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KBCid

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Does YOUR church feed and clothe the entire world?
Does it feed and clothe as many as the Catholic Church??
Did the original Church in Acts feed the entire world?
Your example is impotent unless the answer to all 3 questions is "Yes."

I adhere to no cult.
The original church said exactly this "34There was not a needy person among them"
A real church would help the needy with all that had been donated for God's purposes and not hold back any.

Your cult holds money that is supposed to go to God's purposes to the tune of BILLIONS.... how many needy people could be fed with that?

1. The Vatican Bank has $8 billion in assets
The Vatican Bank, which has about $8 billion in assets, has often been at the center of scandal and corruption since it was founded in 1942
Vatican Bank accounts are only supposed to be held by residents of Vatican City and church personnel. But according to Gerald Posner, a Vatican bank scholar and the author of "God's Bankers," these accounts were often awarded to powerful Italian officials looking to stash money without paying taxes.

2. The Vatican had over €1.1 billion off its balance sheet
When it released its 2014 financial statements in July, the Vatican said it had more than €1.1 billion ($1.2 billion) in assets that weren't previously on the balance sheet.

4. It costs how much to become a saint?!
It's not cheap to get a priest canonized. To wit: The Our Lady of Victory National Shrine & Basilica in Lackawanna, New York, has raised over $250,000 in an effort to canonize its former priest, Father Nelson Baker. The funds cover the publication of materials about Baker, prayer cards, communication between the church and the Vatican, travel costs for visits to and from Rome and the fees of a canon lawyer.
The cost of canonization can vary greatly depending on the length of the process and the specific evidence needed to prove that a candidate is qualified for sainthood. The church first appealed to Rome to have Baker canonized in 1987. The case was approved in 2011, but Our Lady of Victory still has to prove that Baker performed miracles.
Vatican Inc.: 5 facts about the business of the Catholic Church

How many needy people could this money help?
 

amadeus

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What kind of body should one expect?
One that is subject to and very much like the Head. For this reason we read:

"Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is." I John 3:2

And also...

"But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ" Eph 4:15

And further...

"But now hath God set the members every one of them in the body, as it hath pleased him.
And if they were all one member, where were the body?
But now are they many members, yet but one body.
Nay, much more those members of the body, which seem to be more feeble, are necessary:
And those members of the body, which we think to be less honourable, upon these we bestow more abundant honour; and our uncomely parts have more abundant comeliness.
For our comely parts have no need: but God hath tempered the body together, having given more abundant honour to that part which lacked:
That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another.
Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular." I Cor 12:18-27
 

BreadOfLife

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I adhere to no cult.
The original church said exactly this "34There was not a needy person among them"
A real church would help the needy with all that had been donated for God's purposes and not hold back any.

Your cult holds money that is supposed to go to God's purposes to the tune of BILLIONS.... how many needy people could be fed with that?
And, again - although you have a deep affinity for the word "cult", you don
t seem to have a clue as to what it means . . .
1. The Vatican Bank has $8 billion in assets
The Vatican Bank, which has about $8 billion in assets, has often been at the center of scandal and corruption since it was founded in 1942
Vatican Bank accounts are only supposed to be held by residents of Vatican City and church personnel. But according to Gerald Posner, a Vatican bank scholar and the author of "God's Bankers," these accounts were often awarded to powerful Italian officials looking to stash money without paying taxes.

2. The Vatican had over €1.1 billion off its balance sheet
When it released its 2014 financial statements in July, the Vatican said it had more than €1.1 billion ($1.2 billion) in assets that weren't previously on the balance sheet.

4. It costs how much to become a saint?!
It's not cheap to get a priest canonized. To wit: The Our Lady of Victory National Shrine & Basilica in Lackawanna, New York, has raised over $250,000 in an effort to canonize its former priest, Father Nelson Baker. The funds cover the publication of materials about Baker, prayer cards, communication between the church and the Vatican, travel costs for visits to and from Rome and the fees of a canon lawyer.
The cost of canonization can vary greatly depending on the length of the process and the specific evidence needed to prove that a candidate is qualified for sainthood. The church first appealed to Rome to have Baker canonized in 1987. The case was approved in 2011, but Our Lady of Victory still has to prove that Baker performed miracles.
Vatican Inc.: 5 facts about the business of the Catholic Church

How many needy people could this money help?
So, you've exposed your previous falsehood that the Catholic Church is the "Biggest Financial Power on Earth".
Is that because you changed websites from "humansarefree.com" to CNN.com??

If you go to another website it'll be a completely different figure altogether, and so on.
Pathetic . . .
 

BreadOfLife

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And thus you have made my point, right?
Not at all.

YOUR point was that the reason so many don't believe is because of all of the long explanations.
MY point was that the explanations aren't long - unless a person keeps rejecting the truth.
 

GodsGrace

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One does not even have to go to history to learn about your cult..... it's in the headlines quite a bit;

How Rich Is the Catholic Church? It's Impossible to Tell
NEW YORK (TheStreet) -- Feeling guilty about investing in "sin" stocks, like makers of guns, cigarettes and alcohol products? Don't. Over the course of its history of investing, the Catholic Church has done much worse.
In the 1960s, Italian media uncovered evidence that the Vatican had invested in entities that conflict directly with the church's holy mission, including Istituto Farmacologico Serono, a pharmaceutical company that made birth control pills, and Udine, a military weapons manufacturer. There have also been unconfirmed rumor of church money in firearms manufacturer Beretta and companies with activities in gambling and pornography. It has been linked to dealings with Nazi gold during World War II as well.

The Catholic Church has a history of corruption, and it is a notoriously opaque institution. Sexual abuse accusations (and the consequent cover-ups) have put it in the headlines most recently, but it has been at the center of numerous scandals over the years, ranging from accusations of ties to the mafia in Rome to allegations of stealing babies in Chile and Spain.

Just recently, the Vatican was caught up in yet another financial scandal, when Monsignor Nunzio Scarano, who was an accountant at the bank that managed the Church's real estate investments, was arrested when he tried to smuggle €20 million ($26 million in 2013, when the plot was uncovered) into Italy, allegedly on behalf of the d'Amico shipping family. He told the authorities that he stood to gain €2.5 million on the deal. Investigators were first alerted to him when he reported paintings stolen from his apartment and police discovered a luxurious pad packed to the ceiling with expensive art and furnishings, which the Monsignor, who draws a small salary as a member of the clergy, claimed were gifts.
https://www.thestreet.com/story/132...-catholic-church-it-s-impossible-to-tell.html

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

15 World Hunger Statistics

1) Approximately 842 million people suffer from hunger worldwide. That’s almost 12 percent of the world’s population of 7.1 billion people.

4) Approximately 9 million people die of world hunger each year according to world hunger statistics; more than the death toll for malaria, AIDs and tuberculosis combined in 2012.


What would Christ think and do?
Don't be too surprised about Scarano.
I wouldn't even attribute that to the RCC.
EVERYBODY in Italy is corrupt.
Except me, of course. LOL
You know, I don't mean EVERYBODY...
Just 95%.

I also want to remind you I'm not Catholic, but I don't understand, and never have, how anyone could say this is a cult.

What makes it a cult to you?
 

GodsGrace

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Not at all.

YOUR point was that the reason so many don't believe is because of all of the long explanations.
MY point was that the explanations aren't long - unless a person keeps rejecting the truth.
I just read an Italian article, which I'll link below (if I can figure out how, it's from facebook of a friend) that explains that the bible was not, let's say ENCOURAGED, to be read (PROHIBITED) because the CC was afraid persons would begin to translate the verses in a personal way instead of in an ecclesiastical way.

Meaning the bible was meant for the church, and not individuals.
This bothered me but I don't know enough about this and it could be just propoganda. I'm not sure even the priests I know would be willing to divulge this.
 

GodsGrace

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Source:
Traditio Liturgica: La risonanza della Parola

(terrible translation. The original was Italian)

****************************************************
One of the most recurrent themes in the Catholic World is what Sacred Scripture, read in the Church, has its own particular resonance.
This theme is, in fact, that his ancient and traditional, not coincidentally the liturgy is interwoven with biblical expressions and back passages of the new and the old testament.
Before the invention of the printing press was normal read sacred scripture only in Church, before the Assembly of the faithful, since it was the only time he could do.
The invention of the printing press was a revolution that today there nougaty. Stole the Sacred Scripture in the Church handing it to the individual and his free interpretation. Is the invention of printing which, somehow, helped to give a real impetus to the Lutheran doctrine.
The free interpretation of Scripture can lead to same results and consequently to destructive results for the faith and the Church itself because it elevates the individual conscience above the ecclesial consciousness <1>. Well aware of this, the Church at first forbade the reading of Scripture in individual sense because it had to continue to resonate in the ecclesial Assembly within which it was believed there was still the correct mindset to be able to interpreting <2>.
In a liturgy which has preserved the sense of the sacred, in the higher meaning of the term, and a vivid awareness of this, scripture will resonate in the most profound and spiritual, whether it be proclaimed in the language fluently spoken or an ancient liturgical language. In a liturgy in which the sense of the sacred was shattered with all the ensuing simplification, inevitably there will be a repercussion in'biblical interpretation.
I will mention one fact poor soundproof lately and that clearly expresses what I am saying.
Cathedral of Gemona (Udine). Evening mass accompanied by the singing of the Alps.
Reads a passage from an Apostolic Epistle in which, among other things, they say: "if we do not love the next we see, how can we love God whom we can't see?" (1 Jn 4, 21).
The Interior of the Church had an atmosphere that take me back to that of a Berlin Protestant, which I visited a couple of years ago. Absolutely everything suggested to me that the biblical passage were to be understood only humanly: loving your neighbor meant sovvenirlo in a social sense and, on the other hand, the same opening prayer of the priest suggested this. In that courtroom Church Scripture resounded, Yes, but with a meaning all too human, so human that one could not help wondering what could possibly serve the Church.
Only through my monastic settlements I could understand that the passage of 1 Jn 4, 21 evokes a love not human, to which the Christian is enabled by the grace of God because ordinarily the priests today talking about this and may never even suspected. As a result, the "resonance of the word" in Gemona he elevated but not detract from the human spirit. This is how experimentally I could hear. Instead, the end of that resonance is always to rouse the spirit, our innermost sphere, not only the reason of Tickle or our psyche from us by imprisonment in the mirror room of our mind. The resonance (or catechesis, from the Greek katecheo) involves the elevation of human in the divine, not the lowering of the divine in human!
It is no coincidence that in Holy Scripture use two Greek terms to indicate the term "word": logos and rema. The logos is the creative Word, just pronounce creates: "Let there be light and there was light" (Gen 1, 3). Christ makes of logia, or pronunciation of words that give life and Logos is, however, an alternative way to call Christ himself because "in him was life" (Jn 1, 4) <3>. In the consciousness of the old church when the man is sanctified in Christ, becomes another Christ for pardon and can, at times, speaking of the logia, or the "creative words," otherwise such miracles. Miracles are real facts, not purely allegorical tales. If they were pure allegories God would be powerless, could not operate logy or mirabilia Dei and would like us that simple human words we utter. Therefore God would no longer God or, more simply, God would not exist!
The healings and miracles performed in the name of Christ indicate that the individual makes logy and Evangelical case where the Apostles there succeed does disgusting Christ himself because they show that, despite his physical presence, have not yet been permeated by his grace because of the hardness of their heart (Mt 17, 14 ff.). In fact, those who have faith as a mustard seed, you can also do wonderful things (Lk 17, 6; Mt 17, 20).
Another scriptural term to indicate "word" is rema. Rema is but a flatus vocis, our ordinary way of speaking, a word of her does not create anything, indeed, sometimes destroys. That is how the Act of speech is uncoupled from the creative act and the land, because of disobedience Adamič, divorced from the sky.
The "word of God" is not and will never be human, but only rema, the word logos, God's Word. The Holy Bible is not its a collection of logia, because it only contains words printed in their bare materiality, but is a true and authoritative witness of divine, the real existence of logia such creative acts throughout the history of Salvation that continues into the present. The Church and evangelisation are not matter of rowing, words only, but of logy, creative and divine words.
As a result, "if we do not love the next we see, how can we love God whom we can't see?" (1 Jn 4, 21), can never be interpreted strictly psychological and spiritual human but only high, divine. The Church is in the world to bring the spirit of God, not for secular spirit reclining or pleasure to various Scalfari.
And that's why the place par excellence where it guards the Sacred Scripture is the sanctuary or altar, not anywhere: the revelation, in fact, descended from God, although I am also human Word, not a mere man. Establish the Church as a building in the traditional order, means obeying a symbolic order that brings us back to these basic truths as the symbolism speaks always and in every age the human spirit, even if reason doesn't comprehend immediately. That's why in a church building cannot exist the sanctuary as a place normally closed to lay <4>.
Furthermore, the distinction of the biblical term "word" between logos and rema, has strong consequences in ecclesial and liturgy because clearly shows that the divine plan will never be human, as much as man can be made in part a sharer in Christ alone. Their confusion and overlap, in the end, a deep confusion in understanding the faith and the figure of Christ.

In an ecclesial context in which all psychologized — and Humanized, in which "love for one's neighbor" means give him spectacularly to eat in san Petronio in Bologna (just to give just one example of which we give an image), the presence of Grace for which was formed the Church, can be seriously dimmed. It is also an indirect confession that today you are powerless to operate the logy evangelicals, if you still believe that once they are operated. You rely on, so only human contrivances. But if the path leading up to the sky is obscured and mistaken manner, that the Church in these circumstances can only turn the senselessness and be like salt unsalted: good only to be trampled by men (Mt 5, 13) <5>.
In principle, these analyses do not move with the intention of condemning people or environments but record of factual: operate certain choices widely secularized societies, the Church is detached from the Gospel with its lifeblood from the trunk only. As a consequence will turn to religious and sterility lower logy Evangelicals in puri rowing. The road to agnosticism is thus widely Esplanade and, accordingly, certain communities will always have less authentic faithful and will replace the remaining with social workers or atheists in fact to which provide any justification. That's what means the barren fig tree which, therefore, is cursed by Christ and immediately dies (Mt 21, 19). The Gospel relates that Christ can also curse and it must always be remembered ...
Despite its complexity, everything is simple and logical for who knows this to see and have the honesty to admit it: the current crisis in Western Christianity comes from a crisis of faith. In fact, not only no longer believes as before but it is not believed at all.
 
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amadeus

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Not at all.

YOUR point was that the reason so many don't believe is because of all of the long explanations.
MY point was that the explanations aren't long - unless a person keeps rejecting the truth.
No, my point was that some very sincere people who love God still do not even read long and complex writings. They already live their beliefs as they can without getting into the more complex details. This doesn't make them wrong or rejecting. We need to remember how wise Solomon really was when God anointed him to write:

"And further, by these, my son, be admonished: of making many books there is no end; and much study is a weariness of the flesh." Ecc 12:12

Many people wisely seeing the depth of some of these discussions, simply back away and never say a word... Just a simple "nay", I am not going to read it. I am not going to get involved. They recognize also perhaps that in the end of the matter, only God gives the increase.

 
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KBCid

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Don't be too surprised about Scarano.
I wouldn't even attribute that to the RCC. EVERYBODY in Italy is corrupt.
Except me, of course. LOL You know, I don't mean EVERYBODY... Just 95%.
I also want to remind you I'm not Catholic, but I don't understand, and never have, how anyone could say this is a cult.
What makes it a cult to you?

Ahh GG I am not surprised at all... it is quite typical to see justification attempts when a belief system is questioned. The truth is that I don't really even need to provide much in the way of questioning before the full on justification comes flying out as walls of text. Their own replies are forms of fruits that don't fall far from the tree. As you should see in his replies every attempt was made to discredit any point being made by any source. All are liars except him and his cult.

So why is it a cult well let me simply grab some definitions to clarify it for you;
Cult
3 :a religion regarded as unorthodox or spurious

Spurious
1 :of illegitimate birth
2 :outwardly similar or corresponding to something without having its genuine qualities
3 a :of falsified or erroneously attributed origin :forged
b :of a deceitful nature or quality
Definition of SPURIOUS

Cults are notorious for looking like something legitimate but at their core they don't have the genuine qualities to make it legitimate.
The list of things in both the history of that cults actions within this world and the multitude of things they still do which do not reflect Christ are voluminous. We as professing Christians should be doing our best to reflect Christ / the Father in all that we do and think and when you have been on that path for long enough you can see those things that do not make that genuine reflection.
 

KBCid

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And, again - although you have a deep affinity for the word "cult", you don
t seem to have a clue as to what it means . . .
So, you've exposed your previous falsehood that the Catholic Church is the "Biggest Financial Power on Earth".
Is that because you changed websites from "humansarefree.com" to CNN.com??
If you go to another website it'll be a completely different figure altogether, and so on.
Pathetic . . .

You didn't notice or intentionally avoided noticing that my focus went from the cult as a whole to simply its bank.... of course I knew what you would do before I posted which is why I did that.
This is like fishing without a net or a pole.... all I have to do is wave what appears to be bait and you just jump in the boat face first... and yes it is quite pathetic.

Notice that every time I ask how many people could be helped by the money held by your cult or its bank you avoid those answers too....
 

GodsGrace

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Ahh GG I am not surprised at all... it is quite typical to see justification attempts when a belief system is questioned. The truth is that I don't really even need to provide much in the way of questioning before the full on justification comes flying out as walls of text. Their own replies are forms of fruits that don't fall far from the tree. As you should see in his replies every attempt was made to discredit any point being made by any source. All are liars except him and his cult.

So why is it a cult well let me simply grab some definitions to clarify it for you;
Cult
3 :a religion regarded as unorthodox or spurious

Spurious
1 :of illegitimate birth
2 :outwardly similar or corresponding to something without having its genuine qualities
3 a :of falsified or erroneously attributed origin :forged
b :of a deceitful nature or quality
Definition of SPURIOUS

Cults are notorious for looking like something legitimate but at their core they don't have the genuine qualities to make it legitimate.
The list of things in both the history of that cults actions within this world and the multitude of things they still do which do not reflect Christ are voluminous. We as professing Christians should be doing our best to reflect Christ / the Father in all that we do and think and when you have been on that path for long enough you can see those things that do not make that genuine reflection.
Isn't a cult a following of a PERSON instead of an IDEAL??

Doesn't every church have some falsehood in it?
I have my problems with the CC which is why I left it.
Of course, the problems of the times gone by are really no longer present.

So do we still hate them?
Do we still call it a cult?

Except for the Marianne doctrines, I don't see anything cultish about them. Purgatory could be derived from scripture, even though we may not agree with it. Ditto for confession and ditto for the Real Presence in Communion, or transubstantiation even.

My feeling is this: I'm very upset for things that happened within the CC. Just as an example, the inquisition which wanted to force persons to believe, the 4th Crusade which was totally for human reasons and not religious, the prohibition of reading the bible - no matter how wrong it might have been translated, as per BoL (I'm not familiar with this problem and so have no comment). I DO know that it was not translated into known, local languages and kept in either the Greek or the Latin so it would not be available to everyone.

However, I feel we need to get over this and stop hating the CC.
Protestants weren't saints either...
 

KBCid

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Isn't a cult a following of a PERSON instead of an IDEAL??
Doesn't every church have some falsehood in it?
I have my problems with the CC which is why I left it.
Of course, the problems of the times gone by are really no longer present.

If a Church discerns falsehood and doesn't remove it then it becomes a cancer.
If Christ is the head of the Church how can it remain his with falsehood?

So do we still hate them?
Do we still call it a cult?

We should hate evil in all its forms where ever it exists.
We should call a spade a spade. If we see sin and do nothing then we are allowing it. If I see a group that exhibits a form of godliness that doesn't have a Godly core then they are no different than whited walls and they absolutely are a cult according to the definitions I showed you.

Except for the Marianne doctrines, I don't see anything cultish about them. Purgatory could be derived from scripture, even though we may not agree with it. Ditto for confession and ditto for the Real Presence in Communion, or transubstantiation even.

Is that really all you see wrong with them?
Is it ok with you to pray to any other than God? (What did Christ say and do)
Is it ok with you to give honor to anyone or thing other than Christ and the Father?
Is it ok with you that all the money offered to God is not all given to the poor and to help the widows and fatherless?

Those are just the tip of the iceberg in our current time

My feeling is this: I'm very upset for things that happened within the CC. Just as an example, the inquisition which wanted to force persons to believe, the 4th Crusade which was totally for human reasons and not religious, the prohibition of reading the bible - no matter how wrong it might have been translated, as per BoL (I'm not familiar with this problem and so have no comment). I DO know that it was not translated into known, local languages and kept in either the Greek or the Latin so it would not be available to everyone. However, I feel we need to get over this and stop hating the CC. Protestants weren't saints either...

I would be perfectly fine with getting over it if they remove the offensive traditions that came through their history and turn to reflecting God as it was intended for the people of God to do.
The protestant daughters are no better than their mother cult if they hold to any of the traditions added to Christ's teaching for the original Church.

If a body of people professing to be Christians allows murder or adultery or torture they are not Christians no matter how much they make the assertion and Christ will indeed tell them at the judgment that truth no matter how much they believe that they have done God's will;

Matt 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Notice above it says MANY and this MANY is not from the OT. This MANY if from the time of Christ going forward as it specifically says they did these things in his name.
Now tell me what group that is made up of many says they do what they do in Christ's name? How many self proclaimed churches from history asserted that they are doing MANY wonderful works? or have the power to cast out devils?
Up until the 16th century there has only been one to make that claim and then there was a splintering away of variants from that one... I call the splintered ones daughters because just as genetic daughters carry much of the same features as the parents so did the protesting daughters carry along many of the traditions that the mother instituted during her existence.
 

BreadOfLife

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I just read an Italian article, which I'll link below (if I can figure out how, it's from facebook of a friend) that explains that the bible was not, let's say ENCOURAGED, to be read (PROHIBITED) because the CC was afraid persons would begin to translate the verses in a personal way instead of in an ecclesiastical way.

Meaning the bible was meant for the church, and not individuals.
This bothered me but I don't know enough about this and it could be just propoganda. I'm not sure even the priests I know would be willing to divulge this.
And until you can prove what you're claiming - this is just hearsay.
The Church has been undergoing these sorts of unsubstantiated attacks for centuries . . .
 

BreadOfLife

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Source:
Traditio Liturgica: La risonanza della Parola

(terrible translation. The original was Italian)

****************************************************
One of the most recurrent themes in the Catholic World is what Sacred Scripture, read in the Church, has its own particular resonance.
This theme is, in fact, that his ancient and traditional, not coincidentally the liturgy is interwoven with biblical expressions and back passages of the new and the old testament.
Before the invention of the printing press was normal read sacred scripture only in Church, before the Assembly of the faithful, since it was the only time he could do.
The invention of the printing press was a revolution that today there nougaty. Stole the Sacred Scripture in the Church handing it to the individual and his free interpretation. Is the invention of printing which, somehow, helped to give a real impetus to the Lutheran doctrine.
The free interpretation of Scripture can lead to same results and consequently to destructive results for the faith and the Church itself because it elevates the individual conscience above the ecclesial consciousness <1>. Well aware of this, the Church at first forbade the reading of Scripture in individual sense because it had to continue to resonate in the ecclesial Assembly within which it was believed there was still the correct mindset to be able to interpreting <2>.
In a liturgy which has preserved the sense of the sacred, in the higher meaning of the term, and a vivid awareness of this, scripture will resonate in the most profound and spiritual, whether it be proclaimed in the language fluently spoken or an ancient liturgical language. In a liturgy in which the sense of the sacred was shattered with all the ensuing simplification, inevitably there will be a repercussion in'biblical interpretation.
I will mention one fact poor soundproof lately and that clearly expresses what I am saying.
Cathedral of Gemona (Udine). Evening mass accompanied by the singing of the Alps.
Reads a passage from an Apostolic Epistle in which, among other things, they say: "if we do not love the next we see, how can we love God whom we can't see?" (1 Jn 4, 21).
The Interior of the Church had an atmosphere that take me back to that of a Berlin Protestant, which I visited a couple of years ago. Absolutely everything suggested to me that the biblical passage were to be understood only humanly: loving your neighbor meant sovvenirlo in a social sense and, on the other hand, the same opening prayer of the priest suggested this. In that courtroom Church Scripture resounded, Yes, but with a meaning all too human, so human that one could not help wondering what could possibly serve the Church.
Only through my monastic settlements I could understand that the passage of 1 Jn 4, 21 evokes a love not human, to which the Christian is enabled by the grace of God because ordinarily the priests today talking about this and may never even suspected. As a result, the "resonance of the word" in Gemona he elevated but not detract from the human spirit. This is how experimentally I could hear. Instead, the end of that resonance is always to rouse the spirit, our innermost sphere, not only the reason of Tickle or our psyche from us by imprisonment in the mirror room of our mind. The resonance (or catechesis, from the Greek katecheo) involves the elevation of human in the divine, not the lowering of the divine in human!
It is no coincidence that in Holy Scripture use two Greek terms to indicate the term "word": logos and rema. The logos is the creative Word, just pronounce creates: "Let there be light and there was light" (Gen 1, 3). Christ makes of logia, or pronunciation of words that give life and Logos is, however, an alternative way to call Christ himself because "in him was life" (Jn 1, 4) <3>. In the consciousness of the old church when the man is sanctified in Christ, becomes another Christ for pardon and can, at times, speaking of the logia, or the "creative words," otherwise such miracles. Miracles are real facts, not purely allegorical tales. If they were pure allegories God would be powerless, could not operate logy or mirabilia Dei and would like us that simple human words we utter. Therefore God would no longer God or, more simply, God would not exist!
The healings and miracles performed in the name of Christ indicate that the individual makes logy and Evangelical case where the Apostles there succeed does disgusting Christ himself because they show that, despite his physical presence, have not yet been permeated by his grace because of the hardness of their heart (Mt 17, 14 ff.). In fact, those who have faith as a mustard seed, you can also do wonderful things (Lk 17, 6; Mt 17, 20).
Another scriptural term to indicate "word" is rema. Rema is but a flatus vocis, our ordinary way of speaking, a word of her does not create anything, indeed, sometimes destroys. That is how the Act of speech is uncoupled from the creative act and the land, because of disobedience Adamič, divorced from the sky.
The "word of God" is not and will never be human, but only rema, the word logos, God's Word. The Holy Bible is not its a collection of logia, because it only contains words printed in their bare materiality, but is a true and authoritative witness of divine, the real existence of logia such creative acts throughout the history of Salvation that continues into the present. The Church and evangelisation are not matter of rowing, words only, but of logy, creative and divine words.
As a result, "if we do not love the next we see, how can we love God whom we can't see?" (1 Jn 4, 21), can never be interpreted strictly psychological and spiritual human but only high, divine. The Church is in the world to bring the spirit of God, not for secular spirit reclining or pleasure to various Scalfari.
And that's why the place par excellence where it guards the Sacred Scripture is the sanctuary or altar, not anywhere: the revelation, in fact, descended from God, although I am also human Word, not a mere man. Establish the Church as a building in the traditional order, means obeying a symbolic order that brings us back to these basic truths as the symbolism speaks always and in every age the human spirit, even if reason doesn't comprehend immediately. That's why in a church building cannot exist the sanctuary as a place normally closed to lay <4>.
Furthermore, the distinction of the biblical term "word" between logos and rema, has strong consequences in ecclesial and liturgy because clearly shows that the divine plan will never be human, as much as man can be made in part a sharer in Christ alone. Their confusion and overlap, in the end, a deep confusion in understanding the faith and the figure of Christ.

In an ecclesial context in which all psychologized — and Humanized, in which "love for one's neighbor" means give him spectacularly to eat in san Petronio in Bologna (just to give just one example of which we give an image), the presence of Grace for which was formed the Church, can be seriously dimmed. It is also an indirect confession that today you are powerless to operate the logy evangelicals, if you still believe that once they are operated. You rely on, so only human contrivances. But if the path leading up to the sky is obscured and mistaken manner, that the Church in these circumstances can only turn the senselessness and be like salt unsalted: good only to be trampled by men (Mt 5, 13) <5>.
In principle, these analyses do not move with the intention of condemning people or environments but record of factual: operate certain choices widely secularized societies, the Church is detached from the Gospel with its lifeblood from the trunk only. As a consequence will turn to religious and sterility lower logy Evangelicals in puri rowing. The road to agnosticism is thus widely Esplanade and, accordingly, certain communities will always have less authentic faithful and will replace the remaining with social workers or atheists in fact to which provide any justification. That's what means the barren fig tree which, therefore, is cursed by Christ and immediately dies (Mt 21, 19). The Gospel relates that Christ can also curse and it must always be remembered ...
Despite its complexity, everything is simple and logical for who knows this to see and have the honesty to admit it: the current crisis in Western Christianity comes from a crisis of faith. In fact, not only no longer believes as before but it is not believed at all.
Ummmm, you DO understand this this article is from a BLOG, don't you??
It's somebody's opinion - not fact . . .
 

BreadOfLife

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No, my point was that some very sincere people who love God still do not even read long and complex writings. They already live their beliefs as they can without getting into the more complex details. This doesn't make them wrong or rejecting. We need to remember how wise Solomon really was when God anointed him to write:

"And further, by these, my son, be admonished: of making many books there is no end; and much study is a weariness of the flesh." Ecc 12:12

Many people wisely seeing the depth of some of these discussions, simply back away and never say a word... Just a simple "nay", I am not going to read it. I am not going to get involved. They recognize also perhaps that in the end of the matter, only God gives the increase.
And this can also be construed as spiritual pride.
 

BreadOfLife

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You didn't notice or intentionally avoided noticing that my focus went from the cult as a whole to simply its bank.... of course I knew what you would do before I posted which is why I did that.
This is like fishing without a net or a pole.... all I have to do is wave what appears to be bait and you just jump in the boat face first... and yes it is quite pathetic.

Notice that every time I ask how many people could be helped by the money held by your cult or its bank you avoid those answers too....
You mean, like the way YOU avoid explaining what you mean by "cult"??

Can you say, "Hypocrite"?
 

GodsGrace

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And until you can prove what you're claiming - this is just hearsay.
The Church has been undergoing these sorts of unsubstantiated attacks for centuries . . .
You want proof that people could not read the bible until just recently, here. And to some extent even in the states, except for the Protestants who always read their bible.

When you make your next trip here, let me know.
I know priests that are still pretty young who went to seminary and they required PERMISSION to read the Old Testament.
Seminarians!

Believe it or not...
I really don't care.
But it's true.
 
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BreadOfLife

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You want proof that people could not read the bible until just recently, here. And to some extent even in the states, except for the Protestants who always read their bible.

When you make your next trip here, let me know.
I know priests that are still pretty young who went to seminary and they required PERMISSION to read the Old Testament.
Seminarians!

Believe it or not...
I really don't care.
But it's true.
That's completely false.
MOST
of what you say about the Church is false - but so go the claims of anti-Catholics . . .