Confidence or Arrogance?

[Dave L]

Its even harder to find those who simply hang on Jesus every word, and who would rather boast of Him than there learning.

The problem with this is in their denominational bias that filters scripture. So they never interpret it beyond that particular twist.

 

[amadeus]

or
2 Corinthians 4:2 (NIV)
2 Rather, we have renounced secret and shameful ways; we do not use deception, nor do we distort the word of God. On the contrary, by setting forth the truth plainly we commend ourselves to everyone’s conscience in the sight of God.

Indeed, we speak when we are really led by God to so and we remain silent whenever we are ignorant or God so leads us.

 

[101G]

Indeed, we speak when we are really led by God to so and we remain silent whenever we are ignorant or God so leads us.

Good advice.

I know to some I come off as arrogant, but I'm like the apostle Paul, 1 Corinthians 9:22 "To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some".

in Confidence and or Arrogance, I know I take a chance as to not be understood. but as one posters said in another topic, "ask the person, first hand Info is the best", and "Spend more than 15 min"...
great advace.

I know and are aware, when I speak on "diversified Oneness" to the untrained ear, yes it's confusing, but as the poster said, "no one asked me, to get the first hand info".

and that's sometime a problem for me. because even being Confidence or in Arrogance one can lose the "EAR" that would love to hear. and in our Confidence and or Arrogance we get indifferent or grow a tough skin to all and everybody. yes, ME included. we are not God, but human, and we on both side of the aisle are in short comings, we makes mistakes. to be human is to ERROR. this we must keep in the back of our minds, on both side of the aisle.

conclusion: we all have to put up with one another, this we can do, for we're overcomers.

I'm in agreement with the Lord, "it's better to go to heaven with one Good eye or with two bad eyes go to hell.

PICJAG.

 

[marks]

I too see the denominational biases in interpretting Scripture. So many teachings just passed down from the founders, others accepting without question.

I was rather amazed when I began to study for myself, and what I found to be true!

Much love!
mark

 

[mjrhealth]

The problem with this is in their denominational bias that filters scripture. So they never interpret it beyond that particular twist.

Yes we get that from a few here, dont we.. I learned I understand so it must be.. just another personal twist, based on ones own understanding, so few will take things to God.

 

[Jay Ross]

I too see the denominational biases in interpretting Scripture. So many teachings just passed down from the founders, others accepting without question.

I was rather amazed when I began to study for myself, and what I found to be true!

Much love!
mark

What you are saying is true Mark s but even when we study the scriptures for ourselves we are not infallible in the understanding that we arrive at. As a wise woman on another forum often states, iron sharpens iron. So it is also on this forum. We all come to an understanding as if we are looking through very dirty glasses with things still hidden from us.

The traditions of past interpretations and framed understandings do hold sway with many people on this forum and obscures God Word from us.

Shalom

 

[101G]

I too see the denominational biases in interpretting Scripture. So many teachings just passed down from the founders, others accepting without question.

I was rather amazed when I began to study for myself, and what I found to be true!

Much love!
mark

we agree. I use to be trinitarian in my beliefs, because that was what I was taught. (but understand, I don't put down, nor blame any of my teachers). I thank God. see I put that?, I thank God, for it was he who taught me correctly.

so we don't blam anyone, but give Glory and all praise to the Lord JESUS the Spirit. for he brought me to the LIGHT.

but with denominational biases, keep on pointing the TRUTH out in the scriptures. in his time he will open their eyes.

PICJAG.

 

[farouk]

we agree. I use to be trinitarian in my beliefs, because that was what I was taught. (but understand, I don't put down, nor blame any of my teachers). I thank God. see I put that?, I thank God, for it was he who taught me correctly.

so we don't blam anyone, but give Glory and all praise to the Lord JESUS the Spirit. for he brought me to the LIGHT.

but with denominational biases, keep on pointing the TRUTH out in the scriptures. in his time he will open their eyes.

PICJAG.

John's First Epistle does indeed bring out the certainty of faith.

 

[101G]

John's First Epistle does indeed bring out the certainty of faith.

it do indeed.

PICJAG

 

[marks]

What you are saying is true Mark s but even when we study the scriptures for ourselves we are not infallible in the understanding that we arrive at. As a wise woman on another forum often states, iron sharpens iron. So it is also on this forum. We all come to an understanding as if we are looking through very dirty glasses with things still hidden from us.

The traditions of past interpretations and framed understandings do hold sway with many people on this forum and obscures God Word from us.

Shalom

I'd like to think we are all just forming our views from the clear text of Scripture. The way I see it, the more one departs from the straightforward readings, the more one goes off into the weeds.

No we are not infallable, of course not. Just the same, you can't just say to someone who disagrees with you, Oh, you're still chained to the past! Hooked on the stereotypes. Whatever it is. it just becomes another meaningless ad hominem.

How many times I hear things like that instead of a really responsive reply!

Much love!
mark

 

[marks]

we agree. I use to be trinitarian in my beliefs, because that was what I was taught. (but understand, I don't put down, nor blame any of my teachers). I thank God. see I put that?, I thank God, for it was he who taught me correctly.

so we don't blam anyone, but give Glory and all praise to the Lord JESUS the Spirit. for he brought me to the LIGHT.

but with denominational biases, keep on pointing the TRUTH out in the scriptures. in his time he will open their eyes.

PICJAG.

Not trinitarian?

 

[101G]

Not trinitarian?

"Diversified Oneness".

PICJAG

 

[marks]

"Diversified Oneness".

PICJAG

What does that mean?

Thanks!

 

[farouk]

I'd like to think we are all just forming our views from the clear text of Scripture. The way I see it, the more one departs from the straightforward readings, the more one goes off into the weeds.

No we are not infallable, of course not. Just the same, you can't just say to someone who disagrees with you, Oh, you're still chained to the past! Hooked on the stereotypes. Whatever it is. it just becomes another meaningless ad hominem.

How many times I hear things like that instead of a really responsive reply!

Much love!
mark

How we need to search and be searched by the Scriptures continually!

Acts 17.11: "These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."

 

[aspen]

My impression is that "Christian Forums" are made up mainly of the denominationally indoctrinated who argue among themselves. Who have never studied beyond their own constraints. Rarely do you find anyone who studied objectively for years before picking a church and landing on a position.

You’re WRONG! Not sure how, but i thought i would contribute

 

[farouk]

Well, we need to make the Scriptures our yardstick.

 

[Naomi25]

This is a great topic. The example in the OP is not arrogance. Stating your opinion on truth can be arrogant, aggressive, or weak, but none of our opinions on truth has any affect on the truth itself. I can tell you that “Jesus is Lord” in the most arrogant, hateful way possible, but it takes nothing away from Jesus’s sovereignty. However, it has tremendous implications on the speaker’s sanctification....it is unfortumate that we seem to gravitate toward pastors who are zealous and singleminded and basically jerks because their presentation is strangely comforting.....”that pastor would fight to the death for the truth! It must be true!” Yet, in the back of our minds we know the guy is just a pompous ass. I think there is an epidemic of arrogance in the pulpit. It is sad because zealotry reflects the condition of the heart, not the measure of truth described in the opinion offerred

Hi Aspen. Some good thoughts here. And I think you're right...for some bizarre reason people do seem to gravitate towards arrogant leaders. Perhaps it's as you suggest and they see it as passion, zeal and confidence. But, in my book, arrogance is arrogance and not much good will come from that in a leader.
What I look for in a pastor or teacher is how they teach. It's hard to explain, but when a pastor teaches faithfully from scripture it's like a key in a lock and there's that "click"...something within you, which I suspect is the Holy Spirit confirming the truth of the Word, affirming what is being taught. It's not something that hypes, or feels good or makes you feel superior, it just feels...true and right. And sometimes a little confronting. When I come across that in a teacher, compounded with their obvious love for Christ, I know I'm onto a faithful one, no matter their denomination!
I wonder if the current trend of 'church as entertainment', coupled with a Pastor who gets up with a passionate, 'feel good' message goes hand in hand?

 

[farouk]

Hi Aspen. Some good thoughts here. And I think you're right...for some bizarre reason people do seem to gravitate towards arrogant leaders. Perhaps it's as you suggest and they see it as passion, zeal and confidence. But, in my book, arrogance is arrogance and not much good will come from that in a leader.
What I look for in a pastor or teacher is how they teach. It's hard to explain, but when a pastor teaches faithfully from scripture it's like a key in a lock and there's that "click"...something within you, which I suspect is the Holy Spirit confirming the truth of the Word, affirming what is being taught. It's not something that hypes, or feels good or makes you feel superior, it just feels...true and right. And sometimes a little confronting. When I come across that in a teacher, compounded with their obvious love for Christ, I know I'm onto a faithful one, no matter their denomination!
I wonder if the current trend of 'church as entertainment', coupled with a Pastor who gets up with a passionate, 'feel good' message goes hand in hand?

Ecclesiastes 9.15:

"Now there was found in it a poor wise man, and he by his wisdom delivered the city; yet no man remembered that same poor man."

 

[aspen]

Hi Aspen. Some good thoughts here. And I think you're right...for some bizarre reason people do seem to gravitate towards arrogant leaders. Perhaps it's as you suggest and they see it as passion, zeal and confidence. But, in my book, arrogance is arrogance and not much good will come from that in a leader.
What I look for in a pastor or teacher is how they teach. It's hard to explain, but when a pastor teaches faithfully from scripture it's like a key in a lock and there's that "click"...something within you, which I suspect is the Holy Spirit confirming the truth of the Word, affirming what is being taught. It's not something that hypes, or feels good or makes you feel superior, it just feels...true and right. And sometimes a little confronting. When I come across that in a teacher, compounded with their obvious love for Christ, I know I'm onto a faithful one, no matter their denomination!
I wonder if the current trend of 'church as entertainment', coupled with a Pastor who gets up with a passionate, 'feel good' message goes hand in hand?

,

Well, i do think plastic, showman type pastors certainly qualify in the “look at me! I am always right!” category, but they have been around for centuries - the flagellants of the Middle Ages; the Big Tent Revivalists of the turn of the last century; The Mega Churches of today......it is all cult of personality stuff. I am most concerned with the fire and brimstone, lack of empathy, small town types, who preach doctrinal purity over the fruits of the spirit because they preach what they know. They tend to lurk quietly on school boards and in low level, local government positions where they cultivate a ‘big fish/little pond’ persona and are rewarded mightly by their congregation which is filled with local big shots, who ‘run the the town’. They, like all narcissists preach a gospel of compliance and duty; spending their time identifying those loyal and annihilating those who are not.

Flashy is usually not respected and therefore not really taken seriously by the groupies who follow them like they used to follow the Grateful Dead before they were saved at an alter call or other big Jesus event. The small time pastors are taken seriously because they preach insecurity, every move we make is a choice between damnation or salvation.....whether it is preached as once saved always saved and practiced as ‘everything I do reflects my elect statuus’ or i can lose my salvation with every action. The real message is, trust in my message about God, i am the strength you need not the whimp gospel preached by my inferiors out there, who pervert or twist the gospel into what their people want to hear.

 

[marks]

How we need to search and be searched by the Scriptures continually!

Acts 17.11: "These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."

There it is! " . . . and be searched by the Scriptures continually!"

It's the difference between a quest for knowledge, and a thirst for life that comes only in humble submission.

Much love!
mark