Ronald Nolette
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False doctrine is false doctrine whether it is faith and morals or lies about Mary.
Biblical Mary
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False doctrine is false doctrine whether it is faith and morals or lies about Mary.
And so you may believe, but don't be too disappointed because not many here agree with your belief. Disagreements on this forum are rampant, with or without Catholic involvement.
Truths are revealed by Christ and proposed by holy church not obtained from consensus!
Jesus is the Truth!
"Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." John 14:6
The Truth is revealed to a person when what he has consumed from Scripture or preacher or priest or brother or other is quickened in him by the Holy Spirit!
The "holy church" would be the "set apart" [holy] by God "church" [assembly of people].
Of course truth is not obtained from consensus! I have never said that it was. Truth is Jesus as he himself said. How well do we know him? How well do we see him? How well do we understand him?
Jn 1:16-17
the church of the apostles Matt 28:19
The apostles are lead in to all truth, jn 16:13 1 Tim 3:15 then commanded by Christ to teach all nations
I give you credit for having some answers, even if you often have little or no understanding of what I am saying to you. Of course, I do not insist that my beliefs are better than yours, even though I believe that they are. Otherwise I would certainly want to change them. We should all want to be moving toward the "face to face" vision so as to see Him as He is!
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
YOu will find outr how wrong you are! You will also find out god considers your reverence for Mary, the same as worshihp and charge you with idolatry.
You might consider that reverence for Mary is worship but God is more discerning.
Perhaps one may argue that Mary is no idol. That she is the Mother of God and Queen of Heaven, no less. That perhaps she is higher than angels even archangels like Gabriel or Michael. That it is righteous and is no offense to God, to pray to her, ask for her intercession, ask for her mercy and grace perhaps.
All sounds good, but is it?
As for me, Mary is blessed among women. And I love her. I respect her, enough to not kneel and pray to her.
Tong
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Marymog
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Sorry, but you are wrong.
When we pray for each other, of which we are commanded to do, we are being a mediator.
Mary
Marymog
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Ok...educate me. If it was not new then show me where it was written doctrine BEFORE they held the Council at Jerusalem.
We pray for each other, even for all. However, it is one thing to pray for one another, and it is another thing to pray to a creature.
I only pray to my creator, to God.
Tong
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Marymog
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Ok..... But when I pray for you to our creator I am mediating which makes me a mediator so there is not only one mediator between God and man which is how YOU are interpreting that verse.
St. Paul commands “supplications, prayers and intercessions to be made for all men…” Intercession is a synonym for mediation. Hebrews 7:24-25 refers to Jesus acting as our one mediator at the right hand of the Father and refers to him as intercessor!
Marymog: “At the council of Jerusalem the Church Leaders ESTABLISHED A DOCTRINE THAT WAS BINDING ON ALL CHRISTIANS.“
Let’s examine.
Acts 15:23 They wrote this letter by them:
The apostles, the elders, and the brethren,
To the brethren who are of the Gentiles in Antioch, Syria, and Cilicia:
Greetings.
24 Since we have heard that some who went out from us have troubled you with words, unsettling your souls, saying, “You must be circumcised and keep the law”—to whom we gave no such commandment— 25 it seemed good to us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men to you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul, 26 men who have risked their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. 27 We have therefore sent Judas and Silas, who will also report the same things by word of mouth. 28 For it seemed good to the Holy Spirit, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things: 29 that you abstain from things offered to idols, from blood, from things strangled, and from sexual immorality. If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well.
Farewell.
That is what came out of the council in Jerusalem.
First, is that doctrine? If so, what part is there is doctrine you refer to?
Second, if you say that that is doctrine, would you say that doctrines change or they should not?
Third, if you say that that is doctrine, is that binding to all Christians?
Tong
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Marymog
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Thanks. I get your point. What I don't get is why you left off everything that happened BEFORE that? Let's put what you quoted IN CONTEXT:
Then certain individuals came down from Judea and were teaching the brothers, “Unless you are circumcised according to the custom of Moses, you cannot be saved.” 2 And after Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and debate with them, Paul and Barnabas and some of the others were appointed to go up to Jerusalem to discuss this question with the apostles and the elders. 3 So they were sent on their way by the church, and as they passed through both Phoenicia and Samaria, they reported the conversion of the Gentiles, and brought great joy to all the believers. 4 When they came to Jerusalem, they were welcomed by the church and the apostles and the elders, and they reported all that God had done with them. 5 But some believers who belonged to the sect of the Pharisees stood up and said, “It is necessary for them to be circumcised and ordered to keep the law of Moses.” 6 The apostles and the elders met together to consider this matter. 7 After there had been much debate, Peter stood up and said to them,
So now to answer your questions: There was no set doctrine on this matter that is WHY they was dissension and PAUL had a debate with them instead of flat out telling them "No, this is the doctrine concerning this matter and the other Apostles and elders will back me up on this". That is why Paul went to the other Apostles and elders to "consider this matter" because it was NOT a settled doctrine.
AFTER there had been much debate among the Apostles and elders they then decided, with help from the Holy Spirit (vs28), what would be binding upon all Christians (vs29). And as you know Jesus said in Luke 10:16 about the Apostles "“The one who listens to you listens to Me, and the one who rejects you rejects Me; but the one who rejects Me rejects the One who sent Me.” Sooooooo that means if they would have rejected this doctrine, which was sent in the form of a letter (vs23) from the Apostles and elders, they they would reject Jesus.
Bible study Mary
idolatry and worship of any but God alone is forbidden
our reverence for Mary resounds and terminates in Christ who is the source of grace that she is filled with and in God who made her immaculate
Biblical Mary:
Mother of God Lk 1:43
Immaculate conception (sinless) gen 3:15 enmity or total war none of satans works are found in Mary
Also Lk 1:28 full of grace lk 1:49 great things plural (immaculate conception of Mary and the miraculous conception of Jesus) Rev12:1 woman clothed with the sun. Immaculate purity
Lk 1:30 found favor with God (the salvation lost by Adam) mother of our salvation Lk 2:30
Perpetual Virgin Isa 7:14 matt 1:21
Lk 1:31-34
A good tree!
Matthew 7:18
A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
The fruit of the tree of Mary is our salvation! Lk 2:30 Jesus is our salvation!
Lk 1:30 Mary found our salvation!
Lk 1:38 consented to our salvation!
Proving That Mary is not a goddess and this tittle does not apply to Mary most holy, ever virgin mother of God!
Lk 1:28 Hail, Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee, blessed art thou amounts women.
How can a goddess be full of grace?
Hail Mary full of grace!
How can the Lord be with a goddess?
The lord is with thee!
How can a goddess be blessed!
Blessed art thou, and all generations shall call me blessed!
Lk 1: 43 And whence is this to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?
How can a goddess be the mother of God?
Lk 1: 45 And blessed is she that believed: for there shall be a performance of those things which were told her from the Lord.
How could a goddess be faithful?
Lk 1: 46 And Mary said, My soul doth magnify the Lord,
47 And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour.
How could a goddess glorify God or have a savior?
Lk 1:48 For he hath regarded the low estate of his handmaiden: for, behold, from henceforth all generations shall call me blessed.
How could a goddess be humble?
Lk 1:49 For he that is mighty hath done to me great things; and holy is his name.
How could a goddess be the immaculate conception and the have the Holy Spirit accomplish the Miraculous conception of Jesus?
Matt 1:21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.
22 Now all this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying,
23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.
How could a goddess be a perpetual Virgin bringing forth the savior of the world?
Jn 19:27 Then saith he to the disciple, Behold thy mother! And from that hour that disciple took her unto his own home.
How could a goddess be our spiritual mother?
Only a heretical fundamentalists brainwashing can say so!
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