 reads:
I, even I, am the LORD [JEHOVAH]; and beside me there is no saviour.
Jesus came as the Savior of the world, hence Jesus IS God according to Isaiah 43:11.



As I've said, you've twisted most of what I've stated in the past and have added words which I have NEVER said. NOT only do you speak "with a forked tongue", you "bear false witness, as well!

Show me in what post, chapter, and verse did I say that Jesus' teachings are fictitious and without hope? Unless you purported the whole matter!

You just stated Jesus is God, therefore you indicate he lied at Mk 10:40 and 13:32 therefore what hope do you have if Jesus is a liar sir?

There are actually more saviors that Jehovah and Jesus recorded for us in the Bible, have you ever heard of Othniel or Ehud sir? Both Jehovah and Jesus are saviors in their own right Jun.

 

[theefaith]

Because we don’t all HAVE the Same Holy Father or Pray TO the Same.

there is only one God!

 

[theefaith]

Individually! And these individuals must be drawn by the Father [Joh. 6:44]. In turn, these individuals become into groups, and these groups form into one gigantic group called the church, and this church is called the "Israel of God" consisting of the totality of all believers [Gal. 6:16].

And, as @Jim B has said: The church is the body of Christ. It is not the Catholic denomination.

So this needs to be done for me?

 

[Taken]

there is only one God!

Well no kidding!

And ONLY the ONE GOD is the term “Holy Father”, ascribed to:
and it ain’t a man by election called a pope who resides in Vatican City!

John 17:
[11] And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

 

[theefaith]

Well no kidding!

And ONLY the ONE GOD is the term “Holy Father”, ascribed to:
and it ain’t a man by election called a pope who resides in Vatican City!

John 17:
[11] And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

isa 22:21-22

 

[theefaith]

Are you saying call no man father?

 

[Taken]

isa 22:21-22

So? That has nothing to do with Bible alone or my comment.

 

[theefaith]

So? That has nothing to do with Bible alone or my comment.

you said only the father can be called father???

 

[JunChosen]

You just stated Jesus is God, therefore you indicate he lied at Mk 10:40 and 13:32 therefore what hope do you have if Jesus is a liar sir?

As I've said before, and I say it again, most people and you're not an exception, do NOT know how to read Scripture!

A simple question, "was Jesus in Mark 10:40; 13:32 speaking as a man or as God?" Careful with your answer as I've already declared that you do not know how to read Scripture!

There are actually more saviors that Jehovah and Jesus recorded for us in the Bible, have you ever heard of Othniel or Ehud sir? Both Jehovah and Jesus are saviors in their own right Jun.

What do you mean, " Both Jehovah and Jesus are saviors in their own right?" FYI, both are the ONLY Saviors of the world in matters of sin and of life, none other!!! God is the only one who can take both body and soul in hell!

God is the potter and we are the clay. Read Romans 9:21-25 especially verses 21-23.

You've been given the nature of the true Gospel. If you want to be saved by God, get out of the JW persuasion.

 

[JunChosen]

So this needs to be done for me?

Most certainly, by God!

 

[Taken]

you said only the father can be called father???

That is not what I said.

 

[Robert Gwin]

As I've said before, and I say it again, most people and you're not an exception, do NOT know how to read Scripture!

A simple question, "was Jesus in Mark 10:40; 13:32 speaking as a man or as God?" Careful with your answer as I've already declared that you do not know how to read Scripture!



What do you mean, " Both Jehovah and Jesus are saviors in their own right?" FYI, both are the ONLY Saviors of the world in matters of sin and of life, none other!!! God is the only one who can take both body and soul in hell!

God is the potter and we are the clay. Read Romans 9:21-25 especially verses 21-23.

You've been given the nature of the true Gospel. If you want to be saved by God, get out of the JW persuasion.

Jesus was speaking as a man of course as that is what he was. He stated truth of course, he made it clear that only God knew the day and hour, and he did not have the authority to choose who sits at his right or left.

I agree that only Jehovah and Jesus are saviors in matters of sin and life. That is where the buck stops for sure, but you are obligated to obey those Jesus assigned as shepherds as well, unless of course they tell you to do something unscriptural then you would obey God as ruler rather than man Acts 5:29