Called to Overcome....

[GodsGrace]

1 Peter 2:11;
"Dear friends, I urge you, as aliens and strangers in this world, to abstain from sinful desires, which war against your soul".

Would you say that each one of us has a different frailty?
What is a sinful desire?
Disrespecting parents, stealing, missing church, envy...
We don't all have the same weakness.

 

[Willie T]

I only ask persons I trust REAL questions...
Not those I ask to let people think.
So I would trust you with the reply.

This is what I read:

What is Christian dominionism?

Dominion Theology - Wikipedia

Well?
I guess I could trust wiki.
I don't like the idea. It's like Islam only Christian.
Jesus came to set up HIS Kingdom, not a WORLDY Kingdom.
John 18:36
Christianity is spiritual and is a "being". BEING in tune with God.

In fact, the early Christians did not even want to MIX with the government and politics of the day. They had their own communities, their own ways of dealing with everyday life. Their own stores, doctors, etc.

Today this is impossible to do. The Amish do this. I wonder if they still are living in PA. But it would not even be allowed by our present day governments.

As was said to you earlier, you just hit upon one of the major objections of Dominionists..... Secular State Control. (I highlighted it in your post.) Many people are all for this in the name of "Socialism." But, how is Socialism enforced? At the barrel of a gun.

 

[GodsGrace]

As was said to you earlier, you just hit upon one of the major objections of Dominionists..... Secular State Control. (I highlighted it in your post.) Many people are all for this in the name of "Socialism." But, how is Socialism enforced? At the barrel of a gun.

Willie,
I hate socialism.

But your post above reminds me of Animal Farm by John Steinbeck.

THEN instead of Secular State Control,
we'll have Dominionism Christian Control !! (or however it would be titled)

Someone will always be in control.
I like the idea that leaders are Christian in beliefs,
but I would not like a theocracy no matter who was in charge.
Why?
Because man is sinful and messes up everything he tries to do.
Even when God is involved...

 

[Willie T]

Willie,
I hate socialism.

But your post above reminds me of Animal Farm by John Steinbeck.

THEN instead of Secular State Control,
we'll have Dominionism Christian Control !! (or however it would be titled)

Someone will always be in control.
I like the idea that leaders are Christian in beliefs,
but I would not like a theocracy no matter who was in charge.
Why?
Because man is sinful and messes up everything he tries to do.
Even when God is involved...

I agree with you. That is why I stated pretty early-on in this conversation that I agree with some of their views, but cannot go along with others. (Even though, since I have now read a half dozen books on the movement), I have come to understand they actually aren't anywhere near the dictatorial force so many frightened people have painted them as being.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

How can we have Christian leaders in a secular world?
They clash as night and day.

 

[tabletalk]

@"ByGrace"
I would say that it is not the sin itself that we are to overcome. It is rather the way we follow that leads us to repeat sins which we have already confessed to God. Jesus has paid the price for our sins, but he wants us to stop sinning and become witnesses to everyone around us as He was witness. He has provided a Way.

The way we follow when we sin, [whatever we might believe our besetting sin (or sins) to be] stem from what we read here:

"For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.
And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever." I John 2:16-17

The "world" is not planet Earth, but this little lump specially formed dirt that we call our body of flesh. It contains all that we are. It also contains 1) the lust of the flesh 2) the lust of the eyes, and 3) the pride of life. When any one or more of these is followed the result is sin. We sin repeatedly because we have not yet overcome the underlying causes. We cannot, NOT alone.

God sent His Son so that the means to overcome became available to this corrupted creature that each of us, the "old man" of us is. When Adan and Eve they yielded that first time to their temptation and disobeyed God, they corrupted that which was clean and very good and uncorrupted. They were corrupted and their children inherited their corruption and built upon it. The result of that over the centuries is what we see all around us.

God has given us a new start, but the "old man" must be completely killed [overcome]. The old man is our beastly nature for that is what it it, the nature of a beast [or beasts]

"I said in mine heart concerning the estate of the sons of men, that God might manifest them, and that they might see that they themselves are beasts." Ecc 3:18

But then consider these words also written by Solomon:

"Wisdom hath builded her house, she hath hewn out her seven pillars:
She hath killed her beasts; she hath mingled her wine; she hath also furnished her table." Prov 9:1-2

Our wisdom is to use that which God has given us through His Son to kill those beasts, which we are.
Before Jesus came and the Holy Ghost was poured out these words of Jeremiah applied to us and they still apply to our old man. The essence of the old man is the beasts which need to be killed:

"O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps." Jerem 10:23

"But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth." Acts 1:8

You said: "I would say that it is not the sin itself that we are to overcome."

How about the wicked one, who could be described as sin itself?

1 John 2:13
I write to you, fathers, Because you have known Him who isfrom the beginning. I write to you, young men, Because you have overcome the wicked one. I write to you, little children, Because you have known the Father.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
1 John 2:14
I have written to you, fathers, Because you have known Him who is from the beginning. I have written to you, young men, Because you are strong, and the word of God abides in you, And you have overcome the wicked one.

 

[amadeus]

You said: "I would say that it is not the sin itself that we are to overcome."

How about the wicked one, who could be described as sin itself?

1 John 2:13
I write to you, fathers, Because you have known Him who isfrom the beginning. I write to you, young men, Because you have overcome the wicked one. I write to you, little children, Because you have known the Father.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
1 John 2:14
I have written to you, fathers, Because you have known Him who is from the beginning. I have written to you, young men, Because you are strong, and the word of God abides in you, And you have overcome the wicked one.

I rarely write separate requirements with regard to satan because I lean toward him being me, or in me, rather than being a separate entity. The "wicked one" is the "old me" who is not dead yet. When he is then there will nothing more to overcome. Whatever he is, or it is, also needs to be overcome. Please do not derail this thread for a discussion on that. I will gladly go into my understanding on another thread designated for that purpose.