Bible verses most Christians refuse to believe

[amadeus]

Between you and I, we will need to first define what "born again" is. I think we have very different ideas about that.

Much love!

Oh, we most certainly believe different things about being born again or born from above. Just about everybody believing God in any measure claims to be born again... but then they presume that the baby can speak in other than babble as well when he is still only a baby! Some are perhaps even still in the womb or in the birth canal not yet having come out into the Light! Or not even conceived!

 

[marks]

Just about everybody believing God in any measure claims to be born again... but then they presume that the baby can speak in other than babble as well when he is still only a baby! Some are perhaps even still in the womb or in the birth canal not yet having come out into the Light!

What people may claim, and what people may presume should not be foundation for doctrine.

To those be feel that being born again is something that we receive after a life of righteousness, how do you first obtain that life of righteousness without rebirth?

Much love!

 

[marks]

Why do you need to know if anyone other than you is or is not sinless?

I don't. It's a doctrinal/theological question.

 

[marks]

If you doubt the lady then you are effectively calling her a liar without nothing but your own lack of faith in her.

Nonsense!

I've already said that we walk in grace by faith, and I don't question her faith, or her walk, rather, I question her soteriology.

That being said, I'm not really interested in discussing one person with another.

Much love!

 

[CharismaticLady]

What people may claim, and what people may presume should not be foundation for doctrine.

To those be feel that being born again is something that we receive after a life of righteousness, how do you first obtain that life of righteousness without rebirth?

Much love!

Curious, who claims that being born again is after we die? I've never seen a post like that. But, then I don't read everybody's.

 

[marks]

"I" is talking about "mankind"

Then why would he have not said that?

Why should we not believe what he actually said?

 

[CharismaticLady]

Nonsense!

I've already said that we walk in grace by faith, and I don't question her faith, or her walk, rather, I question her soteriology.

That being said, I'm not really interested in discussing one person with another.

Much love!

It may have to do with "grace." What do you believe grace has to do with sin after being born again? What does grace do to sin that we willfully commit as a Christian?

 

[CharismaticLady]

Then why would he have not said that?

Why should we not believe what he actually said?

Again, it is a teaching tool, just as John used "we." It is everybody. Mankind. Humans.

You think "western" instead of "eastern."

 

[marks]

Curious, who claims that being born again is after we die? I've never seen a post like that. But, then I don't read everybody's.

Not after we die, rather, that if we are good enough, we may qualify for being born again, to spend the remainder of our lives without sin. Others seem to see rebirth in Christ to be a long process, as Amadeus says, "in the birth canal", I guess meaning that we may spend years being reborn.

Something I've seen posted from time to time.

Much love!

 

[marks]

You have said, "sin is sin." You've also claimed that you still sin. Is that correct?

Yes, all sin is sin, and there is no sin that is not sin. And all that is not of faith is sin. There is the life lived in the faith of Jesus, and everything else is not it.

And yes, I still commit sins. This is, the sin that lives in my flesh. The flesh is corrupted, and remains that way until the redemption of the body.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Again, it is a teaching tool, just as John used "we." It is everybody. Mankind. Humans.

You think "western" instead of "eastern."

According to who?

I can say literally anything is a teaching tool, and redefine it at will.

Again . . . what would God have to say if this was in fact what He meant? "Now, this is not a teaching tool . . . you should read My Words just as written . . ." Something like that?

John used "we", which is plural and inclusive, but Paul did not.

Much love!

 

[marks]

It may have to do with "grace." What do you believe grace has to do with sin after being born again? What does grace do to sin that we willfully commit as a Christian?

I don't understand your question.

 

[CharismaticLady]

Not after we die, rather, that if we are good enough, we may qualify for being born again, to spend the remainder of our lives without sin. Others seem to see rebirth in Christ to be a long process, as Amadeus says, "in the birth canal", I guess meaning that we may spend years being reborn.

Something I've seen posted from time to time.

Much love!

The truth is just the opposite. It is when we realize that we CAN'T be good enough, and see ourselves for the sinners that we are and enslaved, that we cry out to Jesus and confess this ugly truth. That is when He gives us His Holy Spirit that enters our nature, making us reborn of the Spirit. The Spirit of Grace gives us the power of God that changes our desires to become partakers of the divine nature.

Another difference in theology we may have is on sanctification. You and just about every denomination except one (I just found out) believes that sanctification is a lifelong process to overcome sin. For a few years now I have discovered that justification is from our past sins, and we are immediately sanctified, set apart unto God. This is where I am no longer comparable to that one denomination. I don't know if anyone else believes the following, but there may be. There is a process, but it is not sanctification to overcome sin, but maturing and becoming more and more Christlike. It is called "glorification."

 

[CharismaticLady]

According to who?

I can say literally anything is a teaching tool, and redefine it at will.

Again . . . what would God have to say if this was in fact what He meant? "Now, this is not a teaching tool . . . you should read My Words just as written . . ." Something like that?

John used "we", which is plural and inclusive, but Paul did not.

Much love!

They were both Jews (eastern) and wrote in a non-Greek style called Semitic.

 

[Joseph77]

Actually, even in the OT Ekklesia were born again - when their hearts were circumcised , as written.

 

[amadeus]

Yep, -- like the "turns" in Scripture, which some refuse to obey to their own detriment like LUKE 22:36, which we apparently assume is not VALID until the Holy Spirit FIRST convicts us.

Whew,
Bobby Jo

If you believe you are so convicted, then go with that. God knows your heart, but so slow about deciding for others what their convictions are or should be. What we have been given thus far is what we have to work with... See Luke 12:48

God knows exactly what each of has as well as what we have done or are doing.

 

[Bobby Jo]

If you believe you are so convicted, ...

You ascribe Scripture which you don't like to OTHERS? Are you NOT ACCOUNTABLE to Scripture YOURSELF?

Perhaps either a "Sharpie", or an "Exacto" knife, or possibly tearing whole pages from your Bible is to your liking.

Lke 22:35 And he said to them, “When I sent you out with no purse or bag or sandals, did you lack anything?” They said, “Nothing.” 36 He said to them, “But now, let him who has a purse take it, and likewise a bag. And let him who has no sword sell his mantle and buy one.​

Burn your whole Bible for all I care. But don't tell me that you obey Scripture ...
Bobby Jo

 

[CharismaticLady]

I don't understand your question.

Explain your understanding of grace in relation to sin.

 

[Joseph77]

Explain your definition of grace in relation to sin.

alphabetically , it comes first.

"g" before "s"

 

[CharismaticLady]

Coffee time.